Marantz SR7012,8012 and AV7704'news - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #1 of 44 Old 09-08-2017, 08:53 AM - Thread Starter
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Marantz SR7012,8012 and AV7704'news

An inside look at Marantz's new SR8012 AVR

(September 7, 2017) Marantz has officially announced three new high-end models, rounding out its 2017 class of AV receivers and processors. The new SR7012 ($2,199), SR8012 ($2,999), and AV7704 ($2,199) are on display at CEDIA 2017.





SR7012 is a refresh of last year’s flagship SR7011 model, featuring 11.2-channel processing capability with onboard amplifier support for native 9.2-channel playback. If you’re looking to run a full 7.2.4 Atmos speaker array, then you’ll need to pair the SR7012 with a standalone external two-channel amplifier. Internally, Marantz says it has “re-tuned” the SR7012 with upgraded parts and features. Performance-wise, each of its nine amplifier stages are capable of providing 125 Watts of power. The company’s new flagship standard-bearer, the SR8012, is natively capable of driving a full 11.2-channel audio show. This model trumps the SR7012’s output capabilities, delivering a potent 140 Watts per channel.



Both models ship with onboard decoding of all three immersive sound codecs. Yes, that includes Auro-3D (previously a paid upgrade option on the SR7011), which is rather big news for the European-based sound technology. I had an opportunity to speak with Auro-3D’s founder, Wilfred Van Baelen, and he’s confident this will help to bring Auro-3D encoded movies to the US disc market.



The models also deliver streaming performance using the HEOS app, Bluethooth, and AirPlay, and sound calibration using Audyssey MultEQ XT32.



On the video front, the SR7012 and SR8012 are fully compatible with the latest HDMI and HDCP 2.2 specifications on each of their eight HDMI ports. Buyers can expect to enjoy 4K Ultra HD 60 Hz video passthrough with 4:4:4 color sub-sampling, and support for HDR, 21:9 video, BT. 2020 color, and Dolby Vision. Marantz says the receivers’ triple HDMI outputs allow the models to deliver video performance to several different displays simultaneously.



Another big announcement concerning Marantz’s new top AV Receivers is support and integration of Amazon Home Entertainment Skill. This enables voice command capabilities through Alexa, allowing owners to initiate basic commands such as power on/off, altering volume, and skipping tracks. In addition, the AVRs will support Alexa Multi-room functionality, which allows users to tap the power of Alexa’s streaming services.







The backside of the SR8012 is loaded with connectivity and outputsThe new AV7704 processor is a powerful preamplifier unit, matching many of the performance specifications offered by the SR8012 (minus the amplifier stages) with 11.2 channel XLR and RCA outputs. It carries full unlocked support for Auro-3D, in addition to Dolby Atmos and DTS:X, and houses high-performance 192kHz/32bit D/A converters integrated on all channels. Sound is further enhanced by Audyssey’s MultEQ XT32 room correction suite.



While the AV7704 isn’t designed to play friendly with Amazon’s Alexa, it does offer Marantz’s built-in HEOS technology for wireless streaming, along with Wi-Fi and Bluetooth functionality.



Marantz says the SR7012 and AV7704 will begin shipping in September, while SR8012 should be available in November 2017.

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post #2 of 44 Old 09-08-2017, 09:29 AM
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Alexa support? Sweet!
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post #3 of 44 Old 09-08-2017, 11:20 AM
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Didn't bring back support for Wides?! Booooo......Hissss!!!
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post #4 of 44 Old 09-08-2017, 12:57 PM
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Originally Posted by jkscherk View Post
Didn't bring back support for Wides?! Booooo......Hissss!!!
Yeah no doubt - no wides, no dice.

Actually what is different than the 7703?
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post #5 of 44 Old 09-11-2017, 08:15 AM
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Good question...

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Originally Posted by theblackangus View Post
Yeah no doubt - no wides, no dice.

