Anthem D2/D2v/AVM50/AVM50v/ARC1 tweaking guide - Page 503 - AVS Forum
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post #15061 of 43126 Old 07-20-2008, 11:06 AM
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Sorry, I don't really have a speaker recommendation for you. The usual problem in a surround sound setup is not only matching quality but also matching timbre between your speakers. And I don't know what would go well with your other speakers.

Richard, one of the posters here, discovered from his ARC measurement charts that one of his speakers had a bad driver. He had been living with a broken speaker for who knows how long and thought it sounded pretty good! Of course the fixed speaker sounded even better.

Thus Richard Syndrome: Discovering, via ARC, that one of your speakers is actually broken. Yet another fine audio improvement feature of ARC!

----------------------------------

Of course if your Center speaker really is broken, and if you liked it enough to begin with, one possible solution is to get the bad driver replaced in it.

ETA: My personal opinion is that a Center speaker is essential for quality movie listening. If you go without a Center you really need to move your Front L/R speakers closer together for proper dialog, and that screws up their use for music content, even in movie tracks. I set up the "Music" configuration in my D2 without the Center speaker however.

ETA 2: Some higher end speakers have separate inputs for low and high frequency drivers, with a bus-bar cross connecting them for when you only use one pair of wires to them. If your Center speaker is like that, double check that your still have a good bus-bar or wire connection to your high frequency input on it.
--Bob


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post #15062 of 43126 Old 07-20-2008, 12:15 PM
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I just re-installed ARC 1.2.2 and uploaded newly taken measurements. Everything works fine. Can now safely conclude that there's nothing wrong with my player and sub, something which Nick suspected. So, it means a couple of possibilities - either ARC 1.2.4 has a bug or it doesn't work flawlessly with D2 ver 1.33.
-Ben
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post #15063 of 43126 Old 07-20-2008, 12:20 PM
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I take it you are still on D2 V1.33 as well, right?

I think the odds are something got messed up when the change was made in ARC V1.2.4 to allow Uploading of larger ranges of subwoofer volume trim levels. The thing is, we don't have enough ARC V1.2.4 users reporting here to know how common a problem this will be for folks, or whether it will even be a problem at all for the AVM folks who have no choice but to use ARC V1.2.4.
--Bob


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post #15064 of 43126 Old 07-20-2008, 12:30 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob Pariseau View Post

I take it you are still on D2 V1.33 as well, right?

I think the odds are something got messed up when the change was made in ARC V1.2.4 to allow Uploading of larger ranges of subwoofer volume trim levels. The thing is, we don't have enough ARC V1.2.4 users reporting here to know how common a problem this will be for folks, or whether it will even be a problem at all for the AVM folks who have no choice but to use ARC V1.2.4.
--Bob

Yes, am still retaining D2 v1.33. That's the trouble with amending a piece of software code. I find that it often creates a bug somewhere else down the line. Personally, I'd rather write a new piece of program than amend an existing one.
-Ben
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post #15065 of 43126 Old 07-20-2008, 04:05 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by benleeys View Post

I just re-installed ARC 1.2.2 and uploaded newly taken measurements. Everything works fine. Can now safely conclude that there's nothing wrong with my player and sub, something which Nick suspected. So, it means a couple of possibilities - either ARC 1.2.4 has a bug or it doesn't work flawlessly with D2 ver 1.33.
-Ben


Same here. 1.2.2 with 1.33 is more stable
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post #15066 of 43126 Old 07-20-2008, 04:40 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by xtrips View Post

In fact, I think I do. (BTW, what's Richard syndrome? a joke?)
So what kind of centers would you recommend that suits my setup?
I am not expecting brandnames or models, just something I could start selecting with.
A friend of mine strongly believe his system sounds better without a center (phantom). He uses a pair of wilson watt/puppys 8.
He tried to push me off my convictions that a center is necessary.
I would like to know what you think about that.

Thanks


I think its not the Richard syndrome you are having, your mid and highs are down 10dB only. with Richards syndrome there is no sound energy registering on the graph. Maybe a slight tilt of the speaker towards your ear might do the trick. Or the beam of your speakers are so narrow that when you are off the beam angle, the measured response is lower.

