The "Official" Denon AVR-3808CI Thread - Page 28 - AVS Forum
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post #811 of 20256 Old 08-24-2007, 11:09 AM
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Originally Posted by bwclark View Post

Due to the various issues with the new Denon CI AVRs, I will be refusing delivery of my 3808CI on Wednesday and have it returned to J&R.

Once Denon provides updates that correct these issues then I will be reconsidering a purchase.....but not until that happens. It is unfortunate that we as avid consumers must be the trial horses for these new releases. They should be more thoroughly checked out before release.

I have notified Denon of my non purchase as well as a link to the bug Thread, so hopefully they get the picture soon.......Denon, can you hear me now?

Well. Awesome. Sticking it to the Man, I assume.

Dude, you hear of 30-day trial? Or are you in the habit of taking everything you read on the "interweb" as gospel truth?

Sometimes you got to $hit or get off the pot!

Groovily,
Me
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post #812 of 20256 Old 08-24-2007, 11:14 AM
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One difference I noticed between the Onkyo 875 and the Denon 3808 was on the Onkyo, if I switched to an HDMI source (like cbl tv) and then switched to the radio, the tv picture stayed on (which is what I wanted). On the Denon, the picture went away when I switched to a strictly audio source. There's probably a way to have the picture from a video source while playing audio from a audio source.

Any ideas???
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post #813 of 20256 Old 08-24-2007, 11:22 AM
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Is it just me or does the GUI only work when overlaid over live video?

I bring up the GUI on my TV attached via a HDMI to DVI cable (Panny TH-65PF9UK), and as soon as I change to an input that does not currently display any video, like the CD input, the screen goes blank. I then have to walk over the the receiver and use that display to continue to navigate.

My sources are as follows (all connected via HDMI):

PS3 (1080p60)
HD-A1 (1080i60)
HTPC (1080p60)
DirecTV HR20 (1080i60)

I have the scaler disabled in my 3808, but turning it on doesn't make a difference. I have the output set to 1080p.
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post #814 of 20256 Old 08-24-2007, 11:46 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by meyrowitz View Post

One difference I noticed between the Onkyo 875 and the Denon 3808 was on the Onkyo, if I switched to an HDMI source (like cbl tv) and then switched to the radio, the tv picture stayed on (which is what I wanted). On the Denon, the picture went away when I switched to a strictly audio source. There's probably a way to have the picture from a video source while playing audio from a audio source.

Any ideas???

Just you... I get a "denon" logo on my screen when nothing is passing and I can gui it right up.
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post #815 of 20256 Old 08-24-2007, 11:47 AM
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Originally Posted by bplewis24 View Post

Would any kind soul clue me in as to what it takes to be THX certified? What is the significance of it, in general? Just a brief description in laymen's terms will suffice.

And if somebody could kindly point me in the right direction as to where I can read more on it I would appreciate it.

Brandon

You meet some minimum specs and they prove that you do and you pay George Lucas big $$$'s and you are now THX certified. I think if my pencil were fancy enough and I paid George some bucks I could be the proud owner of a THX certified pencil.
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post #816 of 20256 Old 08-24-2007, 11:49 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bwclark View Post

Due to the various issues with the new Denon CI AVRs, I will be refusing delivery of my 3808CI on Wednesday and have it returned to J&R.

Once Denon provides updates that correct these issues then I will be reconsidering a purchase.....but not until that happens. It is unfortunate that we as avid consumers must be the trial horses for these new releases. They should be more thoroughly checked out before release.

I have notified Denon of my non purchase as well as a link to the bug Thread, so hopefully they get the picture soon.......Denon, can you hear me now?

You are missing out. Of course if you planned on doing a lot of the NET/USB then it would be a valid gripe... how they missed the blacking out of the gui is beyond me... what morons.
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post #817 of 20256 Old 08-24-2007, 12:15 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gordgal View Post

I live in Vancouver, Canada and am dismayed at the markup that the 3808 is being sold for in Canada (compared to the US$ MSRP).

Can anyone recommend a store close to the border (Bellingham, Seattle, etc.) that has the 3808 in stock and is reputable (good exchange/refund policy)?

