"Official" Audyssey thread (FAQ in post #51779) - Page 2400 - AVS Forum
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post #71971 of 72378 Old 08-11-2014, 09:39 AM
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And if I hadn't posted then I would have not learned something new

Quote:
Originally Posted by Alan P View Post

The correct way to do it is with external tones (downloaded, from disc, REW, etc.), that way you are hearing the tones through Audyssey.



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post #71972 of 72378 Old 08-11-2014, 09:59 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Alan P View Post

If you are setting your speakers to 75db using the AVRs internal test tones, your levels are not correct (in relation to reference level) as the internal tones bypass Audyssey's filters.

The correct way to do it is with external tones (downloaded, from disc, REW, etc.), that way you are hearing the tones through Audyssey.

All that being said, it ain't gonna rip a hole in the space-time continuum or anything.
Hi Alan,

Actually the test tones do not bypass the MultEQ filters, but are in a block that comes after the MultEQ block.

Here's a Q & A I had with Chris Kyriakakis on FB on the subject:

Me: Hi Chris, just a short Q. While playing test tones (-30 dBfs, 500 Hz-2kHz band limited pink noise) off a test CD and Audyssey is turned ON and OFF will the meter (C-weighted) show different SPL levels at the MLP? Thanks in advance. Cheers, Feri



  • Chris Kyriakakis Hi Feri, yes it's possible when using a CD. It will depend on how much work the MultEQ filter is doing in that region.

  • Ferenc Mógor How about when using the AVR's internal test tones? AFAIK, the AVR turns off Audyssey filters diring test tone rendering, but leaves the channel trims and distances intact. Thank again.

  • Chris Kyriakakis That's right. The internal test tones don't see the filters so you will get the same answer with Audyssey on and off.

  • Ferenc Mógor Ok, thanks. Lastly. So, for absolute SPL (75 dB) at the MLP which one is the valid test, an external CD with test tones and Audyssey ON, or the internal test tones without Audyssey filters?

  • Chris Kyriakakis If you are absolutely certain that the external CD was properly recorded (there are some that are not--particularly DVDs that have messed up the dialnorm setting), then that's the way to go. Because of this uncertainty, however, we always recommend to go with the internal test tone if you want to check.

  • Ferenc Mógor I see, and understand the worry about external "stuff", but in case of the internal test tones what is the rationale for turning off Audyssey if the MultEQ filters have a job there. Am I far from reality with my conclusion that in this narrow 500 Hz-2 kHz band a typical room will only show subtle differences with MultEQ filters ON or OFF? At least it will be somewhere within the +/- 2dB tolerance range of an average SPL meter due to a region free of room modes not like the bass department.

  • Chris Kyriakakis It's not that MultEQ is turned off. It's because the AVR has the test noise in a block that comes after MultEQ and so it doesn't see the filters. We have asked for this many times, but it's apparently too complicated for them to make the change in the architecture.

Hope this helps clear the subject.
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Last edited by mogorf; 08-11-2014 at 10:02 AM.
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post #71973 of 72378 Old 08-11-2014, 10:00 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Alan P View Post
You knew it was coming.



If you are setting your speakers to 75db using the AVRs internal test tones, your levels are not correct (in relation to reference level) as the internal tones bypass Audyssey's filters.



The correct way to do it is with external tones (downloaded, from disc, REW, etc.), that way you are hearing the tones through Audyssey.



All that being said, it ain't gonna rip a hole in the space-time continuum or anything.


The problem I came across trying to use the external tones on a disk was that neither disk I have does more than the standard 7.1. I don't use backs since I'm against a wall, but have heights and wides. So I used the disk for 5.1 and guesstimated for the heights and wides based on the levels for the mains. Sounds really good, but without a disk that incorporates heights and wides I don't see another option.
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post #71974 of 72378 Old 08-11-2014, 10:19 AM
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Well it didn't sound off while using the internal test tones but always room to learn. Thanks for all the info/support

Quote:
Originally Posted by mogorf View Post
Hi Alan,

Actually the test tones do not bypass the MultEQ filters, but are in a block that comes after the MultEQ block...



