Three Denon S-Series AVRs with HEOS & Wireless Surround Announced - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #1 of 57 Unread 03-14-2017, 09:24 AM - Thread Starter
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Three Denon S-Series AVRs with HEOS & Wireless Surround Announced

I'm sure there is a vibrant dialog occurring in @jdsmoothie s "The "OFFICIAL" 2016 Denon "S-Series" / "X-Series" AVR Owner's Thread + FAQ" and I don't wish to dilute that discussion with this post. So, here's a link to that thread.

Having said that, this is AVS Forum homepage-worthy news given the addition of HEOS and Dolby Vision to two of these new models. So, please click the following link to the article read more: http://www.avsforum.com/denon-s-seri...sion-unveiled/

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Last edited by imagic; 03-14-2017 at 01:14 PM.
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post #2 of 57 Unread 03-14-2017, 01:16 PM
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very very interesting. There needs to be a seriously good wireless solution. I think Klipsch wireless subs have been getting pretty good praise and they use the same technology.
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Pardon my ignorance, what exactly is Dolby Vision? I'll be in the market to upgrade eventually but I am not familiar with Dolby Vision. This receiver sounds nice. Thanks
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And the war against affordable full pre-outs continues...
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Originally Posted by markmathers View Post
Pardon my ignorance, what exactly is Dolby Vision? I'll be in the market to upgrade eventually but I am not familiar with Dolby Vision. This receiver sounds nice. Thanks
Dolby Vision is a high dynamic range (HDR) video technology. It is currently available when streaming UHD content from Vudu, Netflix, and Amazon. This year, it's expected that Ultra HD blu-rays will become available that feature Dolby vision. This is the alternative to HDR10, which is the standard used on all Ultra HD Blu-rays and is also available on Amazon and Netflix. Vudu is currently the only streaming service that exclusively offers Dolby Vision has the HDR option, and it has announced that it will support HDR10 in the future.

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Assuming that the AVR-S730H does not have dual HDMI outputs, only the AVR-S930H?

Any pricing info on the AVR-S930H? Obviously it will be more than $500.

Finally any expected release date?

Many thanks!
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Quote:
Originally Posted by imagic View Post
Dolby Vision is a high dynamic range (HDR) video technology. It is currently available when streaming UHD content from Vudu, Netflix, and Amazon. This year, it's expected that Ultra HD blu-rays will become available that feature Dolby vision. This is the alternative to HDR10, which is the standard used on all Ultra HD Blu-rays and is also available on Amazon and Netflix. Vudu is currently the only streaming service that exclusively offers Dolby Vision has the HDR option, and it has announced that it will support HDR10 in the future.
Any idea on what it has relative to other receivers that makes it compatible with DV? And by extension, what chance other modern receivers(like my SC-95) will be getting a firmware upgrade to allow the same?

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post #8 of 57 Unread 03-14-2017, 02:21 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by mikez28 View Post
Assuming that the AVR-S730H does not have dual HDMI outputs, only the AVR-S930H?

Any pricing info on the AVR-S930H? Obviously it will be more than $500.

Finally any expected release date?

Many thanks!
That's what I deduce. Availability is April 2017.

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post #9 of 57 Unread 03-14-2017, 03:09 PM
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I'll stick with Sonos connect and my old AVR-4311. The HEOS app is just terrible. Terrible.Denon should just call it a day. Sony is no better. SongPal ... ugh.
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post #10 of 57 Unread 03-14-2017, 03:12 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by apw2607 View Post
I'll stick with Sonos connect and my old AVR-4311. The HEOS app is just terrible. Terrible. Denon should just call it a day. Sony is no better. SongPal ... ugh.
Well, not really. And the reason is because an app can always be rewritten and redesigned and made to work better with the hardware.

But then, what makes me excited has nothing to do with streaming using an app. It's the idea of implementing wireless surrounds that bypass the network, and providing both speaker and amplification options that work with it. It's really a completely different usage case as compared to Sonos. I'm into using Google Cast for doing the multi-room streaming audio thing.

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Originally Posted by imagic View Post
Well, not really. And the reason is because an app can always be rewritten and redesigned and made to work better with the hardware.

But then, what makes me excited has nothing to do with streaming using an app. It's the idea of implementing wireless surrounds that bypass the network, and providing both speaker and amplification options that work with it. It's really a completely different usage case as compared to Sonos. I'm into using Google Cast for doing the multi-room streaming audio thing.
What's your take on the limitations of this? 2 speakers?
So, the use case is that you have rear surrounds that double as multi-room HEOS speakers?
I'm not sure I'm getting the major benefit except that it is wireless (but you'd still need to connect the speakers to a HEOS amp)?
Do you think you can drive Atmos in-ceiling speakers this way (with an amp connected to the speakers)?
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post #12 of 57 Unread 03-14-2017, 03:25 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by skro View Post
What's your take on the limitations of this? 2 speakers?
So, the use case is that you have rear surrounds that double as multi-room HEOS speakers?
I'm not sure I'm getting the major benefit except that it is wireless (but you'd still need to connect the speakers to a HEOS amp)?
Do you think you can drive Atmos in-ceiling speakers this way (with an amp connected to the speakers)?
I think it's a step in that direction. I would certainly love to see more transmitters built-in, if HEOS can serve as a foundation for a proper wireless system—lets say 5.2.4—then that would be amazing. I can dream, yes?

