Anthem D2/D2v/AVM50/AVM50v/ARC1 tweaking guide - Page 358 - AVS Forum
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post #10711 of 43014 Old 01-16-2008, 09:52 AM
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Originally Posted by RROSEN View Post

Ok, thanks for the clarification. This is probably why I never had any issue with it hahaa.

So there actually is an issue with the Panasonics? Can this be fixed by adjusting the FLE level in the D2 for that source or is it more complicated than that?

Cheers,

Richard

It is a lot more complicated. We need manufacturers to fix this at the source level - or keep the bug from appearing the first place!

It is *theoretically* possible to cobble together a chain to fix this, but you would have to essentially have TWO different calibrations of your system - one for the offending device, and one for all others that operate correctly. And then remember to switch between them.

There was some discussion in this thread last spring on this, and then in lots of threads in various subforums here. I would expect to see one in a Subwoofer area. You might try and search on "LFE problem" or "LFE bug" and see what you find (if you want to know the gory details).

- Gordon

We don"t see things as they are, we see things as we are. - Anais Nin
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post #10712 of 43014 Old 01-16-2008, 11:05 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gdc View Post

I would agree with this, but I would ADD that there is a hardware limitation in the D2/AVM50 on discrete multichannel audio input of 6 channels (i.e. 5.1).

Since there is a lack of *discrete* 7.1 content available, and the Anthems can do a fantastic job at creating the extra channels from matrixed/encoded information, this is IMHO not a current concern.

To the original poster's point - someday this *will* be an issue, and Anthem will probably release a new box (what some people here call a D3) that will leapfrog ahead. Based on past experience, they may have a hardware upgrade for current D2 owners (like they did for D1 and AVM30 owners). For now, there is nothing equal - so if you want this level of performance, go for it!

Just to interject my experience - last night I watched _Ratatouille_ on my Sony Ruby pj through my D2 with B&W speakers (6.1 system). My wife had seen it in a theater last fall and found it disappointing. When we watched (in SD, not HD) last night, she was thrilled at how clear and immersive both the audio and video were compared with the commercial theater! I myself was impressed with the sound mix - we both jumped during a lightning hit early in the movie! The quality of the Anthem pre pros is far ahead of the norm, but it is easy to take it for granted.

Thanks. I'm currently running a 5.1 set up and have no intentions of going 7.1 anytime soon. I really like the sound/performance from my AVM30 so I think I'm going to quit thinking about it and just have it upgraded. So, what to do without my Anthem for 4+ weeks.
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post #10713 of 43014 Old 01-16-2008, 11:08 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mark Paquette View Post

Thanks. I'm currently running a 5.1 set up and have no intentions of going 7.1 anytime soon. I really like the sound/performance from my AVM30 so I think I'm going to quit thinking about it and just have it upgraded. So, what to do without my Anthem for 4+ weeks.

I do run 7.1 here and the D2 does a great job of
converting 5.1 to 7.1. Is it as good as 7.1 in and
7.1 0ut?

Marc [FimeMixer] who is a professional File Studio
Audio Mixer who also is a D2 Owner. Says he has
a very hard time being able to hear the difference.

It is NOT PERFECT - but it is something you will be
happy with if and when you upgrade to 7.1.
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post #10714 of 43014 Old 01-16-2008, 01:35 PM
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Hi guys,
I thought I'd ask this here since this seems to have the most people in the know re: Anthem.
Has support for the AVM20 been dropped?
Just wondering if Anthem backed out on their 2006 press release regarding HDMI updates, etc...
As per this press release...
Quote:


The Anthem Statement D2 uses internal image processing, as opposed to using an external image processor (scaler) allowing for: convenient switching from source to source; the ability to have as many sources as the preamplifier can handle; separate tweaking for each source; DVD-A playback through HDMI™; and coming soon for current Anthem™ AVM 20s, AVM 30s or Anthem Statement D1 owners, easily incorporated software upgrades (see below).

