Separate Amplification Upgrade Query: Which Way Would YOU Go? - Page 3 - AVS Forum
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post #61 of 213 Old 11-25-2013, 05:21 AM
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Originally Posted by Hopinater View Post

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Originally Posted by IntelliVolume View Post

If I were to add external amplification to my setup, is the concensus that the best way to go about it would be adding a three-channel amp, like Emotiva's XPA-3, just to amp the RTi12s and CSi30 center while a (new) AVR powers the two surrounds? Or, would it make more sense to get a two-channel stereo amp to power just the RTi12s, letting the AVR power the center and surrounds on its own?

 
If you were to do it I would go with a three channel amp.

Especially true since the highest power levels may be in the center channel. It is possible that many systems might benefit from just 1 channel of amplification.

The core problem is that this is a speculative/ abstract analysis discussion because almost nobody knows what the power levels are in their system by means of objective measurement(s).
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post #62 of 213 Old 11-25-2013, 09:04 AM
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Originally Posted by Maddmaster View Post

No I understood what you were saying. My response was I have sat through many of the blind test you are referring to so I understand your point. We could go on forever so I will back away from the table for there are too many variables in this discussion. I laugh because no matter where this subject pops up it always ends up a tit for tat battle.

Hey madd, no worries, I was talking to 2k, it seemed he misread what I originally wrote. And I agree with you that this debate always ends here at this point going back and forth. In the end the OP has to weigh both sides and decide which direction he wants to take. 

 

FWIW, I agree with jason, I would (actually I did) put my money into subs first and then go from there. 

 

Personally, I'm not adverse to amps, in fact if funds permit, perhaps someday I will still buy an Emotiva XPA-3, just not for the reasons I had three months ago. I no longer believe that I will get a bump in SQ. Actually I no longer have a good reason to buy one other than I think I would like to try it out. In the mean time I need to save for a 2nd subwoofer and then perhaps an upgrade to better speakers. So who knows when, if ever, I will end up getting an amp. But appreciate this thread and all the info that was put into it. 

 

Hey Intellivolume, whatever you do, be sure to have fun and enjoy whatever you end up with.  :D 

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post #63 of 213 Old 11-25-2013, 09:16 AM
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+1 to the have fun and enjoy. Sometimes we can certainly over think aspects of this hobby. I'm kinda glad I didn't over think my used xpa-2 when the oppurtunity presented itself. Ive had a lot of fun pushing that beast as far as I can. smile.gif


One of my earlier bits of advice was to determin if you need an amp, then amp up big. If ya cant go big (within your means), what's the point?

I don't need snobs to tell me how to think, thank you!
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post #64 of 213 Old 11-25-2013, 11:14 AM
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I have a Rotel amp for the power off my Yamaha receiver, 200 watts per channel into 5 channels at 8 ohms. Super clean power! Not cheap though, but I love the clean power the Rotel produces. Is all I have to make sure is the receiver I buy has pre-outs. 

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post #65 of 213 Old 11-25-2013, 02:32 PM
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Originally Posted by 67jason View Post

To be faiir mad, I had to upgrade to the 135 watt per channel avr in order to have a unit with preouts. But yeah going from 90 to 200 watts per channel did solve my problems. The 300 watt amp is nothing but vanity for me. smile.gif

You did right. Going from 200 wpc to 300wpc would have only given you a little more headroom. System would not have played any louder. People sometimes perceive being able to play louder will sound better and that is not true.

Reading other comments through this long discussion I noticed reading between the lines that some are looking for more depth (low end from their speakers) and think a power amp will do just that. It will but anyone looking for that will do better investing that money in a good Sub.

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post #66 of 213 Old 11-25-2013, 02:48 PM
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Originally Posted by mxgirl75 View Post

I have a Rotel amp for the power off my Yamaha receiver, 200 watts per channel into 5 channels at 8 ohms. Super clean power! Not cheap though, but I love the clean power the Rotel produces. Is all I have to make sure is the receiver I buy has pre-outs. 

