Logic7 or Dolby Prologic IIx? - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 28 Old 01-10-2007, 10:04 PM - Thread Starter
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Im using an AVR645 wich I love and was just wondering wich 2.0 surround conversion was best. If anyone knows in detail what the diffrence is it would be great to read a post. Il test it myself next time i get a chance. But im still waiting on my good center speaker. Im using crap atm.

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post #2 of 28 Old 01-10-2007, 11:19 PM
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I don't think there is a best. Its a matter of choice. I like them both but couldn't technically explain what they do different.

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post #3 of 28 Old 01-10-2007, 11:20 PM - Thread Starter
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thanx

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post #4 of 28 Old 01-11-2007, 02:28 AM
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I find Logic7 to be better for music because it spreads things out from the center more and is stronger in the bass. PLIIx seems to focus too much into the center channel (less so with music mode but still too much for my taste) with music, but is more focused for TV or movies.
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post #5 of 28 Old 01-11-2007, 07:17 AM
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I am told PLIIx has a host of parameters for changing the sound stage when When PLIIx music is selected. I have not tried this yet, does Logic 7 have something similar?
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post #6 of 28 Old 01-11-2007, 09:16 AM
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I have always preferred 7-channel "stereo". Yamaha has it, and I believe Denon does as well.

It sounds better to me than any other processing on CD sources.

Nothing makes FM sound good, but I think I found some DSP mode on my Yamaha called Roxy Theater that was tolerable.

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post #7 of 28 Old 01-11-2007, 09:20 AM
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I second 7-channel stereo.

I've never heard Logic 7 but I prefer 7 channel stereo over PL II..
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post #8 of 28 Old 01-11-2007, 09:25 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by collin View Post

PLIIx seems to focus too much into the center channel (less so with music mode but still too much for my taste) with music,

The width parameter allows you to vary that. At one extreme all the sound is from L&R and zero center. At the other extreme it's all center and no L&R.

Ed
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post #9 of 28 Old 01-11-2007, 09:28 AM
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That is cool, thanks for that additional information. I really need to play with that some. I used to be a 7 channel sereo person with my old Denon, but now with the new AVR, DPLIIx as well as other softwares available seem to be doing a much better job with it. I still use the multi-channel stereo modes some though as well.
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post #10 of 28 Old 01-11-2007, 09:28 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MichaelJHuman View Post

I have always preferred 7-channel "stereo".

Don't you guys find that the imaging is all messed up? Vocals that belong in the front get smeared across the room.

Ed
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post #11 of 28 Old 01-11-2007, 09:30 AM
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Well, you can pull everything front and center with channel levels, so generally I did not find that an issue. But, as we all should understand, it is an audio no no to have all those speakers reproducing the same signal in your room. never the less I say what ever modes work for you, work for you, and you should not hesitate to use modes that work well for you.
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post #12 of 28 Old 01-11-2007, 09:33 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JOHNnDENVER View Post

I am told PLIIx has a host of parameters for changing the sound stage when When PLIIx music is selected. I have not tried this yet, does Logic 7 have something similar?

I believe that Logic 7 has a mode where the center channel can be filled in using *5.1* material. That would be great for all those concert DVDs that often don't put anything in the center channel of a 5.1 mix. I'm wondering whether the sound that is used to fill the center is removed fron the L&R - Sanjay (or anyone) do you know?

Ed
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post #13 of 28 Old 01-11-2007, 09:56 AM
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Ed,

Centre steering with 5.1 material is standard for all LOGIC7 modes. It basically grabs any correlated (in-phase) mono content in the front L&R channels and moves it to the centre speaker, where it is combined with any discrete centre channel content that might already be there. Essentially anything that would have phantom imaged in the centre of the front soundstage will end up coming out of the centre speaker.

Sanjay

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post #14 of 28 Old 01-11-2007, 10:35 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Xaroe View Post

just wondering wich 2.0 surround conversion was best

In my experience with 2-channel sources: L7 tends to be a little more exciting (larger front soundstage, better wrap-around envelopment). PLIIx tends to be a little more stable (precise directionality, fewer steering artifacts).

After much back and forth comparison, I gave up trying to figure out which was "best". Both did certain things well, so I just used them based on their strengths.

For all my 2-channel movie/TV watching, I use PLIIx. For 2-channel music, I always use L7.