If you are the only listener and you are seated at one central location only, then you might get away without a center, for all other seat configurations, you definitely need one.
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post #15067 of 43126 Old 07-20-2008, 05:57 PM
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I step away from this thread for a couple months since everything was working well, and BAM. New stuff like ARC for AVM's!!!

I looks like it's a dealer install. Can dealers do any other service? My AVM50's HDMI #1 input takes a few minutes before it'll show a picture. BUT, if I have Zone 2 or 3 on (and thus the unit is warmed up), it'll work fine right away. The other HDMI inputs seem to work fine from a cold start. I don't really want to be without it for a few weeks to ship it back when I know how to make it work, but I also don't like spending this much money and know something is wrong with it.
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post #15068 of 43126 Old 07-20-2008, 07:22 PM
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My D1 with 1.33 and ARC v1.2.4 is fine. I have not measured but in the past when I had a bad upload that impacted the SUB it was obvious.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob Pariseau View Post

I take it you are still on D2 V1.33 as well, right?

I think the odds are something got messed up when the change was made in ARC V1.2.4 to allow Uploading of larger ranges of subwoofer volume trim levels. The thing is, we don't have enough ARC V1.2.4 users reporting here to know how common a problem this will be for folks, or whether it will even be a problem at all for the AVM folks who have no choice but to use ARC V1.2.4.
--Bob

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post #15069 of 43126 Old 07-20-2008, 08:08 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by aus View Post

I step away from this thread for a couple months since everything was working well, and BAM. New stuff like ARC for AVM's!!!

I looks like it's a dealer install. Can dealers do any other service? My AVM50's HDMI #1 input takes a few minutes before it'll show a picture. BUT, if I have Zone 2 or 3 on (and thus the unit is warmed up), it'll work fine right away. The other HDMI inputs seem to work fine from a cold start. I don't really want to be without it for a few weeks to ship it back when I know how to make it work, but I also don't like spending this much money and know something is wrong with it.

The dealers won't have any diagnostic tools. If it isn't obvious what needs to be replaced the dealers won't be able to do the job. You will have to send the unit back to the factory for service.
--Bob


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post #15070 of 43126 Old 07-20-2008, 08:11 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by abc999 View Post

I think its not the Richard syndrome you are having, your mid and highs are down 10dB only. with Richards syndrome there is no sound energy registering on the graph.

Actually its not hard to imagine a speaker design where a high mid-range/tweeter driver goes out and the woofer/low mid-range driver covers the higher frequencies enough to yield only 10dB down in measurement. You just have to assume a fairly shallow internal cross over between those two drivers.

The thing that makes it look to me like it might be a driver problem is that he's low at ALL of the mid range and high frequencies -- and specifically the fact that he's low at the mid range frequencies.
--Bob


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post #15071 of 43126 Old 07-20-2008, 08:13 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by aus View Post

I step away from this thread for a couple months since everything was working well, and BAM. New stuff like ARC for AVM's!!!

If you are going to wander off, you should hire someone to track this thread for you and alert you to important stuff.


--Bob


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post #15072 of 43126 Old 07-20-2008, 11:17 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob Pariseau View Post

If you are going to wander off, you should hire someone to track this thread for you and alert you to important stuff.


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So Bob, you need a third job??
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post #15073 of 43126 Old 07-21-2008, 12:40 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob Pariseau View Post

Actually its not hard to imagine a speaker design where a high mid-range/tweeter driver goes out and the woofer/low mid-range driver covers the higher frequencies enough to yield only 10dB down in measurement. You just have to assume a fairly shallow internal cross over between those two drivers.

The thing that makes it look to me like it might be a driver problem is that he's low at ALL of the mid range and high frequencies -- and specifically the fact that he's low at the mid range frequencies.
--Bob

Probably, I should have asked if the center speaker is behind a perforated screen or inside a cabinet as opposed to a free standing design most configurations are. those 2 situations can severely decrease mid and high freq. output.
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post #15074 of 43126 Old 07-21-2008, 02:19 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by abc999 View Post

Probably, I should have asked if the center speaker is behind a perforated screen or inside a cabinet as opposed to a free standing design most configurations are. those 2 situations can severely decrease mid and high freq. output.

