Anthem D2/D2v/AVM50/AVM50v/ARC1 tweaking guide - Page 501 - AVS Forum
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post #15001 of 43028 Old 07-18-2008, 09:32 AM
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Uh, oh!

I just noticed that Anthem switched the "official" ARC version -- on the public download page for the D2 -- to V1.2.4 this morning.

I would recommend that current ARC users hold off updating to that one for a bit until we get some feel for what's going on with the bass issues just reported here.
--Bob

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post #15002 of 43028 Old 07-18-2008, 09:33 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ASW View Post

I was wondering whether a new version might be on the horizon.

Oh I'm sure they are working on it. But I haven't gotten any heads up that a new test try is about to be put out.
--Bob

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post #15003 of 43028 Old 07-18-2008, 09:36 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob Pariseau View Post

Hmmmm, sounds like there is a problem with ARC V1.2.4.

Is anybody else here using ARC V1.2.4 and D2 V1.33 *WITHOUT* having bass issues? I know we had a number of folks who were told to go to ARC V1.2.4 to increase the range of subwoofer level trim that could be Uploaded. Is that working for you folks without problems?

So we know they changed SOMETHING related to bass for ARC V1.2.4.
--Bob

This pm I loaded D2 v1.33 to try out with ARC1.2.4. After reloading user's settings, I checked in the setup menu and found the xovers were lost. Instead, I found all of them showing 80Hz THX.

I also reloaded the last ARC measurements and sadly found the bass still giving me a headache like I mentioned earlier.
-Ben
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post #15004 of 43028 Old 07-18-2008, 09:36 AM
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ARC V1.2.4 has also just now shown up on the public download page for the AVM-40 and AVM-50:

http://www.anthemav.com/NewSitev2.0/...Downloads.html

The AVM50 V1.3x Operating Manual has not yet been updated on that page to the version that includes the new Section 3.15 (ARC instructions), but that will likely happen soon. Also, I've not been able to find any marketing materials on the ARC upgrade for the AVM-40 or AVM-50 -- no pricing or ordering details -- on their public web pages yet.
--Bob

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post #15005 of 43028 Old 07-18-2008, 09:46 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by benleeys View Post

This pm I loaded D2 v1.33 to try out with ARC1.2.4. After reloading user's settings, I checked in the setup menu and found the xovers were lost. Instead, I found all of them showing 80Hz THX.

I also reloaded the last ARC measurements and sadly found the bass still giving me a headache like I mentioned earlier.
-Ben

With your ARC V1.2.4 results properly loaded in D2 V1.33, grab your trusty Radio Shack SPL meter and compare the levels it measures for the main speakers to what it measures for the subwoofer.

Use ARC mic position #1 with the SPL meter pointed straight up and with it set to "C" weighting and Slow response.

Go into Setup / Speaker Calibration, set Noise Sequence to Manual and scroll down to each speaker line to get the noise tone from that speaker. Use the Back button to turn off the noise.

The entries you find in Setup / Speaker Calibration should be the ones that ARC just Uploaded for you. Don't make any changes in there, just note what the SPL meter reads for each speaker. I'm not looking for minor variations here, but rather whether the subwoofer is WAY too hot compared to the other speakers.

--------------------------------------

Also double check that your actual speaker configuration (i.e., which speakers are used for Movie and Music) matches what you told ARC to use during Measurement for each of those.
--Bob

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post #15006 of 43028 Old 07-18-2008, 09:54 AM
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Ok, I just ordered my ARC. My guy at Sounds Deluxe says its just amazing!

I am looking forward to it.
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post #15007 of 43028 Old 07-18-2008, 10:01 AM
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As a dealer I can supply pricing for these items but note this is ONLY for upgrade kit, labor will be additional. BTW, will have Bob McConnell, Central Mgr, Anthem, here to supervise our up of an AVM-50. Have installed several D-2s and upped a D-1. Will report later.

AVM50, 40, 30HD kit......$799

New AVM 40/ARC.....$4499
New AVM 50/ARC.....$5499

Most informative forum, thanks to all
tjg
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post #15008 of 43028 Old 07-18-2008, 10:13 AM
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Thats what I was told $800.00
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post #15009 of 43028 Old 07-18-2008, 10:17 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob Pariseau View Post

With your ARC V1.2.4 results properly loaded in D2 V1.33, grab your trusty Radio Shack SPL meter and compare the levels it measures for the main speakers to what it measures for the subwoofer.

Use ARC mic position #1 with the SPL meter pointed straight up and with it set to "C" weighting and Slow response.

Go into Setup / Speaker Calibration, set Noise Sequence to Manual and scroll down to each speaker line to get the noise tone from that speaker. Use the Back button to turn off the noise.

