Which AVR for longevity? - AVS | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #1 of 73 Old 12-16-2014, 06:44 PM - Thread Starter
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Question Which AVR for longevity?

Being that my initial Denon 3312 developed a failed network port after about 15 months and the replacement refurb unit has decided it wants to spontaneously shutdown and restart ever few minutes after not even two months I'm considering selling it when it is repaired/replaced and replacing it with something else. At the moment I'm looking at the below, what say you? I had no problem with the 3312 when it was working properly but am a bit concerned about the model year's long term reliability now. My previous AVR was an Onkyo TX-DS787 purchased in 2002 and functioned flawlessly for almost 11 years. I'm hoping for something similar as I don't relish spending $$ on a new AVR frequently.

Denon X4000 : Essentially a newer version of the 3312, any input on reliability?
Marantz 7007: Appears to be a marantz version of the 3313. Being that it is a dressed up denon does it share the same components and in theory the same flaws?
Yamaha AVENTAGE RX-A1040: Seems to be similarly featured when compared to the Denon and Marantz while claiming to be using high end components. Any truth to this or is it marketing hype?

Other brand/models? I would like to stay under $1000 but realize that both the Denon and Marantz sticker in the $1500 range even though they can be had for less. Are HK & Onkyo worth looking into? When I was shopping for the Denon it seemed there was a relatively high failure rate on the Onkyo HDMI boards. Seems Denon of the same generation was only marginally better. The biggest features I'm looking for are 7 onboard amp channels and dual zone HDMI switching (One HDMI source playing in main zone and another or the same playing in Zone 2).
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post #2 of 73 Old 12-16-2014, 07:46 PM
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Yamaha AVRs have the best reliability of any brand.....

Just my $0.02...
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post #3 of 73 Old 12-16-2014, 08:35 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by M Code View Post
Yamaha AVRs have the best reliability of any brand.....

Just my $0.02...
I've owned two Yamaha AVRs - I have to agree with you. They are designed and built well and work without hassle.

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post #4 of 73 Old 12-16-2014, 08:56 PM
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Yamaha aren't bad, they just seem to pick the strangest codec and room correction strategies...

I owned one of the first "flagship" they ever built I think around the 90's. The Yamaha DSP-A3090 I think.

The stereo playback on Yamaha has always been decent but I think Yamaha and Pioneer got a bit left behind a bit without Audyssey which was a really decent consumer level upgrade for most of us.

The Yamaha obsession with reproducing soundfields of specific venues was always nothing more than a gimmick without a Dolby Atmos style recording and playback strategy.

My Yamaha did last like FOREVER as far as functionality goes.

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post #5 of 73 Old 01-06-2015, 10:39 AM
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I agree with the earlier posters




Yamaha seems to be the most reliable...although I think Pioneer Elite is as well


D&M products( denon and Marantz) can be buggy...and we all know Onkyo/Integra has had HDMI board issues for a few years now


My personal ownership of all of them speaks to the statements I just made




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Rm 2 LG 47LE8500 Denon 4520 Celestion 305 speaker system
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post #6 of 73 Old 01-06-2015, 12:13 PM
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Go with Yamaha. My nearly 1.5 year old Denon X4000 was dead suddenly. After I tried both A1040 and A2040, it only took me a two hours to be convinced Yamaha sound is much better than Denon's muddy sounds, thanks to the superior DAC and build quality. Yamaha is hefty, and is built to last. Denon seems to have a lot more issues with network and hdmi cards/interfaces not far behind Onkyo. I won't look at a Denon (or Marantz) again unless they up the Denon quality. Right now they are more into chasing the wind which ever stinky way it blows, IMHO.
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post #7 of 73 Old 01-06-2015, 12:14 PM
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Denons come with a 3 year factory warranty, and I added an additional 2 years full warranty from Amazon for $30. So I'm fully covered for 5 years and I figure by then Atmos will be prevalent and cheap enough to finally buy into it.
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post #8 of 73 Old 01-06-2015, 03:15 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheGiantPeach View Post
Denons come with a 3 year factory warranty, and I added an additional 2 years full warranty from Amazon for $30. So I'm fully covered for 5 years and I figure by then Atmos will be prevalent and cheap enough to finally buy into it.
Lets clarify about the Denon warranty for AVRs..
CI AVRs are 3 years
Non CI AVRs are 2 years