Great point. What's ashame is the power amp in the AVR going to waste. As someone said earlier manufacturers price a good pre/pro amp higher and it actually cost them less to build it. It comes down to supply and demand.

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post #67 of 213 Old 11-25-2013, 04:49 PM - Thread Starter
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WHEW...

Just revisited this thread and saw all the replies since my last input...thank you, once more, everyone for all your opinions. It seems, after kinda summarizing most of what is being said here, the best route to take would be to begin with a new, higher-end, higher-powered AVR with preouts, of course, and go from there and that if needed, the three-channel amp route would be the best way to go as far as external amplification is concerned, yes?

Let me ask this as we wind closer -- hopefully? -- to a conclusive element in this thread...lol...will doing a three-channel amp across the front soundstage be just as advantageous as doing, say, a two-channel just for the RTi12 mains? To answer one member's question, the system we're talking about is being used strictly for 5.1 surround duty/film watching (I have a separate two-channel music-only system in a separate room powered by a gorgeous Onkyo 8555 stereo receiver) so the center channel is indeed vital. That being said, would a three-channel amp give "enough current" spread across three channels as compared to, say, one of Emotiva's two-channel amps dedicated just to the mains...if you all can follow my train of thought here?

I am just concerned that by "sharing" three channel circuitry because it has to power three channels, something like the XPA-3 wouldn't be as "potent" as an amp dedicated to just ONE or TWO channels (monoblock/stereo)...but then the question becomes why would I amp just the left and right mains and leave the critical center channel to be powered by the AVR? Shouldn't the front stage have a completely cohesive amp protocol, otherwise it will sound "off"?

Additionally as a side note: I see there were more than a few suggestions for upgrading my sub. Believe me, that's DEFINITELY on my to-do list as my Polk PSW350 isn't cutting it anymore; I'm looking into an SVS but there's no WAF to be had here...rolleyes.gif

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post #68 of 213 Old 11-25-2013, 04:52 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Maddmaster View Post

Great point. What's ashame is the power amp in the AVR going to waste. As someone said earlier manufacturers price a good pre/pro amp higher and it actually cost them less to build it. It comes down to supply and demand.

This is PRECISELY what I was referring to in a previous post -- that I think getting a nice new AVR, even though it has preouts, and completely bypassing its internal amps for ALL channels is kinda a shame...

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post #69 of 213 Old 11-25-2013, 04:56 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by 67jason View Post

The three channel amp makes the most sense if you are going to amp up.

Personally I would upgrade your avr then decide if an additional amp makes sense....I know I said it before, but it is what makes sense and is the route I took

Thank you, VERY much Jason...I believe your suggested route here is the best way to begin...smile.gif

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post #70 of 213 Old 11-25-2013, 04:57 PM - Thread Starter
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When you're ready, hit me up. We'll try to set something up.

Appreciate it very much, brother!

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post #71 of 213 Old 11-25-2013, 05:35 PM
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Originally Posted by IntelliVolume View Post

This is PRECISELY what I was referring to in a previous post -- that I think getting a nice new AVR, even though it has preouts, and completely bypassing its internal amps for ALL channels is kinda a shame...

Yes, it would be a shame, but you'd be saving yourself hundreds, if not thousands, for same quality and more features. If you decide to go the smarter route and use the built in amps you can also save on the expense and additional space taken up by external amps and associated cables and clutter.

That being said, to answer your question, if you insist on getting external amplification, run at least your front three channels off of it for HT use. A better 2CH amp for stereo use. It also depends on your budget. a big amp like the XPR-5 can be used for both movies and stereo use. In your case, you will not hear a difference if you go with either the XPA-5, XPA-3 or the XPA-2. I doubt you will even hear a difference if you used the internal amps of your receiver actually.