Yes, the current limitation is two speakers... that can be used as standard surrounds. And yeah, basically the benefit is that you can either use HEOS speakers—so that it's actually wireless. Or use a HEOS amp ith your own speakers and skip having to run cables from the front of the room to the back of the room.

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post #13 of 57 Unread 03-14-2017, 03:29 PM
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Originally Posted by imagic View Post
Well, not really. And the reason is because an app can always be rewritten and redesigned and made to work better with the hardware.
You did ask in your news article what one prefers ... Sonos or a Heos amp ... just saying ;-)
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post #14 of 57 Unread 03-14-2017, 03:33 PM - Thread Starter
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You did ask in your news article what one prefers ... Sonos or a Heos amp ... just saying ;-)
Not Sonos amp or HEOS amp. For $500, you can get Sonos amp or the Denon AVR-S730H with 7-channels, Atmos, HDMI, Dolby Vision, room correction, bass management, hi-res support, DTS, headphone jack, optical, etc. etc... Oh, and yeah it has HEOS too. That's the value proposition I was talking about.

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post #15 of 57 Unread 03-14-2017, 03:49 PM
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Originally Posted by imagic View Post
Well, not really. And the reason is because an app can always be rewritten and redesigned and made to work better with the hardware.

But then, what makes me excited has nothing to do with streaming using an app. It's the idea of implementing wireless surrounds that bypass the network, and providing both speaker and amplification options that work with it. It's really a completely different usage case as compared to Sonos. I'm into using Google Cast for doing the multi-room streaming audio thing.
No wireless surround option on these "S" series models out of the box, however, perhaps with a future firmware update it may be possible.

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Originally Posted by mikez28 View Post
Assuming that the AVR-S730H does not have dual HDMI outputs, only the AVR-S930H?

Any pricing info on the AVR-S930H? Obviously it will be more than $500.

Finally any expected release date?

Many thanks!
No change in MSRP from last couple of years: S930H - $579, S730H - $479.
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Originally Posted by jdsmoothie View Post
No wireless surround option on these "S" series models.
No? HEOS AVR only for that? Shoot.

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So I assume then all last years models can not do dolby vision then. If so that sucks. I why can't last years models be upgraded then. I would have waited till this yeAr but all over the demon and marantz threads. Dolby vision will work. Screwed by tech again
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So I assume then all last years models can not do dolby vision then. If so that sucks. I why can't last years models be upgraded then. I would have waited till this yeAr but all over the demon and marantz threads. Dolby vision will work. Screwed by tech again
The 2016 D+M models will receive a Dolby Vision firmware update by early 2018, otherwise, unable to pass Dolby Vision at this time.
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Originally Posted by imagic View Post
I think it's a step in that direction. I would certainly love to see more transmitters built-in, if HEOS can serve as a foundation for a proper wireless system—lets say 5.2.4—then that would be amazing. I can dream, yes?
That would be amazing. A proper wireless system like 7.2.4. Especially where aesthetic concerns. Even me who does not care of aesthetic too much still thinking a proper way to put ceiling speakers. Those cables will seen on the ceiling anyway. Actually wireless speakers require a power supply like an adapter. So there is always a cable.

Quote:
Originally Posted by jdsmoothie View Post
The 2016 D+M models will receive a Dolby Vision firmware update by early 2018, otherwise, unable to pass Dolby Vision at this time.
So 2017 models has dolby vision support. It is good news. Also 2016 D+M models has dolby vision hardware built in otherwise they could not have support with firmware. I expected that but why 2018? Why wait? Why didnt have support in first place?
2015 models out of luck or will they have an upgrade?
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For All 2016 D+M Models?

Quote:
Originally Posted by jdsmoothie View Post
The 2016 D+M models will receive a Dolby Vision firmware update by early 2018, otherwise, unable to pass Dolby Vision at this time.
Does this statement reflect all 2016 models, or only the X models? If not, will the 2016 S models will pass the HDR10 data from a Dolby Vision disc, or will the disc not pass any data, i.e., Dolby Vision discs will not pass any data thru a non-DV capable receiver?

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Originally Posted by soyhakan View Post
That would be amazing. A proper wireless system like 7.2.4. Especially where aesthetic concerns. Even me who does not care of aesthetic too much still thinking a proper way to put ceiling speakers. Those cables will seen on the ceiling anyway. Actually wireless speakers require a power supply like an adapter. So there is always a cable.