Just my $0.02...
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post #9 of 73 Old 01-06-2015, 03:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by M Code View Post
Lets clarify about the Denon warranty for AVRs..
CI AVRs are 3 years
Non CI AVRs are 2 years


Just my $0.02...
My x4000 has a 3 year.
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post #10 of 73 Old 01-06-2015, 06:16 PM
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Several Yamaha's with no issues here
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post #11 of 73 Old 01-06-2015, 06:48 PM
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Marantz and Denon are same company IIRC, so guess its Yamaha
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post #12 of 73 Old 01-06-2015, 06:50 PM
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Back in 1994 I bought a Yamaha RX-V1070(I think) which was the "cat's meow" back then per Home Theater Magazine. That's when Pro Logic was just getting started! Anyway, I wasn't able to put it to use until August 1995 when my first home was built.

I used it on my main tv and it was turned off and on hundreds of times and performed without fail for 9 years. I then moved to my second home and upgraded my receiver. The Yamaha sat 4 years in the closet and then I gave it to my father where it is today, but it's not being used, yet it still works!!! That's my Yamaha story

I had a HK AVR 7200 for four years after the Yammy. I sold it and as far as I know it still works too, but it did have to have some warranty work done within the first year of ownership. I bought an Onkyo SR806 in 2009 and it just failed this past December. I have been in a quandary about what direction to go since, but even though Yamaha doesn't use Audyssey I'll more than likely go back to them.

Yamaha is my vote!
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post #13 of 73 Old 01-06-2015, 10:48 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheGiantPeach View Post
My x4000 has a 3 year.
The X products, now called InCommand replaced the CI series and has a 3 year warranty.
These products are targeted to the AV integration specialists and are loaded with features. Also Denon now has their own extended warranty program as well..

These are all marketing changes Denon instituted since they suffered significant market share erosion when they expanded their internet seller and big box retailer sales channels. This happened @ the time of the D&M/Bain Capital situation. They needed to provide a line of AVRs that had a reasonable profit margin. I hope it works for the brand, they need to rebuild their credibility...

Just my $0.02...
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post #14 of 73 Old 01-06-2015, 11:28 PM
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my Pioneer 59TXi was built in 2005 (I think) - and other than having to replace one fuse -its still utterly reliable and sounds fantastic and is used for hours every day

so I've been impressed with Pioneer build quality and reliability
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post #15 of 73 Old 01-06-2015, 11:35 PM
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I have owned Yamaha products for about 20 years until i just recently upgraded to a AV8801 Marantz (fantastic sounding product.. no issues.. knock on wood!) My RX-Z7 still works perfect.. i may use it in a secondary bedroom system at some point Very reliable brand.. i still have a Yamaha 3090 that works great.. and my dad has my old rx-v1300 works perfect.. the only Yammie i ever owned that had issue is my RX-V1 which is in a box... the pre-outs cut in and out on all the channels.. had it fixed twice.. don't know if i will ever fix it again.. it is a great sounding piece though and it sounded fabulous.... you never know with electronics... I hope my Marantz gives me many years of reliability like i had with most of my Yamaha's....
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post #16 of 73 Old 06-04-2015, 02:31 PM
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Upps.
Problems in my RX-V1800 and now in my Z7
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post #17 of 73 Old 06-04-2015, 03:34 PM
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There's no industry data on reliability of AVR's that I've been able to find. Most of what you'll find here are just opinions of what people have purchased. Lots of people here use the X4000. I don't think anyone will have any data on the reliability of any of those AVR's.
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post #18 of 73 Old 06-06-2015, 04:18 PM
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Yamaha is crazy longevity. Say whatever else you will about yamaha's implementation or room correction. But this is a serious consumer electronics company.

