"Official" Audyssey thread (FAQ in post #51779) - Page 16 - AVS Forum
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post #451 of 71857 Old 12-17-2007, 10:03 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Audio View Post

Plus it's adjusted by a machine that can't tell it's head from it's ass.

No machine can. It's the software the machine runs that makes those adjustments, and the people creating the software that decide what to adjust. That's like believing that auto-focus can't work in cameras because they're dumb machines.

Jeremy and Tim already pointed out where your beliefs about EQ differs from what Audyssey is doing, so no need for me to repeat their comments. Aside from reading up on the room correction technologies that Tim mentioned (Audyssey, Trinnov, Lyngdorf/TaCT), you should also look into how Meridian and Lexicon do correction for multiple seating locations.

Sanjay

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post #452 of 71857 Old 12-17-2007, 10:27 AM
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Originally Posted by John Ballentine View Post

The owners manual says EQ is set by Audyssey. What does this mean then?

Who knows? It probably means that Audyssey is an EQ but Audyssey is not the simple graphic EQ that is displayed.

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post #453 of 71857 Old 12-17-2007, 10:36 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pepar View Post

In most rooms, room treatments - alone - will get you closer than Audyssey alone. Can Audyssey improve the sound AFTER room treatments are used. Sure, I'll buy that. (Apparently, I'll have no choice but to "buy" it as all of the latest gear has it built-in.) My problem is not with Audyssey, it is with the mad rush that has most people forgetting EQ's proper place in achieving the best sound possible.

I don't think that the "mad rush" has obscured the necessity for room design and room treatment.

I have been hanging around here for a while and most of the system photos posted (aside from those of dedicated, purpose-designed rooms) clearly show a lack of attention (intentional or otherwise) to acoustical issues. And this is here in this hotbed of discussion about acoustics! Outside, for the unwashed, acoustics are even more rarely addressed. The vast majority of Audyssey users have never considered and never will consider dealing with acoustics. As a result, the modest improvement that Audyssey can make under such poor circumstances is all they will ever get and, for that, they are probably grateful.

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post #454 of 71857 Old 12-17-2007, 10:53 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pepar View Post

In most rooms, room treatments - alone - will get you closer than Audyssey alone. Can Audyssey improve the sound AFTER room treatments are used. Sure, I'll buy that. (Apparently, I'll have no choice but to "buy" it as all of the latest gear has it built-in.) My problem is not with Audyssey, it is with the mad rush that has most people forgetting EQ's proper place in achieving the best sound possible.

Well, I think the addition of Audyssey to consumer gear is a plus for the average Joe Six-Pack, in that it will likely get them closer to correct than they ever would have taken the time to do themselves. And then for those of us who are enthusiasts who cruise A\\V forums like this, it's another tool we can use in addition to our other knowledge on proper setup and room treatment. And like damn near everything else with audio, there is a learning curve involved if you really want to use that tool properly.

But as I said before, there is no magic bullet... and Audyssey doesn't intend MultEQ XT to be one. For those who take the time to get the intended results from it, however, it is a nice addition to consumer grade gear. I got my Onkyo 705 for less than $500... and I can honestly say that the inclusion of MultEQ XT for that price makes that one of the biggest steals of a deal I've ever gotten since I got into this hobby.

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post #455 of 71857 Old 12-17-2007, 01:19 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jeremy Anderson View Post

Well, I think the addition of Audyssey to consumer gear is a plus for the average Joe Six-Pack, in that it will likely get them closer to correct than they ever would have taken the time to do themselves. And then for those of us who are enthusiasts who cruise A\\V forums like this, it's another tool we can use in addition to our other knowledge on proper setup and room treatment. And like damn near everything else with audio, there is a learning curve involved if you really want to use that tool properly.

But as I said before, there is no magic bullet... and Audyssey doesn't intend MultEQ XT to be one. For those who take the time to get the intended results from it, however, it is a nice addition to consumer grade gear. I got my Onkyo 705 for less than $500... and I can honestly say that the inclusion of MultEQ XT for that price makes that one of the biggest steals of a deal I've ever gotten since I got into this hobby.

