Best AV Receiver for under $1000? - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 40 Old 02-18-2014, 06:33 PM - Thread Starter
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Looking for the best AV receiver for under $1000?

I don't need anything more than 7.2 in reality, but 9.2 would be okay.

I currently have the Onkyo TX-SR805 and am really looking to upgrade for 4K, and 3D passthrough. I would like something dependable and of similar quality to the 805 if possible (130W per channel @ 8 Ohms).

I've heard everyone likes the X4000, but is that really the best right now?

Thanks,
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post #2 of 40 Old 02-18-2014, 06:38 PM - Thread Starter
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My current speaker set up is:

Center: Polk Audio CSiA5
Front R/L: Polk Audio RTiA5
Surround R/L: Polk Audio Monitor 40 Series ii
Surround Back R/L: Polk Audio RTiA6
Subwoofer: Polk Audio PSW505
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post #3 of 40 Old 02-18-2014, 10:00 PM
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post #4 of 40 Old 02-19-2014, 03:01 AM
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I recently purchased an x4000 and really like it. It is driving a 7.1 set of Klipsch RF series speakers. Call our sponsors here on the forum (AVS Science) they will hook you up.cool.gif

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post #5 of 40 Old 02-19-2014, 03:53 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Acousticality View Post

Looking for the best AV receiver for under $1000?

I don't need anything more than 7.2 in reality, but 9.2 would be okay.

I currently have the Onkyo TX-SR805 and am really looking to upgrade for 4K, and 3D passthrough. I would like something dependable and of similar quality to the 805 if possible (130W per channel @ 8 Ohms).

I've heard everyone likes the X4000, but is that really the best right now?

Thanks,

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post #6 of 40 Old 02-19-2014, 04:25 AM
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Yup. smile.gif

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post #7 of 40 Old 02-19-2014, 04:25 AM
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I suggest waiting until the 2014 models are out. Many will have HDMI 2.0 compliant ports which is the standard for 4K.
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post #8 of 40 Old 02-19-2014, 05:25 AM
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Any idea when the 2014 models will be introduced?
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post #9 of 40 Old 02-19-2014, 06:49 AM
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Is the X-4000 worth the extra $400 of the X-3000? Otherwise he could get the 3000 for 900 unless he gets hooked up. smile.gif
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post #10 of 40 Old 02-19-2014, 07:36 AM
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Originally Posted by TimWA View Post

Is the X-4000 worth the extra $400 of the X-3000? Otherwise he could get the 3000 for 900 unless he gets hooked up. smile.gif

Give AV Science a call and ask for JD for his opinion on this. Here is their contact information as I think you will find this call worthwhile: http://avscience.com/contact-us/
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post #11 of 40 Old 02-19-2014, 09:55 AM
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Originally Posted by KidHorn View Post

I suggest waiting until the 2014 models are out. Many will have HDMI 2.0 compliant ports which is the standard for 4K.
I tend to agree. There hasn't been a revolutionary hardware upgrade in the last few years. If most 2014 receivers offer hdmi 2 ports anything purchased right now will drop in value and compatibility a lot right away. Right now is a risky time to buy. Waiting a few more months is the way to go for most buyers.
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post #12 of 40 Old 02-19-2014, 10:39 AM
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For much better sound quality than Onkyo, I suggest you look into NAD or Cambridge Audio receivers.

As for 130 watts per channel, that is for two channels only, with a resistive load. That is deceptive and misleading, to say the least!

With speakers connected to all channels, the power available will be MUCH lower for each channel, and the distortion will be much higher.

A resistor is an easy load to drive; a speaker is not!

That is why cheaper receivers have more distortion than better-designed ones.

I wouldn't recommend ANY Onkyo, Pioneer, Yamaha or Sony AVR to anyone who cares 2 cents about sound quality.
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post #13 of 40 Old 02-19-2014, 11:00 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TimWA View Post

Is the X-4000 worth the extra $400 of the X-3000? Otherwise he could get the 3000 for 900 unless he gets hooked up. smile.gif

If you call JD as has been suggested a few times you'll find the x4000 much closer to that $900 price. Definitely wont be $1300.