Actually what is different than the 7703?
I suspect that the differences are extremely small... I think having Auro 3D out of the box is smart for both Marantz and Auro -- will help get more folks using the format.

The changes to any evolving video standards are what you would expect, and fortunately were probably locked in well before the announced Dolby vs Samsung feud... https://www.soundandvision.com/conte...hdr-auro-alexa https://www.cnet.com/news/samsung-in...-dolby-vision/

It is not at all clear what changes are really going to need to happen on any PrePro as long the appropriate video info is passed through from source (BluRay) to display (4k HDR flat panel or projector)...
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post #6 of 44 Old 09-11-2017, 03:13 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jphillips63 View Post
An inside look at Marantz's new SR8012 AVR




Internally, except for the transformer, does this not look like the Denon AVR-X7200?
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post #7 of 44 Old 09-11-2017, 03:51 PM
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The new SR7012 ($2,199), SR8012 ($2,999)

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post #8 of 44 Old 09-11-2017, 05:19 PM
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I was hoping the 7704 would be appealing enough to make me jump from the Anthem AVM60. Alas, I'm having difficulty understanding what's really new with the last two generations of Marantz pre-pros except evolving video protocols.

I mean, are the DAC's better? Is the transformer different? Are they truly balancing any of the circuitry yet? How about the room correction...better?

That the press releases ALWAYS revolve around how many more ceiling speakers can be run drives me absolutely batty. Give us some specs that actually matter!
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post #9 of 44 Old 09-12-2017, 03:13 AM
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The inclusion of HDMI 2.1 and enhanced ARC (eARC) is really great.. at least for me.. as I like to run Netflix , Plex, etc from the TV apps...

As for the new DAC, this is it: http://www.akm.com/akm/en/product/da...artno=AK4458VN

I have no idea how well-liked/respected is this DAC though? anyone has views on it?
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post #10 of 44 Old 09-12-2017, 07:45 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by adrummingdude View Post
I was hoping the 7704 would be appealing enough to make me jump from the Anthem AVM60. Alas, I'm having difficulty understanding what's really new with the last two generations of Marantz pre-pros except evolving video protocols.

I mean, are the DAC's better? Is the transformer different? Are they truly balancing any of the circuitry yet? How about the room correction...better?

That the press releases ALWAYS revolve around how many more ceiling speakers can be run drives me absolutely batty. Give us some specs that actually matter!
Room correction better?: Having the 7703 and having used the new audyssey app it has greatly improved the flexibility of the audyssey correction engine. Not sure how much you know of it, but it's been great to tool around with.

Are the DAC's better?: No, I bet they actually put worse ones in this year. Kidding of course, I would imagine if the DAC's change that they have found some improvement.

Truly Balanced?: Not likely, as no other unit in this price range is truly balanced either.
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post #11 of 44 Old 09-12-2017, 05:17 PM
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Room correction better?: Having the 7703 and having used the new audyssey app it has greatly improved the flexibility of the audyssey correction engine. Not sure how much you know of it, but it's been great to tool around with.

Are the DAC's better?: No, I bet they actually put worse ones in this year. Kidding of course, I would imagine if the DAC's change that they have found some improvement.

Truly Balanced?: Not likely, as no other unit in this price range is truly balanced either.
Hi i am look to buy the new av7704 $2,199 , but i saw the Av 7703 drop price for $1,499 i think is good deal, my question , is any diference in sound quality the Av 7703 to Av 7704 they use same audyssey mult eq xt32. The Dac. Are the same? It not much diference, i think the av7703 are in good price. What you think about?
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post #12 of 44 Old 09-13-2017, 10:44 AM
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Originally Posted by Alfredo1636 View Post
Hi i am look to buy the new av7704 $2,199 , but i saw the Av 7703 drop price for $1,499 i think is good deal, my question , is any diference in sound quality the Av 7703 to Av 7704 they use same audyssey mult eq xt32. The Dac. Are the same? It not much diference, i think the av7703 are in good price. What you think about?
Not a single person I know of has a 7704 in-hand at the moment, including myself, so these questions are impossible to answer. If I am indeed one of the first in the US to have the 7704, as it happened with the 7703, I can provide some educated responses at that time.

