"Official" Audyssey thread (FAQ in post #51779) - Page 562 - AVS Forum
Forum Jump: 
Reply
 
Thread Tools
post #16831 of 71740 Old 07-27-2009, 11:11 PM
AVS Special Member
 
Cam Man's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2000
Location: Tucson, AZ & Los Angeles,CA, USA
Posts: 2,417
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2 Post(s)
Liked: 78
Is there a means with Audyssey to have AT screen compensation (oxymoron ) and no screen compensation user selectable in a system that is used both ways (with the screen and without)? There might be a small amount of EQ and trim change. If not, this situation may require a PEQ. Some PEQs have memories (scenes) that are selectable after being created and saved. Or you could just prioritize and calibrate with the screen and take what you get without it. Anybody faced this?
Cam Man is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #16832 of 71740 Old 07-27-2009, 11:31 PM
Senior Member
 
yankee14's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: DFW, Texas
Posts: 421
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
I will be doing the Audyssey check either tomorrow or wednesday.
I have the Denon AVR-1910

I have two questions in reading this thread (very long) and the audyssey set up guide that I downloaded :

(1)
There is a difference of opinion as to the mic being at ear level or at the top of a couch if the back of the couch is higher.
Common sense (preference) would tell me to place it at my ear level.
It seems it would boast the rears.
However I have ceiling rears (4.5 ft behind) so would that also effect where the mic should be placed : ear or top of couch height ?

(2)
Unfortunately my center and left and right speakers are above the 58" tv and therefore above my ear level.
I was directed to this thread to find how to handle that issue.
Unfortunately I looked and got weary eyed trying to find it.
Is it possible for someone who has this same issue to give me some direction as to how that might effect the height of the Mic.

Thanks, Greg

Greg
yankee14 is offline  
post #16833 of 71740 Old 07-28-2009, 05:44 AM
AVS Club Gold
 
GetGray's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Mid-South USA
Posts: 5,401
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 6 Post(s)
Liked: 44
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cam Man View Post

Is there a means with Audyssey to have AT screen compensation (oxymoron ) and no screen compensation user selectable in a system that is used both ways (with the screen and without)? There might be a small amount of EQ and trim change. If not, this situation may require a PEQ. Some PEQs have memories (scenes) that are selectable after being created and saved. Or you could just prioritize and calibrate with the screen and take what you get without it. Anybody faced this?

YOu bring up an interesting point. I'm currently playing with 2 sets of speakers; A-B'ing them. It would be very nice to have 2 "memories" on the Audyssey for situations like these. Something to consider for the future maybe...
GetGray is offline  
post #16834 of 71740 Old 07-28-2009, 06:17 AM
Wireless member
 
pepar's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Quintana Roo ... in my mind
Posts: 24,909
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 17 Post(s)
Liked: 131
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cam Man View Post

Is there a means with Audyssey to have AT screen compensation (oxymoron ) and no screen compensation user selectable in a system that is used both ways (with the screen and without)? There might be a small amount of EQ and trim change. If not, this situation may require a PEQ. Some PEQs have memories (scenes) that are selectable after being created and saved. Or you could just prioritize and calibrate with the screen and take what you get without it. Anybody faced this?

Quote:
Originally Posted by GetGray View Post

YOu bring up an interesting point. I'm currently playing with 2 sets of speakers; A-B'ing them. It would be very nice to have 2 "memories" on the Audyssey for situations like these. Something to consider for the future maybe...

Presently, the only way I know of doing this is to use the Pro Kit to create, store and load different curves for the various speaker configurations, screen up/down, masking in/out, music/cinema, etc.

I have the same dilemma with swapping a hi-res multichannel speaker config and my regular 7.1 cinema configuration.
pepar is online now  
post #16835 of 71740 Old 07-28-2009, 06:25 AM
AVS Addicted Member
 
millerwill's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Berkeley, CA
Posts: 11,347
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 7 Post(s)
Liked: 24
Quote:
Originally Posted by av-ra View Post

The guy whose been dissing MultEQ XT's bass region correction abilities is back....

