Originally Posted by audyssey
I was told they tried it on a 1909.
I keep staring at your data and an starting to wonder if what we are seeing is the difference between 48 kHz and 96 kHz. With some imagination, the pink curve can be shifted to the right and stretched to start looking like the red curve. So, if the sampling rates of the signals are different but in both cases are going through the 48k MultEQ filters this could happen.
Can you please remind us of your test rig? What settings are you using in the test signals, etc.
Hi Chris, all,
I got a new AVR-590 at Best Buy Friday to setup/check and then return, because I just wanted to see one that actually worked right and be totally certain that it wasn't something else specific to my setup (but what could it be?!). I wasn't sure what I was going to hear, and was afraid it wouldn't be right.
But like it only took me a couple minutes to find that the refurb was messed up, I discovered almost as quickly that the lowest-end 590 works flawlessly with MultEQ as it should! I was gradual checking it.
First made sure bitstream/PCM sounded the same with MultEQ Off (like the 1909s do), then MultEQ enabled (was like, "Wow, they're the same!"), then with Dynamic EQ ("Yep, for sure!!!"). Then later the graph of the output gave absolute evidence of what my ears already told me: bitstream/PCM actually remained the same with MultEQ in use.
You already know that bitstream/PCM sound/graph the same with MultEQ Off, so no need to post that again
, but here's the other 2 for comparison with the refurb 1909
I had to set the volume 8-9dB higher than both 1909s to get the same signal level on the graphs. Does that seem like a weird difference when they should be calibrated for reference level??
The 590's Audyssey set the speakers 4-5dB lower than any 1909 run, and the sub 10dB lower.MultEQ On: PCM vs Bitstream
(Plus the 2 MEQ Off measurements averaged and smoothed)
You said about the previous graph: "With some imagination, the pink curve can be shifted to the right and stretched to start looking like the red curve.
" Well I was thinking they actually looked more like flipped/mirror images of each other.
And the analog sweep for the sub this time:
Stuff sounds nicer than ever to me with the movie scenes I checked (even compared to PCM with the 1909s, which is pretty close to correct, but still a bit off, IMO). Maybe it's just my imagination, but I'd say less fatiguing/harsh. Another amazing part? I've left Dynamic EQ/Volume On with regular TV stuff, which generated too much rumbling back when I last tried it on the 1909. Now, not a bit (comparatively) -- probably some parts are getting boosted more than they should (mix problem) but never once have I thought, "Wow, that's annoying bass boom."
Why is that? Well, most of the channels I'd ever be on are HD ones, which of course only send out Dolby Digital, even if not 5.1, and what is that? A bitstream
! Since the 1909s are screwing up bitstream decoding bigtime, I'd say that's the answer. And also every TV show I've seriously watched (all HD) since getting the 1909 has had its audio ruined!
After calling Customer Service again after they mentioned "setup issue," which was a complete was of time ("Can't think of a setting to check." "Don't really know of a setting that it would be."
), I replied to the e-mail again asking if they even reproduced the problem (didn't say), are they going to do anything to fix it, I shouldn't have to pay to ship it again for the same problem that they didn't even fix or bother to check the refurb for, etc. Response:
"I have asked our senior management to look at this. We will also be contacting Audyessy
(sic) for further information.
I will get back to you as soon as I hear from them.
So I mentioned that the Audyssey Founder and CTO posts here and said it "is among the strangest issues I have come across
." Also that you had already contacted Denon engineering in Japan and they couldn't reproduce my problem. Response:
"Our senior management will be contacting the engineering group in Japan to confirm or not confirm that this is a problem.
Just to clarify, we cannot rely on any forums for accurate information.
I will get back to you as soon as we hear from Japan.
Wow about the forums!
I get what's meant I guess (disclaimer, etc.), but that sounds pretty stupid. So don't believe anything Chris or anyone else says here!
I guess one thing that they're right with so far about Chris not being accurate is from the same post where you stated, "I think that only Denon can help you."
Amazing that a most basic/core feature seems like a dream to have working correctly at this point!
I don't think Audyssey would be very pleased with MultEQ usage being broken if
Denon doesn't care and/or continues to ignore the problem?
BTW, since I've had 2 problem units, I'm now confident that others are affected as well, probably unknown to the user, so I made a new thread: Warning for Denon owners: your xx09/x89 AVR may have a major bug
. I'd love to know their results, especially correct ones. Do you guys have access to one of the 09 models, Chris? Or has one been used/checked/tested "personally" before...?