AccuEQ Vs Audyssey - Page 4 - AVS Forum
Forum Jump: 
 158Likes
Reply
 
Thread Tools
post #91 of 769 Old 08-05-2014, 03:28 AM
AVS Special Member
 
NorthSky's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Canada - West Island: Vancouver, South Direction: Go East
Posts: 2,427
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1069 Post(s)
Liked: 377
Quote:
Originally Posted by fatbottom View Post
IQ?

Celestion A1's in the Hi-Fi. Audiolab 8000Q stereo pre-amp.
IQ is short for 'Evolution', the model of your speakers. ...That's what I read in your sig.

... Krell Evolution 900e x 7

Bests, ~ Robert § (Bob)

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
NorthSky is online now  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #92 of 769 Old 08-05-2014, 03:39 AM
AVS Special Member
 
fatbottom's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2003
Location: UK
Posts: 3,782
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 413 Post(s)
Liked: 185
lol if you think my sig is serious... $140,000 in amplifiers with Bose Jewels. I think I'll just use subwoofer EQ, can't be bothered change av pre-stereo pre just to get EQ which I may not like.

antimode 8033 cinema on the ht, might pickup another cinema or a S-II for the hifi.

Krell Evolution 900e x 7

Bose Jewel speakers.

 

Jealous of my speakers?

fatbottom is online now  
post #93 of 769 Old 08-05-2014, 03:50 AM
Member
 
TomScrut's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 24
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 9 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by fatbottom View Post
lol if you think my sig is serious... $140,000 in amplifiers with Bose Jewels. I think I'll just use subwoofer EQ, can't be bothered change av pre-stereo pre just to get EQ which I may not like.

antimode 8033 cinema on the ht, might pickup another cinema or a S-II for the hifi.
I thought it was a pretty good joke...

Quote:
Originally Posted by NorthSky View Post
But Anthem is not yet on that bandwagon; probably don't matter anyway. Dolby Atmos is not all end to all ends.
- Kal (Rubinson) said it best before; he won't be shedding tears, ...from overhead.
I aren't too fussed about Atmos for now, I haven't got room for highs and I don't think B&W will be making upward firing speakers for the 800 series anytime soon!

AccuEQ not doing the fronts would suit me as I would just run them straight into the CP800 and that would apply the EQ I have set for stereo listening. I wish my 818 would skip the EQ on the fronts so I can do the same (like Marantz do on the 8801 I used to own before I needed money to buy speakers).
TomScrut is offline  
post #94 of 769 Old 08-05-2014, 03:53 AM
AVS Special Member
 
fatbottom's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2003
Location: UK
Posts: 3,782
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 413 Post(s)
Liked: 185
Quote:
I wish my 818 would skip the EQ on the fronts so I can do the same (like Marantz do on the 8801 I used to own before I needed money to buy speakers).
You can do that on Yamaha use "front" mode. It EQ's center and sides rears but leaves L/R alone.

Krell Evolution 900e x 7

Bose Jewel speakers.

 

Jealous of my speakers?

fatbottom is online now  
post #95 of 769 Old 08-05-2014, 04:05 AM
Member
 
TomScrut's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 24
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 9 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by fatbottom View Post
You can do that on Yamaha use "front" mode. It EQ's center and sides rears but leaves L/R alone.
I know that a lot of manufacturers do, even with Audyssey, but Onkyo chose not to do it. Which is very odd considering their new decision to bypass the fronts!
TomScrut is offline  
post #96 of 769 Old 08-05-2014, 05:24 AM
AVS Addicted Member
 
kbarnes701's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Main Listening Positon
Posts: 17,850
Mentioned: 5 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1383 Post(s)
Liked: 1677
Quote:
Originally Posted by fatbottom View Post
My hifi doesn't have a EQ nor does it have acoustic treatments. Sounds great.
How do you know?

I'm not been flippant - how do you know that it sounds as good as it could sound?
IgorZep likes this.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
kbarnes701 is offline  
post #97 of 769 Old 08-05-2014, 11:25 AM
Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2014
Posts: 138
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 86 Post(s)
Liked: 22
Quote:
Originally Posted by fatbottom View Post
Does it matter what Onkyo do? I wouldn't buy a Onkyo AVR anyway.
Then why did you even bother to post in this thread? Troll much?
67jason and TomScrut like this.
htpcforever is offline  
post #98 of 769 Old 08-05-2014, 02:24 PM
Advanced Member
 
IntelliVolume's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Posts: 843
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 190 Post(s)
Liked: 45
Quote:
Originally Posted by sdurani View Post
Don't believe what? This isn't religion; i.e., even if you "don't believe" that EQ can pull down a large peak it won't stop EQ from pulling down a large peak. That will let you hear sounds previously masked by the peak.

