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seeking feedback on music streaming, and perhaps server, devices

2K views 27 replies 4 participants last post by  sjm817 
#1 ·
The forum doesn't seem to have a category that fits questions related to music servers/streaming devices, which is presumably how an increasing number of folks are getting their content. I mulled putting this in the CD player category, but ultimately decided to post it here.

I'm looking for a device to stream Pandora and Amazon Prime music through my mid-fi system (Denon AVR feeding Focal towers and a pretty musical sub). I don't mind if it also serves as a music server from which I can play my Apple lossless-encoded music, but I have an old iPod Classic that's still covering that for me for now. I was using my iPhone, but I don't want my phone tied up delivering music, and Pandora limits phones to a measly 64kbps. I have used a Kindle Fire, but it has sporadic issues with electrical interference, and Pandora limits it to 128k I believe (depends whether it's classified as a mobile device). Why Pandora limits non-computers to 128k I don't get. I think there are ways to play Flash content on a Kindle or an iPad so that you can get the full 196k Pandora quality, but they're workarounds that seem to have issues, since their not supported.

I'm starting to think I need to designate a computer for this function, perhaps outputting via USB to a separate DAC, since the headphone port sound quality isn't likely to be great. I'm not sure whether a Chromebook might be an inexpensive, effective solution, though not with regard to playing local files. Or perhaps a Windows-based tablet or one of those convertible tablet/laptop hybrids? Or just a desktop computer. I've historically been a PC user, and it's what I use at work, but every PC I've ever used developed BSODs after a few years, and I'm tired of dealing with that, so my next laptop will probably be a Macbook (but not a fan of the keyboards--spoiled by years of ThinkPads--oh well, always a trade-off, I guess). But I don't think I want that laptop to be tied up as a music server.

So this is really a question about what I should be considering as music streaming and perhaps server options. Maybe the answer is something like a Mac Mini and monitor? That's spendier than I'd like, but I'm at least open to considering it. Are there other options, either at lesser or similar price ranges, that should be on my radar. I feel like we're in a period of flux in terms of music delivery, and while there are various options, everything seems to involve some trade-offs.

Input appreciated!
 
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#2 ·
Something like a Roku might work. That will do Amazon Prime music and Pandora as well as a heck of a lot more. Amazon Fire TV is probably another option.
 
#3 ·
My Denon AVR has the same functionality as the Roku--so one thing I've considered is splitting the HDMI output, and putting a small/cheap TV on the wall above the stereo rack, so I don't have to fire up the projector to browse music--but sadly (inexplicably) Pandora limits both to 128k.

Here's Pandora's current setup: "Pandora on the Web plays 64k AAC+ for free listeners and 192kbps for Pandora One subscribers. All in-home devices play 128kbps audio, and mobile devices receive a variety of different rates depending on the capability of the device and the network they are on, but never more than 64k AAC+."
 
#4 ·
The Roku has considerably more functionality than your Denon. But it seems that what you really want is a way to stream w/o having to fire up your projector. For Pandora you have the solution right now in the Denon Remote App, which will let you run your receiver w/o a video interface. With a DLNA interface you can stream from a computer or NAS w/o using the video interface -- your Denon will stream ALAC up to 24/96. One problem with living in the Apple-o-sphere is that the Denon will only do gapless playback with FLAC (AirPlay works fine). I've been using a small Synology NAS for those duties for more than a year and am quite happy with it. Amazon Prime music is a different beast and I really can't think of a solution for that other than a Roku (or Amazon Fire TV) which can be done w/o a video interface at this time. There are phone apps for Prime music which you may be able to use with a Bluetooth receiver like the one from Audioengine:

http://audioengineusa.com/Store/B1-Bluetooth-Music-Receiver
 
#11 ·
The Roku has considerably more functionality than your Denon. But it seems that what you really want is a way to stream w/o having to fire up your projector. For Pandora you have the solution right now in the Denon Remote App, which will let you run your receiver w/o a video interface. With a DLNA interface you can stream from a computer or NAS w/o using the video interface -- your Denon will stream ALAC up to 24/96. One problem with living in the Apple-o-sphere is that the Denon will only do gapless playback with FLAC (AirPlay works fine). I've been using a small Synology NAS for those duties for more than a year and am quite happy with it. Amazon Prime music is a different beast and I really can't think of a solution for that other than a Roku (or Amazon Fire TV) which can be done w/o a video interface at this time. There are phone apps for Prime music which you may be able to use with a Bluetooth receiver like the one from Audioengine:

http://audioengineusa.com/Store/B1-Bluetooth-Music-Receiver
What functionality would I get from a Roku or Amazon Fire TV that I don't already have via my Denon X2000 AVR?

