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Old 04-29-2014, 02:13 PM
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Originally Posted by copene View Post

What if you've had 7 years to do it?

Sort of like Theta has done with there yet to be fully released Casablanca IV (and also uses Dirac)

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Old 04-29-2014, 03:23 PM
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What if you've had 7 years to do it?

I often wonder why a company as large as Onkyo can't release a reliable product. Being the critic that you are I am surprised that you haven't contributed to their woes.
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Old 04-29-2014, 05:30 PM
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No, but you can download it for use on a HTPC.

http://www.dirac.se/en/consumer-products/dirac-rcs.aspx

thanks,
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Old 04-30-2014, 03:01 AM
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http://www.dirac.se/en/consumer-products/dirac-rcs/system-requirements-technical-specifications.aspx


• Windows Vista, 7, 8

• Mac OS X 10.6 Snow Leopard - 10.9 Mavericks

Thanks. Chrome is my default browser and when I click on the link you provided, it takes me to the web page for the iPhone/iPod app onlly - no Windows/Mac info. When I paste the same link into Firefox, it takes my to the web page with the Windows/Mac info. Perhaps google thinks Windows and Macs are porn? ;-)

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Old 04-30-2014, 03:50 AM
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Old 04-30-2014, 05:58 AM
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Originally Posted by kokishin View Post

Thanks. Chrome is my default browser and when I click on the link you provided, it takes me to the web page for the iPhone/iPod app onlly - no Windows/Mac info. When I paste the same link into Firefox, it takes my to the web page with the Windows/Mac info. Perhaps google thinks Windows and Macs are porn? ;-)


Weird. Chrome is what I use.
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Old 04-30-2014, 06:38 AM
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I often wonder why a company as large as Onkyo can't release a reliable product. Being the critic that you are I am surprised that you haven't contributed to their woes.

Never bought Onkyo, probably never will. I'm still running my Pioneer VSX-92 with XPA-5 because if it ain't broke don't fix it. I route everything through the Pio and send the Oppo 103 video out direct to the VT60. Pio does all the audio processing along with the 8033 for subs and I waste away on the couch enjoying it. I don't go around slinging mud like a pissed off walrus for the hell of it except when a company clearly deserves it. I don't like when the wool gets pulled over the sheeps eyes and The Lounge is a breeding ground for top tier lemmings. They basically enable those two alpha monkeys to throw their feces around with no fear of hitting the wrong chimp. They can do no wrong when in fact when it comes to processors, they are terrible at best. The excuses and lies are piling up to back breaking levels over there and I have a good feeling the trainwreck's momentum is going to be epic when this thing comes out and it's another brick.
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Old 04-30-2014, 08:00 AM
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Thanks for the link, cwt. I will note that the discussions refer to the XMC-1 when it was thought to embrace the TacT system. Below is the relevant text.

Quote:
Originally Posted by sticknstones;862528 
Hi folks! I too have been on the original wait list for this product and have been biding my time patiently. I have the UMC as well and I think it is a really good product but certainly not in the league of what has been announced with the XMC. There is a emo-cast that goes into a lot more detail about what is going into this architecture that I recommend. This emo-cast is a solely dedicated discussion on the XMC.

http://emotiva.com/podcasts/012712/EmoCastMix.mp3

I would not take the renderings too serious and it is not final and yes the analog video is gone. I hope they do add the second HDMI out for others as I read so much about how important it is but I do not need it.

The system controller is a large ARM9 processor that will future proof the platform for many years. Here is some information on it.

ARM9 Processor Family - ARM


The TI DSP work and decoding is being done by a partner company called Momentum Data Systems as a long term strategic relationship and of course Tact on the RCS. The Emotiva engineering team is retaining the audio and analog work plus putting it all together.

The TACT can be used in auto mode or for the tweakers or you can change settings on the fly with an APP for the GUI that will let you look at before and after corrections. You might have missed that you can sit on your couch pull up the GUI and tweak in real-time and listen to the effects. I mean dang Betty!

Probably the coolest thing about Emotiva for me continues to be the accessibility to their engineers where anyone can call and talk with them. 5 year warranty too always gives me comfort. Believe me I have owned 3 different Denon's and I ain't going back. My B&W 802 Speakers are worth more than any of my other audio gear and so I dig the value I get too.

The high current headphone amp built in is a TPA 6130 IC with separate volume control that is pretty cool. You can set volume for headphone independent of the main volume.

I am really glad that I am on the pre-order and get the 40% discount plus can keep my UMC. If I sold the UMC, The V-link Asynchronous device I use for my laptop (the XMC will be an upgrade based on the specs and will be Asynchronous with 24/192 from XMC and only 24/96 on the V-link), the Headphone Amp, then I am pretty much having no out of pocket.

