Very VERY underwhelmed by the RX-A750 Yamaha - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #1 of 99 Old 03-19-2017, 04:52 PM - Thread Starter
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Very VERY underwhelmed by the RX-A750 Yamaha

I love the App love music cast but where is the PUNCH?

90W per Channel 7.2 4K GREAT reviews - I have small room , 686S2 Bookshelves, 10 inch Sub , B&W center , Dayton 8in in ceiling rear and B&W surrounds - MEH ....

I have a Marantz 100W per upstairs MUCH better

I went to my patio where I have an OLD Pioneer from like 04' - 05' for outdoor setup brought it in tried it in place of Yamaha @ 5.1 and it was pretty damn comparable

Is it Yamaha? this model? is an amp even worth it with this model?
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post #2 of 99 Old 03-19-2017, 08:51 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MeanMachine View Post
I love the App love music cast but where is the PUNCH?

90W per Channel 7.2 4K GREAT reviews - I have small room , 686S2 Bookshelves, 10 inch Sub , B&W center , Dayton 8in in ceiling rear and B&W surrounds - MEH ....

I have a Marantz 100W per upstairs MUCH better

I went to my patio where I have an OLD Pioneer from like 04' - 05' for outdoor setup brought it in tried it in place of Yamaha @ 5.1 and it was pretty damn comparable

Is it Yamaha? this model? is an amp even worth it with this model?
Interesting. I am currently looking into the RX-A760, a 2016 model. Yamaha's always seem to get good reviews. Maybe I should look into the next model up (A860), which is 100W per channel. Any reason you went for the A750 vs. the A760 (newer model)?
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post #3 of 99 Old 03-19-2017, 09:28 PM - Thread Starter
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Interesting. I am currently looking into the RX-A760, a 2016 model. Yamaha's always seem to get good reviews. Maybe I should look into the next model up (A860), which is 100W per channel. Any reason you went for the A750 vs. the A760 (newer model)?
Audiholics has an in depth review of the 860 - I went 760 because I got it on A4L for half the price of the 860 - I'm not sure the 860 was even out ?
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post #4 of 99 Old 03-20-2017, 01:18 AM
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Originally Posted by MeanMachine View Post
[...]

Is it Yamaha? this model? is an amp even worth it with this model?
Mate, it's the room!
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post #5 of 99 Old 03-20-2017, 01:23 AM
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Move your Marantz into the room where the Yamaha is now and connect that instead making sure not to move the speakers or changing stuff in the room. Does it still sound a lot better? Most likely differences in speakers or room that's causing the confusion.
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The A760 produces barely 30 watts of power per channel with 7 speakers lol.

Whoever told you it's 90 watts? Yamaha?

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ben Tan View Post
The A760 produces barely 30 watts of power per channel with 7 speakers lol.

Whoever told you it's 90 watts? Yamaha?

The only receivers that provide true per channel wattage specs are two channel stereo receivers. Five channel or seven channel and so on, home theater receivers, wattage specs are very misleading.
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post #8 of 99 Old 03-20-2017, 06:05 AM
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Originally Posted by jrhooper1963 View Post
The only receivers that provide true per channel wattage specs are two channel stereo receivers. Five channel or seven channel and so on, home theater receivers, wattage specs are very misleading.
Meh, that's besides the point. What pisses me off are the way they are coming up with the specs.

I mean; 6ohms, 1khz at 10% THD and 1 channel driven for a 9-channel receiver? Wtf?
This isn't just Yamaha, it's pretty much all the mainstream brands these days.

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Originally Posted by Ben Tan View Post
The A760 produces barely 30 watts of power per channel with 7 speakers lol.

Whoever told you it's 90 watts? Yamaha?
Poor form Ben.

Not only is this unhelpful to the OP at this point, but it also demonstrates a lack of understanding of the relevance of simultaneous multi-channel Sine wave power output test results as they apply to mainstream AVR's.

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Meh, that's besides the point. What pisses me off are the way they are coming up with the specs.

I mean; 6ohms, 1khz at 10% THD and 1 channel driven for a 9-channel receiver? Wtf?
This isn't just Yamaha, it's pretty much all the mainstream brands these days.
This is the sort of outraged reaction that many of us feel within the first year or so of becoming an audio enthusiast. It's nothing new and it'll pass soon enough.