To many, this IS in fact religion...


Quote:
Can't you pile up a stack of books or something so that the Audyssey mic sits at your approximate ear level?

From what I have been told and what I have read, THAT wouldn't work, either; you need a tripod or mic stand and I don't have one (as of now).


Quote:
Why are you talking about other people's homes? Why haven't you tried it in your home? What's the worst that could happen? You don't like the results and turn off the EQ. But at least give it a try to see if the auto-calibration gets the levels and distances correct, and whether the EQ improves the overall sound.

What are you TALKING about? How do you know that I HAVEN'T tried this in my own home? I HAVE, and consistently didn't like the results Audyssey yielded; I have my distances and levels correct.


Quote:
Your receiver doesn't have the processing horsepower to decode MasterAudio/TrueHD tracks AND also apply Audyssey. One thing you could try is let your player do the decoding (change it's HDMI output setting from bitstream to PCM) so that your receiver is no longer burdened with that task.

Yes, in fact the receiver can't do that, from all accounts (ridiculous mishap in my opinion even if the processing power is something that "should be expected" at this price point) -- but I am NOT going to send PCM signals as decoded by my OPPO player, as it is one of the main reasons I upgraded to this BDP-83 from my first-generation Panasonic player, which didn't have the ability to bitstream the high resolution codecs...so that's off the table, period.

IntelliVolume is offline  
post #99 of 769 Old 08-05-2014, 02:25 PM
Advanced Member
 
IntelliVolume's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Posts: 843
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 190 Post(s)
Liked: 45
Quote:
Originally Posted by htpcforever View Post
Then why did you even bother to post in this thread? Troll much?

Precisely...

IntelliVolume is offline  
post #100 of 769 Old 08-05-2014, 02:29 PM
Advanced Member
 
IntelliVolume's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Posts: 843
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 190 Post(s)
Liked: 45
Quote:
Originally Posted by kbarnes701 View Post
But you are not hearing your speakers as you put it - you are hearing your speakers plus the huge distortions caused by the room. In a typical room you will see swings in frequency response of 20 or 30 dB, hugely distorting the sound your speakers make, unless the room influences are tamed. You can tame them with acoustic treatments and speaker placement or EQ, or both. Professional sound studios use both.

That may be SCIENTIFICALLY so, but I agree with and stick to the sentiments suggested by some sites that "manual calibration is preferred" and so is "leaving room correction algorithms off" because those with "reasonably high quality loudspeakers" can actually be doing more harm than good by applying room correction software and settings; there are more than a few sites I have stumbled across that actually recommend this. At any rate, I just feel more comfortable leaving EQ off and hearing -- TO MY EARS and MY BELIEFS -- what the soundtrack is putting out without any kind of "seasoning" from the GEAR ITSELF...

IntelliVolume is offline  
post #101 of 769 Old 08-05-2014, 02:34 PM
Advanced Member
 
IntelliVolume's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Posts: 843
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 190 Post(s)
Liked: 45
Quote:
Originally Posted by kbarnes701 View Post
How do you do that? To apply EQ manually requires measuring equipment such as REW, a calibrated mic, some form of parametric or other form of equalisation and the knowledge to use it all. It is a lot easier for most people to run an automated EQ system. I realise that 2EQ is very basic, but you seem to be against the whole idea of using automated EQ, on the basis that it somehow 'interferes' with the sound of your speakers. Problem is, the room has already massively interfered with the sound of the speakers anyway, unless measures have been taken to fix it.

Look, you can believe me or choose not to believe me; in this era of free thinking, this is a sentiment all but lost on far too many. What I'm saying is -- and many home theater media publications have commented in kind about this subject several times -- that there are instances when auto setup programs actually made a system sound WORSE than leaving the system untouched at all, or compared to when parameters were manually dialed in. I know some of the people who fall into these "instances" personally and have heard their A/B'ed demos to justify this.


I just don't like the way Audyssey sounds when engaged via the 2EQ implementation on my 605. Does it get any plainer than that?

IntelliVolume is offline  
post #102 of 769 Old 08-05-2014, 02:38 PM
Advanced Member
 
IntelliVolume's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Posts: 843
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 190 Post(s)
Liked: 45
Quote:
Originally Posted by NorthSky View Post
IntelliVolume, get a mic stand with boom ($15 @ Amazon).

