Need advice on "exceptional" receiver approx. $1,000 + or - - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 68 Old 10-31-2013, 05:20 PM - Thread Starter
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The reason I have $1,000 as a starting point is just from my experience of being a quiet observer of numerous Sound & Vision articles and various other sources, the truly great equipment typically isn't less than $1,000. Functional sure, but maybe not with the audio quality, enough juice to power towers, 3D pass through and other features.

Right now I am faking surround sound with a good Marantz stereo receiver and 4 Klipsch Towers. Ironically it's the PS4 features (or lack thereof) that prompted me to finally get around to upgrading my receiver. The PS4 doesn't do analog lol which annoyed me then I realized "it's time". Although I won't be getting PS4 for a while since they are idiotically not including a ton of important features, no reason not to upgrade my receiver and I can use the PS4 preorder money to do it with (and more).

On slickdeals a few years back I found a newegg deal for a good sub and 4 speakers (to use as satellites) with center. So right out of the gate I'm equipped for a 7.1 receiver. I suppose if I could educate myself as to the benefit of a 2nd subwoofer in a small room I could go for a 7.2 receiver also or future proof myself to do so.

I am not a fan of pass through anything so I'm not sure the 3D pass through is important or not since I don't know if any receivers do it "well". If they do then sure it's a good feature for me because I do have a Samsung 61" 3D LED DLP TV (the first and last they made) and it looks exceptional calibrated and 3D is great on it. My experience with home theater is always plug the HDMI into the TV directly and not to pass through so *shrug*

Other features like wifi or ethernet options to have things like Slacker, Pandora etc. wouldn't hurt.

My priorities are the best sounding receiver that has the necessary power to handle 4 full size Klipsch tower speakers, sub, center and 4 "satellites", and preferably zero loss with pass through to make my life easy (although I doubt anything is out there that doesn't suck some quality of picture doing pass through). Heck even if you guys know of a $1,500 or more receiver or more that is a "must" buy I'll entertain the idea, but there is a limit to how much I want to drop on this thing.
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post #2 of 68 Old 10-31-2013, 05:35 PM
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Big fan of NAD receivers. Music first, sure applies to the SQ of their gear, they also do just fine for home theater. You can get good deals on refurbs from places like spearit sound.

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post #3 of 68 Old 10-31-2013, 08:07 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by WaTaGuMp View Post

Big fan of NAD receivers. Music first, sure applies to the SQ of their gear, they also do just fine for home theater. You can get good deals on refurbs from places like spearit sound.

Any model in particular I should be looking at? First time I have heard of NAD. I'm sure that makes me an A/V dolt... lol New on some of their models is over twice what I could even imagine paying, although I'm sure they're fantastic receivers. Any suggestions or help would be great. I'll take a look at Spearit.
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post #4 of 68 Old 10-31-2013, 08:18 PM
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Originally Posted by jwhyrock View Post

Any model in particular I should be looking at? First time I have heard of NAD. I'm sure that makes me an A/V dolt... lol New on some of their models is over twice what I could even imagine paying, although I'm sure they're fantastic receivers. Any suggestions or help would be great. I'll take a look at Spearit.

Out of the loop really for whats the best, I have an old T754, that I bought for $499. Just take a look at features and connections you want, then look at your budget. They are all going to sound very good. I think mine was $1200 or so new. 775HD is $1299. Refurbs are a great way to save money, mine is a refurb.

http://www.spearitsound.com/product.cgi?group=90&product=2972

T757 new from David at DMC $1199, you can always call him or Spearit and get more info.

https://dmc-electronics.com/AllProducts.asp

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post #5 of 68 Old 10-31-2013, 08:24 PM - Thread Starter
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Here's NAD's website on the AV Receiver page: http://nadelectronics.com/products/av-receivers

Then here's a link to Spearit's surround receivers: http://www.spearitsound.com/showall-Products-Surround_Receivers.html

**I wasn't able to find an A/V Receiver link on Spearit although I assume their surround receivers is the same as A/V receivers

Tons of NAD receivers in there, but I really have no clue what I'm looking at to be honest. I'm willing to consider up to $2k, but again it would have to be pretty incredible and really set itself apart from lower priced receivers to go that high.