Perhaps I should go back and take some of the negativity out of my hissy post. I do *want* it to work. I plan on ordering a OP 885 in Jan and while I have acoustical treatments (and plan SSC-style bass traps also in Jan), I have my center channel speaker (M&K S-150AC) behind an acoustically transparent screen that I have not been able to EQ to the L&R speakers (presently NOT behind the screen). I have a Rane 1/3oct graphic EQ and have spent a lot of time trying. I would love for Audyssey to take care of that.
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post #456 of 71857 Old 12-17-2007, 02:09 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pepar View Post

Perhaps I should go back and take some of the negativity out of my hissy post. I do *want* it to work. I plan on ordering a OP 885 in Jan and while I have acoustical treatments (and plan SSC-style bass traps also in Jan), I have my center channel speaker (M&K S-150AC) behind an acoustically transparent screen that I have not been able to EQ to the L&R speakers (presently NOT behind the screen). I have a Rane 1/3oct graphic EQ and have spent a lot of time trying. I would love for Audyssey to take care of that.

It will help.

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post #457 of 71857 Old 12-17-2007, 02:48 PM
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I'm impressed. This weekend, I silenced my AV room, and re-ran the Audyssey EQ using 8 listening positions. I checked the EQ curve using my receiver's GUI. It has many more 'bars' on the curve than 9. I also have an Infinity R.A.B.O.S. kit consisting of a sound meter, test disk, graph paper, etc. I set the receiver to the 'Direct' mode canceling any equalization enhancement and any surround sound. I set the meter on a tripod in front of my main listening position. Using the test disk, I set the receiver so that I was measuring -10dB on the meter using a test tone. The CD then ran through about 23 frequencies from 100Hz to 20Hz, and I measured the amount of Db each frequency produced. If my room was 'anechoically' perfect, I would expect a fairly flat response (+ or -3dB for instance from the -10dB setting). Instead, starting at about 66Hz, there was a rather large spike that went to 0dB and stayed there for about 3 measurements, and then dropped back down towards -10dB. Clearly, the room was 'attenuating' these frequencies. I plotted the measurements on the graph paper (it appeared to be semi-logarithmic). I then compared the graph to the Audyssey equalization curve, and they were exact mirror images of each other. In other words, the Audyssey equalization was attempting to compensate for all of the frequency spikes I manually measured in the 100Hz to 20Hz range. A nice confirmation of its measurements and math.

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post #458 of 71857 Old 12-18-2007, 10:31 AM
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"A nice confirmation of its measurements and math."

How about the sound?

Noah
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post #459 of 71857 Old 12-18-2007, 11:37 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by javry View Post

so how does it sound?

Quote:
Originally Posted by noah katz View Post

How about the sound?

Why aren't people answering these question?

Sanjay

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post #460 of 71857 Old 12-18-2007, 01:15 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sdurani View Post

Why aren't people answering these question?

Sanjay

Because it's a waste of time because preferences are so...subjective?
One person's "What detail!" is another's "Can't stand that brightness", or "Full, warm sound" vs. "What is that boomy bass?!?"

That's probably not the reason, but as you can tell, I don't think sound quality reports are of much use.

Of course, that's just my highly subjective opinion
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post #461 of 71857 Old 12-18-2007, 01:22 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sdurani View Post

Why aren't people answering these question?

Sanjay

I'll give you an answer: Before Audyssey, my speakers had their own little characteristics that I had grown accustomed to. I'm not running anything particularly high-end; my setup is Polk RTi70 mains, CSi40 center, 4 RTi28 surrounds and a SVS 20-39CS+ sub with Samson 1000 amp. Highs would occasionally sound "squeaky", especially with horns, which is just something I was used to from the Polks. Also, I was using an outboard EQ to flatten out room-induced peaks with my subwoofer, though I was never completely satisfied with the results. No matter what I did, I ended up with a giant null in the 50-65Hz range at my main seating position, but pretty flat response at the other seats.