I can, but I'd rather spend the money on another Blu-ray title.

Quote:
Next, save some money and upgrade your receiver (Audyssey 2EQ is not EQuing the most important audio frequencies; the bass from your Sub/LFE channel) with one that has @ least Audyssey MultEQ (minimum), and XT better, and XT32 best (Onkyo 818).

* Look @ some Denon receiver models perhaps, Marantz, next year, with Dolby Atmos too.
If not with Dolby Atmos then you'll find some deals with Audyssey MultEQ XT32 equipped receivers. ...Someone who has the 818 for sale because he is upgrading to Dolby Atmos, the 929, Denons, ...

I guaranty you a better listening experience from upgrading your 2EQ equipped receiver to one equipped with XT or XT32. ...For both multichannel and stereo audio; movies and stereo music.

A couple of things here, Bob -- first, I don't know what to make at all, right now, of Dolby's ATMOS. Second, I don't want to buy a new AVR based on room correction technologies that may best the 2EQ of my 605 because what I would be after is more raw power, not sophisticated processing modes (I like to keep things more simple). Third, this system isn't used for two channel that much, if at all (I have a separate dedicated stereo setup in another room).

Quote:
And I hope you do have a sub?

Oh, come on, Mr. One Ring to Rule Them All...don't you remember suggesting to me that I make sure my LPF of LFE in my 605 is set to 120Hz, my phase switch is flipped to 0 and my sub's crossover knob is all the way up (or set to BYPASS, if possible, as you said it)?

IntelliVolume is offline  
post #103 of 769 Old 08-05-2014, 02:47 PM
AVS Addicted Member
 
sdurani's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: Monterey Park, CA
Posts: 19,395
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1033 Post(s)
Liked: 870
Quote:
Originally Posted by IntelliVolume View Post
To many, this IS in fact religion...
Which is why I said that believing or not believing will not change the outcome. You belief (or lack thereof) doesn't change reality.
Quote:
Originally Posted by IntelliVolume View Post
From what I have been told and what I have read, THAT wouldn't work, either; you need a tripod or mic stand and I don't have one (as of now).
Why are you so opposed to trying?
Quote:
Originally Posted by IntelliVolume View Post
How do you know that I HAVEN'T tried this in my own home?
Your own words make it obvious:
Quote:
Originally Posted by IntelliVolume View Post
I don't have the proper "tools" (that is, a tripod of some kind) or ideal quiet situation in my room which would allow Audyssey to even work properly in my setup -- if I place the mic on a cushion or seat back, the setup procedure is fubar anyway, so wouldn't it make sense to adjust it the best I can without IMPROPERLY utilizing Audyssey? All to many systems have sounded horrendous -- and this is from personally experiencing them in other people's homes
Zero mention of trying it in your own home, instead only talk of experiencing it in other people's homes. Not to mention all the excuses for why it "wouldn't" work, rather than saying it didn't work.
Quote:
Originally Posted by IntelliVolume View Post
I am NOT going to send PCM signals as decoded by my OPPO player, as it is one of the main reasons I upgraded to this BDP-83 from my first-generation Panasonic player, which didn't have the ability to bitstream the high resolution codecs...so that's off the table, period.
What's wrong with sending PCM from your Oppo? It has the same decoder as your receiver.

Sanjay
sdurani is offline  
post #104 of 769 Old 08-05-2014, 02:55 PM
Advanced Member
 
IntelliVolume's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Posts: 843
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 190 Post(s)
Liked: 45
Quote:
Originally Posted by sdurani View Post
Which is why I said that believing or not believing will not change the outcome. You belief (or lack thereof) doesn't change reality.

I feel like we're going around in circles here; the bottom line, no matter how you want to mince words or take elements out of context, is that I am of the OPINION that those factors are not so.


Quote:
Why are you so opposed to trying? Your own words make it obvious: Zero mention of trying it in your own home, instead only talk of experiencing it in other people's homes. Not to mention all the excuses for why it "wouldn't" work, rather than saying it didn't work.

Oh brother...


Let's see if I can make this clear because something doesn't seem to be infiltrating the veil that's stopping you from understanding this...My words didn't make ANYTHING "obvious." You ASSUMED that I never tried it in my own home and you know what's said about those who assume...bottom line and fact is, I HAVE tried it in my own home, several times, even with a professional installer and at no time could we get the 2EQ system to sound remotely acceptable.


There are no "excuses" here; take it easy with all the accusations.


Quote:
What's wrong with sending PCM from your Oppo? It has the same decoder as your receiver.

