New amp is making me grin from ear to ear =) - Page 13 - AVS | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #361 of 4989 Old 07-13-2004, 07:37 PM
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Well, after much thought, I've decided to put my ZR1000 on EBay. Although the receiver seems to be the problem (with pops and clicks), I can not part with it for a while. The upgrade would break me (financially); I just bought a new vehicle too. So, I will sell the ZR1000 instead and live with my integrated amplifiers for a while...
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post #362 of 4989 Old 07-13-2004, 07:47 PM
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I've finally got my list narrowed down. It's down to the QSC RMX850 or the Crown XLS402. The Carver and Crest models I was looking at had to be eliminated due to price, as I need 3 of these guys. The fan swap should be no problem for me, and I'll go with one of the quiet fans from Panaflo, SilenX, Enermax, or Papst silent fans. For a good comparison review of silent fans, take a look at (http://www.directron.com/noise.html).

I also decided how to see just what one of these amps can do...
I've got an old set of unpowered Creative PC speakers with spring-clip connectors, 3" drivers, and a max 25 watt power handling. Hmmm...I wonder what 600 watts (bridged mono-mode) would do to them?
It should be interesting to see them explode! (....Evil laughter....)
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post #363 of 4989 Old 07-13-2004, 07:52 PM
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...been watching this thread for a while.

quick question, if i may:

How does this Amp compare to the Crown XLS ?

any suggestion is appreciated.
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post #364 of 4989 Old 07-13-2004, 08:00 PM
 
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Quote:


Originally posted by Deja-vue
...been watching this thread for a while.

quick question, if i may:

How does this Amp compare to the Crown XLS ?

any suggestion is appreciated.

the pyramid amp might work...... although i've never seen any professional user ever use one of those.....

considering that you are only getting 175 watts per channel @ 8 ohms and the cost is $217...... i would recommend the crown XLS402a - 260 watts per channel @ 8 ohms and all over the net for $299....even less on ebay...

plus you are getting the number one name brand in professional amplifiers!

cheers!

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post #365 of 4989 Old 07-13-2004, 08:03 PM
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Quote:


Originally posted by Deja-vue
...been watching this thread for a while.

quick question, if i may:

How does this Amp compare to the Crown XLS ?

any suggestion is appreciated.

That doesn't look particularly good. I doubt it's in the range of the stuff from pro amp companies. Most pro amp companies that have been around 20-30+ years or so are the brands to consider.
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post #366 of 4989 Old 07-13-2004, 08:05 PM
 
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Quote:


Originally posted by OregonLAN
Well, after much thought, I've decided to put my ZR1000 on EBay. Although the receiver seems to be the problem (with pops and clicks), I can not part with it for a while. The upgrade would break me (financially); I just bought a new vehicle too. So, I will sell the ZR1000 instead and live with my integrated amplifiers for a while...

too bad i didn't have the $495 you are asking or you would have sold it already!!!

looking for another ZR1000 as soon as i can afford it for my rear channels!

oh well....

when i have the money, another ZR1000 will be there.....

cheers!

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post #367 of 4989 Old 07-13-2004, 08:09 PM
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Quote:


Originally posted by CaptainKellog

....... Hmmm...I wonder what 600 watts (bridged mono-mode) would do to them?
It should be interesting to see them explode! (....Evil laughter....)

The question isn't what it will do to the speakers, but what it will do to the amp. Doing this could potentially cause serious damage to your amp. There will be no "explosion", unless its your from your amp .




-Bryan
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post #368 of 4989 Old 07-13-2004, 08:17 PM
 
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Quote:


Originally posted by Bryan G.
The question isn't what it will do to the speakers, but what it will do to the amp. Doing this could potentially cause serious damage to your amp. There will be no "explosion", unless its your from your amp .

there is no chance of harming the amp.....

the speaker voice coil will be damaged.... it might expolde or just melt....

if there is a short in the speaker line, the amp will go into protect mode.... like nearly all professional amplifiers do....

when the short is removed the amp will reset and work fine....

when you buy high end consumer amps you will find these "protections" removed to squeeze the last 1% to 2% of sonic bliss into the signal....

of course, the result is if you short the speaker outputs on a $10,000 plineus amplifier you have to send it to the factory to get repaired.....

i kind of like the protection my pro amp gives me to protect me against my own stupidity....

cheers!