As recommended I averaged my sub's response with and without my manually-set BFD PEQ engaged across the same 8 listening positions as that used for my Audyssey setup. I used my same RABOS SPL meter and 1/8th octave sine wave CD that was used for setting the BFD up. Here's what I found:

100 to 70Hz - Not much difference, which is not surprising given that none of my PEQ settings are in this range. Initially I did see some differences but found this to be due to the extreme position sensitivity of the readings in this range (i.e., a matter of inches can yield variations of +/-1 dB or more).

70 to 40Hz:
  • Audyssey Only - The response increased 6dB by 63Hz and remained there +/1dB down to 40Hz.
  • Audyssey + PEQ - The response increased more gradually, not reaching +5dB until ~46Hz.
Below 40Hz:
  • Audyssey Only - The response increased another 4dB @ 30Hz (for a total of +10dB vs. 100Hz).
  • Audyssey + PEQ - The response increased another 2dB @ 30Hz (for a total of +7dB vs. 100Hz).
The best spin I can put on the above is that the differences are definitely not as significant as those measured from only my main listening position. I also noticed a greater variation in listening position SPL's with the PEQ engaged (which definitely shows the weakness in a manually tweaked PEQ using single location measurements).

The bad news is I continue to measure even greater differences from my main listening position (i.e., with Audyssey alone there is a +3dB peak at 63Hz that isn't there with my PEQ engaged). So, I will continue to trust my ears and neanderthal test equipment and conclude that my 18 year old Velodyne sub and 17' square HT room needs all the help they can get.

All of the above may become moot because my new Denon 3808 and speaker upgrades points to the sub as the weak link in my system...which I intend to upgrade soon with a Rythmik in hope that its more controlled behavior might mean I can retire the BFD. I'm sure you'll be waiting with bated breath for my post reporting on how that goes.

Well, I for one have enjoyed and benefitted from hearing about your experiences.

I have a new Seaton SubMersive arriving next week, and have also ordered a SMS-1 (for a great price now at Vanns). The SMS-1's on screen display will be helpful to compare the result I get from MultEQ XT (via an Onkyo 805) alone, the SMS-1 alone, and the two together. Vanns allows 2 weeks for a no-fault return, so this should give me enough time to see how useful I find it, and if it is worth having in addition to MultEQ XT.
millerwill is offline  
post #16836 of 71740 Old 07-28-2009, 06:29 AM
Wireless member
 
pepar's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Quintana Roo ... in my mind
Posts: 24,909
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 17 Post(s)
Liked: 131
Quote:
Originally Posted by yankee14 View Post

I will be doing the Audyssey check either tomorrow or wednesday.
I have the Denon AVR-1910
(1)
There is a difference of opinion as to the mic being at ear level or at the top of a couch if the back of the couch is higher.
Common sense (preference) would tell me to place it at my ear level.
It seems it would boast the rears.
However I have ceiling rears (4.5 ft behind) so would that also effect where the mic should be placed : ear or top of couch height ?

The mic should be at ear level unless that would prevent the mic from "seeing" all of the speakers and/or cause sound reflected from the seating surface to be reflected into the mic. so raising the mic is appropriate in these cases. If you deduce from this that the listeners' EARS should also be above the couch back, you'd be right. But that's a whole 'nother subject.

Quote:


(2)
Unfortunately my center and left and right speakers are above the 58" tv and therefore above my ear level.
I was directed to this thread to find how to handle that issue.
Unfortunately I looked and got weary eyed trying to find it.
Is it possible for someone who has this same issue to give me some direction as to how that might effect the height of the Mic.

Again, both the mic and listeners' ears benefit from the same thing: They should be as close to on-axis vis-a-vis the front speakers. Usually, this involves tilting a center speaker up or down, and toeing left/right speakers in to aim at the geographical center of the listening area.
pepar is online now  
post #16837 of 71740 Old 07-28-2009, 06:33 AM
Wireless member
 
pepar's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Quintana Roo ... in my mind
Posts: 24,909
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 17 Post(s)
Liked: 131
Quote:
Originally Posted by millerwill View Post

Well, I for one have enjoyed and benefitted from hearing about your experiences.