So 2017 models has dolby vision support. It is good news. Also 2016 D+M models has dolby vision hardware built in otherwise they could not have support with firmware. I expected that but why 2018? Why wait? Why didnt have support in first place?
2015 models out of luck or will they have an upgrade?
The former.
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Does this statement reflect all 2016 models, or only the X models? If not, will the 2016 S models will pass the HDR10 data from a Dolby Vision disc, or will the disc not pass any data, i.e., Dolby Vision discs will not pass any data thru a non-DV capable receiver?
All 2016 models. Also, AFAIK, HDR10 is required on all HDR discs whereas DV is optional so at the very least the HDR10 will pass until the DV update is received.
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Originally Posted by jdsmoothie View Post
The 2016 D+M models will receive a Dolby Vision firmware update by early 2018, otherwise, unable to pass Dolby Vision at this time.
That's interesting, and I'm a bit surprised they don't do it already. I'd assumed that HDMI 2.0a is HDMI 2.0a and the receiver would be agnostic as to whether the HDR signal was HDR10, DV, HLG, or something else since it just has to pass it along and not worry about decoding it or anything. Why is it that passing DV is different than HDR10?

Also, does this release mean we're getting close to the announcement for the 2017 X-Series? I'm hoping for HDMI 2.1 capability in those...
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Nice

Quote:
Originally Posted by jdsmoothie View Post
All 2016 models. Also, AFAIK, HDR10 is required on all HDR discs whereas DV is optional so at the very least the HDR10 will pass until the DV update is received.
Many thanks for the info, and although it has been shared many times, let me throw my hat into the ring and add that your feedback and assistance is a tremendous asset for us D+M owners.

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Originally Posted by TuteTibiImperes View Post
That's interesting, and I'm a bit surprised they don't do it already. I'd assumed that HDMI 2.0a is HDMI 2.0a and the receiver would be agnostic as to whether the HDR signal was HDR10, DV, HLG, or something else since it just has to pass it along and not worry about decoding it or anything. Why is it that passing DV is different than HDR10?

Also, does this release mean we're getting close to the announcement for the 2017 X-Series? I'm hoping for HDMI 2.1 capability in those...
No major brand 2016 AVR can currently pass Dolby Vision. Lower Denon "X" series should be announced soon (next month?); however, considering HDMI 2.1 hasn't even been released yet, don't look for it any earlier than the 2018 models.
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Originally Posted by imagic View Post
Dolby Vision is a high dynamic range (HDR) video technology. It is currently available when streaming UHD content from Vudu, Netflix, and Amazon. This year, it's expected that Ultra HD blu-rays will become available that feature Dolby vision. This is the alternative to HDR10, which is the standard used on all Ultra HD Blu-rays and is also available on Amazon and Netflix. Vudu is currently the only streaming service that exclusively offers Dolby Vision has the HDR option, and it has announced that it will support HDR10 in the future.
why would dolby vision be on a receiver? isn't that just passthrough? I thought the TV decodes the DV signal?

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post #28 of 57 Unread 03-15-2017, 06:53 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by tjcinnamon View Post
why would dolby vision be on a receiver? isn't that just passthrough? I thought the TV decodes the DV signal?
Yes, all it has to do is pass through the Vision data. But, without a firmware update, current AVRs won't do that, and there's no guarantee those updates are forthcoming. In contrast, this unit will support Dolby Vision right out of the box.

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post #29 of 57 Unread 03-15-2017, 07:52 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by imagic View Post
Yes, all it has to do is pass through the Vision data. But, without a firmware update, current AVRs won't do that, and there's no guarantee those updates are forthcoming. In contrast, this unit will support Dolby Vision right out of the box.
Hoping my Marantz SR7010 will be able to do that.

I was hoping to do: Blu-ray (DV) -> AVR (passthrough) -> LG OLED (DV); but what you're suggesting is that I may need to do Blu-Ray (DV) -> LG OLED (DV) -> ARC to AVR (hopefully with Dolby Atmos, not sure if ARC supports that)?

If the latter this is the first I've heard of every device in the chain requiring DV.

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post #30 of 57 Unread 03-15-2017, 08:15 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tjcinnamon View Post
Hoping my Marantz SR7010 will be able to do that.

I was hoping to do: Blu-ray (DV) -> AVR (passthrough) -> LG OLED (DV); but what you're suggesting is that I may need to do Blu-Ray (DV) -> LG OLED (DV) -> ARC to AVR (hopefully with Dolby Atmos, not sure if ARC supports that)?

If the latter this is the first I've heard of every device in the chain requiring DV.
Considering every UHD Blu-Ray player have dual HDMI out what you will do is:

Blu-Ray (DV) -> LG OLED
Blu-Ray (DV) -> SR7010

No need to rely on ARC at all.
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