My recommendation still stands. You will most likely be best served by upgrading your sub system. Don't want to be harsh, but that Polk sub is not the greatest in the world. You would be better off spending that $900 (for the XPA-5 or whatever your budget is) on an ID sub from the likes of Rythmik, HSU, PSA, etc. If DIY is a possibility, you can build a pair of 15" subs powered by a pro amp with DSP for the price of an XPA-5 which, most likely, will not make an audible difference to you.
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post #72 of 213 Old 11-25-2013, 06:08 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by duc135 View Post

Yes, it would be a shame, but you'd be saving yourself hundreds, if not thousands, for same quality and more features. If you decide to go the smarter route and use the built in amps you can also save on the expense and additional space taken up by external amps and associated cables and clutter.

That being said, to answer your question, if you insist on getting external amplification, run at least your front three channels off of it for HT use. A better 2CH amp for stereo use. It also depends on your budget. a big amp like the XPR-5 can be used for both movies and stereo use. In your case, you will not hear a difference if you go with either the XPA-5, XPA-3 or the XPA-2. I doubt you will even hear a difference if you used the internal amps of your receiver actually.

My recommendation still stands. You will most likely be best served by upgrading your sub system. Don't want to be harsh, but that Polk sub is not the greatest in the world. You would be better off spending that $900 (for the XPA-5 or whatever your budget is) on an ID sub from the likes of Rythmik, HSU, PSA, etc. If DIY is a possibility, you can build a pair of 15" subs powered by a pro amp with DSP for the price of an XPA-5 which, most likely, will not make an audible difference to you.

Duc,

While I appreciate all your input and sentiment, with regard to your sub suggestion -- did you not see one of my last posts about recognizing I HAVE to upgrade my sub knowing the PSW350 is more like a POS? I have my eyes on the SVS 12-incher but will take your suggestions into consideration as well...

I'm not really following what you're saying above regarding the amp and AVR and all that though -- are you suggesting to simply keep my AVR I have now? Get a new one and use JUST its internal amps? Get a new one and feed just the front three channels with an external power amp? What are you saying?

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post #73 of 213 Old 11-25-2013, 06:32 PM
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I think you should follow your plans, get a new AVR with pre outs and if you decide you want to go with an external amp (after you hear what your system sounds like) get the 3 channel XPA-3 that you were considering. Then, when you feel like it get your sub. However, I will say take a close look at the PSA XV15. It's just $30 more than the SVS PB12-NSD and has more power and a 15 inch driver. It also has the same 5 year warranty and free shipping. 

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post #74 of 213 Old 11-25-2013, 06:42 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Hopinater View Post

I think you should follow your plans, get a new AVR with pre outs and if you decide you want to go with an external amp (after you hear what your system sounds like) get the 3 channel XPA-3 that you were considering. Then, when you feel like it get your sub. However, I will say take a close look at the PSA XV15. It's just $30 more than the SVS PB12-NSD and has more power and a 15 inch driver. It also has the same 5 year warranty and free shipping. 

Thanks very much for clarifying this a bit, Hop; I shall first start with a new AVR I suppose...

Let me ask you this, just for shits and giggles:

Would it make more sense to introduce a separate pre/pro into the equation, instead, and hook it up to something like an Emotiva XPA-5 to go the complete separates route? And what if I wanted to keep my current preout-less AVR and hook some sort of "line level converter" device up to it (as it's regularly done in car audio with stock head units and amps) so that I can "convert" the speaker level outputs to line level (pre) outs to then feed an amp? Would this even be recommended?

I think Behringer makes these line level converters for home audio use if I'm not mistaken...

And as for your sub suggestion, I will definitely look into that -- I'd prefer a 15 inch driver over a 12 inch if possible...the company is PSA?

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post #75 of 213 Old 11-25-2013, 06:45 PM
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Originally Posted by IntelliVolume View Post

Duc,

While I appreciate all your input and sentiment, with regard to your sub suggestion -- did you not see one of my last posts about recognizing I HAVE to upgrade my sub knowing the PSW350 is more like a POS? I have my eyes on the SVS 12-incher but will take your suggestions into consideration as well...

