The official Dolby Atmos thread (home theater version) - Page 109 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #3241 of 27195 Old 08-07-2014, 08:47 AM
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Originally Posted by harrybnbad View Post
to me just kicking their current flagship avr to the curb just sounds wrong...........
While not a flagship model, I'll be going back to 5.1 with front heights, at least for now.
In our room native 5.1 sounds better than non-native 7.1 so I'll use what I have and maybe pick up a couple wall mounts and attach my spare surrounds to the back of my XD screen frame.
This should remove the urge to go Atmos for a while until I can figure out what do do about the crappy ceiling height.

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Last edited by brwsaw; 08-07-2014 at 09:07 AM.
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post #3242 of 27195 Old 08-07-2014, 09:17 AM
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Originally Posted by harrybnbad View Post
Ya, I too feel the same way... I had my denon 4520 less than a year. While I love the neo:x 11.2. Seems there should be some way to get even 7.2.2 out of it somehow. But I guess it just doesn't have chip setup for any type of atmos. I'd even be willing to send it to denon and pay say 500 bucks to have something upgraded inside so I can atleast add 2 channels up top and center.......to me just kicking their current flagship avr to the curb just sounds wrong..........

Even add some stand alone usb, slash denon link type box to give a few channels of atmos....
I also just last year bought new gear and when i bought them i didn't have a clue that Atmos was even on the horizon. when i saw the announcement, Atmos was comming this Fall, I was Pissed that i would have to upgrade once again to a new AVR to enjoy atmos. that's why i will most likely just get the TX-NR737 for now to try it out in my Den, being its such a small room that doesn't need a lot of power. 5.2.2 will be just fine for me and being a first generation AVR i will not get a flag ship one as i know there will be upgrades coming

My main setup Onkyo TX-NR 1030 7.2.4 /Onkyo M-5010 Amplifier for top middle/ Samsung PN60E8000 / Directv genie / Panasonic 3D blu-ray Bic Acoustech speakers,MICCA M-8S FH/TM on wall / in ceiling speakers / 2 Bic F12 subs
10' X 15' DEN Onkyo TX-NR 737 5.2.2 Atmos / Acoustic Audio 151B Indoor/Outdoor Speakers top middle on Ceiling Speakers/ Samsung PN51F5500 / Directv Genie / Panasonic 3D blu-ray /
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post #3243 of 27195 Old 08-07-2014, 09:21 AM
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Originally Posted by harrybnbad View Post
Ya, I too feel the same way... I had my denon 4520 less than a year. While I love the neo:x 11.2. Seems there should be some way to get even 7.2.2 out of it somehow. But I guess it just doesn't have chip setup for any type of atmos. I'd even be willing to send it to denon and pay say 500 bucks to have something upgraded inside so I can atleast add 2 channels up top and center.......to me just kicking their current flagship avr to the curb just sounds wrong..........

Even add some stand alone usb, slash denon link type box to give a few channels of atmos....
harrybnbad/others - (I hope this does not come across wrong.)
and you've gotten use out of your 4520, and can in the future....it's a great AVR!

maybe it's time for many of us with really great current AVR's to step back, take some deep breaths, and slow down on the urge to jump onto Atmos ....
(I'm a fellow 4520 owner with 11.2 also since Jan-2013)
Sure, if you are on the downslope of your AVR, say it's already +3 years use then planning for the object sound (atmos/other) upgrade as a HT hobbyist makes sense.

Heck - my family and I watched Divergent 2 nights ago and the 4520 processing to NeoX with the 7ch bed plus added front height/wides sounded superb, blows me away every time I watch a blu-ray.

IMO, we HT hobbyist need (not just harrybnbad but many here, including me) a "time out" from upgrading until 3-4 years since last major one.....let the newness flush itself out and all that.