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Originally Posted by beastaudio View Post
Not a single person I know of has a 7704 in-hand at the moment, including myself, so these questions are impossible to answer. If I am indeed one of the first in the US to have the 7704, as it happened with the 7703, I can provide some educated responses at that time.
Dealers will have them later this week or by next week.
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post #14 of 44 Old 09-13-2017, 04:34 PM
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Originally Posted by twinturbo11 View Post
The inclusion of HDMI 2.1 and enhanced ARC (eARC) is really great.. at least for me.. as I like to run Netflix , Plex, etc from the TV apps...

As for the new DAC, this is it: http://www.akm.com/akm/en/product/da...artno=AK4458VN

I have no idea how well-liked/respected is this DAC though? anyone has views on it?
Where in the specs does it say it had HDMI 2.1? Just because someone claims "latest hdmi specification" doesn't mean it actually is. Marketing people are great at lying. It has at least one HDMI 2.1 feature, but that doesn't mean it has the rest.

It has eARC, but that might just possibly have been added to HDMI 2.0.

Unless they explicitly write HDMI 2.1 in the specs, I have serious doubts about it.

If it truly had HDMI 2.1 I would have expected them to list 5k or 8k signal pass through, but they only list 4k signal support, which somewhat hints at HDMI 2.0 still.

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Quote:
Originally Posted by twinturbo11 View Post
The inclusion of HDMI 2.1 and enhanced ARC (eARC) is really great.. at least for me.. as I like to run Netflix , Plex, etc from the TV apps...

As for the new DAC, this is it: http://www.akm.com/akm/en/product/da...artno=AK4458VN

I have no idea how well-liked/respected is this DAC though? anyone has views on it?
Asahi Kasei makes some of the better DACs in the market. An ESS Sabre 9016 or a Cirrus/Wolfson DAC are the only competitors which are likely to have better specs, and in practice, no human ear can tell the difference once you get past a 100 dB signal-to-noise or THD measurement. DACs are a mature technology and have been since the mid-1990s, once they figured out how to do oversampling in the digital domain to improve the quality of the brickwall filter.

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Quote:
Originally Posted by twinturbo11 View Post
The inclusion of HDMI 2.1 and enhanced ARC (eARC) is really great.. at least for me.. as I like to run Netflix , Plex, etc from the TV apps...

As for the new DAC, this is it: http://www.akm.com/akm/en/product/da...artno=AK4458VN

I have no idea how well-liked/respected is this DAC though? anyone has views on it?
The AK4458 has been used since the SR7010/AV7702MKII were released.
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post #17 of 44 Old 09-15-2017, 07:38 PM
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Are there any material differences between the AV7703 and AV7704 ? I have browsed the Marantz website, but it's really hard to tell.
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Are there any material differences between the AV7703 and AV7704 ? I have browsed the Marantz website, but it's really hard to tell.
It seems new DAC's, auro 3d preloaded and not an extra $200 to add.
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I'd like to see a high quality 5.1 amp alternative too. Now the SR-8012 has 11 channels, but I'll only use 5 (+1 for subwoofer which is not active). So I'll have audio components for 11-5=6 channels that is just waste. That waste could have been used for a bigger transformer, bigger capacitors, or higher quality components in general.