I did see your posts, but it seems to me you are dead set on an external amp> It's just my personal opinion that, in your situation, that would be a waste of money for most likely no benefit. I'm trying to prevent you from making the same mistakes I did. Hence my offer to bring my amp for you to test. IMO, your budget would be best served by a. upgrading your sub system first or b. add acoustical treatments. External amplification would be my last recommendation for you in your current situation.
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I'm not really following what you're saying above regarding the amp and AVR and all that though -- are you suggesting to simply keep my AVR I have now? Get a new one and use JUST its internal amps? Get a new one and feed just the front three channels with an external power amp? What are you saying?

Yes, as stated above, I would recommend you keep your current AVR and upgrade your sub system first. If not, get another higher end AVR with pre-outs and use the internal amps. At this point, you are not amp limited. Adding power when not needed is throwing money at a problem does not simply exist at this point.

Now if you decide to forego that advice and get an external amp, I would say to get at least a 3CH amp for your HT setup. Again, I'm of the opinion that no matter if you get the XPA-2, XPA-3 or XPA-5 they will all sound the same as power is not where you're lacking. You are most likely using less than 50W to reach reference when running your speaker small and crossed over to your sub. Remember my speakers only used 10W and are much less sensitive than yours. So 50W from a receiver will sound the same as 50W from any of the Emotiva amps whether it be the small UPA-2 or the monster XPR-1. IIRC there was a thread on the Emotiva forums where one of their engineers stated that all properly designed amplifiers sound the same when not driven beyond their limits. You just need to pick any one of the amps that has the requisite power to as many channels you need. In your case that would be at least the front three.
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post #76 of 213 Old 11-25-2013, 06:45 PM - Thread Starter
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Ahhhhhhhhh.....is THIS the bad boy you're referring to, Hop?

http://www.powersoundaudio.com/products/xv15

Do you think 500 watts RMS for bass is sufficient?

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post #77 of 213 Old 11-25-2013, 06:49 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by duc135 View Post

I did see your posts, but it seems to me you are dead set on an external amp> It's just my personal opinion that, in your situation, that would be a waste of money for most likely no benefit. I'm trying to prevent you from making the same mistakes I did. Hence my offer to bring my amp for you to test. IMO, your budget would be best served by a. upgrading your sub system first or b. add acoustical treatments. External amplification would be my last recommendation for you in your current situation.
Yes, as stated above, I would recommend you keep your current AVR and upgrade your sub system first. If not, get another higher end AVR with pre-outs and use the internal amps. At this point, you are not amp limited. Adding power when not needed is throwing money at a problem does not simply exist at this point.

Now if you decide to forego that advice and get an external amp, I would say to get at least a 3CH amp for your HT setup. Again, I'm of the opinion that no matter if you get the XPA-2, XPA-3 or XPA-5 they will all sound the same as power is not where you're lacking. You are most likely using less than 50W to reach reference when running your speaker small and crossed over to your sub. Remember my speakers only used 10W and are much less sensitive than yours. So 50W from a receiver will sound the same as 50W from any of the Emotiva amps whether it be the small UPA-2 or the monster XPR-1. IIRC there was a thread on the Emotiva forums where one of their engineers stated that all properly designed amplifiers sound the same when not driven beyond their limits. You just need to pick any one of the amps that has the requisite power to as many channels you need. In your case that would be at least the front three.

Thank you. I am, by no means, "ignoring" ANYONE's advice in this thread; you are all appreciated very much. smile.gif

I suppose it can be looked at like this (and please correct me if I'm wrong): With a new AVR, at least, the preouts WILL BE THERE anyway, so I can add more than one amp if I ever desire, yes?

And, yes, I am definitely taking into consideration your recommendation of upgrading the sub first...smile.gif

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post #78 of 213 Old 11-25-2013, 07:08 PM
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Originally Posted by IntelliVolume View Post

Ahhhhhhhhh.....is THIS the bad boy you're referring to, Hop?

http://www.powersoundaudio.com/products/xv15

Do you think 500 watts RMS for bass is sufficient?