The entries you find in Setup / Speaker Calibration should be the ones that ARC just Uploaded for you. Don't make any changes in there, just note what the SPL meter reads for each speaker. I'm not looking for minor variations here, but rather whether the subwoofer is WAY too hot compared to the other speakers.

--------------------------------------

Also double check that your actual speaker configuration (i.e., which speakers are used for Movie and Music) matches what you told ARC to use during Measurement for each of those.
--Bob

Whoaaoooow! Here's my tabulation -
Front Left .. ARC -4 ..... SPL 72
Front Right . ARC -3.5 .. SPL 72
Center ....... ARC +4 .... SPL 73
Sur Left ..... ARC -0.5 .. SPL 71
Sur Right .... ARC +2 .... SPL 72
Sub ........... ARC 0 ...... SPL -- (Right off the scale!)

While measuring the sub with the SPL, I thought there was an earthquake!
Bob, you will appreciate it when I say I dare not wait to re-measure it with a higher scale. That was the first time I heard it bottoming and it is certainly not pleasant.

D2 v1.33 is certainly not recommended. I should have remained with v1.31c.

All speaker configurations are fine.
-Ben
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post #15010 of 43028 Old 07-18-2008, 10:48 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by benleeys View Post

D2 v1.33 is certainly not recommended. I should have remained with v1.31c.

All speaker configurations are fine.
-Ben

Give Anthem tech support a call right away with that info.

I doubt your problem is D2 V1.33 as plenty of people are using that. It is more likely that the problem is ARC V1.2.4.
--Bob

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post #15011 of 43028 Old 07-18-2008, 10:54 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TJG55 View Post

As a dealer I can supply pricing for these items but note this is ONLY for upgrade kit, labor will be additional. BTW, will have Bob McConnell, Central Mgr, Anthem, here to supervise our up of an AVM-50. Have installed several D-2s and upped a D-1. Will report later.

AVM50, 40, 30HD kit......$799

New AVM 40/ARC.....$4499
New AVM 50/ARC.....$5499

Most informative forum, thanks to all
tjg

Thanks for that! I'm assuming these are all MSRP which means dealers have room to maneuver depending on the specific situation with each customer (other products and services being sold to that customer, etc.).

Remind me, what was the MSRP for the AVM-40 and AVM-50 prior to this? I.e., how much has the price increased for a customer to now get ARC bundled with a new AVM-40 or AVM-50? And is Anthem still offering the AVM-40 and AVM-50 for sale WITHOUT ARC? Hardly something I'd recommend for any new purchaser, but just curious.

And finally, have you been told that AVM-40 and AVM-50 units bundled with ARC in the factory are shipping now? Or do you expect it will be a while yet?
--Bob

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post #15012 of 43028 Old 07-18-2008, 10:57 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob Pariseau View Post

Give Anthem tech support a call right away with that info.

I doubt your problem is D2 V1.33 as plenty of people are using that. It is more likely that the problem is ARC V1.2.4.
--Bob

Wherever the problem is, D2 v1.33 certainly cannot work with ARC 1.2.4 which seems to work fine with D2 v1.31c - at least there was no earthquake.

I am located half way round the globe, so I can only email them.
-Ben
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post #15013 of 43028 Old 07-18-2008, 11:10 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by benleeys View Post

Wherever the problem is, D2 v1.33 certainly cannot work with ARC 1.2.4 which seems to work fine with D2 v1.31c - at least there was no earthquake.

I am located half way round the globe, so I can only email them.
-Ben

I have 1.33 with 1.2.4 and have not noticed any boominess. I have not gone back and checked my crossover settings or double checked with an SPL meter, but subjectively my 1.2.4/1.33 results sound much like my 1.31/1.2results.
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post #15014 of 43028 Old 07-18-2008, 11:15 AM
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More ARC and AVM/ARC news:

The ARC V1.2.4 which is now up on the public downloads page for the AVM-40 and AVM-50, as well as on the separate public downloads page for the D2, is identical to the one that was in the "Test" folder on the password protected download page. So there have been no changes for the version now released to the public.

------------------------------

The ARC folder on the public download page for the AVM-40 and AVM-50 includes a revised version of the V1.3x Operating Manual. This is NOT THE SAME as the one offered in the download links for the AVM-40 and AVM-50 manuals!

Anthem has now combined the manuals for these two AVM products together into one book. That means they've had to go through and mark some sections as for AVM-40 only and some as for AVM-50 only. So far I haven't spotted any problems with this.

The additional Section 3.15 (ARC instructions) will be found in this new combo manual.
--Bob

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post #15015 of 43028 Old 07-18-2008, 11:21 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ASW View Post

I have 1.33 with 1.2.4 and have not noticed any boominess. I have not gone back and checked my crossover settings or double checked with an SPL meter, but subjectively my 1.2.4/1.33 results sound much like my 1.31/1.2results.

OK, that's one good report!