I do as well. His posts are like mini-cliffhangers.

Quote:


I have a new Seaton SubMersive arriving next week, and have also ordered a SMS-1 (for a great price now at Vanns). The SMS-1's on screen display will be helpful to compare the result I get from MultEQ XT (via an Onkyo 805) alone, the SMS-1 alone, and the two together. Vanns allows 2 weeks for a no-fault return, so this should give me enough time to see how useful I find it, and if it is worth having in addition to MultEQ XT.

Wooo-HOOO, that's a killer sub. It will be interesting to hear your comments on the two correction schemes.
pepar is online now  
post #16838 of 71740 Old 07-28-2009, 07:56 AM
AVS Special Member
 
audyssey's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Los Angeles
Posts: 4,150
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by GetGray View Post

YOu bring up an interesting point. I'm currently playing with 2 sets of speakers; A-B'ing them. It would be very nice to have 2 "memories" on the Audyssey for situations like these. Something to consider for the future maybe...

Yes, I agree. This is something we have been asking from our licensees for quite some time. Unfortunately it has not happened because of the significant cost of the additional memory required to store multiple settings.

Chris

Join me for Audyssey Tech Talk on Facebook here.
Follow me @ChrisAudyssey on Twitter here.
audyssey is offline  
post #16839 of 71740 Old 07-28-2009, 08:19 AM
AVS Addicted Member
 
millerwill's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Berkeley, CA
Posts: 11,347
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 7 Post(s)
Liked: 24
Quote:
Originally Posted by pepar View Post

I do as well. His posts are like mini-cliffhangers.


Wooo-HOOO, that's a killer sub. It will be interesting to hear your comments on the two correction schemes.

The SubMersive is replacing a SVS PB10-ISD that I've had for 4 yrs, so you can imagine the smile I will have on my face. The PB10 was my first sub, though, and for the price, and in a modest size room such as mine (~2000 cu ft), it is a superb product. I have thoroughly enjoyed having had it for these years. But I was at 'fugueness' get-together several weeks ago here in Berkeley, and the SubMersives are just from a different planet; I was hooked.
millerwill is offline  
post #16840 of 71740 Old 07-28-2009, 08:49 AM
Senior Member
 
av-ra's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 262
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by millerwill View Post

Well, I for one have enjoyed and benefitted from hearing about your experiences.

I have a new Seaton SubMersive arriving next week, and have also ordered a SMS-1 (for a great price now at Vanns). The SMS-1's on screen display will be helpful to compare the result I get from MultEQ XT (via an Onkyo 805) alone, the SMS-1 alone, and the two together. Vanns allows 2 weeks for a no-fault return, so this should give me enough time to see how useful I find it, and if it is worth having in addition to MultEQ XT.

Thanks - please report back with your results (I am interested in finding something that bridges the gap between my crude RABOS/BFD system and the Denon's "black box" implementation of Audyssey in the bass frequency range). So if I understand things, you can use the SMS as a bass response anaylzer to see what things look like before any EQ'ing, after running your Onkyo's Audyssey setup (given that I assume the Onkyo 805 doesn't show you what it did, at least in the bass region) and then after setting up the SMS-1. BTW - why'd you choose the SMS-1 vs. the similar Audyssey-based products (it looks like the SMS provides a mix of auto and manual tools, while the Audyssey-based products seem to continue the practice of not allowing the user to tweak any EQ corrections it makes)?
av-ra is offline  
post #16841 of 71740 Old 07-28-2009, 08:50 AM
AVS Special Member
 
Cam Man's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2000
Location: Tucson, AZ & Los Angeles,CA, USA
Posts: 2,417
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2 Post(s)
Liked: 78
Quote:
Originally Posted by pepar View Post

Presently, the only way I know of doing this is to use the Pro Kit to create, store and load different curves for the various speaker configurations, screen up/down, masking in/out, music/cinema, etc.

I anticipated that, but are those stored curves user-selectable once stored?