Yep, that's it. I just bought it 2 weeks ago. I was so close to pulling the trigger on the SVS PB12-NSD then I noticed that for $30 difference I could get the XV15. Both are great subs but $30 more  for a 15 inch driver and 500 watts? No brainer to me. Plus a lot of the guys here on the forum recommended it, so I got it. I have to say, it's incredible. It works great for both movies and music. It's the best addition I have ever made to my HT. But the SVS subs are great as well so don't ignore them. 

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post #79 of 213 Old 11-25-2013, 07:34 PM
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Originally Posted by IntelliVolume View Post

Thank you. I am, by no means, "ignoring" ANYONE's advice in this thread; you are all appreciated very much. smile.gif

Sorry if I gave you the impression that I felt you were ignoring my advice. To me there is a difference between ignoring and foregoing. I know you have acknowledged my posts, but are still leaning towards external amplification. That's perfectly fine as it's ultimately your system and your money. You are free to do as you please. I just want to provide the scientific numbers as I understand them with my anecdotal experience thrown in. You have been nothing, but gracious with our posts.

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I suppose it can be looked at like this (and please correct me if I'm wrong): With a new AVR, at least, the preouts WILL BE THERE anyway, so I can add more than one amp if I ever desire, yes?

That is correct, but to upgrade the AVR just for pre-outs that you may not use at this point is not the best use of your budget IMO. Heck, I can even bring over one of my 4311s and you can test out Audyssey MultEQ XT32 if you want to hear if it will make an improvement in your setup. You are also correct that you can also use a converter with your existing AVR, but that is not optimal. The less things processing the signal in the chain the better. It's an option for the budget strapped which you don't seem to be.
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post #80 of 213 Old 11-25-2013, 08:28 PM
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Intelli take duc up on that 4311 demo offer. You will then be able to see if a higher end avr will do anything for you, and give you the chance to try out xt32. I know you mentioned that you don't use audyssey, but xt32 is something you should experience before dismissing it.

So yeah work out the details with duc and report back on how the demo went.

I don't need snobs to tell me how to think, thank you!
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post #81 of 213 Old 11-26-2013, 08:36 AM
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Originally Posted by Hopinater View Post

Hey madd, no worries, I was talking to 2k, it seemed he misread what I originally wrote. And I agree with you that this debate always ends here at this point going back and forth. In the end the OP has to weigh both sides and decide which direction he wants to take. 

FWIW, I agree with jason, I would (actually I did) put my money into subs first and then go from there. 

Personally, I'm not adverse to amps, in fact if funds permit, perhaps someday I will still buy an Emotiva XPA-3, just not for the reasons I had three months ago. I no longer believe that I will get a bump in SQ. Actually I no longer have a good reason to buy one other than I think I would like to try it out. In the mean time I need to save for a 2nd subwoofer and then perhaps an upgrade to better speakers. So who knows when, if ever, I will end up getting an amp. But appreciate this thread and all the info that was put into it. 

Hey Intellivolume, whatever you do, be sure to have fun and enjoy whatever you end up with.  biggrin.gif  

I got you Hop, sorry I originally misread it. We are on the same page. I was only trying to explain to the OP the science behind his questions and potentially save him some money. No phallus waving was intended.
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post #82 of 213 Old 11-26-2013, 12:57 PM
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I got you Hop, sorry I originally misread it. We are on the same page. I was only trying to explain to the OP the science behind his questions and potentially save him some money. No phallus waving was intended.

No problem. I re-read what I wrote and realized I could have done a better job explaining my thoughts. I knew we were on the same page, I just didn't say it well.:)

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post #83 of 213 Old 11-26-2013, 02:37 PM
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Thanks for your input with the thread, jevan...
So there would be NO Onkyo receiver in their current lineup that would improve upon the power of my 605?
I don't think I'd be adding even two extra channels for 7.1, let alone more than that...