In keeping with Anthem's demonstrated commitment to providing appropriate upgrades, free software upgrades will be available in the future to add even more features and enhancements to the Anthem Statement D2. Additionally, plans are underway for the D2 features to be made available as a factory upgrade (cost to be determined) for existing Anthem AVM 20s, AVM 30s and Anthem Statement D1 owners.

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post #10715 of 43014 Old 01-16-2008, 01:40 PM
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Maximum7,
Not sure what you are asking. The factory upgrade of an AVM-20 to the equivalent of an AVM-50 became available last year. The details are on the Anthem web site. It is not cheap.
--Bob

Anthem D2/D2v/AVM50/AVM50v/ARC1 tweaking guide. -- Need personal consultation/training? PM me!
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post #10716 of 43014 Old 01-16-2008, 01:47 PM
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Thanks Bob. I must have missed that. I will search harder.
Thanks again.
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post #10717 of 43014 Old 01-16-2008, 04:37 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by drhankz View Post

Feel Free to READ this article

No IR is a 100% Deal Breaker in my Theater.
If you can't control and it can't be rack mounted.
THEN IT IS USELESS.

Someone is coming out with an IR solution. See:

http://www.remotecentral.com/cgi-bin...ad.cgi?14086,1

There are other solutions as well (such as the PS2 remote codes with Radio Shack USB adapter). But the one I mentioned above is the most interesting.
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post #10718 of 43014 Old 01-16-2008, 04:44 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Carlton Bale View Post

I looking to connect the output from an Xantech 79-144 IR connecting block to the IR input of the D2. I know I can connect an IR emitter to the connecting block and stick it on the front of the D2, but I'd rather avoid that option. With my previous receiver, I was able to connect a 3.5mm cable between the Xantech and the receiver to pass along the IR signal.

Does anyone know if there is a way to connect this to the rear panel IR emitter input? It looks like there is only power and signal return on the D2, which wasn't what I was expecting. (I think I need signal and ground.) Any ideas?


I tried connecting an IR out from the Pronto RFX9600 (where an emitter is normally plugged into) using a 3.5mm cable on the RFX9600 side and bare wire on the Anthem D2 side. It does not work. So I assume going directly from the Xantech 791-44 to the D2 with wire would likewise not work correctly. So as not to have an emitter stuck to the front of the D2, I got a Dinky Link receiver and plugged it into the back of the D2. I got an emitter from the RFX9600 and taped it to the Dinky Link. This contraption is at least in the back of the D2 and not visible from the front. It works very well.

The D2 manual also mentions that under some scenario (don't recall the exact wording), the aforementioned "optical" solution is the way to go.
I've had other problems trying to use straight wire on IR outputs normally intended to be used with IR emitters. For example, see:

http://www.remotecentral.com/cgi-bin...thread.cgi?960

To summarize, the optical "coupler" approach doesn't seem particularly efficient, but it works great (and hey, nothing travels faster than the speed of light, right :-) ?

EDIT: I had tried going from my Xantech 791-44 to the D2 with wire and it did not work. I had to use the optical approach. Not bad, but had to spend more $$ on a Dinky Link receiver.
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post #10719 of 43014 Old 01-16-2008, 05:22 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by randman View Post

Someone is coming out with an IR solution. See:

http://www.remotecentral.com/cgi-bin...ad.cgi?14086,1

There are other solutions as well (such as the PS2 remote codes with Radio Shack USB adapter). But the one I mentioned above is the most interesting.

I really like the Nyko Blu-Wave IR remote that I bought for my PS3. http://www.nyko.com/nyko/products/?i=113 I quickly programmed it into my master remote of course. It won't do power off/on, but (dang it) I have to get up to put the disc in and take it out anyways!
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post #10720 of 43014 Old 01-16-2008, 05:29 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mlbrand View Post

I really like the Nyko Blu-Wave IR remote that I bought for my PS3. http://www.nyko.com/nyko/products/?i=113 I quickly programmed it into my master remote of course. It won't do power off/on, but (dang it) I have to get up to put the disc in and take it out anyways!

