"Official" Audyssey thread (FAQ in post #51779) - Page 2401 - AVS Forum
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post #72001 of 72388 Old 08-11-2014, 03:43 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mogorf View Post
Alan, are you also a fan of front stage imaging while you like surrounds (and rear surrounds) do a job of only conveying an ambience effect (without direct firing sounds)?

The film "Gravity" as an example has a lot of such direct firing surround sound effects you may loose, or not percieve well with surrounds trimmed down.

Nothing wrong with that, just seed for thought.
I'd have to answer "yes".

I think I've grown used to a more diffuse surround effect with my bipole/dipole surrounds that I've had for almost 20 years. However, I do seem to get enough direct effects when they are warranted....maybe Audyssey just doesn't deal well with my surrounds.

I happened to just re-watch Gravity yesterday! Nothing lacking in the surrounds that I could tell. As a side note, every time I watch that film I am in awe of the sound design, a very rightly deserved Oscar win for all the work they did!
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post #72002 of 72388 Old 08-11-2014, 04:03 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Alan P View Post
I'd have to answer "yes".

I think I've grown used to a more diffuse surround effect with my bipole/dipole surrounds that I've had for almost 20 years. However, I do seem to get enough direct effects when they are warranted....maybe Audyssey just doesn't deal well with my surrounds.

I happened to just re-watch Gravity yesterday! Nothing lacking in the surrounds that I could tell. As a side note, every time I watch that film I am in awe of the sound design, a very rightly deserved Oscar win for all the work they did!
Thanks for your reply Alan, I do hear you. Yet, with the advent of Dolby Atmos it seems to me that the all-around direct firing speaker arrangements are actually taking over the dipole/bipole lines, while even legacy 5.1/7.1 systems may benefit from such setup.

Just my $0.02 cents.

Cheers, Feri


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post #72003 of 72388 Old 08-11-2014, 04:18 PM
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Originally Posted by mogorf View Post
Gary, to me choice a) makes perfect sense. Care to expand on why you think it is a misunderstanding? Thx.
I don't think choice "a" is a misunderstanding! I just wanted to see if anybody disagreed with it. I was concerned that there still might be an insufficient meeting of the minds.
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post #72004 of 72388 Old 08-11-2014, 04:34 PM
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Originally Posted by garygarrison View Post
I don't think choice "a" is a misunderstanding! I just wanted to see if anybody disagreed with it. I was concerned that there still might be an insufficient meeting of the minds.
Nobody disagrees with it. That wasn't the point.

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post #72005 of 72388 Old 08-11-2014, 07:09 PM
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Good too hear on your adjustments. Now I don't feel so alone

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Originally Posted by Alan P View Post
"Reference" is at 0 MV and at reference DEQ has no effect.

I've got quad 15s and the bass is very well balanced in my room with DEQ enabled....my subs are also running 4db hot. Now the surrounds are a completely different story...I always cut the surrounds (and rear surrounds) by 4 or 5db from where Audyssey sets them. If I didn't, DEQ would suck for sure.



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post #72006 of 72388 Old 08-11-2014, 07:25 PM
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Thanks for your response, Craig!

Yes, I did follow the Audyssey set-up on this forum to the "T"...or I think so. Maybe my Audyssey is broken

I have run Audyssey more than a dozen times and I get the same results after every run. All speaker distances measurements are with a tenth of an inch from their opposite speaker. The only measurement that I don't understand is that it measures one sub at 9' and the other at 7'...every time but they are exactly the same distance from the main listening position? (yes, they are level matched)

I have treatments but not extensively. I did add more treatments the last few weeks and waiting on my new sconces before I take new pictures. Hopefully by next weekend.

That's awesome Audyssey with DEQ works so well in your room. I bet it sounds amazing.

Thanks for the invite and same to you and other if you're ever in the Dallas area.
Quote:
Originally Posted by craig john View Post
I get the "correct" amount of bass.