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post #71975 of 72378 Old 08-11-2014, 10:23 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bigham16 View Post
Well it didn't sound off while using the internal test tones but always room to learn. Thanks for all the info/support
Not at all.
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post #71976 of 72378 Old 08-11-2014, 12:36 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mgrotel View Post
Thanks, but I am a little confused on how adjusting the trim levels does NOT affect the calibration. I honestly do not understand how it cannot affect it. For example, in an extreme case, if I set the front right speaker to run 10dBs hotter than the calibration set it, then when watching a movie, it would sound terrible. How is that not affecting the calibration?

thanks
That would definitely affect the sound, but it wouldn't affect the Audyssey calibration at all. By that I mean that changing the channel trims doesn't change the filters which Audyssey has calculated in order to combat the malign influences of the room.

Your example is a bit like unplugging the left channel speaker and asking if it changes the Audyssey calibration. The answer is "no" - but it would sure as hell screw up the sound!


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post #71977 of 72378 Old 08-11-2014, 12:39 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bigham16 View Post
I am sure I will get some backlash...after running Audyssey, turn off Dynamic EQ and set all channels to 75dbs using an SPL meter if you have one (leave Audyssey on). This made a major difference in my room but then again I have a dedicated room. I do use DEQ for stereo listing as it sounds amazing but not for Movies/TV/Video Games.

If you don't like it then you can always reset your AV back to your original Audyssey setting with DEQ. No harm no foul.

Just another option to try...or preference
If you set the channel levels with an SPL it is essential to use an external source for the test tone. If you use the AVR internal tones, you can't "leave Audyssey on" because the internal tones bypass Audyssey.

For the reasons why setting the levels independently with an SPL and with Audyssey disabled is a Bad Idea - see here, with test results to show why:

e)3. Why is it a bad idea to use your AVR test tones and a SPL meter to check trim levels?
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post #71978 of 72378 Old 08-11-2014, 12:50 PM
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Now I am confused or just a bad reader.

One quote says "use an external source" but before that, you told the other guy "but it wouldn't affect the Audyssey calibration at all. By that I mean that changing the channel trims doesn't change the filters which Audyssey has calculated in order to combat the malign influences of the room"

Then Chris was quoted by saying "That's right. The internal test tones don't see the filters so you will get the same answer with Audyssey on and off."

So which is it? Test tones bypass Audyssey or not?


Quote:
Originally Posted by kbarnes701 View Post
If you set the channel levels with an SPL it is essential to use an external source for the test tone. If you use the AVR internal tones, you can't "leave Audyssey on" because the internal tones bypass Audyssey.

For the reasons why setting the levels independently with an SPL and with Audyssey disabled is a Bad Idea - see here, with test results to show why:

e)3. Why is it a bad idea to use your AVR test tones and a SPL meter to check trim levels?
Quote:
Originally Posted by kbarnes701 View Post
That would definitely affect the sound, but it wouldn't affect the Audyssey calibration at all. By that I mean that changing the channel trims doesn't change the filters which Audyssey has calculated in order to combat the malign influences of the room.

Your example is a bit like unplugging the left channel speaker and asking if it changes the Audyssey calibration. The answer is "no" - but it would sure as hell screw up the sound!
Quote:
Originally Posted by mogorf View Post
Hi Alan,

Actually the test tones do not bypass the MultEQ filters, but are in a block that comes after the MultEQ block.

Here's a Q & A I had with Chris Kyriakakis on FB on the subject:

Me: Hi Chris, just a short Q. While playing test tones (-30 dBfs, 500 Hz-2kHz band limited pink noise) off a test CD and Audyssey is turned ON and OFF will the meter (C-weighted) show different SPL levels at the MLP? Thanks in advance. Cheers, Feri



  • Chris Kyriakakis Hi Feri, yes it's possible when using a CD. It will depend on how much work the MultEQ filter is doing in that region.

  • Ferenc Mógor How about when using the AVR's internal test tones? AFAIK, the AVR turns off Audyssey filters diring test tone rendering, but leaves the channel trims and distances intact. Thank again.