Well, I just came back from a speaker's technician workshop.
The center and the crossover are ok.
It seems that my room is just "terrible".
I'll try 2 things.
- Putting the center a bit higher, just beneath the screen (which is not perforated)
- And have it tilted towards my ears at the sweet spot.

We'll see.
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post #15075 of 43126 Old 07-21-2008, 08:33 AM
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I read the ARC review in Secrets of Hometheatre HIFI and they commented on the mic stand height being to tall which prevented them from measuring at the proper height in the seating position. They eventually tilted the stand to get the mic in the proper location but it seems to me that the mic would have been on an angle and not straight up. Can anyone tell me the ht. of the mic in its shortest configuration?
thanks,
John

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post #15076 of 43126 Old 07-21-2008, 08:55 AM
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The mic mount at the end of the included, straight-pole, mic stand is tilt-able, so you can point the mic straight up even if you tilt the pole of the stand. You can unscrew the pole from the base to rest it at an angle on a seat.

Or you can do what I did and get one of these from B&H. The mic mount from Anthem's included stand screws onto the end of the mic boom for this one. It works *REALLY* well. I highly recommend it:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...7#post13934257

The link to B&H is in the first line of the portion of the post quoted from 3NO who found this stand to begin with.
--Bob


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post #15077 of 43126 Old 07-21-2008, 09:16 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob Pariseau View Post

Or you can do what I did and get one of these from B&H. The mic mount from Anthem's included stand screws onto the end of the mic boom for this one. It works *REALLY* well. I highly recommend it:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...7#post13934257

The link to B&H is in the first line of the portion of the post quoted from 3NO who found this stand to begin with.
--Bob

Looks much like the one used in the AudysseyPro kit which I drafted to this use.

Kal Rubinson

"Music in the Round"
Senior Contributing Editor, Stereophile

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post #15078 of 43126 Old 07-21-2008, 09:23 AM
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Thanks Bob,

I checked the site for the stand but it was going to be close to $80-90 to ship to the Toronto area. However found it at a Canadian music store for $25 and $11.00 shipping. Should get it after ARC installed but probably will do several runs of ARC before I'm satisfied

John

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post #15079 of 43126 Old 07-21-2008, 01:39 PM
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ARC V1.2.5 has just appeared in the "Test" folder (Link 7) on the password protected download page. The change notes for it read as follows:

Quote:


Changes:

v1.2.5:

1. Fix for bug causing too much overall output from channels having significant low-frequency EQ.

As usual, stuff in the Test folder should be used with caution. If Anthem tech support instructs you to try it, then fine, but otherwise it would probably be good to wait a bit for some reports here.

In any event, this appears to be an effort to correct the "bass earthquake" problem we've been discussing over the weekend. Since there is nothing stated to the contrary, I presume V1.2.5 will also work with the AVM units.
--Bob


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post #15080 of 43126 Old 07-21-2008, 05:37 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jayray View Post

Thanks Bob,

I checked the site for the stand but it was going to be close to $80-90 to ship to the Toronto area. However found it at a Canadian music store for $25 and $11.00 shipping. Should get it after ARC installed but probably will do several runs of ARC before I'm satisfied

John

If you are a musician you probably already have a few of these. If you have any musician friends you could borrow one. Or spring for one at a music store like John did - it doesn't need to be road-rugged since it will sit at home.

The boom really helps to position precisely and can also help to get around pesky furniture in the way

- Gordon

We don"t see things as they are, we see things as we are. - Anais Nin
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post #15081 of 43126 Old 07-21-2008, 06:27 PM
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I take it that anything past the 1.2.4 is ok for AVM users if they experience the low freq. bug?
John

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post #15082 of 43126 Old 07-21-2008, 07:04 PM
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Well, John, you might want to pose that question to Nick tomorrow!


--Bob


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post #15083 of 43126 Old 07-21-2008, 08:43 PM
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Long and McQuade in Canada has a boom mic stand that looks a lot
like the one in the picture. I picked one up for sale at a grand opening sale for $40 or so.