I never experience any of those things in my theater. Dialog is always at the proper level, the surrounds are always at the proper level, everything is balanced properly. My room is extensively treated with acoustic treatments and bass traps, and XT32, (run according to guidelines), on top of that gets the whole system properly balanced.


I don't know why you would not realize the benefits of DEQ, but I suspect it's something with your speaker setup or the way you've run Audyssey. Did you follow the standard guidelines?


If you're ever in Lancaster, PA, give me a shout.

Craig



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post #72007 of 72388 Old 08-11-2014, 07:40 PM
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This is a great post!! I agree on getting over obsessed with this. Need to take break and just sit back and listen.

I like what you said about not being in a hurry too. I need to remember that one.

Thanks again!!

Quote:
Originally Posted by mthomas47 View Post
FWIW, I don't think there is a one size fits all answer to this. If you have knowledgeably experimented with your system and reached a particular conclusion/setting that is most pleasing to you, then you are probably in a good place. I think the key is to knowledgeably experiment, and it sounds as if you have done that. I hope that you have tried using various RLO's and even tweaking your center channel volume (which my AVR let's me do in the Audio menu), just for the sake of thoroughness. But the bottom line from reading about 5 years of this thread is that not everyone likes DEQ for every application. And some may not prefer it for any application. IMO there is nothing wrong with preferring "preference" as long as you start with "reference", at least as far as possible.

One of the things that I have noticed about myself, and some others on this thread, is that we like to experiment. And my tastes are not absolutely static either. So, I may prefer one slightly different setting at one time, and then a few days or weeks later, find myself changing something slightly. Depending on your system and your room, those may be variables rather than static, as well. You may find yourself adding or replacing speakers, or adding subtle room treatments, or whatever. And any of those things may not only change your Audyssey calibration, but your perception of how things sound, and what you prefer, as well.

It would be just plain wrong to tell you not to obsess over your current settings/ preferences too much. After all, that's what we do on this forum. But while obsessing, I wouldn't worry about it too much, if that makes any sense. Just keep reading, asking questions if you need to, absorbing information, experimenting as the spirit moves you, and over time you will probably find yourself getting to an even better audio place. There's no real hurry, particularly if you like where you are at this particular moment.
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post #72008 of 72388 Old 08-11-2014, 08:05 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bigham16 View Post
The only measurement that I don't understand is that it measures one sub at 9' and the other at 7'...every time but they are exactly the same distance from the main listening position? (yes, they are level matched)
Never...NEVER expect Audyssey to set your subs at the actual physical distance, it has more to do with your room and the sub's distance to boundaries.
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post #72009 of 72388 Old 08-11-2014, 08:52 PM
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Regarding Audyssey setting the distances of your subwoofers:

1. The times it takes for sound to travel in the air to the microphone.
2. The electrical delay in the signal inside the subwoofer:
♦ Any type of filter in the subwoofer introduces delay.
♦ Any type of DSP processing in the subwoofer introduces delay.
♦ The interaction of the woofer and the port in a subwoofer can also cause problems.
This interaction can also cause polarity reversal warnings.

Because of these delays, it is quite normal to see longer distances reported for the subwoofer.
You should leave it as Audyssey found it.


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post #72010 of 72388 Old 08-11-2014, 11:09 PM
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Just re-watched Divergent again after I made some adjustments to my trim levels. Here is what I have done so far post-Audyssey Multi XT:


Center 1 dB hot
Sub 6 dBs hot
DEQ left at 0
All 4 surrounds each 4 dBs cold


Sounded perfect. In the parts of the movie where all I heard were the surrounds before, I was now just engulfed with sound from all around me. Loved it. Sounds like I need to rent Gravity.


Thanks all for putting up with my stupid questions and comments.
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post #72011 of 72388 Old 08-11-2014, 11:58 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mgrotel View Post
Just re-watched Divergent again after I made some adjustments to my trim levels. Here is what I have done so far post-Audyssey Multi XT:


Center 1 dB hot
Sub 6 dBs hot
DEQ left at 0
All 4 surrounds each 4 dBs cold


Sounded perfect. In the parts of the movie where all I heard were the surrounds before, I was now just engulfed with sound from all around me. Loved it. Sounds like I need to rent Gravity.