The nice thing about the solution I mentioned is that it will provide all the functionality available in the PS3 Blue Tooth remote, but via IR. This solution basically puts an IR receiver and chip in the stock Sony PS3 Bluetooth remote so that the remote acts as an IR receiver and translates the IR to Bluetooth. But I agree, I have the PS2 remote solution, and the only disadvantage is power on and off. But it really isn't a big deal since, as you said, you have to insert and remove the DVD anyway. Unlike my Toshiba HD DVD player, where you have to wait about 45 seconds from the time you hit eject or power and the time the DVD cradle opens, the PS3 is very responsive and you can start playing a DVD in 5 seconds or so. I think a lot of folks have dismissed the PS3 given that it's a game machine and not a traditional audiophile piece of gear. But, I still think, over a year after its release, it is still one of the best Blu-Ray players out there. Its processing power is certainly faster than others, and its firmware is continually being upgraded (the December firmware upgrade provided the latest blu-ray profile release). It has enough processing power to be able to have new functionality via firmware upgrades. Enough said. Back to talking about the D2....
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post #10721 of 43014 Old 01-16-2008, 08:08 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by randman View Post

Someone is coming out with an IR solution. See:

http://www.remotecentral.com/cgi-bin...ad.cgi?14086,1

There are other solutions as well (such as the PS2 remote codes with Radio Shack USB adapter). But the one I mentioned above is the most interesting.

I ordered the one from Schmartz
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post #10722 of 43014 Old 01-16-2008, 09:18 PM
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Re: The Xantech 791-44.

I have the IR amp mentioned and what I did was to simply run wire from the 791-44 signal and gnd input blocks. In other words my IR sensor signal is split between the D2 and the Xantech 791-44 amp. Works like a champ no need for a messy optical emitter.
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post #10723 of 43014 Old 01-17-2008, 09:43 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by whitewolf1
I am seeing red banding and thousands of red dots when using HDMI to my H79 projector. I started getting this noise issue about three months ago. I am having this problem with both my HR20 Direct tv HD sat box as well as with the Oppo 970hd Dvd player. It looks fine with component but every time I change the channel I loose the video. So; its either loss of resolution and change channels using HDMI or nice video until I change the channel using component. Any thoughts?

This sounds like a marginal HDMI cable problem. Make sure your HDMI plugs are fully inserted straight into their sockets. Even the weight of the cable can loosen them enough to cause problems. Since you are using a projector, you may be running into length issues for that HDMI cable, or signal degradation through wall plates/adapters. Try temporarily setting your output resolution to 480p and see if the problem goes away when running that lower bandwidth video. If so, try upgrading/shortening your cable.

Also, see if you can reproduce the problem using the Anthem's internally generated video (the Setup menus and the test patterns in the Video Source Adjust menu under the "7" key). If so, then you know the problem is entirely on the output side of the Anthem, and not related to any issue with your source devices or their cabling. If not, then check your input cabling as well.
--Bob

Bob,

I checked internally (menu 7) and the sparkles are apparent on 1280/720p/60 but disappears on 480p. When I bypass the AVM50 and connect directly from the H79 projector to the HR20 Sat box the red sparkles are not there. Could this still be an HDMI cable issue? or is my AVM50 in need of service? I do have about a 15' HDMI cable to a wall plate then an 2' hdmi cable to DVI connection. The sparkles are not there when I use component but the video drops every time I change channel and I have to go to setup menu to bring it back.. Thanks for your help and where did you gain your knowledge? Your amazing!
DJ
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post #10724 of 43014 Old 01-17-2008, 10:50 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Maximum7 View Post

Thanks Bob. I must have missed that. I will search harder.
Thanks again.

I was in the same boat you are in and ultimately decided to trade in my AVM20 and go straight to the D2. I haven't regretted it for a minute. For me the audio side is at least as important as the video so it was a no brainer.

In either case I am sure you will be enjoying your upgrade.