No need for buyers/builders remorse, enjoy what we have and realize how truly fortunate we are compared to so many others.

fwiw, I'm upgrading in 2016/2017 4k pj , new object sound capable AVR, AT screen, baffle wall, speakers, etc.
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post #3244 of 27195 Old 08-07-2014, 09:34 AM
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Originally Posted by brwsaw View Post
While not a flagship model, I'll be going back to 5.1 with front heights, at least for now.
In our room native 5.1 sounds better than non-native 7.1 so I'll use what I have and maybe pick up a couple wall mounts and attach my spare surrounds to the back of my XD screen frame.
This should remove the urge to go Atmos for a while until I can figure out what do do about the crappy ceiling height.
Thats what i'm doing right now with my TX-NR616 i have no room for back speakers so i mounted two front high speakers up near the ceiling toed down toward my MLP, my room is only 15 x 10 feet and i'm sitting against the back wall with no place to put back speakers so i'm using front Highs and i'm amazed at how good it sounds in there. the sound envelops you and you do get phantom sounds coming from the ceiling. I will enjoy this for now, till my urge to go to Atmos get the better of me and get a new AVR
i watched Divergent when it came out the other night i thought the sound was incredible

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post #3245 of 27195 Old 08-07-2014, 10:06 AM
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Originally Posted by erwinfrombelgium View Post
24.1.10 seems a bit of overemphasizing on the ground level part.
I think most people are missing the main thing here... The 24 positions are most likely not meant to be used all of them, they are to be many enough for you to with good approximation to select which ones you are using.

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post #3246 of 27195 Old 08-07-2014, 10:20 AM
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Originally Posted by harrybnbad View Post
Ya, I too feel the same way... I had my denon 4520 less than a year. While I love the neo:x 11.2. Seems there should be some way to get even 7.2.2 out of it somehow. But I guess it just doesn't have chip setup for any type of atmos. I'd even be willing to send it to denon and pay say 500 bucks to have something upgraded inside so I can atleast add 2 channels up top and center.......to me just kicking their current flagship avr to the curb just sounds wrong..........
Well, nobody is forcing you to kick your AVR to the curb. And if you are SOOOOO interested in Atmos that you are willing to ship it do Denon and pay them hundreds of dollars to upgrade the hardware..... why not simply sell the 4520 and put that money into an X5200 instead?

Technology moves quickly. Deal with it. The AVR-4520CI was relaeased two years ago. Expecting it to be able to support a major hardware/software advance is unrealistic. I never understand the hand wringing and self righteous outrage that happens every year when a new feature appears and owners of the models from the last year or two feel entitled to the new features. You have two choices: (1) don't get caught up in the urgency of the upgrade cycle and just be happy with what you have, or (2) get caught up in the urgency of the upgrade cycle and decide how much resources you are willing to devote to staying current. That's your choice, nobody is forcing you to do either one.

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post #3247 of 27195 Old 08-07-2014, 10:27 AM
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Originally Posted by Nightlord View Post
I think most people are missing the main thing here... The 24 positions are most likely not meant to be used all of them, they are to be many enough for you to with good approximation to select which ones you are using.
who in there right minds will use this many speakers for home use unless you have a small theater in your house most of us will have small rooms or living rooms and 7.2.2 or 5.2.4 will be just fine????

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post #3248 of 27195 Old 08-07-2014, 10:29 AM
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Originally Posted by bargervais View Post
who in there right minds will use this many speakers for home use unless you have a small theater in your house most of us will have small rooms or living rooms and 7.2.2 or 5.2.4 will be just fine????
It's a theoretical maximum. Obviously it's not realistic or relevant for most "typical" home theater setups, even if you have a dedicated room. Considering the processors needed to run this type of setup cost 5 figures it's something that only people with VERY high end home theaters would ever consider.

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post #3249 of 27195 Old 08-07-2014, 10:30 AM
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Originally Posted by batpig View Post
Well, nobody is forcing you to kick your AVR to the curb. And if you are SOOOOO interested in Atmos that you are willing to ship it do Denon and pay them hundreds of dollars to upgrade the hardware..... why not simply sell the 4520 and put that money into an X5200 instead?

