Denon 3806 Owners Thread - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 2883 Old 10-08-2005, 02:52 PM - Thread Starter
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Post all questions & answers about setting up Denon 3806 here tweaking/inputs settings etc.
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post #2 of 2883 Old 10-08-2005, 08:23 PM
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The 3806 is on the top of my list of "possibilities" for my new HT when it's finished.

Official website: Denon website

Denon AVR-3806
Retail $1300
120W x 7, (actual 107W into 5 channels by testing)
Triple zone capable
2 HDMI in, 1 out, no upconversion of analog, but (+) pass through on HDMI.
3 component in, 2 out, component upconversion of analog (to interlaced output only)
Autoroom calibration Audyssey MultEQ XT (mic included)<-- Finally!
XM ready
On screen display
Audio Signal Delay (Sync. Audio with Video signal) – By source
Touchscreen remote (fluorescent membrane keypad)
2 optical in, 2 coax in; 2 optical out

Front:


Back:


Inside:



Other contenders in the same price class: (with HDMI and component video switching):
Pioneer VSX-74TXVi & 72TXV 2xHDMI in w/ upconv, 3 comp in, iPod control, USB to PC (streaming MP3, WMA) Pioneer
Onkyo TX-SR803 2xHDMI in, 3 comp in, (only upconversion with component, not HDMI) Onkyo
Yamaha RX-V2600 & 1600 2xHDMI in, 3xcomp in, upconversion both HDMI & component, Yamaha

With discussion of the different models in this thread
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post #3 of 2883 Old 10-09-2005, 10:25 AM
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correction: it's 4 optical in (not 2), plus 2 coax in.
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post #4 of 2883 Old 10-09-2005, 10:47 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by docrings View Post

2 HDMI in, 1 out, no upconversion of analog, but (+) pass through on HDMI.

I'll get this out of the way early on. What exactly does pass through entail? Does this allow the output of any input (analog and HDMI) over the single HDMI out? And does this just mean there is no enhancement to the image?

If this is true, I'd definitely consider the 3806. One cable going to my TV would be great!

Thanks,
Rob
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post #5 of 2883 Old 10-09-2005, 01:22 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by enigma1406 View Post

Does this allow the output of any input (analog and HDMI) over the single HDMI out? And does this just mean there is no enhancement to the image?
Rob

Exactly thats it.... all inputs on output HDMI.....no deinterlacing..no scaling.. just digitising.. > HDMI
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post #6 of 2883 Old 10-09-2005, 02:18 PM
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This is a long shot, but I might as well ask: Is it possible to pass through an HDMI source to the component outs? (I have an old HDTV.)

E
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post #7 of 2883 Old 10-09-2005, 03:18 PM
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Picked one up this aft at Tweeter. Still in the box and I'll probably set it up tomorrow night. I'll post my impressions when I have a chance to experiment.

If you have questions and don't have access to the operating instructions, I can check on anything that's in their documentation

I'm anxious to test Denon Link 3 with my DVD-3910 to compare audio to analog 5.1 sound.

I wish Denon would update their new site to include firmware updates. Their products are great, but their web site redesign in progressing at a snail's pace.

/George
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post #8 of 2883 Old 10-09-2005, 07:28 PM
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Let us know about the two component outs. I wanted to know whether different inputs could be played on different component outputs simultaneously. It might be cool to test out with a Belkin AV55000 to another tv/monitor.

Aly Sergie
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post #9 of 2883 Old 10-09-2005, 07:43 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by epsilon View Post

This is a long shot, but I might as well ask: Is it possible to pass through an HDMI source to the component outs? (I have an old HDTV.)

I am afraid that the manual clearly states it doesn't convert digital video to analog... sorry.
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post #10 of 2883 Old 10-09-2005, 07:45 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jheoaustin View Post

I am afraid that the manual clearly states it doesn't convert digital video to analog... sorry.

Thanks for looking that up.

E
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post #11 of 2883 Old 10-10-2005, 12:10 AM
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Does the new 3806 have an input for my computer? I'd like to stream music through the receiver, and this is a huge selling point. Otherwise, I am currently considering the Outlaw 990. Thanks
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post #12 of 2883 Old 10-10-2005, 04:05 AM
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This is my first Denon receiver and setup was difficult for me. The Operating Instructions documentation is not good. I had difficulty getiing TV and DVD sound and spent hours getting basic setup right.

I have optical connections from my Hi-Def cable Box and DVD (3910) player and also Denon Link 3 into the 3806 for audio.

Sound is unbelievable so far even before detailed set-up. Very clean and I notice instrumentation that I didn't hear on my Sony ES receiver.

Festus - the 3806 can not be connected to a computer. The upcoming 4306 can.