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post #369 of 4989 Old 07-13-2004, 08:20 PM
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Ok, an update (and maybe just a little venting - bear with me). My Crown will be here tomorrow. I found out that my Onkyo A/V receiver does not have pre outs. So I have to wait for my Denon 3805 which I ordered 10 weeks ago through my company because of an employee benefit and an unbelievable price. Backordered they say. Screw it. I am cancelling the order tomorrow and getting it from another source. Seems everyone has it but our distributor. Not worth the hassle.

I'm done with this.

So no review from me for now. Going to order the Denon, subwoofer and the Axioms and move forward. Ready to list my old system on Ebay!
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post #370 of 4989 Old 07-13-2004, 08:58 PM
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Man Jazzcat, I feel for you!! That would have me pulling my hair out big time,especially if I wanted it for the weekend.

brickie

AM I THE ONLY OASIS IN THE DESERT OF STUPIDITY......" SIR BRICKENBOCKER"
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post #371 of 4989 Old 07-13-2004, 09:01 PM
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Oh yeah, I accidently plugged some cheap speakers into my Onkyo running my bass shakers witht the volume ALL the way up..Turned it on, and BOOM!!!!!!!Instant destruction of that speaker.Amp was fine.

brickie

AM I THE ONLY OASIS IN THE DESERT OF STUPIDITY......" SIR BRICKENBOCKER"
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post #372 of 4989 Old 07-13-2004, 09:09 PM
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Quote:


Originally posted by brickie
Man Jazzcat, I feel for you!! That would have me pulling my hair out big time,especially if I wanted it for the weekend.

brickie

Thanks for the sympathy!

If I knew that it would be such a hassle, I would have had the Denon from another source a month ago! I emailed my boss to take this up the ladder and give me an answer. By tomorrow. I could have gotten the Denon for $781, but it is not worth the hassle anymore!
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post #373 of 4989 Old 07-13-2004, 09:36 PM
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Is there such thing as an authorized Crown Audio dealer, or is any online vender allowed to sell their gear? I'm looking for a list of authorized online vendors for price matching purposes, but can't seem to find that info on the Crown website or anywhere else.

"Excuse me...What does God need with a Starship?" (Captain Kirk - Star Trek V: The Final Frontier)
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post #374 of 4989 Old 07-13-2004, 09:47 PM
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You can call them at 1-800-342-6939.I believe 8-5 EST.

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AM I THE ONLY OASIS IN THE DESERT OF STUPIDITY......" SIR BRICKENBOCKER"
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post #375 of 4989 Old 07-13-2004, 10:00 PM
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Knowing Crown if you had a problem with your amp, they would take care of it anyway, now don't take that as something that is written in stone. But really, if it works the day you get it, it will probably work just as good 10 years from now.
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post #376 of 4989 Old 07-13-2004, 10:11 PM
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Quote:


Originally posted by spacecowboy
I did a very brief comparison yesterday, but not enough to do a quality review just yet but it's coming.

Any opinions yet on how this rates vs that Adcom?

brickie

AM I THE ONLY OASIS IN THE DESERT OF STUPIDITY......" SIR BRICKENBOCKER"
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post #377 of 4989 Old 07-13-2004, 10:18 PM
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I'll post a mini-review on Wed., but so far I'm really impressed.

"Excuse me...What does God need with a Starship?" (Captain Kirk - Star Trek V: The Final Frontier)
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post #378 of 4989 Old 07-13-2004, 10:20 PM
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Cool, gotta get some sleep, but will look for it when I get home from work!!!

brickie

AM I THE ONLY OASIS IN THE DESERT OF STUPIDITY......" SIR BRICKENBOCKER"
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post #379 of 4989 Old 07-13-2004, 10:21 PM
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I got a touch of heat exhuastion and dehydration working under the hot Georgia sun, and haven't had the energy to do much today, but I should be back to normal tomorrow.

"Excuse me...What does God need with a Starship?" (Captain Kirk - Star Trek V: The Final Frontier)
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post #380 of 4989 Old 07-13-2004, 11:30 PM
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Well I started reading this thread at the beginning of the All-Star game and just completed it, approximately four hours of reading...

I now have more decisions to ponder (consumer versions vs. pro versions) I just hope that after reading that other thread entitled "amps amps ...amps" and this one that this pretty much covers the different types of amplifiers available!

I'm very tired and will try and digest all this at a later time and I do have one concern because I have a Denon 3803 and somewhere in this thread somebody was having trouble with his and the new amplifier he just purchased and between the flame war that was taking place and trying to find out actual facts I think I missed if he found a resolution to his problem.