I'm hoping this turns out to be nothing more than a corrupted ARC results file for the folks having this issue.

------------------------------------------

My recommendation is that folks run ARC in Advanced mode and exit ARC after taking Measurements and before doing Calculations. Then write protect the file containing the Measurements. Make a copy of that (turn write protection off in the copy), run ARC again in Advanced mode and Open the copy. Do your Calculations, Save that, exit ARC again and write protect this file that now contains both your Measurements and Calculations. Open that file in ARC again and now Upload it.

If you want to do new Calculations, make an additional copy from your MEASUREMENTS file and work in that new copy. Again, write protect the results.

The purpose of all of this is to make sure you don't accidentally screw up the data in either your Measurements-only or Measurements+Calculations file by opening them in ARC to look around at the charts or whatever and then poking at the values. It seems to me that ARC may make changes in the currently open file AS YOU POKE AT ITS VALUES, which may catch some users unawares.
--Bob

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post #15016 of 43028 Old 07-18-2008, 11:25 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by benleeys View Post

Wherever the problem is, D2 v1.33 certainly cannot work with ARC 1.2.4 which seems to work fine with D2 v1.31c - at least there was no earthquake.

I am located half way round the globe, so I can only email them.
-Ben

So are you saying that you happened to do this SPL check with D2 V1.31c and ARC V1.2.4 as well, at some earlier point? I.e., that even when you were hearing problems in the bass with that combo you did *NOT* have this off-scale result in Setup / Speaker Calibration for your subwoofer?
--Bob

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post #15017 of 43028 Old 07-18-2008, 11:32 AM
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Bob,
AVM-40 3999
AVM-50 4999
Yes, can get either unit either way.
I believe ARC units are shipping now.
I strongly agree with your sentiments, ARC all the way!!
The closest anology I can conjure is, ARC on /off is like the difference between 8-track and CD
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post #15018 of 43028 Old 07-18-2008, 11:45 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ASW View Post

I have 1.33 with 1.2.4 and have not noticed any boominess. I have not gone back and checked my crossover settings or double checked with an SPL meter, but subjectively my 1.2.4/1.33 results sound much like my 1.31/1.2results.

Try "The Sound of Glory" Telarc SACD-60579, using 6-ch source input and set Audio In to AnalogDSP. If you do check the calibration with an SPL meter, do be careful when you reach the sub. abc999 had a fright too.
-Ben
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post #15019 of 43028 Old 07-18-2008, 11:48 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob Pariseau View Post

So are you saying that you happened to do this SPL check with D2 V1.31c and ARC V1.2.4 as well, at some earlier point? I.e., that even when you were hearing problems in the bass with that combo you did *NOT* have this off-scale result in Setup / Speaker Calibration for your subwoofer?
--Bob

Correct.
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post #15020 of 43028 Old 07-18-2008, 11:56 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob Pariseau View Post

Hmmmm, sounds like there is a problem with ARC V1.2.4.

Is anybody else here using ARC V1.2.4 and D2 V1.33 *WITHOUT* having bass issues? I know we had a number of folks who were told to go to ARC V1.2.4 to increase the range of subwoofer level trim that could be Uploaded. Is that working for you folks without problems?

So we know they changed SOMETHING related to bass for ARC V1.2.4.
--Bob

Bass issues here as well - went back to 1.2.2
Bass was literally overwhelming from all directions.
/\\/\\
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post #15021 of 43028 Old 07-18-2008, 11:57 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TJG55 View Post

Bob,
AVM-40 3999
AVM-50 4999
Yes, can get either unit either way.
I believe ARC units are shipping now.
I strongly agree with your sentiments, ARC all the way!!
The closest anology I can conjure is, ARC on /off is like the difference between 8-track and CD

Got it! $500 up charge when ordered in a bundle. $800 to get it as an upgrade separately (plus a few extra pennies to the dealer for installation of the hardware change ).

I'm eagerly awaiting the first end user reports on ARC for the AVM units -- whether it makes as big a difference for them as it does for the D1 and D2.

On the whole, I suspect the average AVM owner is less likely to have a treated room than the average D2 owner, or to have speakers which are specially matched in timbre, and so I suspect we are going to hear some pretty amazing reports once ARC gets out there to them.
--Bob

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post #15022 of 43028 Old 07-18-2008, 11:58 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by drmabuse View Post

Bass issues here as well - went back to 1.2.2
Bass was literally overwhelming from all directions.
/\\/\\

Did you re-Measure with ARC V1.2.4 or did you just use it with your prior, V1.2.2, Measurement file?

