Advice Requested - Upgrading to a Universal Blu Ray Player (Denon 4308ci) - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 12 Old 02-09-2014, 07:08 AM - Thread Starter
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Here is my current setup:
Denon 4308ci
Denon DVD3910 (used only for CD's, SACD, High Resolution DVD Audio (192/24)
PS3: Blu Ray and games
Xbox 360: games
Boston Acoustics VR-M80's (L/R)
Boston Acoustics E70: Center
Boston Acoustics VR-M/EX Surrounds (7.1)
Velodyne SPL-1200R
Mitsubishi 65-inch Diamond Vision DLP (no plans to upgrade for several years as it works great for the amount of time we use it for movies)
Monster Power Filter

I rarely game anymore and am about 80% concerned with audio performance and 20% with Home Theater, though I do have a dedicated 2-channel system elsewhere, so I try to find a balance in this set up. I just listen to more music (2 channel direct, 5.1 SACD and DVD-Audio) than I do watch movies.

I am looking to get rid of the DVD3910 for audio and PS3 as a blu ray player while upgrading both sound and blu ray quality with one unit. I wanted to take advantage of the Advanced AL24 Processing offered on the 4308ci and was excited about upgrading to the new Denon dbt3313 until I just read they completely revamped the Denon Link and it is no longer compatible with older receivers (thanks a bunch, Denon. Much appreciated). One thing to note. My main thought is to consolidate equipment while getting an upgrade in audo/blu ray. I am pretty darn happy with the sound quality I have now, but am sure there is better out there. My budget would max out at $1200, but don't have to spend that much, just to say I did. I also am not in the market to upgrade the receiver and the blu ray player. Worst case scenario is that I would just wait it out or use Option 3. I have a large collection of High Resolution DVD-Audio (192/24) and SACD, so those are requirements for any player. Here are the options I am contemplating and would appreciated feedback and alternate suggestions:

Option 1:
Oppo 103/105 - Will I still get full 192/24 and be able to achieve better sound than what I have through HDMI (the 3910 is great for audio playback)? I know the blu ray piece of it excels, I am just worried about whether the HDMI version of the 4308 will be able to handle all of my requirements (I think it's HDMI 1.3). I currently use the Denon Link (cat6). I've read the Denon Link provides better sound, but have never run my SACD through HDMI so don't know (or know if that's even possible)

Option 2:
Keep the PS3 as a blu ray and try to find the last year that Denon put out a universal blu ray player with the old version of Denon Link. Find a used unit and buy that for audio playback only (unless it happens to be better than PS3 for Blu Ray). If this is the better option, any recommendations?

Option 3:
Keep the 3910 for audio playback, ditch the Xbox 360 and PS3, and buy a PS4 for blu ray (games would be a bonus) and wait it out until I decide to upgrade my receiver. Then buy the best combo I can afford at that time (ETA would probably be a few years as I don't upgrade equipment that often).

Thanks in advance for your help on this.
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post #2 of 12 Old 02-09-2014, 07:14 AM - Thread Starter
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Just read a post that the PS4 is having trouble with Dolby TrueHD, so that might be off the table pending further research...

Maybe Xbox One?
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post #3 of 12 Old 02-09-2014, 07:16 AM
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Oppo 103D would seem to be the best option to me. It will do what you need at only $599.
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post #4 of 12 Old 02-09-2014, 07:24 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by phantom52 View Post

Oppo 103D would seem to be the best option to me. It will do what you need at only $599.

Thanks. And I would be able to utilize all the audio functionality through HDMI (this is where technology has gotten past me a bit.. confused.gif)?
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post #5 of 12 Old 02-09-2014, 07:25 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by paco62 View Post

Thanks. And I would be able to utilize all the audio functionality through HDMI (this is where technology has gotten past me a bit.. confused.gif)?

How about an excellent review for the Oppo 103D.

http://www.soundandvision.com/content/oppo-bdp-103d-blu-ray-3d-player
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post #6 of 12 Old 02-09-2014, 07:26 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by phantom52 View Post

How about an excellent review for the Oppo 103D.

http://www.soundandvision.com/content/oppo-bdp-103d-blu-ray-3d-player

I will check it out. Many thanks.
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post #7 of 12 Old 02-11-2014, 08:07 AM - Thread Starter
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Sounds like a great player. The review focused on the video piece of it. How does the audio compare to the 105? There is a huge price leap.
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post #8 of 12 Old 02-11-2014, 09:52 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by paco62 View Post

Sounds like a great player. The review focused on the video piece of it. How does the audio compare to the 105? There is a huge price leap.