I would think that you might get lucky and be able to get by nicely with possibly doing the Audyssey calibraiton without the screen, then using Flat when using the screen. The only problem would be the 1-2dB drop in level of screen speakers. That may not be such a problem if you don't mind doing a bit of channel trim adjustment...but that would be less than convenient.

I have an Ashly Protea 4.24PS PEQ that could be used for this. For one situation (the Audyssey calibration), I would have all the filters off, measure the response in that mode, then deploy the screen and remeasure. Then tweak the Ashly to emulate the Audyssey response. There is also gain adjustment for each channel on the Ashly.

FWIW, the Ashly is an excellent PEQ for any initial sub/LFE response work. The 4.24 has four channels which can be used for L,C,R, and LFE. As I remember, it has 12 filters per channel, gain, delay by distance, even other things that wouldn't be used in this application such as compression/limiting. It uses a laptop application to control, but extremely flexible. Ashly can provide a rotoray selctor that can be connected to provide the ability to select stored profiles. This is a little low in sophistication, but the unit is actually designed to work as a slave to a main unit that supplies presets. The rotary switch is convenient to those that use the slave as a stand-alone unit.
Cam Man is offline  
post #16842 of 71740 Old 07-28-2009, 09:22 AM
Senior Member
 
Yosef 615's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Bartlesville, OK
Posts: 214
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
So, my Denon AVR-1909 has been killing drivers in my eD A5-350. I'm currently using Audyssey Multi-EQ and Dynamic Volume. I have manually set the subwoofer channel to 0. The crossover on the sub is set to max as to rely on the receivers settings and the phase is set to 0. I run the volume between 50 and 75% on the sub. This is the second sub driver that has been destroyed through damaged spider suspension caused by over excursion. I listed to Blu-ray movies via HDMI from my Panasonic BD-55 at -10dB from reference (0) on my Denon. Any suggestions on settings to keep from destroying sub drivers. The amp in the sub has a built-in subsonic filter, so it shouldn't be creating clipped signal, but it will accept a clipped signal as an input. Is my only recourse to decrease the sub channel level to -6 or something lower than 0? Any suggested settings or anyone that's had similar issues?

Also, all speaker/sub crossover/low pass filter settings are set to 60Hz or 80Hz.

eD's thought was that Audyssey may be overboosting frequencies that are at the limits of my subs ability (Frequency Response (+/-3dB) - 18-100Hz).

Sub specs:
Driver Size 15"
Driver Quantity 1
Driver Excursion 23mm
Total Driver Linear Displacement 3331.04cm³
Room Tuning 20Hz
Frequency Response (+/-3dB) 18-100Hz
Amplifier RMS Power 500W
Cabinet Type Vented
Shipping Weight 108 lbs
Internal Size 4.70ft³
External Size 6.37ft³
Width 19.00"
Height 25.00"
Depth 24.75"
Vent Size 2 x 4"
Amplifier Voltage 115
Included Crossover Yes
Crossover Frequencies 35-180Hz
Phase Switch Yes
Line Level Input Yes
RCA Level Input Yes
Level Control Yes

XBox Live Gamertag: Vash615

Boomer Sooner!!!
Yosef 615 is offline  
post #16843 of 71740 Old 07-28-2009, 09:32 AM
AVS Special Member
 
primetimeguy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: St. Paul, MN
Posts: 3,656
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 50 Post(s)
Liked: 126
Quote:
Originally Posted by Yosef 615 View Post

I have manually set the subwoofer channel to 0.


What did Audyssey set it to?
primetimeguy is online now  
post #16844 of 71740 Old 07-28-2009, 09:35 AM
AVS Addicted Member
 
Kal Rubinson's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: NYC + Connecticut
Posts: 28,384
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 27 Post(s)
Liked: 115
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cam Man View Post

I anticipated that, but are those stored curves user-selectable once stored?