Then I changed out my Onkyo 604 for the Onkyo 705 with MultEQ XT. Post-Audyssey, horns no longer have that harshness to them and sound very restrained (and more realistic), though I don't know whether that's due to the rolloff of the high end due to the Audyssey target curve or equalization done by MultEQ XT. I ended up zeroing my EQ and only using it as a subsonic filter around 20Hz (to complement the tuning of my sub - I have a Buttkicker LFE under the couch helping below that), because Audyssey handled my problems with low frequencies nicely. I'm now only around -3dB from my baseline where that null used to be, and have a much smoother and flatter response curve than I was getting with manual EQ'ing (not only from my main seat but from the others as well, which is sweet!). Makes me think I was previously having phase issues that distance/delay couldn't work out, but whatever Audyssey did seemed to snap things into place. Either that or it just shifted the null somewhere in between the coarse 1/3 octave measurements I was taking, but I certainly don't hear it. Your mileage may vary.

Subjectively, bass guitar is now more even in level across its range, and individual tones are easier to delineate. I listen to a little bluegrass in between punk and hardcore, and was very pleased with how much "sweeter" a sound Audyssey gave me with acoustic instruments. With movies, speaker-to-speaker pans sound far more cohesive (though I did tweak surround distances using DVE's tones located between speakers to really make sidewall imaging snap into the space between speakers) and the overall sound is just fuller and more natural to my ears. After switching out my analog connections for HDMI from my Panny S97, I threw a couple of DVD-Audio discs at it and was VERY pleased at the details I was hearing.

After all of that, I tried doing some quick A/B with Audyssey on and off. With it disengaged, that familiar squeak to horns returned, and bass was generally looser sounding. The overall sound without Audyssey was brighter (presumably because of the Audyssey curve's rolloff), but I definitely hear more detail with it engaged. All in all, it's one of the best things to happen to my speakers and my room.

That answer your question?

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post #462 of 71857 Old 12-18-2007, 01:39 PM
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Originally Posted by Jeremy Anderson View Post

All in all, it's one of the best things to happen to my speakers and my room.

That answer your question?

Thank you for your observations!
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post #463 of 71857 Old 12-18-2007, 02:29 PM
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I have a Denon 4806 (with the firmware update) and have recently rewired my speakers. When I run Audyssey it cannot "find" my left sourround and hangs up trying to send the tones. I've checked the wires. Also when I run the manual setup the offending speaker comes through loud and clear. Anyone else have this problem? Suggestions on its cause and remedy would be welcome. Thanks
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post #464 of 71857 Old 12-18-2007, 07:01 PM
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Originally Posted by noah katz View Post

"A nice confirmation of its measurements and math."

How about the sound?

The sound is memorizing. I did change all of the speakers to small (its a 7.1 system), the crossover to 80Hz and I increased the bass (I like bass). I've sat for literally hours and have been amazed at what I hear. If I relax and close my eyes, the speakers disappear and I'm enveloped in sound. It's pure and every instrument is there.

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post #465 of 71857 Old 12-18-2007, 08:29 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lik2hvfun View Post

The sound is memorizing. I did change all of the speakers to small (its a 7.1 system), the crossover to 80Hz and I increased the bass (I like bass). I've sat for literally hours and have been amazed at what I hear. If I relax and close my eyes, the speakers disappear and I'm enveloped in sound. It's pure and every instrument is there.

are you speaking about audio in movies....or music?
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post #466 of 71857 Old 12-18-2007, 08:35 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jeremy Anderson View Post

I'll give you an answer: Before Audyssey, my speakers had their own little characteristics that I had grown accustomed to. I'm not running anything particularly high-end; my setup is Polk RTi70 mains, CSi40 center, 4 RTi28 surrounds and a SVS 20-39CS+ sub with Samson 1000 amp. Highs would occasionally sound "squeaky", especially with horns, which is just something I was used to from the Polks. Also, I was using an outboard EQ to flatten out room-induced peaks with my subwoofer, though I was never completely satisfied with the results. No matter what I did, I ended up with a giant null in the 50-65Hz range at my main seating position, but pretty flat response at the other seats.