Why are you taking this so personally? I know this is going to open up a whole new door of accusations from you, about how I don't understand the fact that PCM and bitstream approaches are no different from one another and one doesn't "perform" better than the other, but what the heck: I prefer to bitstream signals from a source to a processor, end of story.

IntelliVolume is offline  
post #105 of 769 Old 08-05-2014, 03:15 PM
AVS Addicted Member
 
sdurani's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: Monterey Park, CA
Posts: 19,395
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1033 Post(s)
Liked: 870
Quote:
Originally Posted by IntelliVolume View Post
I am of the OPINION that those factors are not so.
That's my point: you can have the opinion that EQ cannot pull down a peak but that opinion will have no bearing on the fact that EQ can pull down a peak and let you hear less of your room and more of the recording. Your belief or opinion or whatever you want to call it cannot change that reality.
Quote:
Originally Posted by IntelliVolume View Post
There are no "excuses" here; take it easy with all the accusations.
Not accusing you of anything, just quoting all the excuses you posted for why it "wouldn't" work. If you had tried it, then you would have known that placing the mic on the headrest of your couch would work.
Quote:
Originally Posted by IntelliVolume View Post
Why are you taking this so personally?
How does pointing out the fact that the decoder in your player is the same as the decoder in your receiver mean I'm taking anything personally?
Quote:
Originally Posted by IntelliVolume View Post
I know this is going to open up a whole new door of accusations from you, about how I don't understand the fact that PCM and bitstream approaches are no different from one another and one doesn't "perform" better than the other, but what the heck: I prefer to bitstream signals from a source to a processor, end of story.
It's the same lossless soundtrack, bit for bit, whether decoded in the player or the receiver. That's the definition of lossless: identical to the original. One can't be somehow 'more identical' than the other. Again, why are you so opposed to trying?

Sanjay
sdurani is offline  
post #106 of 769 Old 08-05-2014, 03:21 PM
Advanced Member
 
IntelliVolume's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Posts: 843
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 190 Post(s)
Liked: 45
Quote:
Originally Posted by sdurani View Post
That's my point: you can have the opinion that EQ cannot pull down a peak but that opinion will have no bearing on the fact that EQ can pull down a peak and let you hear less of your room and more of the recording. Your belief or opinion or whatever you want to call it cannot change that reality. Not accusing you of anything, just quoting all the excuses you posted for why it "wouldn't" work. If you had tried it, then you would have known that placing the mic on the headrest of your couch would work. How does pointing out the fact that the decoder in your player is the same as the decoder in your receiver mean I'm taking anything personally? It's the same lossless soundtrack, bit for bit, whether decoded in the player or the receiver. That's the definition of lossless: identical to the original. One can't be somehow 'more identical' than the other. Again, why are you so opposed to trying?

Wait -- are you actually telling me that it's your belief that putting the mic on the headrest of the couch WOULD WORK? That's the complete and exact OPPOSITE sentiment I received from so many enthusiasts and what I have read on countless online forums such as this...


And with regard to taking things personally, I wasn't referring to you pointing out the similarities in the decoding process, and you KNOW that -- what I was referring to was the fact that you seem so gung-ho on making me believe that I SHOULD be listening, trying and accepting everything you're saying, and that you can't possibly understand why I'm not actually doing what you say. There's a BIG difference there...


I'm going to say this and try to make it as clear as possible: I have tried both the PCM and bitstream method and though on paper and in technical specifications both processes are supposed to unpack the information the SAME EXACT WAY, I PREFER the sound and method of bitstreaming.

IntelliVolume is offline  
post #107 of 769 Old 08-05-2014, 03:23 PM
Advanced Member
 
IntelliVolume's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Posts: 843
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 190 Post(s)
Liked: 45
Excuse me, AVS people: Just to take a break from this ongoing idiotic struggle I seem to be having with durani:


Is there anyone else here who uses or who has had advanced experience with Audyssey that believes placing the setup mic on the COUCH HEADREST or the back of the pillow is an acceptable method for getting accurate results from the system?


I was always told that this is NOT acceptable for getting accurate readings...

IntelliVolume is offline  
post #108 of 769 Old 08-05-2014, 03:57 PM
AVS Special Member
 
NorthSky's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Canada - West Island: Vancouver, South Direction: Go East
Posts: 2,427
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1069 Post(s)
Liked: 377
Quote:
Originally Posted by IntelliVolume View Post
I can, but I'd rather spend the money on another Blu-ray title.