  • Chris Kyriakakis That's right. The internal test tones don't see the filters so you will get the same answer with Audyssey on and off.

  • Ferenc Mógor Ok, thanks. Lastly. So, for absolute SPL (75 dB) at the MLP which one is the valid test, an external CD with test tones and Audyssey ON, or the internal test tones without Audyssey filters?

  • Chris Kyriakakis If you are absolutely certain that the external CD was properly recorded (there are some that are not--particularly DVDs that have messed up the dialnorm setting), then that's the way to go. Because of this uncertainty, however, we always recommend to go with the internal test tone if you want to check.

  • Ferenc Mógor I see, and understand the worry about external "stuff", but in case of the internal test tones what is the rationale for turning off Audyssey if the MultEQ filters have a job there. Am I far from reality with my conclusion that in this narrow 500 Hz-2 kHz band a typical room will only show subtle differences with MultEQ filters ON or OFF? At least it will be somewhere within the +/- 2dB tolerance range of an average SPL meter due to a region free of room modes not like the bass department.

  • Chris Kyriakakis It's not that MultEQ is turned off. It's because the AVR has the test noise in a block that comes after MultEQ and so it doesn't see the filters. We have asked for this many times, but it's apparently too complicated for them to make the change in the architecture.

Hope this helps clear the subject.



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post #71979 of 72378 Old 08-11-2014, 12:54 PM
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Bad reader

EQ filters aren't the same thing as levels. Changing levels doesn't change the EQ filters. But the EQ filters (if engaged) can impact the perceived / measured levels.

So changing levels doesn't "screw up audyssey" because the EQ filters are the same. But not having the EQ filters in place when attempting to check levels can yield incorrect results.
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post #71980 of 72378 Old 08-11-2014, 01:03 PM
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Figures

Thanks for the replies.

Quote:
Originally Posted by batpig View Post
Bad reader

EQ filters aren't the same thing as levels. Changing levels doesn't change the EQ filters. But the EQ filters (if engaged) can impact the perceived / measured levels.

So changing levels doesn't "screw up audyssey" because the EQ filters are the same. But not having the EQ filters in place when attempting to check levels can yield incorrect results.



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post #71981 of 72378 Old 08-11-2014, 01:06 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by batpig View Post
Yes, you got it right and he got it wrong. Dynamic Volume is for not disturbing babies and ladies.

Dynamic EQ is what keeps tonal balance and surround impression steady regardless of volume level. It certainly helps at lower volume levels by preventing the sound from becoming thin and weak with inaudible surrounds, but it doesn't prevent explosions from being loud.

Others have provided some good suggestions but I would also mention that you can adjust the Reference Level Offset for Dynamic EQ which tones down its boost. If you think your surrounds are a little "hot" with movies that's what I would try first, and then if you want a little more low end oomph you can bump the subs a few dB to compensate.
Thank you; I mixed them up, sorry. ...Could be confusing sometimes this entire odyssey thing.
Got to keep refreshing myself. ...And it don't help either that I never use them.

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post #71982 of 72378 Old 08-11-2014, 01:07 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bigham16 View Post
So which is it? Test tones bypass Audyssey or not?
Once again, hopefully for the last time. In an AVR the test tones are in a block that is after the MultEQ block, so there is no way for the test tones to bypass MultEQ. Capito? Full stop.

Cheers, Feri


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post #71983 of 72378 Old 08-11-2014, 01:10 PM
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This relentless pedantic attempt at clarification is only confusing people. Look up the concept of "distinction without a difference".

Audyssey EQ is not applied to the internal test tones. Whether they "bypass" Audyssey or are in a block after Audyssey the end result is the same: no EQ on the test tones.

What a stupid thing to be mad about.
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post #71984 of 72378 Old 08-11-2014, 01:11 PM
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No worries bud. I won't bother you anymore.

Quote:
Originally Posted by mogorf View Post
Once again, hopefully for the last time. In an AVR the test tones are in a block that is after the MultEQ block, so there is no way for the test tones to bypass MultEQ. Capito? Full stop.