/George
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post #13 of 2883 Old 10-10-2005, 07:06 AM
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I'm planning on getting the Denon AVR 3806 and some of these HDMI issues involving cable boxes and the like concern me. I've got a DirecTV HD Tivo which is currently connected to my TV through an HDMI-DVI cable and it works fine. Since I plan to upgrade my player soon to an HDMI out, I'd like to be able to use the switching function. Is it any help that the system information on my HR10-250 does say that the HDMI output on the Tivo is HDCP compliant?
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post #14 of 2883 Old 10-10-2005, 06:01 PM
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My 3806 arrived today. It was relatively easy to unpack and set it up. The manual appears to be identical to the 3806 manual that's available on the German Denon site.

The good: SACD playback -- the multichannel sound reproduction is wonderful (source is a Denon 1920). Also, Audyssey equalization has improved the acoustics considerably in my oddly-shaped home theater.

The bad: I'm sad to report that the 3806 does not synch up with the HDMI input from a Comcast/Motorola 6412 DVR either (DVI output converted to HDMI via DVI-HDMI cable). HDMI from the Denon 1920 DVD player works fine. Fortunately, my TV has two HDMI inputs, so no worries yet. However, such an expensive receiver should not have trouble synching up with garden variety (HDCP-enabled) DVRs. That's not acceptable.

The ugly: 1) the manual. Never been a big fan of Denon manuals, and this one is no exception. There seems to be no logic to the organization. 2) Human interface design. I spent a frustrating half hour trying to run the auto-equalization scheme. Turns out that you start the sequence by pressing the left-arrow key rather than the "enter" key like all other menus everywhere on the planet. Barf.

More later. Now back to the "Dark Side of the Moon" SACD!
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post #15 of 2883 Old 10-10-2005, 06:56 PM
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Hi,
Thanks for posting.
Can you clarify your statement below (I am a bit of a neophyte)

he bad: I'm sad to report that the 3806 does not synch up with the HDMI input from a Comcast/Motorola 6412 DVR either (DVI output converted to HDMI via DVI-HDMI cable). HDMI from the Denon 1920 DVD player works fine. Fortunately, my TV has two HDMI inputs, so no worries yet. However, such an expensive receiver should not have trouble synching up with garden variety (HDCP-enabled) DVRs. That's not acceptable.

1. Can't the sound get synched via doing a delay on the Denon?
2. I also have a 1920 and the Moto. So does this mean the 1920 will be synched and the Moto won't if I only have 1 HDMI on my TV and I put all the inputs into the Denon and output to the only HDMI input I have on my TV?
3. Any ideas if the 4306 would act any differently?


Thanks.
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post #16 of 2883 Old 10-10-2005, 07:11 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GeorgeG02 View Post

This is my first Denon receiver and setup was difficult for me. The Operating Instructions documentation is not good. I had difficulty getiing TV and DVD sound and spent hours getting basic setup right.

I have optical connections from my Hi-Def cable Box and DVD (3910) player and also Denon Link 3 into the 3806 for audio.

Sound is unbelievable so far even before detailed set-up. Very clean and I notice instrumentation that I didn't hear on my Sony ES receiver.

Festus - the 3806 can not be connected to a computer. The upcoming 4306 can.

/George

George which Sony ES receiver were you using?
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post #17 of 2883 Old 10-10-2005, 11:27 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mooneydriver View Post

The bad: I'm sad to report that the 3806 does not synch up with the HDMI input from a Comcast/Motorola 6412 DVR either (DVI output converted to HDMI via DVI-HDMI cable). HDMI from the Denon 1920 DVD player works fine. Fortunately, my TV has two HDMI inputs, so no worries yet. However, such an expensive receiver should not have trouble synching up with garden variety (HDCP-enabled) DVRs. That's not acceptable.



It's not Denon's fault with the HDCP, this is a common issue with Motorola, Scientific Atlanta and Hughes HR10-250 boxes. They were not developed with HDMI switcher/repeaters in mind. A whole new generation of satellite/cable boxes will be needed if HDMI is expected to work. Component should look fine. Good luck

Aly Sergie
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post #18 of 2883 Old 10-11-2005, 03:58 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ted08721 View Post

George which Sony ES receiver were you using?


Ted-

It is the Sony V333ES. It is a good receiver. I think I paid about $500 and it's got many useful surround fields, a good remote and the SQ is good for a receiver in this price range. No component outs though.

The 3806 sound is amazing so far. Dolby Digital TV sounds superb as does Denon link SACD sound. That's all I've played with so far.

Mooneydriver -

I agree with you on the manual. It sucks. It's also misleading, claiming the 3806 upconverts video. According to it, "upconverting" is passing S-Video through to component, component through to HDMI, etc.. No scaling. I call that switching, not upconverting.

I reached Carl at Denon tech support yesterday after about 10 tries and eventually getting bounced to EMail. He support was excellent. He answered all my questions, helped me with an audio issue and was very patient.
Quality support like this (on a NEW product!), while difficult to reach, is another big plus for Denon. Denon needs to keep Carl and add more like him.

