Should my new receiver be Yamaha RX-V775WA or something else? - AVS Forum
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Old 06-22-2014, 03:26 PM - Thread Starter
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Should my new receiver be Yamaha RX-V775WA or something else?

Greetings!

I’m shopping for a new receiver to replace my trusty Onkyo TX-DS696, which has served me well for 10 years or so.

My first instinct was another Onkyo (perhaps the 818), but in reading the reviews, I’m seeing too many reports of HDMI board problems.

Pre-amp outs, at least for the front L&R, are a must, since I’m listening to a pair of very fine, but power-hungry, electrostatic speakers from the 1980’s. I was a real audiophile back then, before strollers, tooth fairies, driving lessons, and college bills. I still care more about the sound than I do the video.

I don’t need lots of bells and whistles, but it needs to sound good and be easy to operate. I’m leaning toward a Yamaha RX-V775WA.

Is that a good choice, or would you experts suggest something else?

Thanks!

Dave
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Old 06-22-2014, 05:17 PM
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Originally Posted by Dave in Houston View Post
Greetings!

I’m shopping for a new receiver to replace my trusty Onkyo TX-DS696, which has served me well for 10 years or so.

My first instinct was another Onkyo (perhaps the 818), but in reading the reviews, I’m seeing too many reports of HDMI board problems.

Pre-amp outs, at least for the front L&R, are a must, since I’m listening to a pair of very fine, but power-hungry, electrostatic speakers from the 1980’s. I was a real audiophile back then, before strollers, tooth fairies, driving lessons, and college bills. I still care more about the sound than I do the video.

I don’t need lots of bells and whistles, but it needs to sound good and be easy to operate. I’m leaning toward a Yamaha RX-V775WA.

Is that a good choice, or would you experts suggest something else?

Thanks!

Dave
I will not recommend any of the current Yamaha or Onkyo receivers. because the class D amplifiers they are using hurt my ears; bright and tinny.

They have gone cheap as possible on their amplifiers and power supplies, and the sound quality has gone down the tube IMO. They are also the worst choice for speakers like yours. They can become unstable and break into oscillation with electrostatic speakers.

I recommend the NAD T758, which has better designed circuits which will drive real speakers with much lower distortion levels. The sound is much much better, and it has plenty of power to run almost any speakers. It does have full preouts, but I think it has the current reserves to run your speakers without an additional amp.

Whatever you do, don't even LOOK at the manufacturer's claimed power levels, which are basically nonsense. That is a game they play to screw with us; don't play their game.

The key thing is distortion when driving a real speaker, which can be 100 times what is present when driving a simple resistor load on a test bench. Your speakers will drive a cheap receiver into high distortion levels, because electrostatics typically are quite capacitive at some frequencies, and need a well-designed amplifier with good current reserves like the NAD.

No one gives any specs on that, and that is what counts.

Short of connecting a pair of speakers and a $40,000 distortion analyzer, the best test for sound quality are those two sensitive things on either side of your head.

Everyone has an excellent pair of them, and they will tell you what you need to know if you listen carefully.

Cambridge Audio and Arcam also make good receivers, but they tend to be very expensive.

Last edited by commsysman; 06-22-2014 at 05:31 PM.
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Old 06-22-2014, 06:48 PM - Thread Starter
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Thanks for the input. I was hoping to keep the cost down a bit lower than $1000, but I guess in the greater scheme of things, a few hundred dollars is not such a big difference. I paid more than that for a tonearm, back in the day.

I do have a stereo power amp that's of the same vintage as the electrostats, and runs them very well. Does that make any difference in your recommendation?
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Old 06-23-2014, 11:22 AM
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Originally Posted by commsysman View Post
I will not recommend any of the current Yamaha or Onkyo receivers. because the class D amplifiers they are using hurt my ears; bright and tinny.

They have gone cheap as possible on their amplifiers and power supplies, and the sound quality has gone down the tube IMO. They are also the worst choice for speakers like yours. They can become unstable and break into oscillation with electrostatic speakers.