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post #71985 of 72378 Old 08-11-2014, 01:13 PM
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This is much clearer batpig and thank you!

Quote:
Originally Posted by batpig View Post
This relentless pedantic attempt at clarification is only confusing people. Look up the concept of "distinction without a difference".

Audyssey EQ is not applied to the internal test tones. Whether they "bypass" Audyssey or are in a block after Audyssey the end result is the same: no EQ on the test tones.

What a stupid thing to be mad about.
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post #71986 of 72378 Old 08-11-2014, 01:18 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by batpig View Post
This relentless pedantic attempt at clarification is only confusing people. Look up the concept of "distinction without a difference".

Audyssey EQ is not applied to the internal test tones. Whether they "bypass" Audyssey or are in a block after Audyssey the end result is the same: no EQ on the test tones.

What a stupid thing to be mad about.
Agreed. Distinction without difference. End result: no Audyssey on the test tones.
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post #71987 of 72378 Old 08-11-2014, 01:30 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bigham16 View Post
Now I am confused or just a bad reader.

One quote says "use an external source" but before that, you told the other guy "but it wouldn't affect the Audyssey calibration at all. By that I mean that changing the channel trims doesn't change the filters which Audyssey has calculated in order to combat the malign influences of the room"

Then Chris was quoted by saying "That's right. The internal test tones don't see the filters so you will get the same answer with Audyssey on and off."

So which is it? Test tones bypass Audyssey or not?
The *internal* test tones in your receiver bypass the Audyssey filters. *External* test tones such as those found on some test discs can be sent through the Audyssey filters.

However, that is *still* a different test methodology than what Audyssey uses. Audyssey uses frequency sweeps or "chirps" to measure individual frequencies. It then uses a mathematical algorithm to calculate the average level of each channel after the filters have been applied. Then it sets the trims so all channels have the same average levels, (calibration.)

The test discs use band-limited "noise" signals. The frequencies within a certain bandwidth, (usually 1 octave on either side of 1 kHz for the speakers and 40 to 80 Hz for the sub), are played all together, at the same time. This will give you an average level, but the bandwidth will be more limited than the bandwidth Audyssey can compute. In addition, you're using an SPL meter to measure the SPL. You probably don't know how it's been calibrated, or if it is inaccurate and any specific frequencies. Audyssey is using a mic with a *known* and well documented calibration file.

IOW, it would not be at all surprising that a test disc and an SPL would give different readings than Audyssey. Nonetheless, Audyssey's level settings are more likely to be correct than your post-Audyssey measurements.

And don't even bother to measure the internal test tones with an SPL meter if you plan to use the Audyssey filters.

Craig
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post #71988 of 72378 Old 08-11-2014, 01:31 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by batpig View Post
This relentless pedantic attempt at clarification is only confusing people. Look up the concept of "distinction without a difference".

Audyssey EQ is not applied to the internal test tones. Whether they "bypass" Audyssey or are in a block after Audyssey the end result is the same: no EQ on the test tones.

What a stupid thing to be mad about.
Pedantic? OMG. Confusing? OMG.

Have you ever bypassed a car that is in front of you?

Understanding the internal workflow of avrs is a bliss.

Take care.

Cheers, Feri


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post #71989 of 72378 Old 08-11-2014, 01:34 PM
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Feri,

All you're doing is revealing your lack of knowledge of colloquial English. "Bypass" in this case just means "is not affected by".
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post #71990 of 72378 Old 08-11-2014, 01:47 PM
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Originally Posted by Selden Ball View Post
Feri,

All you're doing is revealing your lack of knowledge of colloquial English. "Bypass" in this case just means "is not affected by".
Selden, if that is the case then I stand corrected.

But:
Noun

Wikipedia has an article on: Bypass

bypass (plural bypasses)
  1. a road that passes around something, such as a residential area
  2. a circumvention
  3. a section of pipe that conducts a fluid around some other fixture
  4. an electrical shunt
  5. (medicine) an alternative passage created to divert a bodily fluid around a damaged organ; the surgical procedure to construct such a bypass
All the above definitions show to me that a "bypass" means something is avoided, or the like.