Night and day vs. Sony tech support.

/George
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post #19 of 2883 Old 10-11-2005, 06:03 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Brian Fallon View Post

Hi,
Thanks for posting.
Can you clarify your statement below (I am a bit of a neophyte)

he bad: I'm sad to report that the 3806 does not synch up with the HDMI input from a Comcast/Motorola 6412 DVR either (DVI output converted to HDMI via DVI-HDMI cable). HDMI from the Denon 1920 DVD player works fine. Fortunately, my TV has two HDMI inputs, so no worries yet. However, such an expensive receiver should not have trouble synching up with garden variety (HDCP-enabled) DVRs. That's not acceptable.

1. Can't the sound get synched via doing a delay on the Denon?
2. I also have a 1920 and the Moto. So does this mean the 1920 will be synched and the Moto won't if I only have 1 HDMI on my TV and I put all the inputs into the Denon and output to the only HDMI input I have on my TV?
3. Any ideas if the 4306 would act any differently?


Thanks.

I think you may have misread what was said.

1. When he says "synch up," he means the video output through HDMI. As many others have stated, this is an HDCP issue that occurs from the box itself. As stated in the second post, the 3806 does have "Audio Signal Delay (Sync. Audio with Video signal) - By source"

2. If you plan to use HDMI for both the 1920 and the Moto, then yes there's a good chance you will get no video from the Moto. The immediate workaround is to use component for the Moto and still output all signals via the HDMI out to your TV.

3. I don't think anyone can officially say as the 4306 hasn't been released yet.
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post #20 of 2883 Old 10-11-2005, 08:06 AM
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Enigma,
thank you for the clarification.
I didn't realize that there was a video sync issue! I knew there was a general issue with sound/video sync so I jumped to that wrong conclusion.

Is there a noticeable difference between using the component vs. HDMI output from the Moto and going through the Denon?

Thanks again.
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post #21 of 2883 Old 10-11-2005, 08:10 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Brian Fallon View Post

Is there a noticeable difference between using the component vs. HDMI output from the Moto and going through the Denon?

Using the SA3250HD STB, there was no noticeable difference between component and DVI/HDMI via the 4806.

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post #22 of 2883 Old 10-11-2005, 08:45 AM
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Are you recommending running component cables out from the STB, into the 3806 and then out to the TV through the 3806's HDMI output?

If so, and there's allegedly no noticeable difference in PQ, why not just run the component connection from the HD STB right into the TV? Aside from whatever preference one might have for avoiding input switching on the TV, does the transcoding from analog component cables to digital through the 3806' HDMI output render any improvement in PQ?

Personally, I'm really discouraged about this problem with STB's. Why not just get the Denon AVR-3805 if the HDMI switching doesn't work on the 3806? I'm also very unhappy with Denon for not working out this issue with the various cable and satellite companies before going to market.
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post #23 of 2883 Old 10-11-2005, 08:51 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mooneydriver View Post

My 3806 arrived today. It was relatively easy to unpack and set it up. The manual appears to be identical to the 3806 manual that's available on the German Denon site.

The good: SACD playback -- the multichannel sound reproduction is wonderful (source is a Denon 1920). Also, Audyssey equalization has improved the acoustics considerably in my oddly-shaped home theater.

The bad: I'm sad to report that the 3806 does not synch up with the HDMI input from a Comcast/Motorola 6412 DVR either (DVI output converted to HDMI via DVI-HDMI cable). HDMI from the Denon 1920 DVD player works fine. Fortunately, my TV has two HDMI inputs, so no worries yet. However, such an expensive receiver should not have trouble synching up with garden variety (HDCP-enabled) DVRs. That's not acceptable.

The ugly: 1) the manual. Never been a big fan of Denon manuals, and this one is no exception. There seems to be no logic to the organization. 2) Human interface design. I spent a frustrating half hour trying to run the auto-equalization scheme. Turns out that you start the sequence by pressing the left-arrow key rather than the "enter" key like all other menus everywhere on the planet. Barf.

More later. Now back to the "Dark Side of the Moon" SACD!


I am a little bit confused as you seem to have said that MultEQ XT improved the SACD playback through multichannel analog input. AFAIK, 3806 can't digitize multichannel analog inputs, thus MultEQ XT cannot be applied.
Denon 1920 doesn't have DenonLink 3, does it?
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post #24 of 2883 Old 10-11-2005, 09:00 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by s2silber View Post

Are you recommending running component cables out from the STB, into the 3806 and then out to the TV through the 3806's HDMI output?

If so, and there's allegedly no noticeable difference in PQ, why not just run the component connection from the HD STB right into the TV? Aside from whatever preference one might have for avoiding input switching on the TV, does the transcoding from analog component cables to digital through the 3806' HDMI output render any improvement in PQ?