Thanks all for putting up with my stupid questions and comments.
Good to hear your good news! After watching a couple of more films I'm sure you will be able to find an optimum setting for your pleasure.
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Cheers, Feri


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post #72012 of 72388 Old 08-12-2014, 02:03 AM
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Originally Posted by Bigham16 View Post
Perfect! I guess I am a preference kind of guy. I have tried to like DEQ and just can't get over the loud surrounds, loads of extra bass, and some movies it was hard to hear the dialogue while others were great. I have tired with no DEQ and not using an SPL meter and it definitely lacks punch. To me and in my room, with Audyssey engaged and using my SPL meter, it sounds fantastic. Everything is even, bass is perfect to my taste, and dialogue is crystal clear on all movies so far. Is there a 4th to try?

I know I know, to each his own and I do understand the difference between reference and preference.

Most of you are very helpful and that is one thing that is greatly appricated, even if you have to answer the same questions over and over
What setting of the MV do you normally listen to movies at? If it is very high, then you may not need DEQ in your situation and with your preferences. The effect of DEQ diminishes as you approach 0dB on the MV and ceases totally at 0dB, going into 'reverse' if you take the MV beyond 0dB. If you listen at -20dB or whatever, then DEQ will be applying quite a lot of correction and, in your room, it may be too much for you. There's no law that says you have to like what DEQ does to the curve, so if you are happy with Audyssey on and DEQ off, then just enjoy!

One final check - make sure you have Dynamic Volume turned off for normal listening.


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post #72013 of 72388 Old 08-12-2014, 02:18 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bigham16 View Post
Hi John,

Do you get massive amount of bass with all your subs in your room with DEQ on? I get foundation cracking bass after Audyssey and DEQ engaged. Do you ever experience dialog being too soft in some movies and not on others (Blu Rays)? Or surround sounds that were so loud that you couldn't hear the front stage at all? Is this reference for movie watching at home?

I am just asking and not questioning, I think there is a difference

These are the things I encounter with DEQ on in my room. I think I have a pretty nice set up but I'm I missing something (not for mogorf to answer as I already know his reply ).

I believe my room sounds better than any theater I have been in...maybe not Atmos...well maybe

I would love to listen to one of y'alls systems to get a feel for what it should sound like. I am all alone in my neck of the woods from what I can tell.
This is one of the problems many people have - they never get the chance to hear first class 'reference' systems in first class rooms and so they have no basis for comparison as to what sounds truly great and what sounds just 'meh'. And auditory memory is so unreliable that even when they do, it can be hard to compare with what you hear back home. Long exposure to good sound can give an instinctive understanding, IME, of what sounds 'right' and what doesn't.

WRT to your DEQ issues, many have said similar things, many times. Personally, I find DEQ is useful, but my typical listening level for movies, in a highly treated room, is 5dB (which I call 'home reference'). At that setting of the MV, DEQ isn’t doing much. But when I test listen at lower levels, say -15dB, the sound remains nicely 'balanced'. Nobody has ever really gotten to the bottom of why some people have these issues with DEQ - it may just be that some rooms don't respond as well as others, or whatever.

The issue with the surrounds is just a fact - they are overboosted by DEQ and if you find that objectionable, as many do, then simply adjust the surround trims to your own liking - dropping them by 2dB seems to be OK for most.

If you generally have difficulties with dialog intelligibility, then this FAQ answer may help:

a)2. Why is dialogue from the centre channel difficult to hear or understand?


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post #72014 of 72388 Old 08-12-2014, 02:29 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by garygarrison View Post
I don't think choice "a" is a misunderstanding! I just wanted to see if anybody disagreed with it. I was concerned that there still might be an insufficient meeting of the minds.
Everyone who understands how Audyssey works knows that the internal test tones are not touched by Audyssey. The simple way that that has been explained literally hundreds of times is that "Audyssey bypasses the internal test tones". It seems that every one of the thousands of people who visit this thread understand what is meant by that, except one.