Thanks

Gordon

Magnolia Audio Video

Lynnwood
425.775.7288
4201 196th SW
Lynnwood, WA 98036
2 in stock

Bellevue
425.747.0850
14404 NE 20th Street
Bellevue, WA 98007
3 in stock

I just called both of these stores. Ask them to match J&R (call J&R first to verify that their price is still at the pre-order price). They did price match for me, although I actually bought at the southcenter store.
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post #818 of 20256 Old 08-24-2007, 12:15 PM
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This unit is apparently not compatible with the Epson Powerlite Home Cinema 1080 front projector and the TiVo Series 3 DVR. I also had this issue with one of the new Sony HDMI receivers as well. The cable run to the projector is 20 feet and all cables being used are Monster. Any thoughts? I get no picture from the Series 3 to the projector unless it is connected DIRECTLY to the projector with that same 20ft. HDMI cable. AppleTV works when switched thru these receivers, incidentally. So it appears to be a TiVo Series 3 / Epson issue when combined with these receivers.

New! Sony(TM) Cereal w/VAIOberries!
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post #819 of 20256 Old 08-24-2007, 12:35 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ChromeAce View Post

This unit is apparently not compatible with the Epson Powerlite Home Cinema 1080 front projector and the TiVo Series 3 DVR. I also had this issue with one of the new Sony HDMI receivers as well. The cable run to the projector is 20 feet and all cables being used are Monster. Any thoughts? I get no picture from the Series 3 to the projector unless it is connected DIRECTLY to the projector with that same 20ft. HDMI cable. AppleTV works when switched thru these receivers, incidentally. So it appears to be a TiVo Series 3 / Epson issue when combined with these receivers.

I haven't had any problems with my Series 3 to my Sharp LCD. Well, I take that back - my Series 3 started rebooting every 20 minutes or so, but that's a bad Tivo hardware issue. It all worked fine for a while...
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post #820 of 20256 Old 08-24-2007, 01:07 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ChromeAce View Post

This unit is apparently not compatible with the Epson Powerlite Home Cinema 1080 front projector and the TiVo Series 3 DVR. I also had this issue with one of the new Sony HDMI receivers as well. The cable run to the projector is 20 feet and all cables being used are Monster. Any thoughts? I get no picture from the Series 3 to the projector unless it is connected DIRECTLY to the projector with that same 20ft. HDMI cable. AppleTV works when switched thru these receivers, incidentally. So it appears to be a TiVo Series 3 / Epson issue when combined with these receivers.

I haven't had any issues with my Tivo S3. What kind of cables are you using? There have been more than a few reports where people swapout their cables and everything works. Even though those same older cables work with other devices. Monoprice cables are the ones I haven't heard any issues from. You could get the 28AWG ones for all your needs and a 24AWG for that 20ft run. Wouldn't cost you all that much either.
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post #821 of 20256 Old 08-24-2007, 01:38 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FreddyW View Post

Well. Awesome. Sticking it to the Man, I assume.

Dude, you hear of 30-day trial? Or are you in the habit of taking everything you read on the "interweb" as gospel truth?

Sometimes you got to $hit or get off the pot!

Groovily,
Me


If you read the various threads about the 4308CI and 3808CI as well as the Bug Thread, you will quickly realize that something stinks in Denon Land, and it ain't my pot!

I have the selected the 3808CI as the best AVR that fits my needs, but I will not be purchasing something that does not works as advertised. There are problems that Denon needs to fix. If they fix'em then I'm in; if not I will go elsewhere. Pretty simple isn't it
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post #822 of 20256 Old 08-24-2007, 01:40 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by harrellnukeem View Post

You are missing out. Of course if you planned on doing a lot of the NET/USB then it would be a valid gripe... how they missed the blacking out of the gui is beyond me... what morons.

Exactly, it doesn't work correctly and I will be very happy to wait until it does with a Denon fix....if it comes?