Sanjay

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post #15 of 28 Old 01-11-2007, 12:56 PM
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I'll admit it. I'm an addict. To L7.

L7 music mode is preferable to PLiiX to me. The soundstage is wider. Its hard to describe. Actually, its not now that I think about it. On good clean recordings it anchors vocals in the middle and pulls the instruments and soundstage out left and right and slightly wraps it around. The key here is the quality of the recording. If its an older or badly mastered cd the soundstage falls apart.

2 channel is preferable for some things, but for me L7 is great for cleanly mastered 2ch music.
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post #16 of 28 Old 07-28-2008, 01:52 PM
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I know this is an old thread, but was wondering if you all prefer prologic IIx for movies that are not 7.1 mixed. I'm selling my Lexicon MC-1 to get into the Yamaha RX-v663...yeah, i know it's a "downgrade", but I'm hoping to hear better results from the new HD sound schemes thru my PS3 via HDMI...FYI, my main concern is movies...

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post #17 of 28 Old 07-28-2008, 02:26 PM
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I use PLIIx for 5.1 movies and I am happy with it. I think it sounds as good as any other mode available to me (RX-V2700.)

"But this one goes up to 11"
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post #18 of 28 Old 07-28-2008, 03:19 PM
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Michael,
Have you heard Logic 7?

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post #19 of 28 Old 07-28-2008, 04:51 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by collin View Post

I find Logic7 to be better for music because it spreads things out from the center more and is stronger in the bass. PLIIx seems to focus too much into the center channel (less so with music mode but still too much for my taste) with music, but is more focused for TV or movies.

QFT
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post #20 of 28 Old 07-28-2008, 04:52 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MichaelJHuman View Post

I use PLIIx for 5.1 movies and I am happy with it. I think it sounds as good as any other mode available to me (RX-V2700.)

As I'm aiming for the 354 I'll settle with this too but for stereo music listening I strictly prefer L7 over anything else.
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post #21 of 28 Old 07-28-2008, 05:35 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KBMAN View Post

was wondering if you all prefer prologic IIx for movies that are not 7.1 mixed

I do, because its steering in the surround field is a little more directional than L7. For example: if a sound is isolated in the left surround channel, PLIIx will play it directly at your left side while L7 will play it along the left wall. The latter sounds nice when listening to music, where I want a more subtle 7.1 effect. But I prefer PLIIx for movies, where pin-point localization is more helpful. I'm exaggerating the differences to make my point, but you get the general idea.

Sanjay

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post #22 of 28 Old 07-28-2008, 06:12 PM
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thanks you guys!!

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post #23 of 28 Old 07-28-2008, 06:56 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KBMAN View Post

Michael,
Have you heard Logic 7?

No, unfortunately. Seems to be on higher priced receivers than I have yet to buy

"But this one goes up to 11"
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post #24 of 28 Old 07-29-2008, 04:16 AM
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i like dts neo music
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post #25 of 28 Old 07-29-2008, 06:38 AM
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ditto!
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post #26 of 28 Old 07-29-2008, 06:48 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ekb View Post

Don't you guys find that the imaging is all messed up? Vocals that belong in the front get smeared across the room.

Ed

Yep, it should be called 7ch mono, since each speaker is playing the same signal

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post #27 of 28 Old 07-29-2008, 07:22 AM
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For movie/TV watching, I use PLIIx.

My mom works for Sony, and she brought home a copy of "Starhawk BETA"
I quickly slipped it into my trusty PS3, and started playing.


GOOZEX Game/Movie Exchange
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post #28 of 28 Old 07-30-2008, 10:26 AM
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I was pretty unimpressed with DPLiix. I even turned off all the other speakers once to hear what was being steered to the 2 rear channels and it was a pretty subtle, mostly mono mix.

Now I have Logic 7 and the side and rear surrounds are totally enveloping with excellent directional effects. Also, L7 alters the front 3 speakers, whereas DPLiix doesn't touch them at all.

For music I found DPLiix to be rather laid back with a "horseshoe" sort of soundfield. L7 is way more adjustable anywhere from subtle right up to being among the instruments. The parameters let you tailor the sort of soundfield you like. DPLiix's parameters are too limited (panarama on/off, "dimension", center width).

Overall I found DPLiix to be such a minor improvement, and all it did most of the time was to fill in the back area of the surround field.

For me, L7 blows DPLiix away.
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