Cheers,

Richard
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post #10725 of 43014 Old 01-17-2008, 11:29 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by whitewolf1 View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by whitewolf1
I am seeing red banding and thousands of red dots when using HDMI to my H79 projector. I started getting this noise issue about three months ago. I am having this problem with both my HR20 Direct tv HD sat box as well as with the Oppo 970hd Dvd player. It looks fine with component but every time I change the channel I loose the video. So; its either loss of resolution and change channels using HDMI or nice video until I change the channel using component. Any thoughts?

This sounds like a marginal HDMI cable problem. Make sure your HDMI plugs are fully inserted straight into their sockets. Even the weight of the cable can loosen them enough to cause problems. Since you are using a projector, you may be running into length issues for that HDMI cable, or signal degradation through wall plates/adapters. Try temporarily setting your output resolution to 480p and see if the problem goes away when running that lower bandwidth video. If so, try upgrading/shortening your cable.

Also, see if you can reproduce the problem using the Anthem's internally generated video (the Setup menus and the test patterns in the Video Source Adjust menu under the "7" key). If so, then you know the problem is entirely on the output side of the Anthem, and not related to any issue with your source devices or their cabling. If not, then check your input cabling as well.
--Bob

Bob,

I checked internally (menu 7) and the sparkles are apparent on 1280/720p/60 but disappears on 480p. When I bypass the AVM50 and connect directly from the H79 projector to the HR20 Sat box the red sparkles are not there. Could this still be an HDMI cable issue? or is my AVM50 in need of service? I do have about a 15' HDMI cable to a wall plate then an 2' hdmi cable to DVI connection. The sparkles are not there when I use component but the video drops every time I change channel and I have to go to setup menu to bring it back.. Thanks for your help and where did you gain your knowledge? Your amazing!
DJ

The sparklies not being there at 480p (lower bandwidth requirements) most likely indicate some sort of HDMI issue. Either the cable path (adapters/connectors inline never help but your distance is not very long) or the AVM50. Unfortunately the only way to tell would be to go directly from the AVM50 to the PJ with the 15' cable.

Also, if you go into the HDMI forum, there is a thread dedicated to HDMI wall plates. Not all HDMI wall plates are created equal.

larry

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post #10726 of 43014 Old 01-17-2008, 11:30 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by whitewolf1 View Post

Bob,

I checked internally (menu 7) and the sparkles are apparent on 1280/720p/60 but disappears on 480p. When I bypass the AVM50 and connect directly from the H79 projector to the HR20 Sat box the red sparkles are not there. Could this still be an HDMI cable issue? or is my AVM50 in need of service? I do have about a 15' HDMI cable to a wall plate then an 2' hdmi cable to DVI connection. The sparkles are not there when I use component but the video drops every time I change channel and I have to go to setup menu to bring it back.. Thanks for your help and where did you gain your knowledge? Your amazing!
DJ

Bit drop outs due to a marginal cable (or bad HDMI output in the Anthem or input in the TV) will usually be more likely to happen when you send higher bandwidth video. 720p is much higher bandwidth than 480p.

Also, the chips that implement a DVI connection are not as robust in the face of signal damage (compared to HDMI chip sets). Generally speaking, if the total length of cable when either end is a DVI device gets over 10 feet, you may start seeing trouble.

And every adapter is another potential source of signal damage.

The first thing to do is to eliminate the possibility that your AVM's video section is going out or that the TV is having trouble on its DVI input.

To do this, temporarily move the AVM-50 close to the TV and try directly connecting a shorter (say 6 foot) HDMI to DVI cable of good quality. You won't need any source devices or speaker connections for this test. Use an HDMI to DVI cable -- not an HDMI-HDMI with an HDMI/DVI adapter for example. Then set the AVM output to 720p and view the AVM's INTERNALLY generated video (the Setup menu and the test patterns in the Video Source Adjust menu under the "7" key). If that doesn't work solidly, then you need to determine whether it is the AVM output or the TV input that is at fault. The best way to do that is to try the AVM with a different TV, perhaps at your dealer.

If the short, direct connection works fine, then put the AVM-50 back and temporarily run a DIRECT HDMI to DVI cable of appropriate length to your TV. Try it first with the AVM's internally generated video, and then with your sources. If that works then you know it is your older cabling or wall plates causing the problem.