I have the same thread on slickdeals.net and someone recommended a Sony receiver at about a grand: http://www.amazon.com/Sony-STR-DA...ds=sony+es

reviewed here: http://www.audioholics.com/av-rec...conclusion


I have to admit I was very impressed by all the bells and whistles, but one thing that jumped out at me was the reviewer saying although it sounded great, it wasn't "as dynamic" as he would have liked and gave 3 out of 5 stars on surround quality.
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post #6 of 68 Old 10-31-2013, 08:25 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jwhyrock View Post

Here's NAD's website on the AV Receiver page: http://nadelectronics.com/products/av-receivers

Then here's a link to Spearit's surround receivers: http://www.spearitsound.com/showall-Products-Surround_Receivers.html

**I wasn't able to find an A/V Receiver link on Spearit although I assume their surround receivers is the same as A/V receivers

Tons of NAD receivers in there, but I really have no clue what I'm looking at to be honest. I'm willing to consider up to $2k, but again it would have to be pretty incredible and really set itself apart from lower priced receivers to go that high.


I have the same thread on slickdeals.net and someone recommended a Sony receiver at about a grand: http://www.amazon.com/Sony-STR-DA...ds=sony+es

reviewed here: http://www.audioholics.com/av-rec...conclusion


I have to admit I was very impressed by all the bells and whistles, but one thing that jumped out at me was the reviewer saying although it sounded great, it wasn't "as dynamic" as he would have liked and gave 3 out of 5 stars on surround quality.

I can tell you right now a NAD is top notch sound quality, these suckers are heavy in weight, which is a good thing.

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post #7 of 68 Old 10-31-2013, 08:28 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WaTaGuMp View Post

Out of the loop really for whats the best, I have an old T754, that I bought for $499. Just take a look at features and connections you want, then look at your budget. They are all going to sound very good. I think mine was $1200 or so new. 775HD is $1299. Refurbs are a great way to save money, mine is a refurb.

http://www.spearitsound.com/product.cgi?group=90&product=2972

T757 new from David at DMC $1199, you can always call him or Spearit and get more info.

https://dmc-electronics.com/AllProducts.asp

Thank you! You posted just before I did apparently! =)
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post #8 of 68 Old 10-31-2013, 08:37 PM
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I bought mine from DMC since he is local. Check NAD's site using the dealer locator, maybe you can also have a dealer close to go have a look and a listen. There is also Audiogon, for used gear, Spearit even posts there.

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post #9 of 68 Old 10-31-2013, 11:25 PM - Thread Starter
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I agree from the NAD line the 757 appears to be the Affordable bang for your buck with 3D support. No idea if it's the best among similarly priced competition or not.

http://nadelectronics.com/products/av-receivers/T-757-A/V-Surround-Sound-Receiver-+#heading-consumer-reviews
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post #10 of 68 Old 11-01-2013, 07:05 AM
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I have had 3 receivers over the years in my setup. Denon, Onkyo and now my NAD, for SQ, the NAD destroys the other 2. Granted my other 2 were lower model budget receivers, but still, NAD is just higher end gear. Not sure if you have heard of Paul Barton or not, AKA PSB speakers, but NAD is a sister company.

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post #11 of 68 Old 11-01-2013, 08:12 AM - Thread Starter
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I have had 3 receivers over the years in my setup. Denon, Onkyo and now my NAD, for SQ, the NAD destroys the other 2. Granted my other 2 were lower model budget receivers, but still, NAD is just higher end gear. Not sure if you have heard of Paul Barton or not, AKA PSB speakers, but NAD is a sister company.

I haven't but I'm convinced NAD is amazing after researching. I am curious if any of you have thoughts on video pass-through normally and with 3D with 757 NAD? I read one review where the guy could not see any PQ loss which blew me away. Also wondering if my DLP TV to mitsubishi 3D adapter would cause any issues.
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post #12 of 68 Old 11-01-2013, 11:01 AM
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I haven't but I'm convinced NAD is amazing after researching. I am curious if any of you have thoughts on video pass-through normally and with 3D with 757 NAD? I read one review where the guy could not see any PQ loss which blew me away. Also wondering if my DLP TV to mitsubishi 3D adapter would cause any issues.

I cant give any insight to video processing etc from any receiver. I use them for sound only. I even went from my Onkyo that had HDMI connections to none on my NAD, just cause the SQ is so much better. Digital Optical and Digital Coaxial work just fine, I don't get True HD etc, but that's fine for my usage. The 775 seems like a VERY nice unit, all the SQ of a NAD with the up to date things.