What's the obsession with more channels? I get it that some people use all those channels, so I'm ok with that there are amps for that. But I just think there should be alternatives for people that just want high quality 5.1 sound. Nowadays whenever you step up the price range, you get more channels. I'd like to have options where I only step up in audio quality, not channels.
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I'd like to see a high quality 5.1 amp alternative too. Now the SR-8012 has 11 channels, but I'll only use 5 (+1 for subwoofer which is not active). So I'll have audio components for 11-5=6 channels that is just waste. That waste could have been used for a bigger transformer, bigger capacitors, or higher quality components in general.
Well, the 8012 has a higher-power transformer and larger bank of power supply capacitors compared to a 7012, and likewise a 7012 compared to a 6012, giving each higher model about 20W/channel more power than the step below. That isn't a very significant difference, but it will benefit a 5.1 layout or even a 2-channel Pure/Direct stereo mode with more power for the higher models.

Sure, you are also spending money on power transistors and other components on the unused amp channels. That's why it's reasonable to pick up a 5012 or 6012 (whichever still has the full Audyssey XT 32) if you don't need as many powered amp channels. You're already getting the HDAM discrete preamp section and extra filter caps for EMI/noise between boards on a Marantz compared with the similar Denon models anyway.

Quote:
What's the obsession with more channels? I get it that some people use all those channels, so I'm ok with that there are amps for that. But I just think there should be alternatives for people that just want high quality 5.1 sound. Nowadays whenever you step up the price range, you get more channels. I'd like to have options where I only step up in audio quality, not channels.
Atmos. Anyway, the alternative is to get a pre-pro and separate power amps for as many channels as you need.

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Originally Posted by adrummingdude View Post
I was hoping the 7704 would be appealing enough to make me jump from the Anthem AVM60. Alas, I'm having difficulty understanding what's really new with the last two generations of Marantz pre-pros except evolving video protocols.



I mean, are the DAC's better? Is the transformer different? Are they truly balancing any of the circuitry yet? How about the room correction...better?



That the press releases ALWAYS revolve around how many more ceiling speakers can be run drives me absolutely batty. Give us some specs that actually matter!


What don't you like about the avm60?

I had a sr6010 and used it as a pre amp with rca cables to a rotel amp. Switching out the sr6010 for the avm60 with xlr cables made a huge difference. The voices were much clearer and there are details in movies and music I didn't know own existed....it's not night and day, but it is definitely noticeable.

I like the avm60 can do the osd and volume bar when showing hdr 4k...the marantz can't which is the root cause of me getting the anthem.


What do you think the avm60 is lacking?


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So any idea how many watts of power the 8012 will have? Looked at pics from CEDIA, and it read "000w". Let me know if you have Information JD.

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Thoughts on Anthem MRX 1120 vs Marantz SR8012? Getting ready to buy a flagship 11.2 receiver and the SR8012 is making me question the MRX1120...
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post #24 of 44 Old 09-21-2017, 12:12 AM
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I like the avm60 can do the osd and volume bar when showing hdr 4k...the marantz can't which is the root cause of me getting the anthem.


What do you think the avm60 is lacking?


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That's funny that you found a feature with the AVM60 that the Marantz didn't have.

Let me just give a disclaimer before I bash the AVM60. I think the AVM60 sounds spectacular, and that's why it's in my rack.

Having said that, I believe the AVM60's lack of lifestyle features combined with it's abysmal networking stack make it a unit that is best used by an advanced user in a dedicated space.

My HT setup is also a family room, and as such, family will also interact with the unit from time to time. My wife, with the Marantz AV7702 MKii, could turn the unit on and switch the input with buttons on the remote. She could also use airplay to listen to her podcasts. As the processor is in another room, she didn't have to see the display to do these things. The AVM60 can do neither of these things, nor is it stable on the network for more than about 30 mins before it just dumps IP and MAC addresses...a byproduct of building your entire network stack through Play-Fi. That wouldn't be so bad, except you need the device to be network connected to run the ARC room correction, often meaning you need to pull the power on the AVM, reboot the router, etc. A quick perusal of the AVM 60 thread, which I know you are involved in (I'm pointing the network stuff out for the benefit of other people reading this) will show that there are about 30 of us in that thread having the same issues.