Luckily, PClausen has the same HDTV as me and a 3808CI, so I can learn off his experience at this time:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showp...2&postcount=30

Since he is having issues, I prefer to wait until he give the "all Clear signal". I hope he gets it working.
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post #823 of 20256 Old 08-24-2007, 02:54 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bwclark View Post

If you read the various threads about the 4308CI and 3808CI as well as the Bug Thread, you will quickly realize that something stinks in Denon Land, and it ain't my pot!

bwclark of course it's your call and if you want to wait there's no harm with that. But I think you're overemphasizing the problems seen so far and maybe not realizing the number of glitches common with new releases. So far the number and severity of problems I've seen in the threads have been lower than I would have expected. Granted maybe I'm valuing certain things at lower levels than you are so maybe what's a minor nuisance to me is a dealbreaker to you (for example I have a networked media player so I'd never use the Denon for streaming music anyway).

And luckily we now have the option to update the receivers without needing to take them to a service center or mail them in for update. I believe that the problems seen so far can be addresses with firmware updates (ie they wouldn't need to be sent in for service or hardware replacement).

Erik

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post #824 of 20256 Old 08-24-2007, 03:03 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by erikk View Post

bwclark of course it's your call and if you want to wait there's no harm with that. But I think you're overemphasizing the problems seen so far and maybe not realizing the number of glitches common with new releases. So far the number and severity of problems I've seen in the threads have been lower than I would have expected. Granted maybe I'm valuing certain things at lower levels than you are so maybe what's a minor nuisance to me is a dealbreaker to you (for example I have a networked media player so I'd never use the Denon for streaming music anyway).

And luckily we now have the option to update the receivers without needing to take them to a service center or mail them in for update. I believe that the problems seen so far can be addresses with firmware updates (ie they wouldn't need to be sent in for service or hardware replacement).


Thanks for the thoughts Erikk,

If you look at the post just above yours you will find a link to a post by PClausen who has the same HDTV as mine. He is having difficulty with the HDMI>DVI and the GUI. Perhaps he is doing something wrong, but I prefer not to see these kinds of post especially when it involves the same equipment I would be using. I don't need these types of headaches that would result from this type of hassle.

I certainly hope and would expect Denon to make good on their equipment and provide updates that will remedy all problems that have been identified to date. For me, I prefer to wait until they make good on those promises.
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post #825 of 20256 Old 08-24-2007, 03:11 PM
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Unfortunately I don't think you can use HDMI handshake issues as a litmus test on any piece of gear. That's just a cluster F that could be caused by any piece of gear in your system or maybe even a bird farting as it flies overhead. We've seen plenty of people where one person has issues and another doesn't, using the same gear.

The GUI of course is all Denon. Hopefully they'll fix it soon.

If you don't mind waiting and one or more of the issues are a deal-breaker, then by all means wait until they're fixed. But I'm guessing by the time every possible issue every person has is fixed, you'll be considering whether it's worth waiting for the 3809 or 4309 and then the cycle will start all over.

Erik

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post #826 of 20256 Old 08-24-2007, 03:21 PM
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The HDMI>DVI and no GUI is a biggy for me....don't know about anyone else, but I would like to see PClausen give a two thumbs up that all is ok. I certainly will not accept having to get up and run over to the AVR display and work it from there.

The 3808CI is going to be fine once they get the problems corrected and I am confident that Denon will make good on their equipment. Just how long it will take is a big ?. I remember some of last years Pioneers and the LFE problem and an coming firmware fix that took many months to finally obtain. I don't need that with the 3808CI.

If something else comes along that I feel is a better fit for my needs then I will be happy to wait for my needs and expectations. Right now, Denon is not deliving as promised....no deal.
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post #827 of 20256 Old 08-24-2007, 03:22 PM
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I'm happy to report that my GUI now works on all inputs, even the ones with no video associated with them. Everything began working after I used the web interface to clean up all my settings (much easier to navigate than the on screen GUI IMHO.) Go figure.

I also deleted all the inputs I don't use. This way the input selector knob on the front of the AVR only scrolls through the inputs actually in use. Nice! Of course my 3 most frequently used inputs are also associated with the quick select buttons on the front. I plan to roll all this into my Harmony 880 so it won't really matter, but it is still a neat feature.
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post #828 of 20256 Old 08-24-2007, 03:25 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pclausen View Post

I'm happy to report that my GUI now works on all inputs, even the ones with no video associated with them. Everything began working after I used the web interface to clean up all my settings (much easier to navigate than the on screen GUI IMHO.) Go figure.