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post #14 of 40 Old 02-19-2014, 11:05 AM
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Originally Posted by Chucka View Post

Any idea when the 2014 models will be introduced?

Typically from March through September. The lower end units are usually released first.
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post #15 of 40 Old 02-19-2014, 11:38 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by commsysman View Post

For much better sound quality than Onkyo, I suggest you look into NAD or Cambridge Audio receivers.
I took you advice and looked at CA. Their website won't even download the english version of the manual properly.
It won't even open past page 10 of 40. Typical of boutique brands. Less features and more bugs. And more power
doesn't guarantee less distortion at normal listening levels. Not everybody wants fan noise either.
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post #16 of 40 Old 02-19-2014, 11:39 AM
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Originally Posted by KidHorn View Post

I suggest waiting until the 2014 models are out. Many will have HDMI 2.0 compliant ports which is the standard for 4K.
I tend to agree. There hasn't been a revolutionary hardware upgrade in the last few years. If most 2014 receivers offer hdmi 2 ports anything purchased right now will drop in value and compatibility a lot right away. Right now is a risky time to buy. Waiting a few more months is the way to go for most buyers.

Sort of depends on whether you actually need HDMI 2.0 . I don't even see 4K Blu Ray on the horizon. I'm still buying Blu Rays. I'm going to need a mature 4K Blu Ray player ( 2nd or even 3rd generation ), at least 100 movies I care about available at a discounted price - not an early adopter inflated price ( after they work out the initial mastering problems for a new format ) and a 4K projector ( right now we have 3 choices - $15K, $28K and $180K ) that is worth upgrading to.

I see all those things coming together in 3 - 5 years. You'll be ready to upgrade again by that time even if you buy something today. In the mean time I'll enjoy my Denon 4520 !!

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post #17 of 40 Old 02-19-2014, 11:48 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chucka View Post

Any idea when the 2014 models will be introduced?

There are (2) intro times for NEW AVRs, January and September..
January is mainly the CES (Las Vegas) and the brands ship by March/April which timed to the Japanese brands' new fiscal accounting year. September is timed with the CEDIA (USA) and IFA (Europe) shows, note that the lower priced AVRs (SRP < $1000) are updated each year, and the higher cost AVRs are updated every other year...
The features & software within the higher cost AVRs are simply too comprehensive and costly to update annually, if one is upgraded it usually more of an ID change rather than technical adavancements..

Bottom line..
Every major AVR brand is losing $ and with the mature markets of North America and Europe being saturated, they simply can't change so frequently..


Just my $0.05.... 👍😉
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post #18 of 40 Old 02-19-2014, 12:03 PM
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Originally Posted by M Code View Post

There are (2) intro times for NEW AVRs, January and September..
January is mainly the CES (Las Vegas) and the brands ship by March/April which timed to the Japanese brands' new fiscal accounting year. September is timed with the CEDIA (USA) and IFA (Europe) shows, note that the lower priced AVRs (SRP < $1000) are updated each year, and the higher cost AVRs are updated every other year...
The features & software within the higher cost AVRs are simply too comprehensive and costly to update annually, if one is upgraded it usually more of an ID change rather than technical adavancements..

Bottom line..
Every major AVR brand is losing $ and with the mature markets of North America and Europe being saturated, they simply can't change so frequently..


Just my $0.05.... 👍😉

Denon/Marantz doesn't upgrade all their units every year, but it seems Yamaha, Onkyo, and Pioneer do. Internally there may or may not be much difference, but they at least give them new numbers.