I would be surprised if they were not the industry leader in reliability.

Pioneer, judging my a tv and avr I bought, has also been rock solid.
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post #19 of 73 Old 06-06-2015, 04:53 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Knucklehead90 View Post
I've owned two Yamaha AVRs - I have to agree with you. They are designed and built well and work without hassle.
My father in laws Yamaha just died after light use in 2 yrs... I wouldnt call that reliable.
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post #20 of 73 Old 06-06-2015, 05:01 PM
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I don't know which AVR has the best longevity...but my Denon 2310CI still works w/o a glitch after 5 yrs ,and i hope to have it around for a few more years.
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post #21 of 73 Old 06-06-2015, 05:58 PM
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Originally Posted by toddman36 View Post
My father in laws Yamaha just died after light use in 2 yrs... I wouldnt call that reliable.
In the world of statistics your FIL's Yamaha dying prematurely is whats called statistically insignificant.

And I wouldn't call one person's experience with a product the end-all to the question what is and isn't reliable. There are guys that are still using their Onkyo 606 daily without issues - that would also be statistically insignificant if not somewhat amazing considering the problem. That doesn't negate the issues that all those other owners of the Onkyo 606 have experienced.

The Yamaha AVR on the whole is as reliable as they come IMO - and many others here as well. People have problems with them - its the nature of consumer electronics these days - everyone wants cheaper better faster.

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post #22 of 73 Old 06-06-2015, 06:30 PM
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Having worked with pro gear for a long time and having used the pro versions of most of the AVR makers gear I would have to say Yamaha. They make stuff based on two principles, clarity and longevity.

In the last 17 years I have had two AVR's both Yamaha. First one still works and is currently in use in my dusty shop.

If you want bells and whistles, go else-ware. Yamaha makes sure stuff works before they implement it.
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post #23 of 73 Old 06-06-2015, 06:49 PM
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The local Kansas City authorized repair shop for several various brands, - owner and repair tech said Yamaha had the best build quality, and he rarely saw anything Yamaha come through.

He said Marantz and Denon were generally second (but their quality was slipping as of late a little bit on the lower series units - because Onkyo is eroding the ability to sell anything at a profit margin and include decent parts.

He said Onkyo is terrible, made to last just a short while, and the parts they replace the failed parts with are just as terrible, he stopped doing repair work on Onkyo because they break again and the customer blames everything on him, when it's just cheap parts to begin with.


That was his opinion as a repair tech and audio shop owner for the last 20 some years.


For my part I've had good reliability with my Onkyo units. I've owned the 805, 1007, 818, and 616.


My Denon 4520ci has been a turd. So I suppose, your mileage may vary. Not everyone's experiences will match the statistics - but generally speaking apparently Yamaha uses the best, highest quality electronic components.

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post #24 of 73 Old 06-06-2015, 08:19 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zgeneral View Post
There's no industry data on reliability of AVR's that I've been able to find. Most of what you'll find here are just opinions of what people have purchased. Lots of people here use the X4000. I don't think anyone will have any data on the reliability of any of those AVR's.

An industry survey done in 4th quarter 2014, rated AVRs for reliability as follows:
1. Yamaha
2. Pioneer/Elite
3. Onkyo
4. Denon

Just my $0.02..
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post #25 of 73 Old 06-06-2015, 09:36 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by M Code View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by zgeneral View Post
There's no industry data on reliability of AVR's that I've been able to find. Most of what you'll find here are just opinions of what people have purchased. Lots of people here use the X4000. I don't think anyone will have any data on the reliability of any of those AVR's.