To continue with a pedantic, confusing, semantic discussion would serve no purpose and possibly add more confusion to that which has already been raised and confused at least one reader in the last day or two (but fortunately he understands now that Audyssey 'bypasses'/ignores the internal test tones anyway).

The bottom line, however it is expressed, is that Audyssey has no effect on internal test tones and, for that reason, users should be circumspect about using internal test tones and a SPL meter to set channel trims. The reason: when the Audyssey filters are applied after the 'testing' is done, the levels may be dramatically altered by the very action of those filters which were earlier bypassed.

Craig John has recently replied with a very full and cogent answer, and indeed in thw FAQ answer which deals with this very issue, in detail, Craig's test results give conclusive evidence.

e)3. Why is it a bad idea to use your AVR test tones and a SPL meter to check trim levels?


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post #72015 of 72388 Old 08-12-2014, 06:01 AM
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Yes, I was in the FAQ's and thank you for the reminder

Quote:
Originally Posted by Alan P View Post
Never...NEVER expect Audyssey to set your subs at the actual physical distance, it has more to do with your room and the sub's distance to boundaries.
Quote:
Originally Posted by NorthSky View Post
Regarding Audyssey setting the distances of your subwoofers:

1. The times it takes for sound to travel in the air to the microphone.
2. The electrical delay in the signal inside the subwoofer:
♦ Any type of filter in the subwoofer introduces delay.
♦ Any type of DSP processing in the subwoofer introduces delay.
♦ The interaction of the woofer and the port in a subwoofer can also cause problems.
This interaction can also cause polarity reversal warnings.

Because of these delays, it is quite normal to see longer distances reported for the subwoofer.
You should leave it as Audyssey found it.


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post #72016 of 72388 Old 08-12-2014, 06:07 AM
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Originally Posted by Bigham16 View Post
Yes, I was in the FAQ's and thank you for the reminder
You are welcome. All of these things which recur here time after time are covered in the FAQ. Indeed, the recurring nature of many issues is the very reason the FAQ came into being - to save members from having to explain the same thing over and over. The idea was we could just point to the FAQ answer instead. And, of course, the FAQ has been peer-reviewed by every experienced member and everyone who is interested in reading it, and any discrepancies or alternative viewpoints have been corrected or incorporated over time -- a process which still goes on.


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post #72017 of 72388 Old 08-12-2014, 06:12 AM
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I watch movies around the 60dB mark. The volume range on my 4520 goes up. I did try parts of Twister at 70dB with my preferred settings is it was very intense. Not sure I could watch the whole movie this way.

I have listened to movies at the 60dB mark with DEQ engaged and it was over powering on surrounds and sub (I know I have said this before) except for the front sound stage.

I couldn't even imagin listening to movies at the 0dB (100dB?) range in my room with either setting. Talk about bleeding of the ears

I am going to retry the default settings from Audyssey with DEQ off and only boosting the sub and see how that sounds. I did this before but left the sub as is and had zero bass.

Quote:
Originally Posted by kbarnes701 View Post
What setting of the MV do you normally listen to movies at? If it is very high, then you may not need DEQ in your situation and with your preferences. The effect of DEQ diminishes as you approach 0dB on the MV and ceases totally at 0dB, going into 'reverse' if you take the MV beyond 0dB. If you listen at -20dB or whatever, then DEQ will be applying quite a lot of correction and, in your room, it may be too much for you. There's no law that says you have to like what DEQ does to the curve, so if you are happy with Audyssey on and DEQ off, then just enjoy!

One final check - make sure you have Dynamic Volume turned off for normal listening.



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post #72018 of 72388 Old 08-12-2014, 06:23 AM
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Originally Posted by Bigham16 View Post
I watch movies around the 60dB mark. The volume range on my 4520 goes up. I did try parts of Twister at 70dB with my preferred settings is it was very intense. Not sure I could watch the whole movie this way.
I'm not familiar with a MV setting like that. Anyone know what that translates to in the usual relative MV terms? Does your unit not permit Relative settings of the MV display? (By which I mean a figure relative to 0dB being Reference).