A couple of things here, Bob -- first, I don't know what to make at all, right now, of Dolby's ATMOS. Second, I don't want to buy a new AVR based on room correction technologies that may best the 2EQ of my 605 because what I would be after is more raw power, not sophisticated processing modes (I like to keep things more simple). Third, this system isn't used for two channel that much, if at all (I have a separate dedicated stereo setup in another room).

Oh, come on, Mr. One Ring to Rule Them All...don't you remember suggesting to me that I make sure my LPF of LFE in my 605 is set to 120Hz, my phase switch is flipped to 0 and my sub's crossover knob is all the way up (or set to BYPASS, if possible, as you said it)?
1. Buy 'Gravity' 3D Blu-ray ($15 on sale).
2. Go to a thrift store or Salvation Army store and look for a camera tripod (should be less than $5).
3. Look for a good condition second-hand receiver like an Onkyo TX-SR876 (I've seen some for $200-300).
4. Or look for an Onkyo TX-NR818 receiver on the street (roughly $400-500). ...Private sales, eBay, ...
5. Or look for Denon or Marantz receivers with Audyssey MultEQ XT or XT32 (second-hand / value).
6. Or look for a Pioneer or Yamaha receiver with a PEQ (parametric EQ) inside (secon-hand / value).
7. Or look for a second-hand Anthem receiver (ARC inside).
8. There are also several places online to shop for all these products above; refurb from A4L, Newegg (Saturdays only - for the best sales), ...

* Yes, the Low-Pass for the LFE channel should be set @ 120 Hz. ...LFE x-over on your setup menu from your 605. Dolby soundtracks have up to 120 Hz content on their LFE (.1) channel; that's why.
- The Phase control on your subwoofer is most of the time for most people best set @ 0° [It is easier like that with Audyssey - Or use a Radio Shack level meter first and experiment with that Phase control on your sub - It's important.]
- The sub's X-over control (Low-Pass filter) should be set to "Bypass" (if avail) or its highest position.

<<>> My memory is usually good; I remember stuff from 55 years ago, very vividly.

Bests, ~ Robert § (Bob)

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

Last edited by NorthSky; 08-05-2014 at 04:05 PM.
NorthSky is online now  
post #109 of 769 Old 08-05-2014, 04:04 PM
Advanced Member
 
IntelliVolume's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Posts: 843
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 190 Post(s)
Liked: 45
Quote:
Originally Posted by NorthSky View Post
1. Buy 'Gravity' 3D Blu-ray ($15 on sale).

Nope. Didn't like the film and don't have a 3D display or player.


Quote:
2. Go to a thrift store or Salvation Army store and look for a camera tripod (should be less than $5).
3. Look for a good condition second-hand receiver like an Onkyo TX-SR876 (I've seen some for $200-300).
4. Or look for an Onkyo TX-NR818 receiver on the street (roughly $400-500). ...Private sales, eBay, ...
5. Or look for Denon or Marantz receivers with Audyssey MultEQ XT or XT32 (second-hand / value).
6. Or look for a Pioneer or Yamaha receiver with a PEQ (parametric EQ) inside (secon-hand / value).
7. Or look for a second-hand Anthem receiver (ARC inside).
8. There are also several places online to shop for all these products above; refurb from A4L, Newegg (Saturdays only - for the best sales), ...

Ahhhhhh....so you DON'T believe a couch's seatback can be used instead of a tripod?

Quote:
* Yes, the Low-Pass for the LFE channel should be set @ 120 Hz. ...LFE x-over on your setup menu from your 605.
- The Phase control on your subwoofer is most of the time for most people best set @ 0° [It is easier like that with Audyssey, but it does not apply to you because you only have Audyssey 2EQ - So you need your Radio Shack level meter and experiment with that Phase control on your sub - It's important]
- The sub's X-over control (Low-Pass) should be set (with Audyssey MultEQ) to "Bypass" or its highest position.

<<>> My memory is usually good; I remember stuff from 55 years ago, very vividly.

Apparently it's not that great because when you originally told me about the LPF aspect and discussed with me keeping my crossover knob turned all the way up or on bypass if possible, you also made it very clear that the PHASE switch should be on NOTHING but 0 degrees (from your days over at High Def Digest)...


And you knew at that point that I was running a 605...

At any rate, you also agreed with me that if a sub is positioned on the SAME WALL as the main speakers/center/display, the phase should always be at zero; the 180 degree and other possibilities should only be experimented with, you agreed, when a sub is placed in an irregular location such as side wall or the back of a room...