Please do pass on your info to Anthem tech support.
--Bob

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post #15023 of 43028 Old 07-18-2008, 12:05 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by drmabuse View Post

Bass issues here as well - went back to 1.2.2
Bass was literally overwhelming from all directions.
/\\/\\

That is true. I went back and reloaded my files from previous ARC versions and found the problem existed back then. I was using D2 v1.31c when I tried those old files.
-Ben
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post #15024 of 43028 Old 07-18-2008, 01:15 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by benleeys View Post

Try "The Sound of Glory" Telarc SACD-60579, using 6-ch source input and set Audio In to AnalogDSP. If you do check the calibration with an SPL meter, do be careful when you reach the sub. abc999 had a fright too.
-Ben

I will take a closer listen, but I have used several different SACDs (I do not have Sound of Glory) and just do not hear a sub problem (at least not one that was easily noticed).
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post #15025 of 43028 Old 07-18-2008, 02:01 PM
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so for the AVM40 and 50 guys, should we use 1.2.2 with 1.33 or try the 1.2.4?

John

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post #15026 of 43028 Old 07-18-2008, 02:12 PM
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AVM-40 and AVM-50 owners must use AVM V1.33 and ARC V1.2.4.

ARC V1.2.2 will not recognize the AVM-40 or AVM-50 as valid units for it to work with.

--------------------------

I suspect we will learn in short order that the D2 folks having problems with ARC V1.2.4 have something relatively isolated to deal with -- something peculiar to their setup or the way they are using ARC. The problem they are reporting is so significant that I can't believe it would have escaped the pre-release testing of ARC V1.2.4.

So odds are you are going to be fine using ARC V1.2.4 with your AVM unit.

But for *CURRENT* ARC users (i.e., with the D1 or D2), who happen to be on ARC V1.2.2 at the moment and have it working fine, there are no significant bug fixes reported in ARC V1.2.4 so there is no rush to switch to it. Wait a bit until this issue is better understood.

I'm also not sure whether switching to ARC V1.2.4 from ARC V1.2.2 means you have to re-Measure, or re-Calculate old Measurements, or what.
--Bob

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post #15027 of 43028 Old 07-18-2008, 02:21 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob Pariseau View Post

Did you re-Measure with ARC V1.2.4 or did you just use it with your prior, V1.2.2, Measurement file?

Please do pass on your info to Anthem tech support.
--Bob

I re-measured with 1.2.4.
After the earthquake, I reloaded my previous measurements from 1.2.2 using the 1.2.4 and it corrected things.
Will try another measurement this weekend...
/\\/\\
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post #15028 of 43028 Old 07-18-2008, 03:09 PM
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Please excuse me if this question has already been asked, but, after running the ARC measurements and setting the sources to EQ on...are the Xovers visible when looking at the speaker configurations?
For example, if the ARC settings:
50 L/R main
55 Center
110 L/R Surrounds with the sub at 120
Will these numbers show up in the D2's speaker configurations?
Thanks.
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post #15029 of 43028 Old 07-18-2008, 03:55 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by "MIKEY" View Post

Please excuse me if this question has already been asked, but, after running the ARC measurements and setting the sources to EQ on...are the Xovers visible when looking at the speaker configurations?
For example, if the ARC settings:
50 L/R main
55 Center
110 L/R Surrounds with the sub at 120
Will these numbers show up in the D2's speaker configurations?
Thanks.

Yes. Otherwise the ARC Upload hasn't happened properly.

And once they are in there you must be careful not to fiddle with them or you will screw up what ARC has set up for you. The same is true about the speaker volume level settings in the Setup menu and the configuration of which speakers are included in the Movie and Music configuration.

This is why it is wise to Save User and/or Installer Settings after you Upload ARC results so that you capture those values and won't accidentally undo them by Reloading Saved User or Installer Settings at some later point.

---------------------------

You must still manually set up your speaker distances and the Polarity and Phase settings for your subwoofer. You can do this either before or after setting up ARC. There is no need to re-Measure when you do this. The ARC results will just sound better once you have made these manual settings.
--Bob

Anthem D2/D2v/AVM50/AVM50v/ARC1 tweaking guide. -- Need personal consultation/training? PM me!
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post #15030 of 43028 Old 07-18-2008, 03:58 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by drmabuse View Post

I re-measured with 1.2.4.
After the earthquake, I reloaded my previous measurements from 1.2.2 using the 1.2.4 and it corrected things.
Will try another measurement this weekend...
/\\/\\

So I suppose there could be a bug, revealed by your setup, in the ARC V1.2.4 Measurement or Calculation process.

Or I suppose that random corruption of ARC Uploads may have returned in ARC V1.2.4 and you were just lucky the second time you used it, i.e., when you used V1.2.4 to Upload your ARC V1.2.2 results file.

ETA: Anthem Tech support will likely need to look at your original ARC V1.2.4 results file -- the one that produced the earthquake. So if you haven't already emailed that to them, hold on to it.
--Bob

Anthem D2/D2v/AVM50/AVM50v/ARC1 tweaking guide. -- Need personal consultation/training? PM me!
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