from yamaha to denon - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 7 Old 08-08-2014, 02:25 PM - Thread Starter
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from yamaha to denon

Hi all,
I was previously a Yamaha rx-v365 with 5.0 avant Mordaunt Shorts. with the Yamaha avr i was able to direct the low bass that the sub would usually produce to the front main l/r speakers and was more than enough without a sub.

Since then i came to realize that the connections and the non audio pass through on the Yamaha started to get irritating due to only having the two opticals to go through, the lack of quality sound and the lack of features.

After reading posts and reviews I decided to upgrade to a Denon avr x3000, the improvement was huge and has all the features that i need. now the problem came when i spend a while setting it all up to my liking and realised the lack of bass from the front main speakers. after changing some setting i still could not find out where to go, read up on the manual and the internet and i seemed to do everything that the was suggested.

I would be grateful if anyone has any ideas on this or information, maybe I do need to get an active sub but wanted to gain so valuable information on this receiver before I do.

Many thank
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post #2 of 7 Old 08-08-2014, 03:25 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by boden08 View Post
Hi all,
I was previously a Yamaha rx-v365 with 5.0 avant Mordaunt Shorts. with the Yamaha avr i was able to direct the low bass that the sub would usually produce to the front main l/r speakers and was more than enough without a sub.

Since then i came to realize that the connections and the non audio pass through on the Yamaha started to get irritating due to only having the two opticals to go through, the lack of quality sound and the lack of features.

After reading posts and reviews I decided to upgrade to a Denon avr x3000, the improvement was huge and has all the features that i need. now the problem came when i spend a while setting it all up to my liking and realised the lack of bass from the front main speakers. after changing some setting i still could not find out where to go, read up on the manual and the internet and i seemed to do everything that the was suggested.

I would be grateful if anyone has any ideas on this or information, maybe I do need to get an active sub but wanted to gain so valuable information on this receiver before I do.

Many thank


If you will simply shut off the processing software completely and run all your speakers in a direct full-range mode, that should be a big improvement.

In my experience the software often causes more problems than it solves, plus ALL digital processing tends to lower sound quality unless very expensive professional-quality equipment is used.

I also think that the inferior power supply and amplifiers of the Denon and Yamaha are not going to drive your speakers without producing unacceptable levels of distortion. They will never sound that good. The power supplies are too puny to give the kind of speaker current required for decent bass.

The superior power supply and amplifiers of the NAD T758 would make your whole system sound 300% better IMO.

And please don't look at power specs to guide you; they are total nonsense.

The only numbers that count are actual DISTORTION when a REAL SPEAKER is connected; no one gives such numbers, so your ears are the best way to tell what is what.

Actual distortion with real speakers connected can be 100 times what one gets on a test bench with a resistor for a load; especially with Onkyo, Yamaha, and similar mass-market designs that skimp on power-supply capability and put their money into feature after feature instead of audio quality.

Lots of bells and whistles, but the beef is not there.

Last edited by commsysman; 08-08-2014 at 03:40 PM.
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post #3 of 7 Old 08-08-2014, 04:32 PM
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Do you have the no sub selected in your speaker configuration settings and your speakers set to large?
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post #4 of 7 Old 08-08-2014, 04:32 PM
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There's a whole thread dedicated to the 2013 Denon models to include the X3000 .... review posts #3-6 in that thread for helpful information.

The 'Official' 2013 Denon "E Series" / "X Series" AVR Model Owner's Thread & FAQ

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post #5 of 7 Old 08-09-2014, 01:23 AM - Thread Starter
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commsysman, yes I did set up the speakers using the audyssey multiEQ XT when I first got the reciever but then changed a few setting due to personal preference.

Gimpy, the speaker configuration is set to no sub with the mains on large, centre on small and rears on small.

jdsmoothie, thanks thanks for the link.

thanks for all the replys
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post #6 of 7 Old 08-09-2014, 02:36 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by commsysman View Post
If you will simply shut off the processing software completely and run all your speakers in a direct full-range mode, that should be a big improvement.

I also think that the inferior power supply and amplifiers of the Denon and Yamaha are not going to drive your speakers without producing unacceptable levels of distortion. They will never sound that good. The power supplies are too puny to give the kind of speaker current required for decent bass.
I don't have a problem with receiver power at reasonable volume levels, say -10 dB below reference. I would not be surprised that as you push to reference level, you might hear some distortion on loud scenes in movies or with loud music. But at any level I listen at, receivers work great. I have amps too, and they don't make a difference in my setup.

The OPs issue seems to be that possibly the system is setup to redirect some bass to a non existent sub. Never seen that happen on any system I have owned, the auto setup detects no sub and runs all the speakers full range. I can't help there, as I am not a Denon guy.

Just wanted to put in a plug for subwoofers. Maybe your speakers are truly full range and you are happy and that's great. Personally, I have yet to own any speakers that were not improved using a subwoofer. Seeing how the sub is designed for the low frequencies and has a dedicated amp it can take the load off the other speakers and that has always cleaned up some muddiness in the bass. Something to be said for using large diameter drives to produce effortless bass perhaps.

Anyway, good luck. Not trying to change the OPs setup, but I disagreed with some of what was said and wanted to throw my own two cents in

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post #7 of 7 Old 08-09-2014, 04:30 AM - Thread Starter
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michaeljhuman, thanks for the response and opinion.

after changing some setting and playing around with the avr i have come to the conclusion that i could do with a sub. i borrowed an alumni sub off a friend for a few hours and the difference is huge and sounds just as i expected it to sound.

thanks for the reply's, they are greatly appreciated.
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