Nope. The only product that does this at the moment, afaik, is the Wisdom Audio SC-1.
http://www.wisdomaudio.com/products_sc-1.php

Kal Rubinson

"Music in the Round"
Senior Contributing Editor, Stereophile
http://www.stereophile.com/category/music-round

Kal Rubinson is online now  
post #16845 of 71740 Old 07-28-2009, 10:11 AM
Advanced Member
 
Beta Tester's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 604
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by brock1 View Post

http://www.frontendaudio.com/On_Stag...9999-04642.htm

$14 to ship. It was the cheapest store I found that will ship to Canada
I couldn't find it online in Canada or at any pro music stores or camera shops here in Ottawa. It's definitley an oddball part.

I ordered the CM01 adapter from frontendaudio, and was surprised that they shipped it UPS even though I explicitly stated FedEx Ground. As Canadians who have used regular UPS shipping knows, they are notorious for charging $50 to clear customs which other shippers such as USPS do not. This doesn't make sense on a $20 item. I make it a personal policy that I will not deal with any retailer that only ships UPS to Canada. I also do not bid on any eBay items that insists on shipping via UPS.

When I phoned frontendaudio, they told me that the web-site is wrong, and that FedEx cannot ship to Canada (this makes no sense to me). I told her that UPS is not even listed as an option for shipment to Canada on their web-site, and that if I knew they would use UPS I wouldn't have ordered from them in the first place.

I will refuse shipment when it comes, and order it from another web-site. Personally, I will not order from frontendaudio again.

As an aside, does UPS pay a bonus to the seller for using them? I notice lots of sellers on eBay that only ship via UPS.
Beta Tester is offline  
post #16846 of 71740 Old 07-28-2009, 10:12 AM
AVS Special Member
 
mogorf's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Budapest, Hungary
Posts: 4,214
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 67 Post(s)
Liked: 96
Quote:
Originally Posted by audyssey View Post

Yes, I agree. This is something we have been asking from our licensees for quite some time. Unfortunately it has not happened because of the significant cost of the additional memory required to store multiple settings.

You know, I'd even be ready to pay a little extra for those memory features to store 3-4 settings of the Audyssey curves (well, if those costs are not that significant as you say, Chris).

It would surely make the initial set-up much more convenient being able to do A-Bing afterwards, instead of rerunning the whole procedure again and again, and later on I would surely use one of those memories for a X-mas setting. It could be very handy every December when a big X-mas tree occupies a substantial part of the living room while some furnitures (armchairs) are relocated during the season, spoiling the Audyssey filters' responses. Or does a X-mas tree not do such an evil thing?

Anyone with X-mas setup experience?
Chris?
mogorf is online now  
post #16847 of 71740 Old 07-28-2009, 10:13 AM
AVS Addicted Member
 
batpig's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: San Diego
Posts: 23,700
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 82 Post(s)
Liked: 887
Quote:
Originally Posted by primetimeguy View Post

What did Audyssey set it to?

funny, he double-posted this question in a Denon thread and I just asked him the same thing! that was of course my first thought....


Quote:


So, my Denon AVR-1909 has been killing drivers in my eD A5-350.

jumping to inflammatory conclusions is a great way to start off a help request

batpig's "Denon-to-English Dictionary"
Setup Guide and FAQ
http://batpigworld.com/

Become a fan "batpigworld.com" on Facebook!
batpig is offline  
post #16848 of 71740 Old 07-28-2009, 10:14 AM
Senior Member
 
av-ra's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 262
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by pepar View Post

I do as well. His posts are like mini-cliffhangers. ....

Yeah, though I feel like I'm still standing on the edge of that cliff unconvinced that I should take the Audyssey-only leap of faith, but not getting a sophisticated-enough improvement from my BFD to back away from the cliff. Perhaps my new sub will make it moot and, if not, maybe the report on the SMS will point to another step to take....