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post #13 of 68 Old 11-01-2013, 02:08 PM
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The NAD T757 has been replaced with the T758 which is being sold by Crutchfield and Audioadvisor for just under $1k. NAD has not updated their web pages with the new model although there is nothing functionally different. They re-arranged the connectors on the back.

I'd highly recommend it in that price range.

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post #14 of 68 Old 11-01-2013, 03:20 PM - Thread Starter
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The NAD T757 has been replaced with the T758 which is being sold by Crutchfield and Audioadvisor for just under $1k. NAD has not updated their web pages with the new model although there is nothing functionally different. They re-arranged the connectors on the back.

I'd highly recommend it in that price range.

So is there a preference between the two even though they are largely the same? T758?
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post #15 of 68 Old 11-01-2013, 03:33 PM - Thread Starter
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So based on my ignoramus search based only off recommendations I'm at two options: features /inputs vs sound and picture quality

http://www.audioholics.com/av-receiver-reviews/sony-str-da2800es

http://www.audioadvisor.com/prodinfo.asp?number=NAT758

On one hand 8 vs 4 hdmi inputs with no ethernet, but considering my online entertainment is already addressed and i only use 2 hdmi ports with a third on the way, maybe I'm fine with the NAD.

Thoughts or other suggestions?
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post #16 of 68 Old 11-01-2013, 03:56 PM
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So based on my ignoramus search based only off recommendations I'm at two options: features /inputs vs sound and picture quality

http://www.audioholics.com/av-receiver-reviews/sony-str-da2800es

http://www.audioadvisor.com/prodinfo.asp?number=NAT758

On one hand 8 vs 4 hdmi inputs with no ethernet, but considering my online entertainment is already addressed and i only use 2 hdmi ports with a third on the way, maybe I'm fine with the NAD.

Thoughts or other suggestions?

NAD, all day any day and twice on Sundays. Are you ruling out the refurb NAD T775HD at $1299? Yes its more money, but its a $3000 unit new. The 759 new at $999 im sure is great also, its just the 775 is higher up the food chain.

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post #17 of 68 Old 11-01-2013, 04:13 PM
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There are a lot of great receivers out there and when looking at them, I would think about what offers you the not only the best audio fidelity but also the best "bang" for the buck. NAD does make a good receiver, but some of the more well known brands, such as Marantz or Denon, might be a viable solution to not only keep your cost down, but give you more flexibility. The Marantz SR70007 or the SR6008 could work. Also you mentioned that you don't really need all the networking capability, so another possibility is the Denon E400.
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post #18 of 68 Old 11-01-2013, 07:03 PM - Thread Starter
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NAD, all day any day and twice on Sundays. Are you ruling out the refurb NAD T775HD at $1299? Yes its more money, but its a $3000 unit new. The 759 new at $999 im sure is great also, its just the 775 is higher up the food chain.

I didn't see any reference to 3D support on Spearit for the 775 other than that I'm definitely open to spending more if worth it.
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post #19 of 68 Old 11-02-2013, 08:19 AM - Thread Starter
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Spearit told me the 775HD2 added 3D support. Can anyone simplify the difference between 758 and 775?

ARC and CEC would not be included with 775HD2 unless added I assume with a separate module. I of course have no idea what either of those formats are...
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post #20 of 68 Old 11-02-2013, 03:12 PM - Thread Starter
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While searching for reviews found this conversation where there were a couple mentions of NAD but they seemed to prefer Denon and Marantz. Curious what you guys thought:

http://forums.stevehoffman.tv/threads/advice-on-a-new-home-theater-receiver.283406/
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post #21 of 68 Old 11-02-2013, 03:53 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jwhyrock View Post

While searching for reviews found this conversation where there were a couple mentions of NAD but they seemed to prefer Denon and Marantz. Curious what you guys thought:

http://forums.stevehoffman.tv/threads/advice-on-a-new-home-theater-receiver.283406/

I think its like any audio gear, different people like different things. Never owned any Marantz gear, so I cant say for sure. But like I said in another post, I prefer my NAD over any receiver I have owned, which were Denon and Onkyo.