My iPhone can connect to the Denon via AirPlay, so no need for a Bluetooth receiver, I think. Same for an iPad, say, at some point I'd like to stop relying on my phone to feed my system (okay as a controller, definitely prefer not to have it actually feeding content, e.g. AirPlaying).
 
#5 ·
FWIW, I've recently moved from Pandora to Spotify. Partly due to the 128K bitrate, and also its small music library. Spotify premium (paid) is 320K ogg vorbis. The free version is 160K. Spotify has ~ 20M tracks Vs Pandoras ~ 1M. Spotify Connect (you need a supported AVR) streams directly to the AVR without the need of a display device. You use your mobile device or tablet as the "remote control"

Just thought I'd toss that out there.
 
#6 ·
The Denon Remote App is great! Works for Pandora, albeit at 128k, and includes Spotify also. The Denon AVR includes Amazon Prime I believe, odd that it's not in the app, perhaps it'll be added. But I think Spotify will probably meet my needs regardless. Glad I posted this!
 
#9 ·
Yep. My Denon X2000 AVR doesn't seem to support Spotify Connect (correct me if I'm mistaken!). So my options are a cruder Spotify app within the Denon Remote App or just playing Spotify on my phone (or a future tablet or other device) via their dedicated app and using AirPlay, or a hard-wired connection from the headphone jack.

Spotify within the Denon Remote App seems to work fine, not as pretty/slick as the Spotify app. I don't see anywhere to select the audio quality, though. I noticed on the PC app you have to select the higher-quality audio, and it seems to be by device rather than across the board. Tips welcome!

Spotify on my iPhone or a future tablet device, connected via AirPlay, gives me the prettier/slicker Spotify app (why does it only seem to offer the options of "shuffle play" and individual tracks, how do I play an album?). I'm not sure what the quality implications of AirPlay wireless streaming are, any insights?

Spotify on my phone or a future tablet can also be connected via the headphone out. I don't have a good sense of how the DACs in the phone or a future tablet compare to the Denon X2000's DACs, but my guess is this is a less good option quality-wise.
 
#8 ·
Tidal streams CD quality but is not free. A PC with a DLNA server on it (or a purpose-built NAS with same) will do everything you need for local streaming. No need for fancy DACs or HDMI then, it'll just use the DAC in your receiver.
 
#10 ·
Tidal looks promising, I wonder if Denon will make it compatible with (slightly) older AVRs like my X2000 with a firmware update. (I wonder if that might happen for Spotify Connect too, my impression is not, for technical reasons I don't entirely understand.) In the interim it could be accessed via various devices. Any sense of how the catalog compares to Spotify?

A PC or Mac as music server and streaming utility is arguably the best option, but pricier. Can I just plug a hard drive with music files on it into my X2000 via USB? The Denon Remote App seems to include options for controlling something like this, but I don't know how feasible, or slick, it would be.
 
#27 ·
I'll be curious to see what you find. I haven't sat down and tried the comparison, so at most I can definitively say that 320k Spotify sounds notably better than 64k Pandora, both over AirPlay. Which is reassuring, in a "yep, gravity's still operating" sort of way. :)
 
#28 ·
I did a brief comparison of Spotify Connect/Airplay/Bluetooth. I tested with an iPad Air. The receiver is a Sony STR-DN1050. The Bluetooth supports AAC and aptX, but I dont think there is a way to determine what it is using. The good news is they all sound great and frankly it was hard to tell any difference. I could not switch the connection method in a blink so that made it a bit more difficult to A/B/C test. I was driving the setup (and my wife) :) crazy with all the switching back and forth. The Airplay seemed a bit "different" than the Connect and bluetooth. Maybe a little less bright? Hard to say. I prefer the connect method for the direct stream to the AVR, but if that is not available, the other options seem just fine.
 
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