If only the Denon/Audyssey bass correction approach wasn't such a "black box" I might have already moved on with my HT existence....
av-ra is offline  
post #16849 of 71740 Old 07-28-2009, 10:15 AM
AVS Addicted Member
 
batpig's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: San Diego
Posts: 23,700
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 82 Post(s)
Liked: 887
av-ra -- did you do the same measurements with both Audyssey and PEQ disabled (i.e. the "control" measurement as a reference)?

it could be cool if you could post the "averaged" response graph for the 8 measurements, for each of the three situations (no correction, MultEQ XT only, MultEQ XT + PEQ)

batpig's "Denon-to-English Dictionary"
Setup Guide and FAQ
http://batpigworld.com/

Become a fan "batpigworld.com" on Facebook!
batpig is offline  
post #16850 of 71740 Old 07-28-2009, 10:23 AM
AVS Special Member
 
Cam Man's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2000
Location: Tucson, AZ & Los Angeles,CA, USA
Posts: 2,417
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2 Post(s)
Liked: 78
Quote:
Originally Posted by mogorf View Post

Anyone with X-mas setup experience?
Chris?

Oh, yeah. The absence of that "acoustic treatment" removed to make room for the tree makes a surprising difference. It's just one of those things I tollerate for a month or so.
Cam Man is offline  
post #16851 of 71740 Old 07-28-2009, 10:27 AM
AVS Addicted Member
 
Kal Rubinson's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: NYC + Connecticut
Posts: 28,384
Mentioned: 1 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 27 Post(s)
Liked: 115
Quote:
Originally Posted by GetGray View Post

YOu bring up an interesting point. I'm currently playing with 2 sets of speakers; A-B'ing them. It would be very nice to have 2 "memories" on the Audyssey for situations like these. Something to consider for the future maybe...

Quote:
Originally Posted by audyssey View Post

Yes, I agree. This is something we have been asking from our licensees for quite some time. Unfortunately it has not happened because of the significant cost of the additional memory required to store multiple settings.

Would be nice to see it in the Sound Equalizer, even if just to set the bar for others.

Kal Rubinson

"Music in the Round"
Senior Contributing Editor, Stereophile
http://www.stereophile.com/category/music-round

Kal Rubinson is online now  
post #16852 of 71740 Old 07-28-2009, 10:32 AM
AVS Special Member
 
mogorf's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Budapest, Hungary
Posts: 4,214
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 67 Post(s)
Liked: 96
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cam Man View Post

Oh, yeah. The absence of that "acoustic treatment" removed to make room for the tree makes a surprising difference. It's just one of those things I tollerate for a month or so.

Hi Cam Man, wouldn't it be nice to have that additional X-mas button for just a little extra on your AVR to have a full 12 months all-year-'round Audyssey treat?

Thanks for your reply.
mogorf is online now  
post #16853 of 71740 Old 07-28-2009, 12:16 PM
Senior Member
 
av-ra's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 262
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by batpig View Post

av-ra -- did you do the same measurements with both Audyssey and PEQ disabled (i.e. the "control" measurement as a reference)?

it could be cool if you could post the "averaged" response graph for the 8 measurements, for each of the three situations (no correction, MultEQ XT only, MultEQ XT + PEQ)

Other than the "I'm sick of this" syndrome...great idea and I'd certainly be happy to entertain your request. Back with the third result later tonite....

As for posting the graphs - I did it by hand (I'm a to-be-pitied REW-less kind of guy) so it won't look pretty. Perhaps I'll spruce 'em up and scan 'em.
av-ra is offline  
post #16854 of 71740 Old 07-28-2009, 12:33 PM
AVS Addicted Member
 
millerwill's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Berkeley, CA
Posts: 11,347
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 7 Post(s)
Liked: 24
Quote:
Originally Posted by av-ra View Post

Thanks - please report back with your results (I am interested in finding something that bridges the gap between my crude RABOS/BFD system and the Denon's "black box" implementation of Audyssey in the bass frequency range). So if I understand things, you can use the SMS as a bass response anaylzer to see what things look like before any EQ'ing, after running your Onkyo's Audyssey setup (given that I assume the Onkyo 805 doesn't show you what it did, at least in the bass region) and then after setting up the SMS-1. BTW - why'd you choose the SMS-1 vs. the similar Audyssey-based products (it looks like the SMS provides a mix of auto and manual tools, while the Audyssey-based products seem to continue the practice of not allowing the user to tweak any EQ corrections it makes)?