How can anything be avoided if it happens afterwards?


You are testing my English, eh? Thanks.

Cheers, Feri


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post #71991 of 72378 Old 08-11-2014, 01:50 PM
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Perfect! I guess I am a preference kind of guy. I have tried to like DEQ and just can't get over the loud surrounds, loads of extra bass, and some movies it was hard to hear the dialogue while others were great. I have tired with no DEQ and not using an SPL meter and it definitely lacks punch. To me and in my room, with Audyssey engaged and using my SPL meter, it sounds fantastic. Everything is even, bass is perfect to my taste, and dialogue is crystal clear on all movies so far. Is there a 4th to try?

I know I know, to each his own and I do understand the difference between reference and preference.

Most of you are very helpful and that is one thing that is greatly appricated, even if you have to answer the same questions over and over

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Originally Posted by craig john View Post
The *internal* test tones in your receiver bypass the Audyssey filters. *External* test tones such as those found on some test discs can be sent through the Audyssey filters.

However, that is *still* a different test methodology than what Audyssey uses. Audyssey uses frequency sweeps or "chirps" to measure individual frequencies. It then uses a mathematical algorithm to calculate the average level of each channel after the filters have been applied. Then it sets the trims so all channels have the same average levels, (calibration.)

The test discs use band-limited "noise" signals. The frequencies within a certain bandwidth, (usually 1 octave on either side of 1 kHz for the speakers and 40 to 80 Hz for the sub), are played all together, at the same time. This will give you an average level, but the bandwidth will be more limited than the bandwidth Audyssey can compute. In addition, you're using an SPL meter to measure the SPL. You probably don't know how it's been calibrated, or if it is inaccurate and any specific frequencies. Audyssey is using a mic with a *known* and well documented calibration file.

IOW, it would not be at all surprising that a test disc and an SPL would give different readings than Audyssey. Nonetheless, Audyssey's level settings are more likely to be correct than your post-Audyssey measurements.

And don't even bother to measure the internal test tones with an SPL meter if you plan to use the Audyssey filters.

Craig



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post #71992 of 72378 Old 08-11-2014, 02:13 PM
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Originally Posted by Bigham16 View Post
Perfect! I guess I am a preference kind of guy. I have tried to like DEQ and just can't get over the loud surrounds, loads of extra bass, and some movies it was hard to hear the dialogue while others were great. I have tired with no DEQ and not using an SPL meter and it definitely lacks punch. To me and in my room, with Audyssey engaged and using my SPL meter, it sounds fantastic. Everything is even, bass is perfect to my taste, and dialogue is crystal clear on all movies so far. Is there a 4th to try?

I know I know, to each his own and I do understand the difference between reference and preference.

Most of you are very helpful and that is one thing that is greatly appricated, even if you have to answer the same questions over and over
For your better understanding here's how Audyssey with the chirps sets channel trims:

"Chris Kyriakakis: Audyssey measures the entire frequency response of each speaker. The chirps are "full range" even though it's hard to hear the low frequencies in the beginning. After that the energy under the 500-2k range is analyzed to produce an SPL estimate. The trim is the difference between that estimate and 75 dB SPL."

Hope this helps.
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post #71993 of 72378 Old 08-11-2014, 02:53 PM
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Multiple choice:

a) "After" is "after," i.e., later in the circuit. In the case of an AVR's internal test noise (usually band limited pink noise) being after the Audyssey filters, "after" means "the internal test noise does not go through the filters."

b) Choice "a" is a misunderstanding.

c) The space-time continuum has been ripped.
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post #71994 of 72378 Old 08-11-2014, 02:58 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bigham16 View Post
Perfect! I guess I am a preference kind of guy. I have tried to like DEQ and just can't get over the loud surrounds, loads of extra bass, and some movies it was hard to hear the dialogue while others were great. I have tired with no DEQ and not using an SPL meter and it definitely lacks punch. To me and in my room, with Audyssey engaged and using my SPL meter, it sounds fantastic. Everything is even, bass is perfect to my taste, and dialogue is crystal clear on all movies so far. Is there a 4th to try?