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I couldn't even imagin listening to movies at the 0dB (100dB?) range in my room with either setting. Talk about bleeding of the ears
When the sound is undistorted, not being driven into clipping etc, no matter how loud it gets it never causes any sort of "bleeding of the ears" type of reaction. No wincing, or 'edginess' or harshness - just more SPL. This is one of the signs of a powerful, clean system that can be driven to very high SPLs - it doesn't sound "loud" even when it is. If when my system is peaking at 105db on various 'action' sequences, I speak out loud to someone else in the room, I cannot actually hear my own voice over the sound of the system. Yet it doesn't sound subjectively 'loud'. When this happens it always catches me by surprise as I had no idea I was listening to something so loud.

HST, almost nobody listens at home at 0dB reference level. I use -5dB or thereabouts as what I call "home Reference Level". By that I mean it is subjectively as loud as I feel it is in a commercial theater.

If, when you crank your system up, it sounds excessively 'loud' or harsh to your ears, or you feel an urgent and overwhelming need to turn it down, then chances are your amps are running out of steam and are approaching, or in, clipping. If that is the case then you need more powerful amps for your conditions. (I am assuming your speakers are able to deliver the required SPLs without any problems of their own coming into the equation).

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bigham16 View Post
I am going to retry the default settings from Audyssey with DEQ off and only boosting the sub and see how that sounds. I did this before but left the sub as is and had zero bass.
Or you could adjust the point at which DEQ starts to work, using the RLO control and see if that helps. Explained here:

g)3. What is Reference Level Offset in Dynamic EQ?


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post #72019 of 72388 Old 08-12-2014, 06:35 AM
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Yeah, I have gone to just about every home theater dealer in my area to compare mine verse theirs. Most see to have not taken the time to really set up each of their rooms. They just place speakers here and there and plug and play. There is one place that has a "certified" JBL media room where JBL can only touch/calibrate the room (so I was told). It sounded great but didn't sound better than what I have at home. They also had the D-Box chairs in this room which were quite fun!

Yes, I did try different settings for the dialog with DEQ on. Boosted the center up one or two dBs and tried the dialog enhancer. Nether worked as well as with DEQ off. It really sounds like someone put a thick quilt over the center with DEQ on but is clear as day with DEQ off.

Audyssey set most of the front stage to 75dB's, the surrounds where around 73db's, and each sub was about 68dB's. I didn't have to adjust each trim level by much or if at all. The sub's were the only ones that got around a 5dB increase. Of course this is with DEQ turned off.

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Originally Posted by kbarnes701 View Post
This is one of the problems many people have - they never get the chance to hear first class 'reference' systems in first class rooms and so they have no basis for comparison as to what sounds truly great and what sounds just 'meh'. And auditory memory is so unreliable that even when they do, it can be hard to compare with what you hear back home. Long exposure to good sound can give an instinctive understanding, IME, of what sounds 'right' and what doesn't.

WRT to your DEQ issues, many have said similar things, many times. Personally, I find DEQ is useful, but my typical listening level for movies, in a highly treated room, is 5dB (which I call 'home reference'). At that setting of the MV, DEQ isn’t doing much. But when I test listen at lower levels, say -15dB, the sound remains nicely 'balanced'. Nobody has ever really gotten to the bottom of why some people have these issues with DEQ - it may just be that some rooms don't respond as well as others, or whatever.

The issue with the surrounds is just a fact - they are overboosted by DEQ and if you find that objectionable, as many do, then simply adjust the surround trims to your own liking - dropping them by 2dB seems to be OK for most.

If you generally have difficulties with dialog intelligibility, then this FAQ answer may help:

a)2. Why is dialogue from the centre channel difficult to hear or understand?