IntelliVolume is offline  
post #110 of 769 Old 08-05-2014, 04:25 PM
AVS Special Member
 
NorthSky's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Canada - West Island: Vancouver, South Direction: Go East
Posts: 2,427
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1069 Post(s)
Liked: 377
...I was just wondering out loud; AccuEQ versus Audyssey 2EQ.

* Audyssey 2EQ is definitely not for me and my setup. ...And AccuEQ I know nothing more than what I read and did not like what I read about it.

Give me a PEQ any day, or J River, or Audyssey XT32 (Pro), or ARC?
....Dirac Live Amarra, Accurate, Trinnov Altitude, Datasat RS20i; would love to, tomorrow morning perhaps...

Bests, ~ Robert § (Bob)

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
NorthSky is online now  
post #111 of 769 Old 08-05-2014, 04:27 PM
Advanced Member
 
IntelliVolume's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Posts: 843
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 190 Post(s)
Liked: 45
^^^

IntelliVolume is offline  
post #112 of 769 Old 08-05-2014, 04:47 PM
AVS Addicted Member
 
sdurani's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: Monterey Park, CA
Posts: 19,395
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1033 Post(s)
Liked: 870
Quote:
Originally Posted by IntelliVolume View Post
Wait -- are you actually telling me that it's your belief that putting the mic on the headrest of the couch WOULD WORK?
Not a belief, as I have tried it. Which is why I encourage people to try it for themselves rather than expect them to believe or not believe.
Quote:
Originally Posted by IntelliVolume View Post
That's the complete and exact OPPOSITE sentiment I received from so many enthusiasts and what I have read on countless online forums such as this...
No, it is not the opposite. You might have read that a tripod works better than resting it on a couch and that a mic stand works better than a tripod, but no one has said that it "wouldn't work" on the headrest of a couch. IF "so many enthusiasts" have made such a claim, please quote some.
Quote:
Originally Posted by IntelliVolume View Post
I was referring to was the fact that you seem so gung-ho on making me believe that I SHOULD be listening, trying and accepting everything you're saying, and that you can't possibly understand why I'm not actually doing what you say.
Pointing out logical fallacies in what you post is not me taking anything personally. I don't even know you, why would any of this discussion be personal, to either one of us?

Sanjay
sdurani is offline  
post #113 of 769 Old 08-05-2014, 04:50 PM
AVS Special Member
 
NorthSky's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Canada - West Island: Vancouver, South Direction: Go East
Posts: 2,427
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1069 Post(s)
Liked: 377
Quote:
Originally Posted by IntelliVolume View Post
Nope. Didn't like the film and don't have a 3D display or player.
Too bad, it's a good one; visually (in 3D) and auditory (awesome surround sound).

Quote:
Originally Posted by Intelli
Ahhhhhh....so you DON'T believe a couch's seatback can be used instead of a tripod?
Abso!utely not! Ever never ever never ever!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Volume
Apparently it's not that great because when you originally told me about the LPF aspect and discussed with me keeping my crossover knob turned all the way up or on bypass if possible, you also made it very clear that the PHASE switch should be on NOTHING but 0 degrees (from your days over at High Def Digest)...
Ahhhh, finally, that's where. ...AVS has a fantastic Audyssey Setup Guide; did you ever look @ it?
Keith (Barnes) I believe has the link in its sig. ...Yep, he does.

Quote:
Originally Posted by IV
And you knew at that point that I was running a 605...

At any rate, you also agreed with me that if a sub is positioned on the SAME WALL as the main speakers/center/display, the phase should always be at zero; the 180 degree and other possibilities should only be experimented with, you agreed, when a sub is placed in an irregular location such as side wall or the back of a room...
I would need to have all the past coordinates of your setup, and would love to make your experience more pleasurable with your Onkyo 605 receiver with Audyssey 2EQ, I truly would, as of now you prefer Audyssey disengaged and I don't blame you for one drop of a doubt.

* It is by helping nice people like you that we all learn to advance together. ...Is there another thread where you discussed these matters regarding 2EQ in your 605 and preferring without engaging it?
...Perhaps in the official Onkyo 605 thread? ...Which one; there are few of them, but most important it has to do with Audyssey 2EQ.

I asked because all the proper settings have been discussed extensively in them other threads.
- Phase setting: Where it sounds the loudest at the crossover point.
...Where it has the most balanced uniformity around that region. ...A RS level meter is indispensable for that, you need it, because by ear alone is tough sometimes, but it is feasible, with some experience.