An industry survey done in 4th quarter 2014, rated AVRs for reliability as follows:
1. Yamaha
2. Pioneer/Elite
3. Onkyo
4. Denon

Just my $0.02..
This result doesnt surprise me in the slightest based on having owned yamaha, marantz, integra, and pioneer.

i would have expected denon to be higher than onk though. Judging by threads at avs and my experience with integra, the above result surprises me. The difference may not be statistically significant though.

Often one type of model ends up being the topic of the most discussion. Once a model is built right, the tend to work flawlessly a very long time...
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post #26 of 73 Old 06-06-2015, 10:41 PM
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I owned a Yamaha RX-V690 Pro-Logic 5.1 Receiver in the 1990's and had nothing but problems with it.
Decided I'd never buy Yamaha again.

Then a Harmon Kardon AVR 520 that's still working after all these years as a bedroom system.

Then I went with a Lexicon CP-1 preamp with Adcom amplifiers to get 7.1 channels, then upgraded to a Lexicon MC-1.
Never had a problem with either.

Switched to an Onkyo PR-SC5508 preamp to get 9 .1 channels that was in the shop constantly.

Switched to a Marantz 8801 preamp to get 11.2 channels that's worked flawlessly since it first came out.
Everyone I know with a Denon receiver has never had a problem either.

Maybe I just had a bad experience with Yamaha, but I'm not the only one who had problems with Onkyo.
Lots of features for a low price, but no build quality.

Would love the build quality of a Anthem D2, Datasat RS20i, Lexicon MC-14, Theta Casablanca III, or Trinnov Atitude 32 but too much money even used.
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post #27 of 73 Old 06-06-2015, 11:00 PM
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While Sony is not mentioned anywhere on this thread or listed in any surveys above, I found my Sony to be very reliable, unless I was extremely lucky.
Over 12 years ago I bought my Sony HTIB with all wires and speakers (something many people on AVS forums stopped doing long ago) but I did not have a single problem with it, sound or operation wise.

Now, I am in the market for a new receiver because while the receiver works great, I lost the front LCD panel display, it's probably fixable with a soldering iron, I am not sure it's something I can tackle.

When I checked the reviews of various brands, especially those that were mentioned in this thread, all of them had negative reviews on their entry/bottom of the line models. So I think the key is not to buy their lowest model in the line up, it seems like those are not well made and they are not just the essentials but also budget models just to complete with other guys in those price levels.

With #1 choice of posters in this thread, Yamaha, I was ecstatic to see Yamaha finally release V379 with hdcp 2.2 complaint HDMI (only 1) at a very affordable $250 level. Soon I realized it was just an extremely stripped down model, even removing USB, so god knows what else was stripped from internals. Don't even look for Analog to HDMI upconversion, which doesn't show up until you hit V679 at +$600 levels.

So, my question would be this, is there any difference in terms of quality and craftsmanship of the internal components between V379 and V679? Or is it exact same unit with additional features, so there would be no quality difference between the two despite major difference in price.

I guess their Aventage line is the competition to Pioneer's Elite line, but I don't see any new models with hdcp 2.2 so far.

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post #28 of 73 Old 06-07-2015, 04:21 AM
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Yamaha is the most reliable if it is made in Yamaha's plant in Malaysia. Yamaha is the only major manufacturer that doesn't outsource its receivers to plants in China and makes them in its owned factory in Malaysia. Some of the lower end models are made in China to be competitive. The China ones are made along side every other manufacturers Denon, Marantz, Pioneer, Onkyo, etc and have about the same failure rate as the others.
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post #29 of 73 Old 06-07-2015, 04:46 AM
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When it comes to longevity, listen with the hand.

Place the hand (right or left) on the top of a powered up receiver. The more heat generated, the shorter the lifespan of the components inside.

As for brands, Onkyo is famous for making receivers that can fry eggs on top while playing your favorite tunes.
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post #30 of 73 Old 06-07-2015, 04:53 AM
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Pioneer? haven't had a problem with mine for 5yrs! lolz however, mine is well ventilated and it sits in a glass unit which probably helps.

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