Yes, one of the frustrating things about Onkyo's MultEQ XT is that you don't get a chance to look at the results; one gets what Audyssey gives you, take it or leave it, no tweaking allowed (except for changing the sub trim level, of course). And I find--with admittedly rather crude measuring devices--that XT does not remove some of the strong resonances I have (presumably due to the room). I have played with a BFD (and sinewaves) on my PB10 off and on for a couple of years, with varying results; but I am familiar enough with this procedure that using the SMS-1 should be easy, and MUCH more efficient. So yes, the SMS-1 seems like it will be extremely handy to see the results of Audyssey, PEQ'ing with the SMS-1, or even PEQ'ing with the old BFD. The final reason going with a SMS-1 is Vanns' new price, and the possibility of returning it (with full refund) within 15 days if I decide I don't want it, or within 30 days and a re-stocking fee; SVS's AS-EQ1 is almost $300 more, and as I understand it, it is still not a 'tweakable' system.
millerwill is offline  
post #16855 of 71740 Old 07-28-2009, 12:47 PM
Wireless member
 
pepar's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Quintana Roo ... in my mind
Posts: 24,909
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 17 Post(s)
Liked: 131
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cam Man View Post

I anticipated that, but are those stored curves user-selectable once stored?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kal Rubinson View Post

Nope. The only product that does this at the moment, afaik, is the Wisdom Audio SC-1.
http://www.wisdomaudio.com/products_sc-1.php

Not user-selectable after they are stored. User-selectable in the sense that after they are created, a different curve must be uploaded. Not as elegant as user-selectable in memory. But I'm willing to do it that way.
pepar is online now  
post #16856 of 71740 Old 07-28-2009, 01:02 PM
Wireless member
 
pepar's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Quintana Roo ... in my mind
Posts: 24,909
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 17 Post(s)
Liked: 131
Quote:
Originally Posted by millerwill View Post

Yes, one of the frustrating things about Onkyo's MultEQ XT is that you don't get a chance to look at the results; one gets what Audyssey gives you, take it or leave it, no tweaking allowed (except for changing the sub trim level, of course). And I find--with admittedly rather crude measuring devices--that XT does not remove some of the strong resonances I have (presumably due to the room). I have played with a BFD (and sinewaves) on my PB10 off and on for a couple of years, with varying results; but I am familiar enough with this procedure that using the SMS-1 should be easy, and MUCH more efficient. So yes, the SMS-1 seems like it will be extremely handy to see the results of Audyssey, PEQ'ing with the SMS-1, or even PEQ'ing with the old BFD. The final reason going with a SMS-1 is Vanns' new price, and the possibility of returning it (with full refund) within 15 days if I decide I don't want it, or within 30 days and a re-stocking fee; SVS's AS-EQ1 is almost $300 more, and as I understand it, it is still not a 'tweakable' system.

Having come from using pro audio gear in my theater with tweaking options out the wazoo and *still* not achieving results that SOUNDED good, I am so happy with Audyssey's results that I could . . . well, let's just leave it at I'm happy.
pepar is online now  
post #16857 of 71740 Old 07-28-2009, 01:24 PM
AVS Addicted Member
 
millerwill's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Berkeley, CA
Posts: 11,347
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 7 Post(s)
Liked: 24
Quote:
Originally Posted by pepar View Post

Having come from using pro audio gear in my theater with tweaking options out the wazoo and *still* not achieving results that SOUNDED good, I am so happy with Audyssey's results that I could . . . well, let's just leave it at I'm happy.

I may very well come to this same conclusion (with my not having had anything like your experience); in fact, I hope I do, and then I'll return the SMS-1. But I have to convince myself of this.
millerwill is offline  
post #16858 of 71740 Old 07-28-2009, 01:33 PM
Wireless member
 
pepar's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Quintana Roo ... in my mind
Posts: 24,909
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 17 Post(s)
Liked: 131
Quote:
Originally Posted by millerwill View Post

I may very well come to this same conclusion (with my not having had anything like your experience); in fact, I hope I do, and then I'll return the SMS-1. But I have to convince myself of this.