Now, I said the AVM60 sounds spectacular, because it really does. However, if Marantz can up their game on the sound quality front, be it by way of better converters, preamps, room correction, amps etc, I'd be more inclined to go with a Marantz unit and it's inherent feature-rich stability. These sonic tweaks are the things that matter, after all, since MOST processors have a very similar feature set these days. This is why it wobbles my mind why every press release focuses on Atmos speaker count and/or Dolby vision, Neo XX, or whatever other flavor of the month codec can be decoded. How about the REAL stuff though? Not a peep about which DSP chips, room correction tweaks (xt32 is getting long in the tooth after all) or balanced circuits perhaps(?). Okay Okay, I get it. I can now have 24 overhead speakers and push a million watts to each one of them...whoopy s**t. That's awesome for the three guys who can accommodate that. How about the rest of us? What improvements have been made to the sound quality? After all, we all listen to it, regardless of how many holes we've put in the ceiling, right?

Wow, this post went downhill fast....train back on tracks, please.

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post #25 of 44 Old 09-21-2017, 12:43 AM
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So any idea how many watts of power the 8012 will have? Looked at pics from CEDIA, and it read "000w". Let me know if you have Information JD.
..the receiver's 11 high quality amplifier stages with 140W of power per output. These power ratings enable the SR8012 to drive a full 7.1.4 home cinema setup without the need of additional external amplifiers.

Unlike the other models in the Marantz line, the SR8012 does NOT share a common architecture to sister company Denon counterparts. Instead, this appears to be a completely new design exclusive to Marantz at this time. Seeing the build quality of the SR8012 restores our faith that solid amplification isn't dead in AV receivers. This looks like one tasty amp section that we can't wait to get on our bench for testing.

http://www.audioholics.com/av-receiv...7704-processor
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post #26 of 44 Old 09-21-2017, 03:59 AM
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Originally Posted by Dan30thz28 View Post
So any idea how many watts of power the 8012 will have? Looked at pics from CEDIA, and it read "000w". Let me know if you have Information JD.
Same as the X6400H - 140W into 2CH.
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post #27 of 44 Old 09-21-2017, 05:15 AM
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JD, with the toroidal transformer and all, I figured it might have more than 750Watts total that the 6400H has. That is why I am asking about the watts for the unit overall.

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post #28 of 44 Old 09-21-2017, 05:58 AM
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Originally Posted by adrummingdude View Post
That's funny that you found a feature with the AVM60 that the Marantz didn't have.



Let me just give a disclaimer before I bash the AVM60. I think the AVM60 sounds spectacular, and that's why it's in my rack.



Having said that, I believe the AVM60's lack of lifestyle features combined with it's abysmal networking stack make it a unit that is best used by an advanced user in a dedicated space.



My HT setup is also a family room, and as such, family will also interact with the unit from time to time. My wife, with the Marantz AV7702 MKii, could turn the unit on and switch the input with buttons on the remote. She could also use airplay to listen to her podcasts. As the processor is in another room, she didn't have to see the display to do these things. The AVM60 can do neither of these things, nor is it stable on the network for more than about 30 mins before it just dumps IP and MAC addresses...a byproduct of building your entire network stack through Play-Fi. That wouldn't be so bad, except you need the device to be network connected to run the ARC room correction, often meaning you need to pull the power on the AVM, reboot the router, etc. A quick perusal of the AVM 60 thread, which I know you are involved in (I'm pointing the network stuff out for the benefit of other people reading this) will show that there are about 30 of us in that thread having the same issues.