In the meantime, it's not really necessary to have a crack at a bloke's chosen gear.
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post #10 of 99 Old 03-20-2017, 07:09 AM
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Originally Posted by philipbtz View Post
Move your Marantz into the room where the Yamaha is now and connect that instead making sure not to move the speakers or changing stuff in the room. Does it still sound a lot better? Most likely differences in speakers or room that's causing the confusion.
This is great advice....also, I think A4L (where the OP purchased) only sells refurbished equipment. Maybe the AVR wasn't fixed properly?
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post #11 of 99 Old 03-20-2017, 07:13 AM
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"Punch" is achieved mostly by the room and the speakers. I'm willing to bet that if you put a top of the line AVR in the room as it is now, it will more than likely underwhelm you as well. The exact same setup I have now sounded 3 times better in my last space. However, the "tactile" bass is much better in the new space.

In other words, there's a lot that goes into "Punch".
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post #12 of 99 Old 03-20-2017, 07:45 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MeanMachine View Post
I love the App love music cast but where is the PUNCH?

90W per Channel 7.2 4K GREAT reviews - I have small room , 686S2 Bookshelves, 10 inch Sub , B&W center , Dayton 8in in ceiling rear and B&W surrounds - MEH ....

I have a Marantz 100W per upstairs MUCH better

I went to my patio where I have an OLD Pioneer from like 04' - 05' for outdoor setup brought it in tried it in place of Yamaha @ 5.1 and it was pretty damn comparable

Is it Yamaha? this model? is an amp even worth it with this model?
Unless I missed it somewhere did you run YPAO? If not try that and see if helps.
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post #13 of 99 Old 03-20-2017, 07:53 AM
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Very VERY underwhelmed by the RX-A750 Yamaha

Quote:
Originally Posted by MeanMachine View Post
I love the App love music cast but where is the PUNCH?
Define "punch."
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post #14 of 99 Old 03-20-2017, 03:03 PM
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Originally Posted by jrhooper1963 View Post
The only receivers that provide true per channel wattage specs are two channel stereo receivers. Five channel or seven channel and so on, home theater receivers, wattage specs are very misleading.
Not entirely correct....A few of the higher-end manufacturers such as NAD, Anthem etc. provide full-disclosure power ratings with ALL channels driven. Everyone needs to start reading specs a little more closely when purchasing from your big box brands as they ALL clearly state WPC w/2 Channels Driven. In the specs for the OP's A750 it states 90 WPC 20Hz w 2/Channels driven, so like BenTan says that breaks down to a little over 30 WPC with 7 Channels driven....This might be the cause of the "underwhelming" performance the OP is experiencing....Especially with B&W 686 low sensitivity of only 85db...

Just my 2 cents...
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Originally Posted by carminepesce View Post
Not entirely correct....A few of the higher-end manufacturers such as NAD, Anthem etc. provide full-disclosure power ratings with ALL channels driven. Everyone needs to start reading specs a little more closely when purchasing from your big box brands as they ALL clearly state WPC w/2 Channels Driven. In the specs for the OP's A750 it states 90 WPC 20Hz w 2/Channels driven, so like BenTan says that breaks down to a little over 30 WPC with 7 Channels driven....This might be the cause of the "underwhelming" performance the OP is experiencing....Especially with B&W 686 low sensitivity of only 85db...

Just my 2 cents...
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What does that mean low sensitivity?
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post #16 of 99 Old 03-20-2017, 03:08 PM
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What does that mean low sensitivity?
Means your speakers need more power to make equivalent sound level as some sensitive speakers with less.
What's underwhelming may I ask? Audio quality? Volume?
Did you run the YPAO correctly?
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post #17 of 99 Old 03-20-2017, 03:11 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ben Tan View Post
The A760 produces barely 30 watts of power per channel with 7 speakers lol.