I generally agree it's probably not cost effective to do an upgrade every year, but since HDMI 2.0 will likely be a good selling point (Whether it's really important or not is debatable, but most people will prefer to be 4K ready) I suspect manufacturers may upgrade all their models to it. If Yamaha has 2.0 ports and Pioneer doesn't, Pioneer may lose out on a lot of sales. It wouldn't make sense to put 2.0 ports on lower models and not on higher models, so I would guess if an upgrade to 2.0 is done, they'll do it for all models. I'm just guessing.
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post #19 of 40 Old 02-19-2014, 12:04 PM
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Originally Posted by kikkenit2 View Post

I took you advice and looked at CA. Their website won't even download the english version of the manual properly.
It won't even open past page 10 of 40. Typical of boutique brands. Less features and more bugs. And more power
doesn't guarantee less distortion at normal listening levels. Not everybody wants fan noise either.

I can download the manual with no problem at all. It did take almost 50 seconds for the full 40+ pages.

You may have a software or download speed problem there.

Home Theater magazine always has high praise for the Cambridge receivers they have reviewed over the past few years. They seem to think it has less distortion than most other receivers, and I would agree with that.

Cambridge Audio is hardly a "boutique brand'. They may not churn out as much crap as Sony and Onkyo, but they have a reputation for excellent reliability, and have been one of the top brands in Great Britain and Europe for many years.

The type of "whisper fan" they use should be inaudible unless the sound is muted, and it does not operate unless the heat sinks get rather hot anyway.

Sounds like a bunch of rather dubious and trivial concerns to me.
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post #20 of 40 Old 02-19-2014, 12:53 PM
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Originally Posted by KidHorn View Post

Denon/Marantz doesn't upgrade all their units every year, but it seems Yamaha, Onkyo, and Pioneer do. Internally there may or may not be much difference, but they at least give them new numbers.

I generally agree it's probably not cost effective to do an upgrade every year, but since HDMI 2.0 will likely be a good selling point (Whether it's really important or not is debatable, but most people will prefer to be 4K ready) I suspect manufacturers may upgrade all their models to it. If Yamaha has 2.0 ports and Pioneer doesn't, Pioneer may lose out on a lot of sales. It wouldn't make sense to put 2.0 ports on lower models and not on higher models, so I would guess if an upgrade to 2.0 is done, they'll do it for all models. I'm just guessing.

Once an AVR is designed, tooled and built as a working prototype it takes 6 months just for software debugging and agency certifications.
Regarding HDMI 2.0 & 4K capability, no question it is required in every AVR going forward..
For Marantz & Denon and respective AVR introductions, since both are part of the D&M Holdings who have lost major $ since the Bain Capitiol buyout they simply can't afford the costly AVR changeovers as frequently besides both brands are now using common processors and key components to save $....

Just my $0.05... 👍😉
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post #21 of 40 Old 02-19-2014, 01:56 PM
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Originally Posted by Acousticality View Post

My current speaker set up is:

Center: Polk Audio CSiA5
Front R/L: Polk Audio RTiA5
Surround R/L: Polk Audio Monitor 40 Series ii
Surround Back R/L: Polk Audio RTiA6
Subwoofer: Polk Audio PSW505

IMO you'd get more out of a sub upgrade than you will out of a $1K AVR.

Klipsch RF-62II, RC-500, RS-400, SVS PC12+,
Def Tech SC8000
Harman Kardon AVR 1600
PS3, Apple TV, Sharp 70" Qattron
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post #22 of 40 Old 02-19-2014, 02:27 PM
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Originally Posted by commsysman View Post

I can download the manual with no problem at all. It did take almost 50 seconds for the full 40+ pages.

You may have a software or download speed problem there.

Home Theater magazine always has high praise for the Cambridge receivers they have reviewed over the past few years. They seem to think it has less distortion than most other receivers, and I would agree with that.

Cambridge Audio is hardly a "boutique brand'. They may not churn out as much crap as Sony and Onkyo, but they have a reputation for excellent reliability, and have been one of the top brands in Great Britain and Europe for many years.

The type of "whisper fan" they use should be inaudible unless the sound is muted, and it does not operate unless the heat sinks get rather hot anyway.