Design by Rives...dollars by The Bogg

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post #15084 of 43126 Old 07-22-2008, 05:00 AM
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Tried ARC 1.2.5 and made new measurements. so far so good.
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Quote:
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Well, John, you might want to pose that question to Nick tomorrow!


--Bob

True

John

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post #15086 of 43126 Old 07-22-2008, 08:19 AM
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So is the 1.2.4 version ok for D2 or not?
I erased 1.2.3 and need to rerun ARC.
Is that ok or should I wait for 1.2.5?
And anyway where do you all guys get those betas? How can I get access too?

Thanks
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post #15087 of 43126 Old 07-22-2008, 08:35 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by xtrips View Post

So is the 1.2.4 version ok for D2 or not?
I erased 1.2.3 and need to rerun ARC.
Is that ok or should I wait for 1.2.5?
And anyway where do you all guys get those betas? How can I get access too?

Thanks

The prior "official" version of ARC for D2 V1.33 was ARC V1.2.2.

The current "official" version is ARC V1.2.4. That's the version that is still on the public download page. It appears that it has a problem for folks whose room and speaker setup results in a "significant amount of bass EQ" for some speakers. The problem is that the overall bass level sent to those speakers ends up WAY too high. Based on the description of the problem it looks like it would only affect some users.

However ARC V1.2.4 has only one change that a D2 user might want -- it increases the range of subwoofer volume trim that ARC can Upload to the D2. If you do not need that fix, and if your ARC V1.2.2 setup is working fine at the moment, then you might as well just continue with ARC V1.2.2 for now. For AVM owners, on the other hand, ARC V1.2.4 is crucial -- it is the first ARC version to support the AVM units upgraded to add the second DSP hardware.

Anthem tech support runs a password protected download page where they put out beta (test) versions of new software. It is no big secret, but they keep it password protected to try to keep track of who might be using such versions. In the past, for example, they put up test versions that were designed for specific combinations of Anthem hardware version and certain source and display devices, knowing that they would not work with certain other combos. They would get the configuration details from the customer and only steer them to the test software if it was likely to work.

ARC V1.2.5 is on there now. It looks like it is a fix for the problem in ARC V1.2.4, but it is still early days yet.

IF you have deleted your ARC V1.2.2 setup and can't retrieve it from a backup, or if you need the subwoofer level Upload fix that V1.2.4 provides, then you will probably be fine with ARC V1.2.4 from the Anthem public download page. Or you could wait a few more days until we have more comments here either from folks using V1.2.4 or folks trying the test version V1.2.5. I've no idea how to predict whether V1.2.4 will give you a problem in your particular setup. Personally, my V1.2.2 is working fine and I'm not switching to V1.2.4 or V1.2.5 yet.

If you decide you need to go to V1.2.5, contact Anthem tech support and explain your situation and they will give you access to the password protected download page. But be aware that using beta software will sometimes result in unpleasant surprises, so don't be in a rush to use test software unless you really need to.
--Bob


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post #15088 of 43126 Old 07-22-2008, 08:36 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by abc999 View Post

Tried ARC 1.2.5 and made new measurements. so far so good.

That was with D2 V1.33 correct? Good news!

By the way, did Anthem tech support tell you that new Measurements were necessary? It may be just a matter of doing a re-Calculation and re-Upload. I don't know.
--Bob


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post #15089 of 43126 Old 07-22-2008, 03:24 PM
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I just recalculated and uploaded my previous 1.2.4 ARC measurements (the ones which gave me the earthquake) and everything appears to be better in 1.2.5
I did not have time to do a full measurement again but will in the next day or two.
/\\/\\
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post #15090 of 43126 Old 07-22-2008, 03:35 PM
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I've just started getting some clicking noises (feedback?) through my speakers whenever the OSD of my AVM-50 comes on. For example, when I turn up the volume, every time I increase the volume there is a high pitched static noise that comes from my speakers. This happens no matter what source I use.

Has anyone else had this happen. Any ideas on what I can do to find/fix the problem?

Thanks.


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