Whoever told you it's 90 watts? Yamaha?
That is not true. It's not limited to 30w per channel when in 7 channel mode.
Power is dynamic so if two of the speakers playing, and the rest is silent, you still get 90-100w rated 2 channel driven output.
The 30w measurement is when all channels are driven equally which is rarely the case in almost any situations. It's a good test see how much power is reserved so about 210w ish.
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Means your speakers need more power to make equivalent sound level as some sensitive speakers with less.
What's underwhelming may I ask? Audio quality? Volume?
Did you run the YPAO correctly?
Thats what it feels like! just MEH ugh Like the speakers are barely juiced ....

When I put the MARANTZ in 1000W 5011 BOOM Sounds great But I love that Yamaha interface APP

Pissed
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post #19 of 99 Old 03-20-2017, 03:13 PM
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Thats what it feels like! just MEH ugh Like the speakers are barely juiced ....

When I put the MARANTZ in 1000W 5011 BOOM Sounds great But I love that Yamaha interface APP

Pissed
First run the YPAO make sure everything is set up correctly.
Marantz does have that warm pronounced mid lower sound to it. Yamaha is more balanced and clean.
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Low sensitivity is how efficiently the speaker turns electricity into sound.

If you have a receiver and plug an 86db speaker as left and 89db speaker as right then the one on the right will louder. If you want them to be equal volume you'll need to adjust your amp so that the right channel gets HALF the power that the left channel does. You do this by setting the level @ -3db (-3db is half in decibels)

If you have 92db speakers upstairs then your marantz is dealing with 1/4 of the work-load.

All that said... it's your room or your settings or your sub isn't working right.

The power ratings of the amps is about the same, roughly 1db different. Compare apples to apples.

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post #21 of 99 Old 03-20-2017, 10:10 PM - Thread Starter
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I bought the Pioneer VSX - LX101 on a whim I went to BB , found it for $339 read some quick reviews checked the specs - it's in the magnolia room too.... I mean this thing to good to be true? I hooked it up it BLOWS the Yamaha out of the water - now I need to really take a few days to hear it though ... but its more powerful no question , it's in your grill IMO, I watched x men half hour on it ...basement shaking with Dayton Sub but just right when it had too ...

We shall see - the Yamaha might have had a cleaner sound ? does that make sense, less charged music wise ....
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post #22 of 99 Old 03-20-2017, 10:18 PM
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Very VERY underwhelmed by the RX-A750 Yamaha

Two different AVRs, no mention of automated setup and leveling ... is it plausible that one would drive the speakers to kingdom come while the Yamaha merely tickles them?
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Originally Posted by MeanMachine View Post
We shall see - the Yamaha might have had a cleaner sound ? does that make sense, less charged music wise ....
Nope. Very different qualitative assessments IMHO. The answer likely lies in something else.

Still haven't noticed if you told us you ran YPAO on the Yamaha, after being asked in three separate posts, so I'll presume No you didnt' run YPAO.
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post #23 of 99 Old 03-21-2017, 01:21 AM
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Poor form Ben.

Not only is this unhelpful to the OP at this point, but it also demonstrates a lack of understanding of the relevance of simultaneous multi-channel Sine wave power output test results as they apply to mainstream AVR's.


This is the sort of outraged reaction that many of us feel within the first year or so of becoming an audio enthusiast. It's nothing new and it'll pass soon enough.

In the meantime, it's not really necessary to have a crack at a bloke's chosen gear.
Quote:
Originally Posted by jasonsong View Post
That is not true. It's not limited to 30w per channel when in 7 channel mode.
Power is dynamic so if two of the speakers playing, and the rest is silent, you still get 90-100w rated 2 channel driven output.
The 30w measurement is when all channels are driven equally which is rarely the case in almost any situations. It's a good test see how much power is reserved so about 210w ish.
Oh come on guys. I know everything about the full range, sine wave, full volume test on home receivers. And yes yes, the amount of people who even run their receivers at full power at all times are practically close to none since there's no actual entertainment contentthat does it. I know all of that.

I made the 30w per channel point due to the fact I assumed that OP's room is of a medium to large size. He didn't give any exact measurements, so I'm basing that on the speakers and setup he has (I mean, his mains are of low sensitivity to begin with).

My post probably came off sounding wrong, I was simply making my point that no one should look at the sticker on the box and expect that's the power they are getting.