I know I know, to each his own and I do understand the difference between reference and preference.

Most of you are very helpful and that is one thing that is greatly appricated, even if you have to answer the same questions over and over
This is what it's all about after all, right?

For those that are a little more OCD, getting the levels "just right" with external tones is a must...otherwise they'd have this little voice in their heads yelling "YOUR LEVELS AREN'T 'REFERENCE'!? SACRILEGE!!"

Me...I usually just trust Audyssey on the speaker trims, although I bump up the sub 4-5db.
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post #71995 of 72378 Old 08-11-2014, 02:58 PM
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Hi John,

Do you get massive amount of bass with all your subs in your room with DEQ on? I get foundation cracking bass after Audyssey and DEQ engaged. Do you ever experience dialog being too soft in some movies and not on others (Blu Rays)? Or surround sounds that were so loud that you couldn't hear the front stage at all? Is this reference for movie watching at home?

I am just asking and not questioning, I think there is a difference

These are the things I encounter with DEQ on in my room. I think I have a pretty nice set up but I'm I missing something (not for mogorf to answer as I already know his reply ).

I believe my room sounds better than any theater I have been in...maybe not Atmos...well maybe

I would love to listen to one of y'alls systems to get a feel for what it should sound like. I am all alone in my neck of the woods from what I can tell.


Quote:
Originally Posted by craig john View Post
The *internal* test tones in your receiver bypass the Audyssey filters. *External* test tones such as those found on some test discs can be sent through the Audyssey filters.

However, that is *still* a different test methodology than what Audyssey uses. Audyssey uses frequency sweeps or "chirps" to measure individual frequencies. It then uses a mathematical algorithm to calculate the average level of each channel after the filters have been applied. Then it sets the trims so all channels have the same average levels, (calibration.)

The test discs use band-limited "noise" signals. The frequencies within a certain bandwidth, (usually 1 octave on either side of 1 kHz for the speakers and 40 to 80 Hz for the sub), are played all together, at the same time. This will give you an average level, but the bandwidth will be more limited than the bandwidth Audyssey can compute. In addition, you're using an SPL meter to measure the SPL. You probably don't know how it's been calibrated, or if it is inaccurate and any specific frequencies. Audyssey is using a mic with a *known* and well documented calibration file.

IOW, it would not be at all surprising that a test disc and an SPL would give different readings than Audyssey. Nonetheless, Audyssey's level settings are more likely to be correct than your post-Audyssey measurements.

And don't even bother to measure the internal test tones with an SPL meter if you plan to use the Audyssey filters.

Craig



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post #71996 of 72378 Old 08-11-2014, 03:03 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by garygarrison View Post
Multiple choice:

a) "After" is "after," i.e., later in the circuit. In the case of an AVR's internal test noise (usually band limited pink noise) being after the Audyssey filters, "after" means "the internal test noise does not go through the filters."

b) Choice "a" is a misunderstanding.

c) The space-time continuum has been ripped.
Gary, to me choice a) makes perfect sense. Care to expand on why you think it is a misunderstanding? Thx.

Cheers, Feri


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post #71997 of 72378 Old 08-11-2014, 03:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bigham16 View Post
Hi John,

Do you get massive amount of bass with all your subs in your room with DEQ on? I get foundation cracking bass after Audyssey and DEQ engaged. Do you ever experience dialog being too soft in some movies and not on others (Blu Rays)? Or surround sounds that were so loud that you couldn't hear the front stage at all? Is this reference for movie watching at home?
"Reference" is at 0 MV and at reference DEQ has no effect.