Then I changed out my Onkyo 604 for the Onkyo 705 with MultEQ XT. Post-Audyssey, horns no longer have that harshness to them and sound very restrained (and more realistic), though I don't know whether that's due to the rolloff of the high end due to the Audyssey target curve or equalization done by MultEQ XT. I ended up zeroing my EQ and only using it as a subsonic filter around 20Hz (to complement the tuning of my sub - I have a Buttkicker LFE under the couch helping below that), because Audyssey handled my problems with low frequencies nicely. I'm now only around -3dB from my baseline where that null used to be, and have a much smoother and flatter response curve than I was getting with manual EQ'ing (not only from my main seat but from the others as well, which is sweet!). Makes me think I was previously having phase issues that distance/delay couldn't work out, but whatever Audyssey did seemed to snap things into place. Either that or it just shifted the null somewhere in between the coarse 1/3 octave measurements I was taking, but I certainly don't hear it. Your mileage may vary.

Subjectively, bass guitar is now more even in level across its range, and individual tones are easier to delineate. I listen to a little bluegrass in between punk and hardcore, and was very pleased with how much "sweeter" a sound Audyssey gave me with acoustic instruments. With movies, speaker-to-speaker pans sound far more cohesive (though I did tweak surround distances using DVE's tones located between speakers to really make sidewall imaging snap into the space between speakers) and the overall sound is just fuller and more natural to my ears. After switching out my analog connections for HDMI from my Panny S97, I threw a couple of DVD-Audio discs at it and was VERY pleased at the details I was hearing.

After all of that, I tried doing some quick A/B with Audyssey on and off. With it disengaged, that familiar squeak to horns returned, and bass was generally looser sounding. The overall sound without Audyssey was brighter (presumably because of the Audyssey curve's rolloff), but I definitely hear more detail with it engaged. All in all, it's one of the best things to happen to my speakers and my room.

That answer your question?

yep...it sure does. If I understand all you said, it sounds like there's a few things missing from the the way your system sounded before but the sacrifice comes with benefits that optimized your system toward a fuller sound with more detail and overall appeal.
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post #467 of 71857 Old 12-18-2007, 09:04 PM
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Jeremy, lik2hvfun,

Thanks, that's more like it

Noah
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post #468 of 71857 Old 12-18-2007, 10:15 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fyzziks View Post

That's probably not the reason, but as you can tell, I don't think sound quality reports are of much use.

I was simply curious about people's thoughts before and after Audyssey, like in the post right after your's...
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That answer your question?

Spectacularly. Much appreciated Jeremy.

Sanjay

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post #469 of 71857 Old 12-19-2007, 08:06 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by javry View Post

are you speaking about audio in movies....or music?

I spend most of my time listening to music. After I ran the Audyssey setup, besides changing the bass and crossover, I set it to bypass front L/R and reduced the front left, center and right channels by .5dB because I wanted to hear a little more of the surround affect. These are all my own personal tastes, and having the ability to 'fine tune' the Audyssey settings is another feature I really appreciate.

For movies, I've watched 'Terminator 3' and 'Independence Day' among others. I understand that for movies it's better to change the 'bypass front L/R' back to the original Audyssey setting, but I didn't do that. I simply changed the Dolby Pro Logic setting from 'music' to 'movie'. Again, the sound was fantastic. My only observation is that my SW drops off the very low frequencies more prevalent in movie sound than in music. That's a function of the SW and has nothing to do with Audyssey.

All in all, the entire sound stage is beyond what I thought I could achieve in a family room with all of its restraints to accurately reproducing perfect sound. There's really nothing I can do about the room. However, IMHO, Audyssey can.

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post #470 of 71857 Old 12-19-2007, 08:41 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lik2hvfun View Post

My only observation is that my SW drops off the very low frequencies more prevalent in movie sound than in music. That's a function of the SW and has nothing to do with Audyssey.


Are you sure it's not Audessy? Try turning it on and off during a movie and see if you notice a difference in the low SW frequencies. That is the one thing keeping me form using it. I didn't spend alot on a good sub that can hit below 20Hz to have that rolled off. It has been noted that Audessy seems to be rolling off some of the lower bass frequencies that an "average" sub might not be reproducing anyway, but for those of us with subs that can it is a problem.
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post #471 of 71857 Old 12-19-2007, 09:47 AM
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Hi,

It makes now 3 weeks that I received my Onkyo 905B ordered July 04th. Yes it is so extremely difficult to get this product in EU... and I was lucky. It's replacing a Pio AX10, TX59 in US.