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post #22 of 68 Old 11-02-2013, 04:54 PM
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Just chiming in with my experiences. I currently own a Marantz 5006 and a Denon 3313 and have owned Onkyo 809 in the past. Personally I would rank Marantz and Denon equally well. I think they both have excellent SQ and I like the way they play music better than Onkyo. I have never owned NAD but I have read from a number of different sources about their high all around quality. Personally I would not hesitate to buy a Marantz or Denon if you can find one that meets your needs. But if you can get a NAD at a good price I would consider jumping on it, I doubt you would be disappointed. They are well known for their quality.

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post #23 of 68 Old 11-02-2013, 05:29 PM - Thread Starter
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Yep and all the research I've done supports that conclusion. The above thread was just some random thread I came across. Now basically i need to decide between the 758 AND 775HDV2 models. $1k vs $1.5k (refurb). I understand the 775 will be better I just haven't figured specifically if it's just the wattage or if there are other features as well.
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post #24 of 68 Old 11-02-2013, 09:41 PM - Thread Starter
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Well for the extra power alone I'm in. I'll grab the $1500 refurb.

Any suggestions on cable/wire? I've been using ridiculously cheap wire for too long.

Oh and I never said what my speakers are:

I'll be phasing into my 2 x KLF 20 and 2 x Synergy F3 Kliptsch towers, new speakers that have been gathering dust awaiting the day I bought a surround receiver = 4 satellites & center Take 5 Classic Energ-y and a Polk subwoofer.
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post #25 of 68 Old 11-02-2013, 11:57 PM - Thread Starter
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Found this article that recommends 12 gauge monoprice cable: http://m.thewirecutter.com/reviews/the-best-speaker-cable/
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post #26 of 68 Old 11-03-2013, 12:58 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jwhyrock View Post

While searching for reviews found this conversation where there were a couple mentions of NAD but they seemed to prefer Denon and Marantz. Curious what you guys thought:

http://forums.stevehoffman.tv/threads/advice-on-a-new-home-theater-receiver.283406/

(1) Steve Hoffman's forums lack credibility for certain of their content in certain circles at AVS. OK, they can be funny to read if you don't take them too seriously. ;-)

(2) This thread has racist overtones that again show ignorance and are amusing if not taken too seriously.

Here are some relevant facts:

Denon and Maraatz components are made by the same company

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Denon

"“D&M Holdings Inc.” was created in May 2002 when Denon Ltd and Marantz Japan Inc. merged"

IOW thy are the same company and no doubt Denon and Marantz components are assembled on the same machines and production lines. Their parts no doubt come from the same bins. There is one engineering and management team. The difference between them is branding, pure and simple.

An amazingly high percentage of all basic electronic components are made in China. The most common difference is the ownership of the factories that make them. A fantastically high percentage of all circuit boards are made there as well.

IOW no matter what country the final assembly is done in, a very high percentage of all audio gear is either made of basic parts manufactured in China, or includes subassemblies made in China, or is wholly made in China. All this back and forth in the thread on that forum about NAD is particularly curious given this enlargement of the back of a new NAD AVR which says "Manufactured to NAD specifications in China"



Sorry about the pixalization, but the text can be read with some difficulty.

The thread at that forum goes on and some wise persons eventually reveals much of the above.

They then start talking about Anthem in glowing terms to which I respond:



Notice the word "China"? ;-)

Finally they mention Macintosh, for whom back panel pictures are harder to find, and one that I found is proudly emblazoned with "Made in USA", but of course translated from the original English that means "Assembled in the USA of Pacific Rim sourced parts". Case in point the cooling fan in the picture is branded with "Sanyo Denki", and a little research shows that the are a Japanese company with 3 factories in the Philippines.

In my experience the Chiniese and Philippines people can be wonderful, bright industrious workers, but it all depends on the quality of the management and supervision which cannot be reduced to three words, the first two of which are "Made in".
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post #27 of 68 Old 11-03-2013, 01:25 AM
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Quote:
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Well for the extra power alone I'm in. I'll grab the $1500 refurb.

Any suggestions on cable/wire? I've been using ridiculously cheap wire for too long.