I've got quad 15s and the bass is very well balanced in my room with DEQ enabled....my subs are also running 4db hot. Now the surrounds are a completely different story...I always cut the surrounds (and rear surrounds) by 4 or 5db from where Audyssey sets them. If I didn't, DEQ would suck for sure.
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post #71998 of 72378 Old 08-11-2014, 03:20 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bigham16 View Post
Hi John,
Do you get massive amount of bass with all your subs in your room with DEQ on? I get foundation cracking bass after Audyssey and DEQ engaged.
I get the "correct" amount of bass.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bigham16 View Post
Do you ever experience dialog being too soft in some movies and not on others (Blu Rays)? Or surround sounds that were so loud that you couldn't hear the front stage at all? Is this reference for movie watching at home?
I never experience any of those things in my theater. Dialog is always at the proper level, the surrounds are always at the proper level, everything is balanced properly. My room is extensively treated with acoustic treatments and bass traps, and XT32, (run according to guidelines), on top of that gets the whole system properly balanced.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bigham16 View Post
I am just asking and not questioning, I think there is a difference

These are the things I encounter with DEQ on in my room. I think I have a pretty nice set up but I'm I missing something (not for mogorf to answer as I already know his reply ).
I don't know why you would not realize the benefits of DEQ, but I suspect it's something with your speaker setup or the way you've run Audyssey. Did you follow the standard guidelines?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bigham16 View Post
I believe my room sounds better than any theater I have been in...maybe not Atmos...well maybe

I would love to listen to one of y'alls systems to get a feel for what it should sound like. I am all alone in my neck of the woods from what I can tell.
If you're ever in Lancaster, PA, give me a shout.

Craig

Lombardi said it:
Perfection is not attainable, but if we chase perfection we can catch excellence."


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post #71999 of 72378 Old 08-11-2014, 03:24 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Alan P View Post
Now the surrounds are a completely different story...I always cut the surrounds (and rear surrounds) by 4 or 5db from where Audyssey sets them. If I didn't, DEQ would suck for sure.
Alan, are you also a fan of front stage imaging while you like surrounds (and rear surrounds) do a job of only conveying an ambience effect (without direct firing sounds)?

The film "Gravity" as an example has a lot of such direct firing surround sound effects you may loose, or not percieve well with surrounds trimmed down.

Nothing wrong with that, just seed for thought.

Cheers, Feri


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post #72000 of 72378 Old 08-11-2014, 03:25 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bigham16 View Post
Perfect! I guess I am a preference kind of guy. I have tried to like DEQ and just can't get over the loud surrounds, loads of extra bass, and some movies it was hard to hear the dialogue while others were great. I have tired with no DEQ and not using an SPL meter and it definitely lacks punch. To me and in my room, with Audyssey engaged and using my SPL meter, it sounds fantastic. Everything is even, bass is perfect to my taste, and dialogue is crystal clear on all movies so far. Is there a 4th to try?

I know I know, to each his own and I do understand the difference between reference and preference.

Most of you are very helpful and that is one thing that is greatly appricated, even if you have to answer the same questions over and over
FWIW, I don't think there is a one size fits all answer to this. If you have knowledgeably experimented with your system and reached a particular conclusion/setting that is most pleasing to you, then you are probably in a good place. I think the key is to knowledgeably experiment, and it sounds as if you have done that. I hope that you have tried using various RLO's and even tweaking your center channel volume (which my AVR let's me do in the Audio menu), just for the sake of thoroughness. But the bottom line from reading about 5 years of this thread is that not everyone likes DEQ for every application. And some may not prefer it for any application. IMO there is nothing wrong with preferring "preference" as long as you start with "reference", at least as far as possible.

One of the things that I have noticed about myself, and some others on this thread, is that we like to experiment. And my tastes are not absolutely static either. So, I may prefer one slightly different setting at one time, and then a few days or weeks later, find myself changing something slightly. Depending on your system and your room, those may be variables rather than static, as well. You may find yourself adding or replacing speakers, or adding subtle room treatments, or whatever. And any of those things may not only change your Audyssey calibration, but your perception of how things sound, and what you prefer, as well.

It would be just plain wrong to tell you not to obsess over your current settings/ preferences too much. After all, that's what we do on this forum. But while obsessing, I wouldn't worry about it too much, if that makes any sense. Just keep reading, asking questions if you need to, absorbing information, experimenting as the spirit moves you, and over time you will probably find yourself getting to an even better audio place. There's no real hurry, particularly if you like where you are at this particular moment.


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Last edited by mthomas47; 08-11-2014 at 03:30 PM.
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