If the longer, direct cabling fails with the AVM's internal video then your TV is not handling the signal issues from that length of cable. If the internal video works but your source video still fails then look to upgrade the cabling on the SOURCE side of the AVM.

Just approach this stuff in a logical fashion and you will soon be able to isolate whether it is the cabling, the TV, the AVM or your sources that are the cause.
--Bob

Anthem D2/D2v/AVM50/AVM50v/ARC1 tweaking guide. -- Need personal consultation/training? PM me!
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post #10727 of 43014 Old 01-17-2008, 02:25 PM
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Thank you for your thoughts Bob and Larry! I will let you know how it works out!
DJ
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post #10728 of 43014 Old 01-17-2008, 05:00 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by obie_fl View Post

Re: The Xantech 791-44.

I have the IR amp mentioned and what I did was to simply run wire from the 791-44 signal and gnd input blocks. In other words my IR sensor signal is split between the D2 and the Xantech 791-44 amp. Works like a champ no need for a messy optical emitter.

Can you elaborate? Did you connect an IR receiver to the 791-44's signal, ground, and 12vdc and then connected 2 wires from the 791-44's signal and gnd to the D2?
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post #10729 of 43014 Old 01-17-2008, 05:38 PM
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Originally Posted by randman View Post

Can you elaborate? Did you connect an IR receiver to the 791-44's signal, ground, and 12vdc and then connected 2 wires from the 791-44's signal and gnd to the D2?

Exactly...which means I actually have two wires on the sig and gnd blocks and one going from the 12vdc to the IR receiver.
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post #10730 of 43014 Old 01-17-2008, 07:03 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by randman View Post

I tried connecting an IR out from the Pronto RFX9600 (where an emitter is normally plugged into) using a 3.5mm cable on the RFX9600 side and bare wire on the Anthem D2 side. It does not work. So I assume going directly from the Xantech 791-44 to the D2 with wire would likewise not work correctly.

I have a direct 2-wire connection (signal+ground/shield) from an output jack (meant for an emitter) on a Niles MSU480 into the back of the D2. Works like a champ. Must be something about the Pronto and/or 791-44. I assume you tried both high and normal power settings on the Xantech output. I use the low power output on the MSU480.
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post #10731 of 43014 Old 01-17-2008, 07:43 PM
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Originally Posted by whitewolf1 View Post

Thank you for your thoughts Bob and Larry! I will let you know how it works out!
DJ

The wallplate "tester" in the HDMI forum just gave an update today. He dumped the wall plates! He had things working and then he went to a new HDMI 1.3 AVR and things stopped working. Although he had 2 wall plates "inline". http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=832382

larry

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post #10732 of 43014 Old 01-17-2008, 09:39 PM
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Originally Posted by PooperScooper View Post

The wallplate "tester" in the HDMI forum just gave an update today. He dumped the wall plates! He had things working and then he went to a new HDMI 1.3 AVR and things stopped working. Although he had 2 wall plates "inline". http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=832382

larry

Interesting. I have D2 -> wallplate -> 30 foot HDMI cable -> wallplate -> 1 foot HDMI -> Sony Ruby. No problems on this end. (knock on wood!)

- Gordon

We don"t see things as they are, we see things as we are. - Anais Nin
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post #10733 of 43014 Old 01-18-2008, 04:02 AM
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Which Blu-Ray player other than the PS3 (not a gamer) is a good match with the Anthem D2? Thanks guys.
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post #10734 of 43014 Old 01-18-2008, 05:50 AM
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Originally Posted by jpillar View Post

Which Blu-Ray player other than the PS3 (not a gamer) is a good match with the Anthem D2? Thanks guys.

I think Pioneer has the least number of Complaints from Owners.

NONE are PERFECT - Pioneer seems to come the closest and has great support.
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post #10735 of 43014 Old 01-18-2008, 06:04 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gdc View Post

Interesting. I have D2 -> wallplate -> 30 foot HDMI cable -> wallplate -> 1 foot HDMI -> Sony Ruby. No problems on this end. (knock on wood!)