Sounds like a bunch of rather dubious and trivial concerns to me.
I'm using win 7 64 bit with internet explorer 11.0.3. I just downloaded several pdf manuals from 5 different mainstream companies no problem in the last few days. Even 250 page denon manuals. The CA 751 azur download locks up my computer 10 times in a row over 3 days. Weird. And pretty lame.

By boutique I don't mean new. I mean limited models and only expensive stuff. The fact is Home Theater/Sound & Vision sings praise for almost every model/brand of receiver they test. Even Sony. Onkyo I don't like so much (heat/reliability). NAD & Cambridge do make good products. You just pay a lot more for what you get and have to do without important features/connections. The dirty secret is every brand puts out super clean audio quality these days. Very few people need 100 watts rms to 7 channels. For $1000 the X4000 has better overall value than what CA offers. This thread wasn't about sony or onkyo was it?
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post #23 of 40 Old 02-19-2014, 03:58 PM
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Originally Posted by kikkenit2 View Post

 The fact is Home Theater/Sound & Vision sings praise for almost every model/brand of receiver they test.

C.A AVRs have quirks that are not reported by reviewers.

 

Quick search on this forum

http://www.avsforum.com/t/1443173/owners-thread-cambridge-audio-651r-751r/480#post_24253023

http://www.avsforum.com/t/1443173/owners-thread-cambridge-audio-651r-751r/480#post_24312822

 

Cheers

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post #24 of 40 Old 02-19-2014, 04:01 PM
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Exactly. Thank you. Every time I try to read the forums on boutique brands, they are so bug ridden, why bother?
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post #25 of 40 Old 02-19-2014, 05:06 PM
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IMO you'd get more out of a sub upgrade than you will out of a $1K AVR.

I agree that a good sub would make a lot more sense.

Btw, what is wrong with your current AVR that you want to change?
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post #26 of 40 Old 02-19-2014, 07:10 PM - Thread Starter
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I agree that a good sub would make a lot more sense.

Btw, what is wrong with your current AVR that you want to change?

It's just dated, no 3D or 4k pass through support (my TV uses polarized glasses in 3D mode to make split screen games full screen for each player and you cant see the other split screen). No MHL. No Wi-Fi or Bluetooth connectivity.
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post #27 of 40 Old 02-19-2014, 07:13 PM - Thread Starter
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IMO you'd get more out of a sub upgrade than you will out of a $1K AVR.
What sub upgrades would you recommend?
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post #28 of 40 Old 02-19-2014, 07:32 PM - Thread Starter
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I agree that a good sub would make a lot more sense.

Btw, what is wrong with your current AVR that you want to change?
What sub upgrades would you recommend?
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post #29 of 40 Old 02-19-2014, 07:48 PM
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What sub upgrades would you recommend?

For the same 1000 you could get a pair of SVS PB1000s, a single HSU VTF-15, a PSA XV15, SVS pb2000, the latter two being $800.

Or get a $400 AVR if you need the 3d pass through and a $600 sub like the SVS pb12NSD (while still available on close out) or a Rythmik LVR12.

Any. Of the subs mentioned would be a huge upgrade.

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post #30 of 40 Old 02-19-2014, 08:00 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Kini62 View Post

For the same 1000 you could get a pair of SVS PB1000s, a single HSU VTF-15, a PSA XV15, SVS pb2000, the latter two being $800.

Or get a $400 AVR if you need the 3d pass through and a $600 sub like the SVS pb12NSD (while still available on close out) or a Rythmik LVR12.

Any. Of the subs mentioned would be a huge upgrade.
Well I currently have the Pioneer SC-1323-K sitting in a box in my living room. I got it on sale on Amazon for $599. but wasn't that impressed with the sound when compared to my Onkyo 805 so I'm thinking of sending it back.

Do you think the SVS PB12NSD being a sealed subwoofer would be better than the SVS PB1000?
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