Now, I said the AVM60 sounds spectacular, because it really does. However, if Marantz can up their game on the sound quality front, be it by way of better converters, preamps, room correction, amps etc, I'd be more inclined to go with a Marantz unit and it's inherent feature-rich stability. These sonic tweaks are the things that matter, after all, since MOST processors have a very similar feature set these days. This is why it wobbles my mind why every press release focuses on Atmos speaker count and/or Dolby vision, Neo XX, or whatever other flavor of the month codec can be decoded. How about the REAL stuff though? Not a peep about which DSP chips, room correction tweaks (xt32 is getting long in the tooth after all) or balanced circuits perhaps(?). Okay Okay, I get it. I can now have 24 overhead speakers and push a million watts to each one of them...whoopy s**t. That's awesome for the three guys who can accommodate that. How about the rest of us? What improvements have been made to the sound quality? After all, we all listen to it, regardless of how many holes we've put in the ceiling, right?



Wow, this post went downhill fast....train back on tracks, please.


Great discussion....


Feature wise, the anthem does its inputs the way Marantz does smart select, and the anthem can have over 10. Probably the only other feature and them has over marantz.

I agree with you the marantz interface is really easy and clean. It's also really nice seeing which speakers are active and which speaker channels are coming from the source.


I can't understand how a company with the features Marantz puts out can't overlay a volume bar or OSD when doing 4k hdr or dolby vision.

The lack of a volume bar and osd is what pushed me away from the Marantz...I waited for the new models to come out this year assuming they would be able to process hdr 4k which they Cannot, as they only pass it through with no volume bar or osd.

I have a similar setup as you, with my all of my equipment in another room. We use a harmony elite to control the system which has been working well for the wife. It's kind of surprising that a unit in that price range doesn't have have airplay, but we did a workaround using an apple tv with cec engaged to turn the avm60 on and off..
Which has been working.

I agree with you about the anthem networking issues. The concept of doing arc over a laptop and configuring it with a keyboard is just really cool.....luckily after doing a factory reset of the unit the network issues seemed to have disappeared. Have you tried that?

I am a big marantz fan, I even drilled a hole in the top of a closet on the first floor where I can a 3.5mm audyssey extension cable assuming I'd be running audyssey on marantz for many models to come.

BUT when you compare marantz sound quality to things like the anthem, the marantz has a house sound that is less accurate or more in your face. I'm not sure how to describe it....Not sure if it's audyssey or the marantz itself, but after hearing the anthem i can distinguish certain sounds and movies that didn't exist when using my marantz.

Marantz Features: marantz is probably the best in town. In multiple years I've never called tech support with an issue.

Marantz sound quality: marantz has work to do.

Anthem: Definitely for an advanced user to setup and configure...but worth it because of sound quality.


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post #29 of 44 Old 09-21-2017, 09:08 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Newbie789 View Post
I can't understand how a company with the features Marantz puts out can't overlay a volume bar or OSD when doing 4k hdr or dolby vision.

The lack of a volume bar and osd is what pushed me away from the Marantz...I waited for the new models to come out this year assuming they would be able to process hdr 4k which they Cannot, as they only pass it through with no volume bar or osd.
If an AVR can play audio from an HDMI connection, then it must be processing the signal and negotiating HDCP successfully, and only then forwarding the video portion onward to the display.

The D&M models which support 4k video are likely using an ADV7850 + an ADV8005 for the OSD itself:

http://www.analog.com/en/products/au...s/adv8005.html

...and since it doesn't mention handling HDR10 or Dolby Vision packed formats, it's pretty likely to be the reason.

BTW, I'm curious which AVRs support the OSD over DV signals? Do you know which chipset they are using?

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post #30 of 44 Old 09-21-2017, 10:00 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Newbie789 View Post
BUT when you compare marantz sound quality to things like the anthem, the marantz has a house sound that is less accurate or more in your face. I'm not sure how to describe it....Not sure if it's audyssey or the marantz itself, but after hearing the anthem i can distinguish certain sounds and movies that didn't exist when using my marantz.
Don't forget that the quality of the sound after you've run Audyssey is going to be strongly affected by the acoustics of the microphone and its placement in your room. Microphone quality does vary from one mic to the next (they're allowed +/- 2dB) and placement is critical, which is why a microphone boom stand is recommended in the FAQ.

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