Bests, ~ Robert § (Bob)

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
NorthSky is online now  
post #114 of 769 Old 08-05-2014, 04:53 PM
Advanced Member
 
IntelliVolume's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Posts: 843
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 190 Post(s)
Liked: 45
Quote:
Originally Posted by sdurani View Post
Not a belief, as I have tried it. Which is why I encourage people to try it for themselves rather than expect them to believe or not believe. No, it is not the opposite. You might have read that a tripod works better than resting it on a couch and that a mic stand works better than a tripod, but no one has said that it "wouldn't work" on the headrest of a couch. IF "so many enthusiasts" have made such a claim, please quote some. Pointing out logical fallacies in what you post is not me taking anything personally. I don't even know you, why would any of this discussion be personal, to either one of us?

Oh you have GOT to me kidding me...are you telling me I AM THE ONLY ONE who feels placing the mic on the back of a couch or atop a pillow/cushion is the WRONG way to use an auto setup program? Are you just playing semantics here? Of course the program WILL run...but I've been told the results WON'T be correct by a multitude of people in this industry; could it PHYSICALLY RUN? Yes. Will the results be ACCURATE? That's a whole different ball game -- and one I was advised not to play in.


You didn't point out any "logical fallacies" in any post whatsoever; you're attempting to ram opinions down throats of people who feel other than you do by continuing to exclaim "WHY WON'T YOU TRY IT??!!!" and such (when I made it clear I DID try what you're referencing).

IntelliVolume is offline  
post #115 of 769 Old 08-05-2014, 04:57 PM
AVS Special Member
 
NorthSky's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Canada - West Island: Vancouver, South Direction: Go East
Posts: 2,427
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1069 Post(s)
Liked: 377
Quote:
Originally Posted by IntelliVolume View Post
^^^
I'm sorry, sometimes I have to tell it like it is; my own personal truth, and it's not to put you down.
The Onkyo 605 is still a very good receiver.

And if you prefer the sound without Audyssey I totally understand, and I would do the same; shame on Audyssey 2EQ.

Bests, ~ Robert § (Bob)

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
NorthSky is online now  
post #116 of 769 Old 08-05-2014, 05:00 PM
Advanced Member
 
IntelliVolume's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Posts: 843
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 190 Post(s)
Liked: 45
Quote:
Originally Posted by NorthSky View Post
Too bad, it's a good one; visually (in 3D) and auditory (awesome surround sound).

I reviewed the 2D Blu-ray of the title and don't recall the audio and video specification analysis points to be honest; the film itself I thought was overrated. Especially when I just found out how much that twat Bullock made on the film...absolutely ridiculous.

Quote:
Abso!utely not! Ever never ever never ever!

Can you please take this up and explain it to durani, who has been arguing with me about how it's perfectly fine to leave it on a couch's pillow or back?

Quote:
Ahhhh, finally, that's where. ...AVS has a fantastic Audyssey Setup Guide; did you ever look @ it?
Keith (Barnes) I believe has the link in its sig. ...Yep, he does.

High Def Digest was only one place you were advising me -- but rest assured you DID suggest all those parameters for me...

Quote:
I would need to have all the past coordinates of your setup, and would love to make your experience more pleasurable with your Onkyo 605 receiver with Audyssey 2EQ, I truly would, as of now you prefer Audyssey disengaged and I don't blame you for one drop of a doubt.

Thank you; the setup before was as it is now -- a 605 powering two Polk RTi12 mains, a CSi30 center, two SpeakerCraft in-ceiling surrounds and a Polk PSW350 handling LFE duties...everything connected via HDMI from an OPPO BDP-83 to the 605 and then off to a Sony projection display...

Quote:
* It is by helping nice people like you that we all learn to advance together. ...Is there another thread where you discussed these matters regarding 2EQ in your 605 and preferring without engaging it?
...Perhaps in the official Onkyo 605 thread? ...Which one; there are few of them, but most important it has to do with Audyssey 2EQ.

Thank you; and I appreciate all your past help -- it truly assisted me with making sure everything was set up right. I don't have specific references to threads I encountered these discussions in, but I am open to continuing discussions now...

Quote:
I asked because all the proper settings have been discussed extensively in them other threads.
- Phase setting: Where it sounds the loudest at the crossover point.
...Where it has the most balanced uniformity around that region. ...A RS level meter is indispensable for that, you need it, because by ear alone is tough sometimes, but it is feasible, with some experience.

I am experienced enough to be able to balance the channels by ear -- and I'm NOT saying this PREFERABLE or even COMPARABLE to an SPL meter -- and have pretty much dialed everything in tight...the thing is, I know you had definitely recommended to me that the phase should always be on "0" degrees, especially if a sub is positioned on the same wall as the mains and display...