Personally, I'm really discouraged about this problem with STB's. Why not just get the Denon AVR-3805 if the HDMI switching doesn't work on the 3806? I'm also very unhappy with Denon for not working out this issue with the various cable and satellite companies before going to market.

Really the only reason for the component to the receiver and then hdmi to the TV is that there is one connection to the TV. You DVD player or other device can connect to the receiver via hdmi and then just one single hdmi connection to the TV for a nice clean install.

I would also not be mad at denon, its not a denon issue with hdmi switching, its an issue with HDCP on the cable/sat boxes. Other have reported similar issues even before the 3806 arrived.

The plus for the 3806 over the 3805 is the ability to use HDMI ports for DVD and Xbox 360, Component for SAT/Cable, composite for VCR etc and have it all conenct to the TV with one cable!
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post #25 of 2883 Old 10-11-2005, 09:23 AM
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s2silber

I can't get my SA8300 to sync directly with IF4805 due to issue with TWC's software in Southwest Ohio....this is a major roadblock for me to upgrade. I want the HDMI(via DVI) switching but its pointless for me until cableco gets off its posterior.

If anyone has success with SA8300 TWC sync via HDMI, please post your findings. Thanks

Its not just a hobby, its a 401K reduction plan.
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post #26 of 2883 Old 10-11-2005, 09:49 AM
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GeorgeG02,
Thanks for the review. I'm contemplating a 3806 and own a V444ES so your review is intriguing to me.
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post #27 of 2883 Old 10-11-2005, 09:58 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jb1677 View Post

Really the only reason for the component to the receiver and then hdmi to the TV is that there is one connection to the TV. You DVD player or other device can connect to the receiver via hdmi and then just one single hdmi connection to the TV for a nice clean install.

I would also not be mad at denon, its not a denon issue with hdmi switching, its an issue with HDCP on the cable/sat boxes. Other have reported similar issues even before the 3806 arrived.

The plus for the 3806 over the 3805 is the ability to use HDMI ports for DVD and Xbox 360, Component for SAT/Cable, composite for VCR etc and have it all conenct to the TV with one cable!

Yes, but you're still denied the advantage of being able to use digital connections for BOTH SAT/cable and DVD, which Denon acknowledges does render optimum picture quality on both sources. So, with these problems you've got to forego true digital output from your SAT/cable box if you've only got one digital input on your TV and you want to take advantage of digital transmission from a DVD player, too. Again, what we're talking about here is inferior SAT/Cable picture quality for the dubious advantage of not having to push your TV's input button. I still say Denon should have addressed this issue and should at least warn customers that not all video sources are compatible with their much-touted HDMI switching capability.
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post #28 of 2883 Old 10-11-2005, 10:01 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jheoaustin View Post

I am a little bit confused as you seem to have said that MultEQ XT improved the SACD playback through multichannel analog input. AFAIK, 3806 can't digitize multichannel analog inputs, thus MultEQ XT cannot be applied.
Denon 1920 doesn't have DenonLink 3, does it?

No, the 1920 does not have DenonLink 3. MultEQ XT does not require digitization of the signal as far as I know. It just changes the crossover and level settings for speakers and applies parametric equalization. As far as I can tell, it works for the multichannel analog inputs or any other source. To be sure, I'll try it again tonight and compare Audyssey versus flat settings with an SACD and see whether there is a substantial difference.
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post #29 of 2883 Old 10-11-2005, 10:40 AM
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This is definitely the first receiver manual that I've had to flip through over and over again upon initial setup. It's my first Denon, but I've set up my old receivers and other people's receivers on instinct. Otherwise, I'm enjoying the receiver's sound so far. Almost as good as my Anthem amp.
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post #30 of 2883 Old 10-11-2005, 10:40 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by s2silber View Post

Yes, but you're still denied the advantage of being able to use digital connections for BOTH SAT/cable and DVD, which Denon acknowledges does render optimum picture quality on both sources. So, with these problems you've got to forego true digital output from your SAT/cable box if you've only got one digital input on your TV and you want to take advantage of digital transmission from a DVD player, too. Again, what we're talking about here is inferior SAT/Cable picture quality for the dubious advantage of not having to push your TV's input button. I still say Denon should have addressed this issue and should at least warn customers that not all video sources are compatible with their much-touted HDMI switching capability.

I see what you mean on this but I will ahve to guess that Denon's stance is that they can not test everything and that their equipment is engineered to proper standards/specifications for HDCP. Then again the SAT/STB manufacturers likely believe the same thing. You are right that in the end the consumer is the one that suffers.

For me the switching capabilities will satisfy the majority of my requirements and therefore will not play into my purchasing decisions at this point (since all manufacturers seem to have HDCP compatibility issues)
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