I've played with an SMS-1 and it definitely improved my sub performance better than my PEQ with REW. I never compared it to MultEQ XT, but my sense is that MultEQ XT was a wee bit better on the bottom, plus it is a complete solution for room correction. As for using something in addition to MultEQ XT on the bottom, I have been playing with an AS-EQ1. If I can find the time, I'll add my Pro Kit to the mix soon and overlay that with the AS-EQ1.
pepar is online now  
post #16859 of 71740 Old 07-28-2009, 01:38 PM
AVS Special Member
 
toddRiffic's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Puyallup, WA
Posts: 1,102
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 24
Quote:
Originally Posted by Yosef 615 View Post

So, my Denon AVR-1909 has been killing drivers in my eD A5-350. I'm currently using Audyssey Multi-EQ and Dynamic Volume. I have manually set the subwoofer channel to 0. The crossover on the sub is set to max as to rely on the receivers settings and the phase is set to 0. I run the volume between 50 and 75% on the sub. This is the second sub driver that has been destroyed through damaged spider suspension caused by over excursion. I listed to Blu-ray movies via HDMI from my Panasonic BD-55 at -10dB from reference (0) on my Denon. Any suggestions on settings to keep from destroying sub drivers. The amp in the sub has a built-in subsonic filter, so it shouldn't be creating clipped signal, but it will accept a clipped signal as an input. Is my only recourse to decrease the sub channel level to -6 or something lower than 0? Any suggested settings or anyone that's had similar issues?

Also, all speaker/sub crossover/low pass filter settings are set to 60Hz or 80Hz.

eD's thought was that Audyssey may be overboosting frequencies that are at the limits of my subs ability (Frequency Response (+/-3dB) - 18-100Hz).

Hey Yosef,

It sounds like you really need to back down the subs volume knob down quite a bit. I have a 1909 and if I had my subs knob at 50 to 75% with the sub level on the 1909 at 0 and Dynamic volume on, I would hear nothing but bass like "boom car".

I love Dynamic volume and use it all the time for TV and movies, but on my 1909 it significantly increases my subs output to the point of where the subs level settings that would be fine without Dynamic EQ/Vol engaged would be unbearably bass heavy with them on. If the local newscasters voice rumbles like jaba the hut, it's time to turn the sub down!
toddRiffic is offline  
post #16860 of 71740 Old 07-28-2009, 01:44 PM
AVS Club Gold
 
counsil's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Kansas City, Missouri
Posts: 1,979
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 13
Chris,

A little while back you confirmed that it would be possible to free up the sub resolution in the AVR and the resolution could be distributed across all the other channels when using an SVS AS-EQ1. I realize this will probably never come to fruition... However...

How about freeing up the sub resolution in the AVR and distributing it across all the other channels (even if just the mains and center) when using an Audyssey Sub Equalizer and MultEQ Pro (on AVR and/or Sound Equalizer)? Since MultEQ Pro uploads the filters, does it have the 'power' to do this without a firmware update? If so, do you see this functionality ever being added? I am thinking if the sub filter cannot be eliminated all together, it could very small (and flat), then all the other filters could be expanded with more resolution points.

I realize I'm dreaming here, please just play along.

Never argue with an idiot; they drag you down to their level and beat you with experience.

Counsil Basement HT
counsil is offline  
Reply Receivers, Amps, and Processors

Tags
Audyssey , Receivers Amplifiers , Kef Kht1005 2se 5 1 Subwoofer Satellite System With C4 Subwoofer Gloss White , 5 6 7 1 7 2 Or 8 1 8 2 One Or Two Subwoofer Compatible 16 Banana Post 2 Rca Speaker Wall Plate For H
Gear in this thread

    Thread Tools
    Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
    Email this Page Email this Page


    Forum Jump: 

    Posting Rules  
    You may not post new threads
    You may not post replies
    You may not post attachments
    You may not edit your posts

    BB code is On
    Smilies are On
    [IMG] code is On
    HTML code is Off
    Trackbacks are Off
    Pingbacks are Off
    Refbacks are Off