The emo-cast ends by stating all the heavy lifting with TACT and Momentum Data Systems is complete. MDS has pretty much eliminated jitter with their work on the DSP part. They also added a loudness button because of the Fletcher-Munson Curves that will allow a correct implementation for that feature.

There is really just too much to type but I highly recommend listening to the emo-cast.

In closing I do agree that anything new like this will get its justifiable due scrutiny and speculation until it ships and folks can share actual experience.

It is nice to have options folks and product release notes like this keep me jazzed while I continue to patiently wait.

I would urge folks to listen to the podcast and note the utter certainty of the product's imminent release and the confidence of Dan and Lonnie and juxtapose it with what one is currently reading and hearing. Maybe those are still the software people. They seem pretty together. Stay tuned for....something!
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Old 04-30-2014, 10:57 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chu Gai View Post

Thanks for the link, cwt. I will note that the discussions refer to the XMC-1 when it was thought to embrace the TacT system. Below is the relevant text.
I would urge folks to listen to the podcast and note the utter certainty of the product's imminent release and the confidence of Dan and Lonnie and juxtapose it with what one is currently reading and hearing. Maybe those are still the software people. They seem pretty together. Stay tuned for....something!

That's certainly one old podcast Chu ; dated 27/1/12 [ we put the month second in the antipodes because were down under biggrin.gif ]
It's undergone significant change since then and if TACT had worked out we wouldn't still be waiting I suspect wink.gif
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Old 04-30-2014, 11:18 AM
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I hadn't seen the stuff about them still working it out with Dirac. I heard there was a podcast but I've never listened to their's and I don't follow the stuff on their boards. If that is true that is definitely a little disappointing, at this point they shouldn't be working on anything with the product except getting enough assembled to start shipping out. Everything else should be locked down at this point if you are saying you're shipping out in volume any day now.

I agree with this but the same is true with making any changes this late in the game including to the hdmi board, Part of not having these delays is having your ducks in a row. Indeed i could see how production numbers could be a problem but the product should be done by now.

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Old 05-01-2014, 05:12 PM
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When are we to expect the second batch of XMC's to ship now that it's May?
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Old 05-01-2014, 05:36 PM
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I have a real good BS meter built in and I will say it again , June is the soonest from my interpretation of the podcast
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Old 05-01-2014, 07:28 PM
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I have a real good BS meter built in and I will say it again , June is the soonest from my interpretation of the podcast

If Emotiva is still working with Dirac to determine the full capabilities of the version included with the XMC-1 then I don't see June as much of a possibility. But hopefully I'm wrong with that assumption.

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Old 05-01-2014, 08:49 PM
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Second batch? Did a first batch ship already?

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Old 05-02-2014, 07:31 AM
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Yes, according to Emotiva a small batch was released in April. Although a working model does not actually exist, nor are they anywhere even close to being ready for primetime. The second batch of phantom XMC's are due out shortly although the glorified garage they are to be assembled in is currently still occupied by that really cool guy Dann that used to work there.
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Old 05-02-2014, 07:54 AM
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I remember those heady days when Outlaw released photos of their upcoming 978 and Emotiva soon after announced that the XMC was really, really, really close with TacT. So the 978 folded, and the XMC? Still waiting.

There is a chance that they are beta testing with these first releases.
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Old 05-02-2014, 09:58 PM
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Originally Posted by Socketman View Post

I have a real good BS meter built in and I will say it again , June is the soonest from my interpretation of the podcast
Could I borrow your meter for work?
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Old 05-04-2014, 10:08 PM
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Reading about issues with past Emotiva processors, does anyone know the QA/QC process that Emotiva is going to implement for the XMC-1? If history is any guide, the paying customers are going to be the beta testers and this is no longer an acceptable long term way of maintaining goodwill among the public.

Interested to find out the testing lab at Emotiva's facility. Assuming that Emotiva doesn't do any beta testing, that means the factory must have done some very extensive testing equipment to give a high degree of assurance that the product is going to work once purchased. To do all this extensive factory tests, Emotiva must have bought quite a bit of consumer devices that could possibly connect up to the XMC-1. This includes:
(1) All consumer TVs;
(2) All projectors;
(3) All blu-ray players;
(4) All type of media players and streamers;
(5) All CD players;
(6) All turn tables;
(7) All set top boxes from cable provides;
(8) All type of HTPC and associated software;
(9) All types of switches, routers and NAS.

If Emotiva hasn't done the above, there's a reasonable chance that when a consumer buys the XMC-1, plugs things into it - problems are going to occur.

I'm speculating that Emotiva would have an internal list of what devices they have tested in the factory with the XMC-1. A suggestion is that a potential buyer of the XMC-1 can send an email of his/her set-up, Emotiva would check and confirm that these devices have been tested in the factory and found to be satisfactory, then send a confirmation email that the set-up would work. This then give some assurance to the potential owner of XMC-1 that it would work at home and increase customer satisfaction - out of the box.