Ok - I looked at the specs of that NAD, and it uses a lower echelon of Auddyssey tech. MultiEQ XT. You would be MUCH better served to get a model with the much coveted ( for good reason ) XT32 on any Audyssey equipped receiver. The Denon X 4000 has the latest XT32, along with SUBEQ XT ( for measuring two subs if you're so inclined ) and you can get it new for about 1000 dollars I bet. In fact AVscience is a Denon dealer, if you call them they could quote you a price. The ONKYO 929 is a little more expensive but is also equipped with the above, along with 9 channels of amplification. If you're worried about power, you could always add an external amp to either of the above amps, but doubt you'll need it unless you're in a VERY big room playing movies and music at reference. As far as speaker wire goes, Cheap wire is fine, anyone who tells you different are probably the same that would recommend Monster HDMI cables over generic ones at 900% mark up, for zero reason. I'm sure I've read somewhere that in double blind ABX tests between ultra high end speaker wire, and a coat hanger, NO ONE could tell the difference. There's something to be said for low gauge wire if you're over 25 feet between speakers, but other then that I'm sure that 16 gauge cheap generic wire would be just fine.

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post #28 of 68 Old 11-03-2013, 01:38 AM
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Well for the extra power alone I'm in. I'll grab the $1500 refurb.

Any suggestions on cable/wire? I've been using ridiculously cheap wire for too long.

Oh and I never said what my speakers are:

I'll be phasing into my 2 x KLF 20 and 2 x Synergy F3 Kliptsch towers, new speakers that have been gathering dust awaiting the day I bought a surround receiver = 4 satellites & center Take 5 Classic Energ-y and a Polk subwoofer.

I don't think that center is going to keep up with the Klipsch speakers, that's a very small center speaker by comparison. For wire this is a good read http://www.roger-russell.com/wire/wire.htm#connect

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post #29 of 68 Old 11-03-2013, 01:44 AM
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Originally Posted by jwhyrock View Post

Spearit told me the 775HD2 added 3D support. Can anyone simplify the difference between 758 and 775?

ARC and CEC would not be included with 775HD2 unless added I assume with a separate module. I of course have no idea what either of those formats are...

ARC (Audio Return Channel, permits sound from your tv back to your avr with a single HDMI cable) and HDMI-CEC (permits control of multiple units in a system via HDMI) are of questionable value IMHO, but usually come with an avr that meets HDMI 1.4a standards (like 3D), weird that NAD only added the 3D when adding a module. Personally I'd look at something with Audyssey XT32, perhaps the Denon X4000.

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post #30 of 68 Old 11-03-2013, 10:49 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by arnyk View Post

(1) Steve Hoffman's forums lack credibility for certain of their content in certain circles at AVS. OK, they can be funny to read if you don't take them too seriously. ;-)

(2) This thread has racist overtones that again show ignorance and are amusing if not taken too seriously.

Here are some relevant facts:

Denon and Maraatz components are made by the same company

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Denon

"“D&M Holdings Inc.” was created in May 2002 when Denon Ltd and Marantz Japan Inc. merged"

IOW thy are the same company and no doubt Denon and Marantz components are assembled on the same machines and production lines. Their parts no doubt come from the same bins. There is one engineering and management team. The difference between them is branding, pure and simple.

An amazingly high percentage of all basic electronic components are made in China. The most common difference is the ownership of the factories that make them. A fantastically high percentage of all circuit boards are made there as well.

IOW no matter what country the final assembly is done in, a very high percentage of all audio gear is either made of basic parts manufactured in China, or includes subassemblies made in China, or is wholly made in China. All this back and forth in the thread on that forum about NAD is particularly curious given this enlargement of the back of a new NAD AVR which says "Manufactured to NAD specifications in China"



Sorry about the pixalization, but the text can be read with some difficulty.

The thread at that forum goes on and some wise persons eventually reveals much of the above.

They then start talking about Anthem in glowing terms to which I respond:



Notice the word "China"? ;-)

Finally they mention Macintosh, for whom back panel pictures are harder to find, and one that I found is proudly emblazoned with "Made in USA", but of course translated from the original English that means "Assembled in the USA of Pacific Rim sourced parts". Case in point the cooling fan in the picture is branded with "Sanyo Denki", and a little research shows that the are a Japanese company with 3 factories in the Philippines.

In my experience the Chiniese and Philippines people can be wonderful, bright industrious workers, but it all depends on the quality of the management and supervision which cannot be reduced to three words, the first two of which are "Made in".


I should have clarified my post. I was ignoring the made in China **** lol. Do these people live under rocks? I was made in China! Jk. I appreciate the detailed reply though because there are a lot of xenophobic people trolling the internet and this might educate them.
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