I'm just concerned that a five-channel amp doesn't have the same "guts" as a "more" dedicated three-channel model would, concentrating on powering JUST the mains (and the center)...

But I see your reasoning.
Which AVR and amp were you comparing?

Not in the 6xx series but maybe in the 8xx or 9xx series and up. AVR manufacturers have cut back on their amp sections, especially in the lower models. I'd probably upgrade to the 818 or 929 anyway because of the Audyssey MultEQ XT32 room correction.

As far as the Emotiva XPA series, the XPA-5 and XPA-2 use the same transformer but the XPA-3 has a smaller one since it is only three channels. The XPA-2 offers up 300 watts x 2 and keeps the 1200 VA. The XPR series is a step above that and use either a 2400 VA or 3300 VA transformer.

My AVR is a Denon AVR-5308ci. I'm still using it as a pre-pro and to provide amplification for the additional 2 to 6 surround speakers that I run depending on source material. My amp is the Emotiva XPR-5 at 400 watts x 5. I actually borrowed an XPA-5 and tried it out. There was no improvement in headroom at all going from my AVR's rated 140 watts x 7 to the XPA-5's 200 watts x 5 plus running two channels from the AVR. After I upgraded the Denon to DTS Neo:X / DSX , I decided to run 9.x / 11.x. I picked up an XPR-5 at Emofest. I was actually looking for a deep discount on an XPA-5 but got one on the XPR-5 instead and went with that. Going from 140 watts / channel to 400 watts / channel did make a difference at loud volumes but the difference was minimal at normal levels. I can play two channel stuff ridiculously loud with no distortion or clipping. I wouldn't rush out and get an XPR-5 unless your speakers can handle the power. I have the DefTech BP7000SC and I've heard those run on 1000 watt Krell monoblocks

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post #84 of 213 Old 11-26-2013, 07:01 PM - Thread Starter
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Yep, that's it. I just bought it 2 weeks ago. I was so close to pulling the trigger on the SVS PB12-NSD then I noticed that for $30 difference I could get the XV15. Both are great subs but $30 more  for a 15 inch driver and 500 watts? No brainer to me. Plus a lot of the guys here on the forum recommended it, so I got it. I have to say, it's incredible. It works great for both movies and music. It's the best addition I have ever made to my HT. But the SVS subs are great as well so don't ignore them. 

Thank you...

Does the 15" really rock?

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post #85 of 213 Old 11-26-2013, 07:19 PM - Thread Starter
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Thank you, all; I will respond individually as soon as I get another free moment...tied up with work...smile.gif

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post #86 of 213 Old 11-26-2013, 07:23 PM
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Thank you...

Does the 15" really rock?

It's a great sub in my opinion. I can't help but smile when I hear it regardless of whether I'm listening to music or watching a movie.  

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post #87 of 213 Old 11-26-2013, 10:03 PM
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To answer the original question, yes the Polk RTi12 speakers performance can benefit from a more powerful amplifier. The 12s are a large, heavy (80lbs. Ea.) full-range speaker. They are a 3 -way design with 6 drivers: three 7" woofers, two 5.25" midrange, and a 1" tweeter. The woofers are crossed over at 120hz to the midrange, which are crossed at 1800hz to the tweeter. Polk rates the speaker at 30hz at -3db. In real world use, they can hit 100db at 20hz if driven with a high current, high power amp. They can out-perform many so-called subwoofers on the market.

The 3 woofers have a surface area greater than a 12 inch sub. You'd never consider buying a 80-90 watt subwoofer.

Now, if you aren't going to run them full range, and you want to use a subwoofer for 80hz and lower, a power amp is not necessary. But if you really want to know what the 12s can do, you need to run them full-range, and you need much more power than your Onkyo can produce.