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Old 05-04-2014, 10:36 PM
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^^^. Even in your idealized situation, there is no way to know what every consumer setup will include.

You can only test your gear to make sure it meets spec.

Look at Anthem. They make fantastic products, and have a great team of engineers.

Time and time again they spend valuable resources and engineering in work arounds for shoddy HDMI implementation from source and display providers who don't properly design their products.

You can't relight expect Emotiva to do what you're suggesting.

It's impossible...

I'd be happy with bass management that works correctly and features implemented properly.

If there are source component issues / handshake problems they will be forgiven.

But broken core features and buggy operations will not be easily overlooked. And them trying to explain those away will do much more harm than anything they can easily work around for a source component or sink due to poor HDMi design on those manufacturers part.
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Old 05-05-2014, 08:31 AM
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Have you had the chance to skim over the Emotiva Fusion 8100 thread where the first ones off the line out in the wild are total bricks? These guys have no shame in spewing out half baked garbage. The XMC, if it ever comes out, is going to be the death of Emo selling processors.

http://www.avsforum.com/t/1517916/emotiva-fusion-8100-receiver-has-been-released
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Old 05-05-2014, 08:38 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by copene View Post

Have you had the chance to skim over the Emotiva Fusion 8100 thread where the first ones off the line out in the wild are total bricks? These guys have no shame in spewing out half baked garbage. The XMC, if it ever comes out, is going to be the death of Emo selling processors.

http://www.avsforum.com/t/1517916/emotiva-fusion-8100-receiver-has-been-released

Skip over to the Onkyo threads. They have produced products for years that were great. In the pas few years they have also produced a lot of bricks. Seems as if experience does not account for much in the quality department.
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Old 05-05-2014, 09:56 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by copene View Post

Have you had the chance to skim over the Emotiva Fusion 8100 thread where the first ones off the line out in the wild are total bricks? These guys have no shame in spewing out half baked garbage. The XMC, if it ever comes out, is going to be the death of Emo selling processors.

http://www.avsforum.com/t/1517916/emotiva-fusion-8100-receiver-has-been-released

Skip over to the Onkyo threads. They have produced products for years that were great. In the pas few years they have also produced a lot of bricks. Seems as if experience does not account for much in the quality department.

 

Pavlov Alert!! :)

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Old 05-05-2014, 09:57 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by copene View Post

Have you had the chance to skim over the Emotiva Fusion 8100 thread where the first ones off the line out in the wild are total bricks? These guys have no shame in spewing out half baked garbage. The XMC, if it ever comes out, is going to be the death of Emo selling processors.

http://www.avsforum.com/t/1517916/emotiva-fusion-8100-receiver-has-been-released

 

Yes, the Fusion 8100 seems to have an unfortunate start. Hopefully, the much more expensive XMC-1 will not be beta-tested by the early adopters and will function brilliantly right from the get-go.

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Old 05-05-2014, 11:47 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by copene View Post

Have you had the chance to skim over the Emotiva Fusion 8100 thread where the first ones off the line out in the wild are total bricks? These guys have no shame in spewing out half baked garbage. The XMC, if it ever comes out, is going to be the death of Emo selling processors.

http://www.avsforum.com/t/1517916/emotiva-fusion-8100-receiver-has-been-released

I've been very critical of Emo for various reasons.

But your post is really off base.

One user in that thread has an issue with HDMI handshaking.

He did have to reset the unit at first to get it to pass video to his projector (with a 25' cable run). And has tried various things to get it to perform better with HDMi switching.

But you're really speeding FUD with your post.

He was very complimentary about the sound quality and had other good things to say about the room correction.

"Total bricks?" Hardly.
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Old 05-05-2014, 12:29 PM
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Well, only two Fusion owners reported and one of them had a defective unit which wouldn't pass video. That seems to be a pretty damning indictment of an AVR. Fortunately, Emotiva replaced it promptly. Unfortunately the replacement was defective too. So, of three units reviewed, two were defective.  It's a very small sample of course, but nonetheless, based on actual user reports, it seems to have gotten off to a poor start. Hopefully, more owners will report with better experiences.

 

The guy who had two units commented that the display was different on both units - on one of them the lettering is cut off at the bottom when viewed square on, but not on the other. That would kinda worry me...