I recommend the NAD T758, which has better designed circuits which will drive real speakers with much lower distortion levels. The sound is much much better, and it has plenty of power to run almost any speakers. It does have full preouts, but I think it has the current reserves to run your speakers without an additional amp.

Whatever you do, don't even LOOK at the manufacturer's claimed power levels, which are basically nonsense. That is a game they play to screw with us; don't play their game.

The key thing is distortion when driving a real speaker, which can be 100 times what is present when driving a simple resistor load on a test bench. Your speakers will drive a cheap receiver into high distortion levels, because electrostatics typically are quite capacitive at some frequencies, and need a well-designed amplifier with good current reserves like the NAD.

No one gives any specs on that, and that is what counts.

Short of connecting a pair of speakers and a $40,000 distortion analyzer, the best test for sound quality are those two sensitive things on either side of your head.

Everyone has an excellent pair of them, and they will tell you what you need to know if you listen carefully.

Cambridge Audio and Arcam also make good receivers, but they tend to be very expensive.
How would you feel about the Yamaha receiver for someone who is not going to play at a very high volume and is just looking for something with decent upconversion, dynamic range reduction, and two hdmi outputs as something to allow my other devices to feed through my Xbox One. I am seeing some good deals on the RX-773WA and similar models with fewer features, and my budget is much less than this NAD receiver would allow.
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Old 06-23-2014, 03:26 PM
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Originally Posted by avs_n00b View Post
How would you feel about the Yamaha receiver for someone who is not going to play at a very high volume and is just looking for something with decent upconversion, dynamic range reduction, and two hdmi outputs as something to allow my other devices to feed through my Xbox One. I am seeing some good deals on the RX-773WA and similar models with fewer features, and my budget is much less than this NAD receiver would allow.
I don't like any Yamaha receiver at any price; not for your speakers.

I think they are very poorly designed and not good value for your money.

I am seeing the RX-773 for $670 on Amazon, and you can get the NAD T748 receiver for $600 several places.

You will have to check to see if it has all the functions and features you want, but it probably does; and IMO it will sound better at almost ANY volume level.

Amazon is also offering the Marantz SR5006 receiver for $650, and IMO that is much better than the Yamaha.

I don't know what model speakers you have, but with most electrostatics the issue is not so much the need for a lot of power; just an amplifier that will be stable with a highly capacitive load.

As I said, I think the Yamaha receivers have very unstable amplifiers, and therefore a very poor choice for that type of speaker.
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Old 06-23-2014, 04:05 PM
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Originally Posted by commsysman View Post
I don't like any Yamaha receiver at any price; not for your speakers.

I think they are very poorly designed and not good value for your money.

I am seeing the RX-773 for $670 on Amazon, and you can get the NAD T748 receiver for $600 several places.

You will have to check to see if it has all the functions and features you want, but it probably does; and IMO it will sound better at almost ANY volume level.

Amazon is also offering the Marantz SR5006 receiver for $650, and IMO that is much better than the Yamaha.

I don't know what model speakers you have, but with most electrostatics the issue is not so much the need for a lot of power; just an amplifier that will be stable with a highly capacitive load.

As I said, I think the Yamaha receivers have very unstable amplifiers, and therefore a very poor choice for that type of speaker.
And when did Yamaha start using Class D amps?
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Old 06-23-2014, 06:12 PM - Thread Starter
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I don't know what model speakers you have, but with most electrostatics the issue is not so much the need for a lot of power; just an amplifier that will be stable with a highly capacitive load.
The speakers are Acoustat 2+2. But my idea is to drive them not with the receiver, but with an old Hafler amp modified by an outfit called Musical Concepts. So if I buy the NAD, it would be the T758, since it has the preamp outs.

Then I would just try both ways, and see which I like more.

I'm going to see what I can learn about the Marantz receiver you mentioned. You prefer the NAD receivers, though?

By the way, another guy, avs_n00b, is also asking questions in this thread. I'm not him, I'm Dave in Houston.