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post #72020 of 72388 Old 08-12-2014, 06:37 AM
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Yes, I will do a better job of going through the FAQ's before I start up a convo. I have read through them a few times but might need a refresh

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You are welcome. All of these things which recur here time after time are covered in the FAQ. Indeed, the recurring nature of many issues is the very reason the FAQ came into being - to save members from having to explain the same thing over and over. The idea was we could just point to the FAQ answer instead. And, of course, the FAQ has been peer-reviewed by every experienced member and everyone who is interested in reading it, and any discrepancies or alternative viewpoints have been corrected or incorporated over time -- a process which still goes on.



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post #72021 of 72388 Old 08-12-2014, 06:49 AM
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Hmmm...Not sure where to look for the a figure relative to 0dB. I have the Denon 4520 and a Gen 2 Emotiva XPA-5 which is rated at 200 watts for each channel @ 8 ohms. I have Golden Ear Triton 2 tower speakers with a 91dB efficiency.

I would hope all my gear could preform what you are asking and not give me "bleeding of the ears"

60dBs in my room gives me that feeling of being loud but not loud at the same time feeling.

I will definitely try your suggestion on the reference level offset and see what happens.

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Originally Posted by kbarnes701 View Post
I'm not familiar with a MV setting like that. Anyone know what that translates to in the usual relative MV terms? Does your unit not permit Relative settings of the MV display? (By which I mean a figure relative to 0dB being Reference).



When the sound is undistorted, not being driven into clipping etc, no matter how loud it gets it never causes any sort of "bleeding of the ears" type of reaction. No wincing, or 'edginess' or harshness - just more SPL. This is one of the signs of a powerful, clean system that can be driven to very high SPLs - it doesn't sound "loud" even when it is. If when my system is peaking at 105db on various 'action' sequences, I speak out loud to someone else in the room, I cannot actually hear my own voice over the sound of the system. Yet it doesn't sound subjectively 'loud'. When this happens it always catches me by surprise as I had no idea I was listening to something so loud.

HST, almost nobody listens at home at 0dB reference level. I use -5dB or thereabouts as what I call "home Reference Level". By that I mean it is subjectively as loud as I feel it is in a commercial theater.

If, when you crank your system up, it sounds excessively 'loud' or harsh to your ears, or you feel an urgent and overwhelming need to turn it down, then chances are your amps are running out of steam and are approaching, or in, clipping. If that is the case then you need more powerful amps for your conditions. (I am assuming your speakers are able to deliver the required SPLs without any problems of their own coming into the equation).



Or you could adjust the point at which DEQ starts to work, using the RLO control and see if that helps. Explained here:

g)3. What is Reference Level Offset in Dynamic EQ?



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post #72022 of 72388 Old 08-12-2014, 06:57 AM
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Yes, I will do a better job of going through the FAQ's before I start up a convo. I have read through them a few times but might need a refresh
I wasn't in any way criticizing you. I don't think anyone expects every user to read the entire FAQ before asking a question - the FAQ is just an easy way to reply when they do (ask a question).
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post #72023 of 72388 Old 08-12-2014, 07:02 AM
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Yeah, I have gone to just about every home theater dealer in my area to compare mine verse theirs. Most see to have not taken the time to really set up each of their rooms. They just place speakers here and there and plug and play. There is one place that has a "certified" JBL media room where JBL can only touch/calibrate the room (so I was told). It sounded great but didn't sound better than what I have at home. They also had the D-Box chairs in this room which were quite fun!
Few dealers, IME, have very good demo rooms. I was fortunate that for many years I was involved with cinema commercial production (I mean cinema advertising - here in the UK audiences have to sit through 15 minutes of ads before the movie starts!) and part of my job was attending the edits and post production operations, carried out of course in very good, professional facilities. It was at those sessions that I was first exposed to high quality audio (stereo in those days) and the effortless way in which a good system could reproduce sound. And of course, it was also a good introduction to the value of acoustic treatments.

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Yes, I did try different settings for the dialog with DEQ on. Boosted the center up one or two dBs and tried the dialog enhancer. Nether worked as well as with DEQ off. It really sounds like someone put a thick quilt over the center with DEQ on but is clear as day with DEQ off.