 

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Old 05-05-2014, 12:54 PM
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When you have a processor that can't pass ANY VIDEO that a standard run of the mill AVR can, you have a problem. This guy isn't passing some alien lifeform format, he's trying to watch a blu-ray. Would you be cool with opening up your brand new machine and spending days on the phone with Emo tech support telling you "Ok, can you try a different HDMI cable and this time pull your left ear when inputting the cable"? No, plug and play is the norm now. Is HDMI a Godless wretched way of transport? Yes. But the 8100's only purpose in life is to pass the video and process the audio. It only does half. And LOL at you mentioning the guy said it sounded good, great, that's just great. *facepalm
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Old 05-05-2014, 01:02 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by copene View Post

When you have a processor that can't pass ANY VIDEO that a standard run of the mill AVR can, you have a problem. This guy isn't passing some alien lifeform format, he's trying to watch a blu-ray. Would you be cool with opening up your brand new machine and spending days on the phone with Emo tech support telling you "Ok, can you try a different HDMI cable and this time pull your left ear when inputting the cable"? No, plug and play is the norm now. Is HDMI a Godless wretched way of transport? Yes. But the 8100's only purpose in life is to pass the video and process the audio. It only does half. And LOL at you mentioning the guy said it sounded good, great, that's just great. *facepalm

 

Quite a lot of people believe that audio sounds better if it is separated from the video circuitry. My Onk has a setting which disables the video circuitry for that very (alleged) reason. Maybe Emo misunderstood that the user is supposed to be able to get video and audio though, when he wants both... let's see if Lonnie chimes in and says that this is a feature...

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Old 05-05-2014, 01:09 PM
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Quote:
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Quote:
Originally Posted by copene View Post

When you have a processor that can't pass ANY VIDEO that a standard run of the mill AVR can, you have a problem. This guy isn't passing some alien lifeform format, he's trying to watch a blu-ray. Would you be cool with opening up your brand new machine and spending days on the phone with Emo tech support telling you "Ok, can you try a different HDMI cable and this time pull your left ear when inputting the cable"? No, plug and play is the norm now. Is HDMI a Godless wretched way of transport? Yes. But the 8100's only purpose in life is to pass the video and process the audio. It only does half. And LOL at you mentioning the guy said it sounded good, great, that's just great. *facepalm

Quite a lot of people believe that audio sounds better if it is separated from the video circuitry. My Onk has a setting which disables the video circuitry for that very (alleged) reason. Maybe Emo misunderstood that the user is supposed to be able to get video and audio though, when he wants both... let's see if Lonnie chimes in and says that this is a feature...

Count me as one of them. The Oppo 95 has a "Pure Audio" feature that effectively "turns off" the video signal sending only a black screen to the display.
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Old 05-05-2014, 01:20 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by copene View Post

When you have a processor that can't pass ANY VIDEO that a standard run of the mill AVR can, you have a problem. This guy isn't passing some alien lifeform format, he's trying to watch a blu-ray. Would you be cool with opening up your brand new machine and spending days on the phone with Emo tech support telling you "Ok, can you try a different HDMI cable and this time pull your left ear when inputting the cable"? No, plug and play is the norm now. Is HDMI a Godless wretched way of transport? Yes. But the 8100's only purpose in life is to pass the video and process the audio. It only does half. And LOL at you mentioning the guy said it sounded good, great, that's just great. *facepalm

Didn't say they didn't have a problem..

Just took issue with your post that said they were shipping "total bricks.."

You and I have a different definition of what that is.. that's all..

That user even says: "But now that it is happening on a second unit -- and not with all displays -- I am thinking the problem is mostly on my end."

HDMI Handshake Issues with the Fusion 8100

I owned an Anthem D2v that went through plenty of issues with HDMI connections, and they worked very had to solve them with their owners..

You are right.. it should be plug and play... but that also means that a cable run that works with one product doesn't work as well with another AVR/SSP.. I've experienced the same issues over the years (probably had close to 20 different AVR's and processors in the last 5 years...)

Past precedence would leave me to believe that Emo doesn't have the engineering chops to address such issues in house, nor the ability to get it out of the company contracted to build the units for them, in any kind of a timely manner...

Again, my issues is with the hyperbole of your original statement... "where the first ones off the line out in the wild are total bricks? These guys have no shame in spewing out half baked garbage. "

One user and his issue doesn't make a failed product launch...
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Old 05-05-2014, 01:35 PM
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Originally Posted by kbarnes701 View Post

Quite a lot of people believe that audio sounds better if it is separated from the video circuitry. My Onk has a setting which disables the video circuitry for that very (alleged) reason. Maybe Emo misunderstood that the user is supposed to be able to get video and audio though, when he wants both... let's see if Lonnie chimes in and says that this is a feature...

LOL, yup, I've got an OPPO 103 and I have "pure audio" setup as a macros command on the harmony when I'm using it as a music player and controling the playback from my phone. That Lonnie, when he's not enjoying poorly barbecued possum roadkill burgers he's staying one step ahead of the curve with his brilliant programming.

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