The price increase is due to many components that were changed out from the 103. There are test reviews on the 105 also. Read some of them to see if they will effect your use and if they are something that's worth the price difference to you. All specs IIRRC are on the Oppo site. Good luck. I don't feel that you could wrong with either of them though. They are still the best all around disc players on the market, especially in their price range.
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post #9 of 12 Old 02-11-2014, 10:32 AM
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The OPPO BDP-103 is a very good player for audio at its price. The OPPO BDP-95 and BDP-105 have almost nothing in common with the 103; completely different in every respect.

The BDP-105 (and 95) are in a whole different class; they are arguably the best CD/SACD players for under $10,000. At $1200 the 105 is the bargain of the decade, and a must for any serious music lover.

I had an AYRE C5xe player for 6 years (it cost $6000), and IT was quite possibly the best you could get for a number of years.

When I heard the OPPO BDP-95, which I still have, I sold my Ayre, because the OPPO was better-sounding. My system consists of some of the best components that $25,000 can buy, so I think I can say with some assurance that this player is the real deal; sound to die for.

The SABRE DAC chips in the OPPO 95 and 105 are revolutionary. The sound quality is the realization of the "perfect sound' that Sony trumpeted 30+ years ago. They apparently didn't realize that it would take 30 years for affordable playback technology to be equal to the potential of the medium they had created. A lot of engineers had to sweat for a lot of years to get to this point.

I have CDs that are 30 years old that I assumed were poor-quality due to poor recording equipment or other technical reasons. They sounded like crap for years, on a number of different players. Guess what? They sound wonderful now on my BDP-95.

IMO all of the players you can get for under $10K or so are obsolete and irrelevant because of the OPPO 95/105. A lot of manufacturers are left holding the bag, because OPPO has undone them.

The 105 has now replaced the 95. There is no difference in them except for a couple of additional features on the 105. The audio circuits are absolutely identical in every respect according to technical people I talked to at OPPO; NO changes of any kind whatsoever.




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Originally Posted by paco62 View Post

Sounds like a great player. The review focused on the video piece of it. How does the audio compare to the 105? There is a huge price leap.
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post #10 of 12 Old 02-11-2014, 12:16 PM - Thread Starter
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phantom52 & commsysman - Thanks for your continued replies. I did read multiple reviews of the 103 and 105, but sometimes the opinions of everyday users has a bit more meat to it, so I appreciate the input and opinions. I don't updgrade equipment very often so when I do purchase, I try to future proof as much as possible. It sounds like both would be fantastic and my current system can benefit from either, as well as utilize the features. Given that the majority of my time with this system is listening to music or watching blu ray concerts, the 105 feels like it would still be top of the line several years down the road when I upgrade the receiver (2-4 probably). I will have to give them both serious consideration, but if I can swing it, the 105 may be coming my way in the near future. Thanks again for taking the time to respond.
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post #11 of 12 Old 03-07-2014, 02:40 PM - Thread Starter
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I am getting close to purchase and am trying to do more research to see which Oppo I should purchase, 103 or 105. I had my sights on the 105, but the more I read, the more it feels like I won't really utilize the audio benefits (and key difference between the 103/105) of the 105 (the Sabre DACs) unless I use analogue out to my Denon 4308ci. Not that I can't do that, and if it's worth it I will, but for arguments sake lets remove it from the discussion for a moment. That leaves two questions.

Question 1 - If I were to only use HDMI for audio and video into my Denon 4308ci, would there still be a sizeable difference in the audio between the 103 and 105, or if the Sabre DAC's are no longer in the picture, is the sound quality of the 105 worth the extra money?

Question 2 - If the real power of the 105 is the DAC, is the sound quality of the Sabre DAC using analogue out to the external in of my Denon 4308ci worth buying the 105 and then picking up a bunch of interconnects to utilize the DAC?

Thanks in advance for the continued help as I try to figure out the best approach.
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post #12 of 12 Old 03-07-2014, 04:55 PM
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For what you want your player to do the plain old BDP103 should be just fine. At $499 it is by far the best BD player in its price range and better than most that cost much more. Many reviews and none negative that I've read.
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