Audyssey set most of the front stage to 75dB's, the surrounds where around 73db's, and each sub was about 68dB's. I didn't have to adjust each trim level by much or if at all. The sub's were the only ones that got around a 5dB increase. Of course this is with DEQ turned off.
It seems as if you have tried most things. Barring adding treatments to your room, I think you may have done all that you can, or wish, to do. If so, and you are happy with the sound, just enjoy!


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post #72024 of 72388 Old 08-12-2014, 07:14 AM
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Yeah, I just haven't crossed any other room that sounds anything close to mine, maybe the JBL room I had mentioned. So I will continue to wait for that "good introduction"

Until then, I will just sit back and enjoy. Thanks again for the convo/information.

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Few dealers, IME, have very good demo rooms. I was fortunate that for many years I was involved with cinema commercial production (I mean cinema advertising - here in the UK audiences have to sit through 15 minutes of ads before the movie starts!) and part of my job was attending the edits and post production operations, carried out of course in very good, professional facilities. It was at those sessions that I was first exposed to high quality audio (stereo in those days) and the effortless way in which a good system could reproduce sound. And of course, it was also a good introduction to the value of acoustic treatments.



It seems as if you have tried most things. Barring adding treatments to your room, I think you may have done all that you can, or wish, to do. If so, and you are happy with the sound, just enjoy!
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Until then, I will just sit back and enjoy. Thanks again for the convo/information.
Very nice to discuss things with you. Recently this thread has been going some way towards getting back to its glory days and the atmosphere that made it the biggest thread on AVS, and then some. I hope that it continues in this direction and isn't (almost terminally) derailed again by anyone.
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post #72026 of 72388 Old 08-12-2014, 07:43 AM
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Originally Posted by kbarnes701 View Post
I'm not familiar with a MV setting like that. Anyone know what that translates to in the usual relative MV terms? Does your unit not permit Relative settings of the MV display? (By which I mean a figure relative to 0dB being Reference).
Page 124 of your owners manual.

Relative vs. Absolute Volume.

I believe that 80 on the Absolute scale is equal to 0db on the Relative scale.
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post #72027 of 72388 Old 08-12-2014, 09:05 AM
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Ooops, didn't mean to quote kbarnes there.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kbarnes701 View Post
When the sound is undistorted, not being driven into clipping etc, no matter how loud it gets it never causes any sort of "bleeding of the ears" type of reaction. No wincing, or 'edginess' or harshness - just more SPL. This is one of the signs of a powerful, clean system that can be driven to very high SPLs - it doesn't sound "loud" even when it is. If when my system is peaking at 105db on various 'action' sequences, I speak out loud to someone else in the room, I cannot actually hear my own voice over the sound of the system. Yet it doesn't sound subjectively 'loud'. When this happens it always catches me by surprise as I had no idea I was listening to something so loud.
Or maybe you are just going deaf, LOL
I am just kidding, I understand what you are explaining, just thought I would throw out a joke in here.
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post #72029 of 72388 Old 08-12-2014, 10:07 AM
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Quote:
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Page 124 of your owners manual.

Relative vs. Absolute Volume.

I believe that 80 on the Absolute scale is equal to 0db on the Relative scale.
I have a Denon E-300, and my volume scale is the same as this one, so yes 80 db absolute is equal to 0 db relative.

On a side note, I'm not sure why 80 db absolute is equivalent to 0 db "relative" when 85 db is "reference." Is there a reason for this or something I'm missing? Do different AVRs or different brands have their own scales?
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post #72030 of 72388 Old 08-12-2014, 10:12 AM
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I have a Denon E-300, and my volume scale is the same as this one, so yes 80 db absolute is equal to 0 db relative.

On a side note, I'm not sure why 80 db absolute is equivalent to 0 db "relative" when 85 db is "reference." Is there a reason for this or something I'm missing? Do different AVRs or different brands have their own scales?
It is not 80 dB, just 80 on a scale 0-100. The other scale is calibrated in dB which goes from like -80 dB to 0 dB reference level and a bit up like to +15-18 dB.
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