Thanks again for sharing your smarts. I'm pretty ignorant about current A/V gear.
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Old 06-23-2014, 06:32 PM
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The C man is the only poster here that pushes nad and CA. Good luck finding any website or professional review that knocks Yamaha sound quality. Usually rated #1 on most sites. The room correction is a little weak and so is the internal multi-channel amp rating. That is meaningless when using preamp outs. Hello! Yamaha has so many more working features and less bugs than nad. It all boils down to price.

The Yamaha midlevel receiver with full preamp out can be had on sale. The 773 was pretty much sold out in January for $450 so $650 now is a joke. Then the 7065 sold out at the same price in February. About a month ago the 775 went for $450 at newegg. That was a real good deal. Again about sold out so price went up. The 777BT is about to be released so there may still be deals on the 775. Watch newegg.com. I have a 773. It will drive 7 speakers very loud and very clean no sweat. And will do even better with external amps. Go with Y. Marantz has a front preamp out model also.
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Old 06-23-2014, 09:59 PM
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The Yamaha is fine...I have a 773 and it is a solid AVR. It also has a full set of pre outs if you need mo powah.
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Old 06-24-2014, 06:51 AM
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The Yamaha is fine...I have a 773 and it is a solid AVR. It also has a full set of pre outs if you need mo powah.
If you are using that amp for powering your speakers a Yamaha model with pre-outs will work just fine. Look for a bargain on the 775WA and it will work just fine. Also look into the older Aventage line with pre-outs and its even better. There are deals out there on these models also. Yamaha is still #1 for reliability and longevity. Denon and Marantz seem to be going into the direction of Onkyo. Seems there are more problems with their newer models than in previous years. The buyout of those brands seem to me to be going in the wrong direction. JMHO. After a quick google found an 820 for a good price.

http://www.amazon.com/Yamaha-Aventag.../dp/B0087KGMUC

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Old 06-24-2014, 07:23 PM - Thread Starter
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Thanks, everyone, for the input. Since I'm still using speakers and an amp from the 80's, you can tell I don't need to have the latest and greatest thing. In fact, I'm actually a late adopter when it comes to technology.

Phantom, do you think those Aventage models were of better quality than the newer Yamaha pieces?
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Old 06-24-2014, 07:46 PM
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Last time I checked, Yamaha was not using class D. Does anyone have proof any of their receivers use it? It's weight seems to indicate a typical weight for Yamaha receivers that were designed around a class AB design ( large transformer for power supply, with typical heat sinking for class AB efficiency.)

I have been very happy with Yamaha over the years. Some people who posted have a track record for bashing Yamaha, which could indicate an unfair bias against them.

It's unclear if Adventage models are superior in sound, I have my doubts. In quality, they may be better as they used to have a better warranty.

"But this one goes up to 11"

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Old 06-25-2014, 09:50 AM
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Originally Posted by Dave in Houston View Post
Thanks, everyone, for the input. Since I'm still using speakers and an amp from the 80's, you can tell I don't need to have the latest and greatest thing. In fact, I'm actually a late adopter when it comes to technology.

Phantom, do you think those Aventage models were of better quality than the newer Yamaha pieces?
Well they do have a fifth foot also. As far as I know the build quality is the same until you get to the upper two models. And then you get a better version of YPAO and better DAC's. Review for 775WA below.

http://www.soundandvision.com/conten...wa-av-receiver

Last edited by phantom52; 06-25-2014 at 09:59 AM. Reason: added review
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Old 06-25-2014, 01:08 PM
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Originally Posted by Dave in Houston View Post
Thanks, everyone, for the input. Since I'm still using speakers and an amp from the 80's, you can tell I don't need to have the latest and greatest thing. In fact, I'm actually a late adopter when it comes to technology.

Phantom, do you think those Aventage models were of better quality than the newer Yamaha pieces?
As long as the speakers are in good working condition go with that. If they don't sound right/good then upgrade. The Aventage and V line are the same age. The A830 is similar to 775 with 2 more hdmi inputs for a lot more money. Maybe slightly cleaner but same watts etc. The 775 is generally the lowest price receiver any brand with main channel preamp outs.
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