Harley
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post #381 of 4989 Old 07-13-2004, 11:39 PM
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Quote:


Originally posted by .jss designs
I run Crest Audio in my HT. Bought Crest on the recommendation of a bud of mine. He's been doing pro sound for 30+ years for acts from the James Gang, Joe Walsh, the Eagles, Bob Weir and Bonnie Raitt.

I asked him about Samson. His response: "Don't waste your money on that ****."


Although an amp may be perfectly reliable for home (fairly stationary) use, this does not translate reliability in the context of pro sound (road). Pro gear is often mistreated and forced to drive loads that would kill most consumer amps. Although the Samson amp is very reliable in the context of studio/home use (there is little data to suggest the contrary and I'm willing to bet tube guy cannot come up with data to suggest otherwise), I do think it is underengineered for roadie pro use. This fact is validated by their (Samson) unwillingness to rate their amps to 2 ohms, even though bench tests suggest that many of their amps handle this load without problems. So my suggestion is take comments from Pros with a grain of salt.

Also lets not forget the needs of pros may also be defined by totally different criteria than home/studio users (e.g. repair on the road, warranty, ease of finding parts, size, weight, etc.). (And pros are also susceptible to power of marketing).

BTW, two other amps to consider are the Mackies (1200 and 2400) and the Behringers (ep1500 and ep2500), the latter apparently sharing some DNA with QSC.



Cheers,
R.

Ignorance more frequently begets confidence, than it does knowledge. Charles Darwin
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post #382 of 4989 Old 07-14-2004, 03:29 PM
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First, I owe a big thanks to Mazeroth and Brickie. I am in the process of building my theater (will be hanging sheetrock next week) and have been looking at inexpensive upgrades. I first picked up 6 NHT SuperOnes for a very good price on the web. When I hooked them up to my old Yamaha 5250 and I was not very impressed and having serious regrets about my speaker choice (I was also looking at Ascend, AV123, AXIOM, and Swan). I had heard the NHTs before and really liked their sound but it was not nearly as enjoyable as I had remembered. So I decided to try one Crown 402As to see (and hope) if it made a difference....BOY DID IT.

The NHTs sound better than I had remembered and I will be buying 2 more 402As and eventually a new receiver or preamp. Right now I am listening to the Blue's Traveler and the NHT / SVS PC-Ultra / Crown combo sounds incredible.

Thanks for the thread and sorry for the ramble!

Jeff
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post #383 of 4989 Old 07-14-2004, 04:00 PM
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Quote:


Originally posted by jmicheal
First, I owe a big thanks to Mazeroth and Brickie. I am in the process of building my theater (will be hanging sheetrock next week) and have been looking at inexpensive upgrades. I first picked up 6 NHT SuperOnes for a very good price on the web. When I hooked them up to my old Yamaha 5250 and I was not very impressed and having serious regrets about my speaker choice (I was also looking at Ascend, AV123, AXIOM, and Swan). I had heard the NHTs before and really liked their sound but it was not nearly as enjoyable as I had remembered. So I decided to try one Crown 402As to see (and hope) if it made a difference....BOY DID IT.

The NHTs sound better than I had remembered and I will be buying 2 more 402As and eventually a new receiver or preamp. Right now I am listening to the Blue's Traveler and the NHT / SVS PC-Ultra / Crown combo sounds incredible.

Thanks for the thread and sorry for the ramble!

Jeff

More people interpret 'clean power' as sound quality than other other
variable found in an amplifier

25 cents per watt is nice.

I'm waiting for someone to take the 602 plunge.



The storm was gone, but dark clouds still hung around
The perfect setting for things to come......

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post #384 of 4989 Old 07-14-2004, 04:02 PM
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Are there any brave people here that can do a test ?

Listen to your Crown amplifier with only one speaker connected,
either left or right channel. Listen to some music like this for
5 minutes or so.

Then bridge the amplifier and rewire the speaker accordingly.

Re-test.

What do you think of the sound now ?

If your speakers are a difficult load, it might make the test
more revealing.



The storm was gone, but dark clouds still hung around
The perfect setting for things to come......

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post #385 of 4989 Old 07-14-2004, 04:11 PM
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I recently bought this amp for my mains (Phase Tech 9.1 , 4ohm). I also received the Denon 3805. Being that the amp has not stepped in my door yet, I am getting antsy.(sp)
Can any of you help me on how to hook this bad boy up to the receiver and speakers. What kind of connections am I going to need. Will I hook it up on the same area on the Denon. Also, I see from earlier in the thread about the Male RCA to XLR Male Connection. Can I get this at Radio Shack or do I have to get this over the internet. Never had an amp. Soryy about the newbie questions. I don't want to waste any time when it gets here. Will be getting Sat according to UPS tracking!
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post #386 of 4989 Old 07-14-2004, 05:31 PM
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Stewee, go to you local Pro audio shops to get some XLR male to RCA male cables. That's what I did here in Atlanta. I got some 5 ft runs for $8.99 a pop.