Technology moves quickly. Deal with it. The AVR-4520CI was relaeased two years ago. Expecting it to be able to support a major hardware/software advance is unrealistic. I never understand the hand wringing and self righteous outrage that happens every year when a new feature appears and owners of the models from the last year or two feel entitled to the new features. You have two choices: (1) don't get caught up in the urgency of the upgrade cycle and just be happy with what you have, or (2) get caught up in the urgency of the upgrade cycle and decide how much resources you are willing to devote to staying current. That's your choice, nobody is forcing you to do either one.
ouch

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10' X 15' DEN Onkyo TX-NR 737 5.2.2 Atmos / Acoustic Audio 151B Indoor/Outdoor Speakers top middle on Ceiling Speakers/ Samsung PN51F5500 / Directv Genie / Panasonic 3D blu-ray /
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post #3250 of 27195 Old 08-07-2014, 10:33 AM
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Originally Posted by batpig View Post
It's a theoretical maximum. Obviously it's not realistic or relevant for most "typical" home theater setups, even if you have a dedicated room. Considering the processors needed to run this type of setup cost 5 figures it's something that only people with VERY high end home theaters would ever consider.
It needs quite the room if it would not look ridiculous as well. I'm building with 13 'arounds' and adding nine more would place them silly close to eachother...

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post #3251 of 27195 Old 08-07-2014, 10:33 AM
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Originally Posted by batpig View Post
It's a theoretical maximum. Obviously it's not realistic or relevant for most "typical" home theater setups, even if you have a dedicated room. Considering the processors needed to run this type of setup cost 5 figures it's something that only people with VERY high end home theaters would ever consider.
understand It's a theoretical maximum but some may think to keep up with the jones i always want the latest and baddest that i can afford

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10' X 15' DEN Onkyo TX-NR 737 5.2.2 Atmos / Acoustic Audio 151B Indoor/Outdoor Speakers top middle on Ceiling Speakers/ Samsung PN51F5500 / Directv Genie / Panasonic 3D blu-ray /
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post #3252 of 27195 Old 08-07-2014, 10:40 AM
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I think you would need a HUGE room to make anything beyond a 9.1.6 speaker layout really worth it, imho.

Any more than that and the gap between speaker angles is too small making all the extra speakers (and effort) rather trivial.

Not that it isn't fun to think about but I'm just a very practical person.

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post #3253 of 27195 Old 08-07-2014, 10:48 AM
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Originally Posted by Scott Simonian View Post
I think you would need a HUGE room to make anything beyond a 9.1.6 speaker layout really worth it, imho.
Well, I'm using "11.6" speakerwise for 7.1 already, so...

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post #3254 of 27195 Old 08-07-2014, 10:58 AM
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Consumers IMHO have learned to be prudent with new technology, first with 3D, currently with 4K. So while replicating Atmos theater effects in one's home theater might be a desirable goal, usually first generation products are compromise these days IMHO.

Look at what TDG survey told us about the current consumer marketplace when someone is trying to sell a new UDTV for example. If only 17% of consumers polled are aware of 4K for example, with 6% willing to spend $1500 on a UDTV, and 3% to spend $2000 on a UDTV.

How difficult do you think selling to the same consumers Dolby Atmos for home? What percentage of consumers do you think are familiar with Dolby Atmos at this time, and then would willing to buy a upscale AVR with Atmos processing, along with necessary speakers or home theater modifications to take full advantage of BD's with Atmos soundtracks? I wonder?

Mind you I am not being negative just playing Devil's advocate.
None of that has anything to do with Dolby Atmos. And I am not being negative either - just playing Devil's advocate.

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post #3255 of 27195 Old 08-07-2014, 10:59 AM
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Originally Posted by Nightlord View Post
Well, I'm using "11.6" speakerwise for 7.1 already, so...
That's because you are set up for NEO:X which is an 11.1 layout. I'm not counting subs which is irrelevant for Atmos talk as it is.

When I said 9.1.6 that will include your wides and your front heights. Add in two more pairs of overhead surrounds and there you have it. You can call that 15.6 if you so incline but it's the same as my 9.1.6 which is relating to the layout.