Don't change anything!

larry

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post #10736 of 43014 Old 01-18-2008, 07:58 AM
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This might be a good point to re-cite this article from Blue Jeans -- one of the better regarded makers of cables -- as to why HDMI cabling is so tough to get right, and in particular why adapters (including wall plates) add to the problems as the bandwidth of the signal you are passing goes up:

http://www.bluejeanscable.com/articl...-with-hdmi.htm

I think what some people may be missing is that this stuff is thorny enough that it may even come down to batch differences in the same model of cable/adapter from the same manufacturer.

The people responsible for the HDMI spec are well aware of the potential for problems of course. But they know that properly engineered and tested cables and adapters WILL WORK. And that's why they pushed through the much stricter design and testing standards for cables that want to use the HDMI V1.3 label.

They are also banking on a new generation of HDMI V1.3 (and higher) chip sets which will include much improved signal "equalization" processing that enables the product to work reliably even in the face of signal degradation by the cable (and adapters). The problem is, there is no way for the customer to tell that a given HDMI V1.3 product includes such chips. It is not part of HDMI V1.3a or even the latest HDMI V1.3b labeling for products.

What is clear is that older HDMI V1.2a or lower products can not have such improvements, and that DVI products are worse at this than even HDMI V1.0 products. Which means if EITHER END of the cable is attached to such a product (or even an HDMI V1.3 product without the new, magic chips) you need to be more concerned about total cable length from product to product and the quality of the cable(s)/adapter(s) in the path. This is particularly tough on folks who have a DVI product at either end and want a cable run of more than, say, a mere 10 feet. And folks using 1080p/60 video are MUCH more likely to run into cabling issues than folks using 1080i or 720p video. (The even higher resolutions defined in the HDMI V1.3 spec for future products some years down the road will only make this worse.)

Anecdotal evidence that someone has managed to make a really long cable run work even through adapters just means that sometimes you can luck out. Another person using the very same electronics, cables, and adapters may not be so lucky simply due to manufacturing variances and the quality of the plug/socket connections.

Note that this is just between any two products since HDMI and DVI products, except for the simplest/cheapest passive switches, invariably regenerate an input signal to create a new output signal -- thus starting the process over again.

This also means that if you have long-run cabling problems, the solution may be to add an HDMI repeater of some sort (often a switch) into the cable path. But that can only switch the problem over to the other bugaboo of HDMI which is that each product added to the TOTAL signal path from source to display complicates the job of the source in verifying HDCP (copy protection) from end to end.

The fiber optic (and new coax) in-wall HDMI cabling solutions solve this by essentially putting a piece of electronics at either end of the in-wall cabling and then using fiber (or coax) in between them to eliminate signal degradation issues over the long run through the wall. The box at each end has the effect of repeating the signal. Again, this should eliminate signal degradation problems but MAY introduce HDCP problems.
--Bob

Anthem D2/D2v/AVM50/AVM50v/ARC1 tweaking guide. -- Need personal consultation/training? PM me!
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post #10737 of 43014 Old 01-18-2008, 08:45 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jpillar View Post

Which Blu-Ray player other than the PS3 (not a gamer) is a good match with the Anthem D2? Thanks guys.

I heard this one was good Panasonic DMP-BD30.

I was going to get one until i heard the next gen Bluerays are coming soon so i decided to wait for a bit and see if this is true.
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post #10738 of 43014 Old 01-18-2008, 08:48 AM
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I heard this one was good Panasonic DMP-BD30.

All the Panasonic Players 10, 20 and 30 have an LFE bug.
Other than that bug - I think they are ok.
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post #10739 of 43014 Old 01-18-2008, 01:09 PM
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plus the BD30 has no internal decoding, so you wouldn't get TrueHD or DTS-HD MA with the D2.
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post #10740 of 43014 Old 01-18-2008, 02:38 PM
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Has anyone heard any updates regarding room eq from CES?
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