My setup consist of 5* Tannoy Pro S800 as LCR + BL/BR and 2* KEF TDM34DS THX Ultra dipoles as SL/SR. The sub is a (single) JBL Pro 4645c + QSC DCA1222 amp + Velodyne SMS1. The BL/BR are close together Ã* la THX Ultra2.

The Audissey setup was made on 8 measures as our listening/watching couch is for 4 people. So 1 + 3 measures were made on the couch (ear height) and 4 symetricaly 60cm in front of the previous measures (also ear height).

The speaker configuration was modified for a global 80/THX cross over for all channels.

And the end result is just simply fabulous!!!

In fact in the installation described above, the speakers completely "disappear". The sound that you hear doesn't come from a localisable speaker source, it's coming from "somewhere" in the air above.

This is the case in plain Stereo (with Audyssey) where in fact the "scene" is located in the Front beyond the speakers, but also on the sides, largely in front of the speaker axis.

I have to add that for this test I used my "old faithfull" Pio CLD925 LaserDisc player with a Toslink connexion.

Anyway during this session I also tried the rare Woodstock LD, something I haven't watched for a long time now, and oh boy, oh boy, TYA, Santana and Jimi Hendrix in THX Neural Surround, waouw! OK the initial distorsion is omni present, but who cares as the immersion is complete.

Concerning the 5.1 surround reproduction (with Audyssey), the source is a Tosh XE1, A2 in US I guess, HDMI linked. All sound processing is made by the Onkyo 905, listening in THX Ultra2 Cinema mode or eventually THX Surround EX (Harry Potter)

During "Top Gun" in DD+ (English Version), at the beginning you are simply on the deck with the F14s, the integration of the sub is total, and during the take off one is in the cockpit asking himself why he's watching behind... anyway it's really lifelike.

In HP2/Chamber of Secrets in THX Surround EX mode (this is the way it is encoded), during the last scenes with ths basilisk, you easily turn your head left/right/up to make sure and see that it eventually doesn't come up.

As you can see here, all this speaks of "reality" and how one can perceive the reproduction of "life" burried in a recording.

Who does the major part, is it Audyssey, or Onkyo, or the speakers, or the installation, I don't know exactly. But what I can say, is that since I changed the amplifier and made the Audyssey setup, it's all here, and this is what finally counts.

Hugo

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post #472 of 71857 Old 12-19-2007, 09:53 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by curlyjive View Post

Are you sure it's not Audessy? Try turning it on and off during a movie and see if you notice a difference in the low SW frequencies. That is the one thing keeping me form using it. I didn't spend alot on a good sub that can hit below 20Hz to have that rolled off. It has been noted that Audessy seems to be rolling off some of the lower bass frequencies that an "average" sub might not be reproducing anyway, but for those of us with subs that can it is a problem.

I see people talking about Audyssey rolling off the low end, but I'm not seeing that in my room. My sub (SVS 20-39CS+) is port-tuned to around 18Hz... and turning Audyssey on and off has little to no effect in the 20-30Hz range. I do run an in-line subsonic filter at around 18Hz to prevent driver bottoming and reduce the odds of port unloading, but I still get significant output down toward 12Hz. I certainly don't get a LACK of deep end, and I actually had to back my Buttkicker's gain down a bit after Audyssey to make it mesh better with my sub.

To my knowledge, Audyssey shouldn't inherently roll off the low end unless your initial mic positions are too close to room boundaries, where boundary gain will be the root cause. If your first three readings are within 12-18" or so of your back wall, it's very likely that Audyssey will attempt to excessively cut the very low end. That isn't a weakness of Audyssey itself as much as something you have to keep in mind with your mic placement. Also, if you run positions 4-6 a foot or two further into the room than positions 1-3, MultEQ XT should even things out since it will get a better idea of how bass interacts with the room further away from the room boundaries.