"Excuse me...What does God need with a Starship?" (Captain Kirk - Star Trek V: The Final Frontier)
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post #387 of 4989 Old 07-14-2004, 05:39 PM
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Quote:


Originally posted by thylantyr

I'm waiting for someone to take the 602 plunge.

thylantyr, I was seriously considering doing a 602. The Axioms are rated for 200 watts @ 8 ohms conservatively. 402 gives 260 watts; 602 gives 370. But if I put my center speaker on the 402 I just got today, if I bridge it would be 800 watts for a 400 watt speaker. I spoke to Alan at Axiom and he said that 260 watts for the mains is more than I would ever need, so I am getting a 202 for the center and bridging it for 400 watts @ 8 ohms (the Axiom 150 center is rated at 6 ohms) so it should give me maybe 450 watts.

I am going from probably 30 watts continuous on my 6.1 Onkyo to 260 and 450 watts. I think that will do for now

I'm going to order 4 fans tomorrow to replace the ones in the Crowns. Way too much noise for me and I will never need that much air flow with very effecient speakers.
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post #388 of 4989 Old 07-14-2004, 06:40 PM
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OK, here is a brief review of the Crown 402a amps that I have been comparing recently to my 5-channel Adcom amp (100X3, 60X2). First of all, my gear consists of the following: Athena AS-F2 fronts, Athena AS-C1 center, Polk LS/fx rears, Wharfedale WH-2 surround backs, and a Sony SAWM-40 sub. All of this is powered by a new Yamaha HTR-5760 used as a prepro, and the Adcom mentioned above.

Before I hooked up the Crowns for use w/ the L,R, and C speakers, I always identified the Adcom as a neutral and balanced amp - the highs, mids, and lows always maintained their proper place, although I always wanted just a little more out of the upper frequencies (personal taste). Anyway, after hooking up the Crowns I immediately noticed more effortless volume w/ the songs I played from several CDs (Sting, Classical, Jazz and Collective Soul). I would describe the Crowns as very detailed w/ voices and music. I got the most enjoyment out of vocals and instruments. With classical and jazz music, this amp is absolutely outstanding. If you like crystal clear detail, this amp is an excellent low-cost alternative to the multi- thousand dollar amps in the consumer market.

For hometheater, I listened to excerpts from "Master and Commander", and "Behind Enemy Lines" and to make a short story shorter, there's nothing like gobs of headroom. The 260W rating into the left, center and right speakers gave me everything I needed and more. The most surprising thing about all of this is the fact that I'm staring at Crown Pro amps of all things. This has changed completely the way I view amplification. I have always only daydreamed of amps like Krell, Bryston, Aragon, and EAD - and while those all are still probably superior amps (even though I never owned them), I don't wonder anymore what it's like to have all the power and detail I want and need.

So is the Crown better than my Adcom? Absolutely not! While I am very pleased and surprised w/ the Crown amps, for music, I found them a little bright on some recordings where the Adcom was always a bit smoother. Most of this I attribute to my new Athenas which are known to be bright speakers. I bought them to liven up my movies and music. Previously I had Paradigm Monitor 7s w/ the matching center channel which I sold to get the Athenas. The Crowns would've been a perfect match for them. Overall, the Crown is very good for music, and absolutely stunning for hometheater. I never, ever see a need to buy the ultra expensive amps. I was skeptical to buying and trusting a Pro amp for my love of movies and music, but the Crowns put all of that to rest. I'm just glad I never wasted big bucks on an overpriced consumer amp. The only thing I need to do is disconnect the fans. I don't think I need them. More critical reviews to come....

"Excuse me...What does God need with a Starship?" (Captain Kirk - Star Trek V: The Final Frontier)
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post #389 of 4989 Old 07-14-2004, 06:54 PM
 
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spacecowboy,

congrats on your amps....

nice review!

cheers!

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post #390 of 4989 Old 07-14-2004, 07:04 PM
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Someone said the XLS is not a Crown design. C-Audio right?

If so, that changes the ball game because this amplifier could have had a
different sticker other than a Crown sticker and nobody would have given it
the time of day.



The storm was gone, but dark clouds still hung around
The perfect setting for things to come......

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