Quote:
Originally Posted by carminepesce View Post
Not entirely correct....A few of the higher-end manufacturers such as NAD, Anthem etc. provide full-disclosure power ratings with ALL channels driven. Everyone needs to start reading specs a little more closely when purchasing from your big box brands as they ALL clearly state WPC w/2 Channels Driven. In the specs for the OP's A750 it states 90 WPC 20Hz w 2/Channels driven, so like BenTan says that breaks down to a little over 30 WPC with 7 Channels driven....This might be the cause of the "underwhelming" performance the OP is experiencing....Especially with B&W 686 low sensitivity of only 85db...

Just my 2 cents...
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Exactly my point.

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post #24 of 99 Old 03-21-2017, 05:46 AM - Thread Starter
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Yes I ran it twice - I won't move to the pioneer until I go back to the Yamaha one more time - maybe you are correct maybe it is me maybe I missed something with it.
I'll initialize it then I'll decide
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post #25 of 99 Old 03-21-2017, 05:53 AM - Thread Starter
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I ran mcacc btw which seemed rudimentary? In any event when running it - and I've run Audessy before - it truly punches the speakers to where you see them visually pop.
The pioneer now onkyo infused comes off at least after three hours as a powerhouse of a budget albeit magnolia avr. This thing kicks .
The guy in magnolia @ BB said there isn't a better sub 600 amp and will match many over priced avrs as well.
I was looking at the Sony DN 1070 and he called it garbage - Sony over 150 bucks more ... hmm
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post #26 of 99 Old 03-21-2017, 07:02 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MeanMachine View Post
I ran mcacc btw which seemed rudimentary? In any event when running it - and I've run Audessy before - it truly punches the speakers to where you see them visually pop.
The pioneer now onkyo infused comes off at least after three hours as a powerhouse of a budget albeit magnolia avr. This thing kicks .
The guy in magnolia @ BB said there isn't a better sub 600 amp and will match many over priced avrs as well.
I was looking at the Sony DN 1070 and he called it garbage - Sony over 150 bucks more ... hmm

On what AVR did you use Audessy? Neither the Yamaha or the Pioneer use it. The newer Onkyo's use Accu-EQ which has nothing to do with Audessey. I'll ask again did you run YPAO on that Yamaha. There should be no difference in the "Pop" between the Pioneer and the Yamaha.
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post #27 of 99 Old 03-21-2017, 08:03 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MeanMachine View Post
I bought the Pioneer VSX - LX101 on a whim I went to BB , found it for $339 read some quick reviews checked the specs - it's in the magnolia room too.... I mean this thing to good to be true? I hooked it up it BLOWS the Yamaha out of the water - now I need to really take a few days to hear it though ... but its more powerful no question , it's in your grill IMO, I watched x men half hour on it ...basement shaking with Dayton Sub but just right when it had too ...

We shall see - the Yamaha might have had a cleaner sound ? does that make sense, less charged music wise ....
Did U activate the punch feature for the Yamaha??
It is found on page 3 of the OSD menu. This will make a big difference for low frequency bass..

Just my $0.02...
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post #28 of 99 Old 03-21-2017, 08:48 AM - Thread Starter
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What ??
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post #29 of 99 Old 03-21-2017, 08:49 AM - Thread Starter
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I have a marantz 5011 upstairs - why are so sure one avr can't sound more powerful?
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post #30 of 99 Old 03-21-2017, 09:05 AM
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Meanmachine, I'm seeing a trend with some of your thread topics:

Very VERY underwhelmed .....

How many watts per channel? Is it a Lie?

If you bought a 4k TV you've been robbed ...bamboozled

A lot of negativity....which if you are not getting the sound or image you want from the equipment? Then it's the limits of the equipment you purchased, user error, room acoustic/image issues, improper calibration or no calibration at all, incorrect settings or expectations don't align with reality?

How to achieve max/better results?

Two of the best attributes of a Home Theaters hobbyist is desire to read and educate oneself (meaning research-not necessarily starting a new thread for every thought that pops into one's mind) and patience.

Ron
muzz, Knucklehead90 and ChromeJob like this.

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