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post #3256 of 27195 Old 08-07-2014, 11:07 AM
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Originally Posted by mtbdudex View Post
harrybnbad/others - (I hope this does not come across wrong.)
and you've gotten use out of your 4520, and can in the future....it's a great AVR!

maybe it's time for many of us with really great current AVR's to step back, take some deep breaths, and slow down on the urge to jump onto Atmos ....
(I'm a fellow 4520 owner with 11.2 also since Jan-2013)
Sure, if you are on the downslope of your AVR, say it's already +3 years use then planning for the object sound (atmos/other) upgrade as a HT hobbyist makes sense.

Heck - my family and I watched Divergent 2 nights ago and the 4520 processing to NeoX with the 7ch bed plus added front height/wides sounded superb, blows me away every time I watch a blu-ray.

IMO, we HT hobbyist need (not just harrybnbad but many here, including me) a "time out" from upgrading until 3-4 years since last major one.....let the newness flush itself out and all that.

No need for buyers/builders remorse, enjoy what we have and realize how truly fortunate we are compared to so many others.

fwiw, I'm upgrading in 2016/2017 4k pj , new object sound capable AVR, AT screen, baffle wall, speakers, etc.
Step back? Not a chance!
Dolby ATMOS is one of the best new features in audio to come out in years!
I've been to ATMOS theaters and they are awesome.
The world is falling apart and I plan to have ATMOS installed in my HT on day one!
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post #3257 of 27195 Old 08-07-2014, 11:19 AM
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Originally Posted by Scott Simonian View Post
That's because you are set up for NEO:X which is an 11.1 layout. I'm not counting subs which is irrelevant for Atmos talk as it is.
No, if I count my possible neo:x/dsx setup I have 15. I meant what I said, I have 11 speakers for 7 channels - three speakers each for the side surrounds.

I agree on the subs, just put the correct number for clarity.

I also have 11 speakers (with four ported 10" subs) in out tiny tv-room upstairs, same there... Three for each side surround.

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post #3258 of 27195 Old 08-07-2014, 11:27 AM
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Okay. Gotcha. That's pretty cool but (just giving some constructive criticism) you'd benefit from eliminating one of those pairs. At least in the back. You have two speakers within a foot. Might as well be a single speaker back there or just the two in the back corners. I'm sure you like how it sounds so I won't argue with you. Just my opinion.

I like your style, sir.

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post #3259 of 27195 Old 08-07-2014, 11:38 AM
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Originally Posted by Scott Simonian View Post
Okay. Gotcha. That's pretty cool but (just giving some constructive criticism) you'd benefit from eliminating one of those pairs. At least in the back. You have two speakers within a foot. Might as well be a single speaker back there or just the two in the back corners. I'm sure you like how it sounds so I won't argue with you. Just my opinion.

I like your style, sir.
The two in the back are the back surrounds and yes, they should be slightly better spaced, they probably are compare to when the pic was taken too. ( All should be equdistant angle-wise, but I was lucky enough with the room as it is, I cannot put a speaker onto my son's bedroom door. )

( You actually have a higher need for many speakers in such a tiny room as this than in a larger to avoid localizing them. )

They actually don't sound anything at all as I cannot locate them, so I'm happy. Otherwise, given their cost, I would have downsized and moved some of them to the big cinema.

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post #3260 of 27195 Old 08-07-2014, 11:50 AM
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Originally Posted by Nightlord View Post
No, if I count my possible neo:x/dsx setup I have 15. I meant what I said, I have 11 speakers for 7 channels - three speakers each for the side surrounds.

I agree on the subs, just put the correct number for clarity.

I also have 11 speakers (with four ported 10" subs) in out tiny tv-room upstairs, same there... Three for each side surround.
i went and visited the Larch theater and that's a nice theater you built, wish i had the time to do something like that..
Great Job

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post #3261 of 27195 Old 08-07-2014, 12:07 PM
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i went and visited the Larch theater and that's a nice theater you built, wish i had the time to do something like that..
Great Job
Thanks. Still building, though... Just cleaned a paintbrush. But I hope to plug the power in during this fall.