IntelliVolume is offline  
post #117 of 769 Old 08-05-2014, 05:03 PM
Advanced Member
 
IntelliVolume's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Posts: 843
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 190 Post(s)
Liked: 45
Quote:
Originally Posted by NorthSky View Post
I'm sorry, sometimes I have to tell it like it is; my own personal truth, and it's not to put you down.
The Onkyo 605 is still a very good receiver.

And if you prefer the sound without Audyssey I totally understand, and I would do the same; shame on Audyssey 2EQ.

Oh, I only put those question mark faces because I didn't UNDERSTAND what you were even referencing/talking about...lol...


But I gotta say...2EQ aside, I probably wouldn't run any room correction program no matter how advanced the AVR...there's just something about "EQ OFF" that I prefer...

IntelliVolume is offline  
post #118 of 769 Old 08-05-2014, 05:05 PM
AVS Special Member
 
NorthSky's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Canada - West Island: Vancouver, South Direction: Go East
Posts: 2,427
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1069 Post(s)
Liked: 377
Quote:
Originally Posted by sdurani View Post
Not a belief, as I have tried it. Which is why I encourage people to try it for themselves rather than expect them to believe or not believe. No, it is not the opposite. You might have read that a tripod works better than resting it on a couch and that a mic stand works better than a tripod, but no one has said that it "wouldn't work" on the headrest of a couch. IF "so many enthusiasts" have made such a claim, please quote some. Pointing out logical fallacies in what you post is not me taking anything personally. I don't even know you, why would any of this discussion be personal, to either one of us?
I'm one of them.

* By the way, the Onkyo 605 uses Onkyo's own mic, the small black hockey puck style. ...It's not helping it @ all to rest it on your couch or on any soft surface, or any surface @ all. ...Tripod, or mic stand; much much better.

But yes, it still works the way you put it, just not optimally.

Bests, ~ Robert § (Bob)

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

Last edited by NorthSky; 08-07-2014 at 10:55 PM. Reason: Typo (on, not 'or')
NorthSky is online now  
post #119 of 769 Old 08-05-2014, 05:13 PM
AVS Addicted Member
 
sdurani's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: Monterey Park, CA
Posts: 19,395
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1033 Post(s)
Liked: 870
Quote:
Originally Posted by IntelliVolume View Post
Of course the program WILL run...
That's a nice change from claiming it "wouldn't work".
Quote:
Originally Posted by IntelliVolume View Post
Will the results be ACCURATE? That's a whole different ball game -- and one I was advised not to play in.
So you haven't tried it, since you don't have a tripod or mic stand.
Quote:
Originally Posted by IntelliVolume View Post
You didn't point out any "logical fallacies" in any post whatsoever;
Sure I did. You're avoiding EQ because you don't want the signal messed with when that's already being done by the room. As logical as saying you're avoiding A in order to have A. You're prefer one lossless decoder to another when they're both, by definition of lossless, identical to each other. As logical as saying A is better than A.

Sanjay
sdurani is offline  
post #120 of 769 Old 08-05-2014, 05:17 PM
Advanced Member
 
IntelliVolume's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Posts: 843
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 190 Post(s)
Liked: 45
Quote:
Originally Posted by sdurani View Post
That's a nice change from claiming it "wouldn't work".

You're TOTALLY taking comments out of context -- commendable tactic, but one that won't work on me. You know DAMN WELL that what I was referring to was the program giving FALSE RESULTS if the mic is placed atop anything other than a tripod device.


Quote:
So you haven't tried it, since you don't have a tripod or mic stand.

I HAVE TRIED IT without a tripod or mic stand and compared it to results a pro installer friend of mine made with HIS 605 using a pro-grade boom mic stand and was advised my readings would ALWAYS be out of whack...I was further advised that INCORRECTLY placing the mic, such as on a cushion or pillow, is WORSE than doing a manual dialed in calibration such as I did ultimately.


Quote:
Sure I did. You're avoiding EQ because you don't want the signal messed with when that's already being done by the room. As logical as saying you're avoiding A in order to have A. You're prefer one lossless decoder to another when they're both, by definition of lossless, identical to each other. As logical as saying A is better than A.

No, you actually didn't; you're attempting to get me to say "YOU'RE RIGHT! BOTH SOUND THE SAME! I'M GOING TO DEFINITELY LISTEN TO YOU, NO MATTER WHAT!"

IntelliVolume is offline  
Reply Receivers, Amps, and Processors

User Tag List

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page


Forum Jump: 

Posting Rules  
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off