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post #88 of 213 Old 11-27-2013, 06:39 AM
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Originally Posted by .jss designs View Post

To answer the original question, yes the Polk RTi12 speakers performance can benefit from a more powerful amplifier. The 12s are a large, heavy (80lbs. Ea.) full-range speaker. They are a 3 -way design with 6 drivers: three 7" woofers, two 5.25" midrange, and a 1" tweeter. The woofers are crossed over at 120hz to the midrange, which are crossed at 1800hz to the tweeter. Polk rates the speaker at 30hz at -3db. In real world use, they can hit 100db at 20hz if driven with a high current, high power amp. They can out-perform many so-called subwoofers on the market.

The 3 woofers have a surface area greater than a 12 inch sub. You'd never consider buying a 80-90 watt subwoofer.

Now, if you aren't going to run them full range, and you want to use a subwoofer for 80hz and lower, a power amp is not necessary. But if you really want to know what the 12s can do, you need to run them full-range, and you need much more power than your Onkyo can produce.

how do you know -
Quote:
In real world use, they can hit 100db at 20hz if driven with a high current, high power amp

how can using say 5 watts of power average with say 50-80 watts per peak off an amp change the way the speaker sounds vs the same power from an avr? - this is my estimation of intellivolumes usage as he has made it clear he does not have clipping issues at his desired spl levels in his room.

not trying to "pick" on you or your post or anything, just genuinely curious - especially the 20hz at 100db in room response.
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post #89 of 213 Old 11-27-2013, 07:59 AM
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.jss, I don't want to pile on here, but you obviously didn't do the math. It is a ported speaker, so it rolls off VERY sharply after port tune. In order for those speakers to reach 100db @20hz, you would need an amp in excess of 50,000 watts. Even if you could find one, it would melt that speaker long before it was capable of such output. You seem to put a great emphasis on the number of drivers and weight of the speaker...that doesn't matter at all. Sensitivity, Frequency Response (+/-3db), Impedance, and power handling tell you exactly what those speakers are capable of.

We do agree running them full range will eat up much more amplifier power if you intend to push them to the limit (something the OP has already stated he doesn't do)...but rather than running them full range your money would be better spent on buying a sub that really can hit 20hz with authority. if you want that extra low end, If you listen to the type of material that has nothing below 30hz, then these speakers would be adequate for that. Of course that eliminates most modern movies and pop/electronic music.
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post #90 of 213 Old 11-27-2013, 12:31 PM
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Originally Posted by Audiophile2k View Post

.jss, I don't want to pile on here, but you obviously didn't do the math. It is a ported speaker, so it rolls off VERY sharply after port tune. In order for those speakers to reach 100db @20hz, you would need an amp in excess of 50,000 watts. Even if you could find one, it would melt that speaker long before it was capable of such output. You seem to put a great emphasis on the number of drivers and weight of the speaker...that doesn't matter at all. Sensitivity, Frequency Response (+/-3db), Impedance, and power handling tell you exactly what those speakers are capable of.

We do agree running them full range will eat up much more amplifier power if you intend to push them to the limit (something the OP has already stated he doesn't do)...but rather than running them full range your money would be better spent on buying a sub that really can hit 20hz with authority. if you want that extra low end, If you listen to the type of material that has nothing below 30hz, then these speakers would be adequate for that. Of course that eliminates most modern movies and pop/electronic music.


I am in total agreement this time. LOL To many have fallen in the deep hole of thinking more power will mean more Bass. It usually gives them more of what they already had but maybe a little louder ( may be just perception too) depending on what they bought. I would also add that if they are satisfied with the sound quality of what they have the Sub is by far a better investment.

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Polk Audio Speakers Rti 12 , Denon Avr X4000 7 2 Channel Home Theater Receiver , Emotiva Xpa 3 Amplifier , Emotiva Xpa 2 Stereo Power Amplifier , Onkyo Tx Nr929 9 2 Channel Network A V Receiver , Onkyo Tx Nr818 , Emotiva Xpa 5 5 Channel Power Amplifier
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