Time... Yes... Several hours each evening for 2,5 years. 3000 hours? Given my professional hourly rate, I definitely couldn't have afforded myself.

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post #3262 of 27195 Old 08-07-2014, 12:36 PM
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Per Scott Simonian


"Not that it isn't fun to think about but I'm just a very practical person."


perhaps true as a public confession for most here but personally and secretly also for many, to quote mick Jagger: "meantime, I was still thinkin"
9.x.4 or 9.x.6 for about 15 x 19 space, willing to settle for 7.x.4

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www.avsforum.com/forum/155-diy-speakers-subs/1485120-submaximus-large-front-loaded-horn
http://www.avsforum.com/forum/155-di...orn-build.html
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post #3263 of 27195 Old 08-07-2014, 03:05 PM
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For me 9.2.2 will work great.

- Three B&W 800D2 (L/C/R)
- Four B&W 802D2 (SRWR/SR/SL/SWL)
- Two B&W 805D2 (SRB/SLB)
- Two in-ceiling right over the seats

Two JLAudio Subs Fathom F113
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post #3264 of 27195 Old 08-07-2014, 03:46 PM
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Originally Posted by ss9001 View Post
As with all new technology, it will gradually trickle down to more (& lower priced) models in a year or 2
And a few years from now it will also be a bit more mature - I expect some growing pains with something this new. My Onkyo 3010 will certainly stay amazingly awesome for a few more years.
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post #3265 of 27195 Old 08-07-2014, 03:54 PM
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Originally Posted by htpcforever View Post
And a few years from now it will also be a bit more mature - I expect some growing pains with something this new. My Onkyo 3010 will certainly stay amazingly awesome for a few more years.
If the content is there. Studios? Are you listening??

Listen up, studios! Just say "NO" to DNR and EE!!
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post #3266 of 27195 Old 08-07-2014, 03:55 PM
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If the content is there. Studios? Are you listening??
I've got a few bricks with some of my thoughts about that ready to send through their lobby windows.
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My Dual 18" LLT subs 120dB down to 10hz ***FOR SALE***

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post #3267 of 27195 Old 08-07-2014, 03:57 PM
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Originally Posted by Scott Simonian View Post
I've got a few bricks with some of my thoughts about that ready to send through their lobby windows.
It sounds like Scott needs a press release RIGHT NOW!! He's getting violent thoughts.

Listen up, studios! Just say "NO" to DNR and EE!!
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post #3268 of 27195 Old 08-07-2014, 03:59 PM
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Originally Posted by Dan Hitchman View Post
It sounds like Scott needs a press release RIGHT NOW!! He's getting violent thoughts.
Hopefully my fears will be put to rest in a few days.

My Dual 18" LLT subs 120dB down to 10hz ***FOR SALE***

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post #3269 of 27195 Old 08-07-2014, 04:44 PM
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Originally Posted by Scott Simonian View Post
Hopefully my fears will be put to rest in a few days.
In a few days ???????????

My main setup Onkyo TX-NR 1030 7.2.4 /Onkyo M-5010 Amplifier for top middle/ Samsung PN60E8000 / Directv genie / Panasonic 3D blu-ray Bic Acoustech speakers,MICCA M-8S FH/TM on wall / in ceiling speakers / 2 Bic F12 subs
10' X 15' DEN Onkyo TX-NR 737 5.2.2 Atmos / Acoustic Audio 151B Indoor/Outdoor Speakers top middle on Ceiling Speakers/ Samsung PN51F5500 / Directv Genie / Panasonic 3D blu-ray /
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post #3270 of 27195 Old 08-07-2014, 04:46 PM
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In a few days ???????????
The next Dolby announcement is supposed to be next week. Hopefully, that's when they'll start announcing the first wave of titles. They'll almost have to otherwise they're not going to hit their fall release target promise.

Listen up, studios! Just say "NO" to DNR and EE!!

Last edited by Dan Hitchman; 08-07-2014 at 04:52 PM.
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