I will say, however, that most people are used to typical in-room response, with all the room-induced gain that comes along with it. The average Joe would hear a sub with flat in-room response and think it was subjectively lacking in bass... despite the fact that it is accurately reproducing the low end. In fact, I'd say that most people's disappointment with post-Audyssey bass response stems either from poor mic setup or just generally being accustomed to the typical room-induced gain of most setups. For me, however, it wasn't as wide a gulf, since I had EQ'd for pretty flat response long before Audyssey and was accustomed to how flattened in-room response sounds.

Just a thought. YMMV.

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post #473 of 71857 Old 12-19-2007, 01:54 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by curlyjive View Post

Are you sure it's not Audessy? Try turning it on and off during a movie and see if you notice a difference in the low SW frequencies. That is the one thing keeping me form using it. I didn't spend alot on a good sub that can hit below 20Hz to have that rolled off. It has been noted that Audessy seems to be rolling off some of the lower bass frequencies that an "average" sub might not be reproducing anyway, but for those of us with subs that can it is a problem.

I don't have the data in front of me at the moment, but when I measured the dB response starting at about 28Hz to 20Hz I noticed a 'sharp' drop off using a test disk with the system set to Direct w/o Audyssey. This is just the nature of the SW I have. I'll get the numbers tonight when I'm home. Just for grins and giggles, I'll measure the entire 100Hz to 20Hz test tones again with the Audyssey turned on to see if it was able to compensate for my lousy room acoustics. I have to set a base level lower than -10dB since it warns that tones produced during the test could damage smaller speakers.

In the meantime, the bass now sounds more 'even' without the lower frequencies being 'overshadowed'. (My terms.) They come through very nicely and it's always a pleasant surprise to hear them, say in smooth jazz or something more contemporary. Since there's so much sound in a movie, they aren't as noticable to me. Perhaps it's time for a couple of Buttkickers.

On a side note, a friend loaned me an Intersound Mozart 'Surround Sound' CD. It says the music was 'captured in all-digital Surrournd Sound.' It has no Dolby, DTS or any other trademark notice on it and is dated 1993. I'm going to see what it sounds like tonight when I get home as well.

The Devil's in the Details
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post #474 of 71857 Old 12-20-2007, 08:09 AM
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Originally Posted by pepar View Post

Perhaps I should go back and take some of the negativity out of my hissy post. I do *want* it to work. I plan on ordering a OP 885 in Jan and while I have acoustical treatments (and plan SSC-style bass traps also in Jan), I have my center channel speaker (M&K S-150AC) behind an acoustically transparent screen that I have not been able to EQ to the L&R speakers (presently NOT behind the screen). I have a Rane 1/3oct graphic EQ and have spent a lot of time trying. I would love for Audyssey to take care of that.

I have a similar set-up. I have S-150's all the way around with the center channel hidden away. After I understood how to best take advantage of it, I found Audyssey is great! My center matches my Left/Right almost perfectly and the surrounds sound so much more natural.

In Spider-Man 3 there is a scene where there is a marching band and Peter spins around while marching to the music. It used to bother me that the drums changed sonic character so much as the sound panned all the way around the room to each speaker in the system (and this is with five identical speakers!). After Audyssey, the pan is smooth and seamless.

My system is so neutral now. Music sounds better than ever too. Vocals are clear and imaging is awesome. I love it! In the beginning, I would switch it on and off just to hear what it was doing to different material but now I just leave it on because I know it sounds better. I am hooked. It really makes a difference. Try it!

Mike
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post #475 of 71857 Old 12-20-2007, 11:28 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BigPines View Post

I have a similar set-up. I have S-150's all the way around with the center channel hidden away. After I understood how to best take advantage of it, I found Audyssey is great! My center matches my Left/Right almost perfectly and the surrounds sound so much more natural.

In Spider-Man 3 there is a scene where there is a marching band and Peter spins around while marching to the music. It used to bother me that the drums changed sonic character so much as the sound panned all the way around the room to each speaker in the system (and this is with five identical speakers!). After Audyssey, the pan is smooth and seamless.

My system is so neutral now. Music sounds better than ever too. Vocals are clear and imaging is awesome. I love it! In the beginning, I would switch it on and off just to hear what it was doing to different material but now I just leave it on because I know it sounds better. I am hooked. It really makes a difference. Try it!

Mike

Thank you. It is this kind of comment that I am looking for.
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post #476 of 71857 Old 12-21-2007, 08:11 AM
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I have an Integra 8.8 and have run the Audyssey setup. It sounds pretty good, but was wondering if anyone has had the pro calibration done on their system. If so...what do you think? To others...do you think it is worth consideration? My dealer said it would cost $500 to have a cetified tech come to do the work. I am using Def Tec Mythos 1 fronts...center and rears...super cube 1 sub. With paradigm in-walls for back center in my 7.1. setup. Input is appreciated!

Dale
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post #477 of 71857 Old 12-22-2007, 07:58 AM
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I have an Audyssey Sound Equaliser and with the Pro kit completed one provisional setting-up session of 10 position readings around a 2-seat listening area. No doubt, with experience, further sessions will improve on the result but firstly I would appreciate some advice from experienced users, particularly anyone also using the Linn Unidisk SC Player, a unit incorporating a pre-amplifier/surround processor which has limited adjustments.

Although the SC Player only provides for two alternative crossover choices for the speakers, Large or Small, the Audyssey confirmed large for all 5 speakers and the distances were also spot-on so that seemed to be satisfactory. My query relates to how to apply the dB recommendations which were as follows:

Left and Right Fronts: 10.4 dB
Centre: 8.9 dB
Left and Right Surround: 5.4 dB

I've ignored the sub here because being an active unit running off a low level input it can be adjusted for gain prior to future runs.

I don't understand the relevance of the main speaker trim figures of 10.4 dB. What is that relative to? Surely, the master gain control sets the level of the main speakers (left/right front) and it is the relationship of the others to the fronts that need the adjustment? Certainly the SC Player has trim settings only for the centre, surround and sub.

But how to use these figures? Should I, for example, be setting the other speakers at the relative differences, e.g. the centre at -1.5 db relative to the fronts, and surrounds at -5 dB relative to the fronts?

Also, the SC Player has trim ranges for the centre, surrounds and sub of -10 to +10 but no dB relationship. What is one to do in these circumstances?

Could someone please enlighten me?

Terry
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post #478 of 71857 Old 12-22-2007, 02:26 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Betwixt View Post

Although the SC Player only provides for two alternative crossover choices for the speakers, Large or Small, the Audyssey confirmed large for all 5 speakers and the distances were also spot-on so that seemed to be satisfactory.

You can reset the speakers to SMALL if that is more appropriate for you.

Quote:


I don't understand the relevance of the main speaker trim figures of 10.4 dB. What is that relative to? Surely, the master gain control sets the level of the main speakers (left/right front) and it is the relationship of the others to the fronts that need the adjustment? Certainly the SC Player has trim settings only for the centre, surround and sub.

These settings will maintain the relevance of the dB calibrations on the control unit/display.

Quote:


But how to use these figures? Should I, for example, be setting the other speakers at the relative differences, e.g. the centre at -1.5 db relative to the fronts, and surrounds at -5 dB relative to the fronts?

Either setting the differentials or the absolute settings will work but the latter is better for the above reason.

Quote:


Also, the SC Player has trim ranges for the centre, surrounds and sub of -10 to +10 but no dB relationship. What is one to do in these circumstances?

One usually presumes that these are in dB but you would have to ask Linn for confirmation.

Kal Rubinson

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post #479 of 71857 Old 12-22-2007, 02:33 PM
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Geesh can someone give me some advice on proper sub setup with Audyssey. I know a great deal about HT and did not experience this same weird behavior with my Denon 3806 or 2807. I currently have an Onkyo 875 and HSU 3.3, Audyssey calculated the sub as being 24 feet away (it's actually 11ft) and -2.5db on the output level (that's about right). I used Audyssey correctly; 8 locations, tripod and dead silence however my sub seems to be non existent in the lower frequencies. I have the gain turned about 20%. Advise, please......

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post #480 of 71857 Old 12-22-2007, 02:42 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lrstevens421 View Post

Audyssey calculated the sub as being 24 feet away (it's actually 11ft)

As has been stated and posted n times: The Audyssey measurement is correct since it takes into account the phase and delays due to processing and filters.

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