I also deleted all the inputs I don't use. This way the input selector knob on the front of the AVR only scrolls through the inputs actually in use. Nice! Of course my 3 most frequently used inputs are also associated with the quick select buttons on the front. Of course I plan to roll all this into my Harmony 880 so it won't really matter, but it is still a neat feature.

Thank you for the post! One down.....XX to go.

This has me feeling much better....humm...
I do have a Streamium player for internet radio, PC music, so maybe.......
I also have an XM mini tuner/dock on the way.......

Damn, I will reconsider.......
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post #829 of 20256 Old 08-24-2007, 06:05 PM
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The power off trick reliably brings my GUI back, but by chance, tonight I noticed another, less disruptive fix.

Just turn the Source Select knob one position to the right or to the left to restore the GUI. Then dial back to NET/USB. Voila! Note: changing source from the remote doesn't seem to have the same restorative effect...you have to actually rotate the Source Select knob to get the GUI back. Still awkward, but better than a complete power off.

Would be curious to know if this works for anyone else...
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post #830 of 20256 Old 08-24-2007, 07:14 PM
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ANOTHER BUG:

If you change any of the HDMI Setup i/p scaler options and then you run Audyssey, all the i/p scaler options are reverted to their defaults.

It happened to me twice already, can anyone else confirm this?
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post #831 of 20256 Old 08-24-2007, 07:55 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ryaneagon View Post

I have the Denon 3808ci and a sunfire signature sub, my question is, what should I set my crossover too, seeing that the denon and the sub both have crossovers? is there anyway to bypass the crossover on the denon (full signal) I have the sub crossed over at about 60hz and the denon crossed all the way up. My mains are klipsch rf-5 they are set to 60hz everything else is set to 80hz the sunfire can be adjusted between 35-100hz, I think it gets a little muddy when set above 60hz I know I have a gap between 60-80 but I don't seem to noticed when i do a freq drop using my rears and the sub. what do think is the best setting. Thanks for any help

You need to set your Sub's crossover as high as it will go (120Hz - 150Hz) and use the Denon to adjust the crossover. If you set both at 80Hz, you will "cascade" the crossovers which will result in a 3db - 6db suck out at 80Hz. I have Paradigm Studio 60.4s, matching Center and B&W LM1s for Rears. I have the Mains set at 40Hz, the Center at 60Hz and the Rears at 80Hz. I have no issues with Bass with this Receiver. By setting the Sub at Full Range you delegate the Crossover settings to the Denon. Hope this helps.
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post #832 of 20256 Old 08-24-2007, 08:08 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bwclark View Post

Thanks for the thoughts Erikk,

If you look at the post just above yours you will find a link to a post by PClausen who has the same HDTV as mine. He is having difficulty with the HDMI>DVI and the GUI. Perhaps he is doing something wrong, but I prefer not to see these kinds of post especially when it involves the same equipment I would be using. I don't need these types of headaches that would result from this type of hassle.

I certainly hope and would expect Denon to make good on their equipment and provide updates that will remedy all problems that have been identified to date. For me, I prefer to wait until they make good on those promises.


I have a monoprice HDMI to DVI and hooking it up to a 2nd generation (HLN) Samsung DLP. It is working fantastic from my perspective. Good solid sync. Like I said before... if you just want to wait then you can. Meanwhile I can enjoy all this 3808 goodness to myself! (I could care less about the network audio... it is neat but I don't sit in my theatre to listen to music).
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post #833 of 20256 Old 08-24-2007, 08:12 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Noonystock View Post

The power off trick reliably brings my GUI back, but by chance, tonight I noticed another, less disruptive fix.

Just turn the Source Select knob one position to the right or to the left to restore the GUI. Then dial back to NET/USB. Voila! Note: changing source from the remote doesn't seem to have the same restorative effect...you have to actually rotate the Source Select knob to get the GUI back. Still awkward, but better than a complete power off.

Would be curious to know if this works for anyone else...


I actually got it to come back by hitting either menu a couple of times or return a couple of times. I think that the "grey" screen might be some kind of screen saver for doofuses who leave their plasma on to get fried. Of course the result has run amok and is very buggy to return to normal from the remote (also a feature as a person who leaves it on and then the cat stomps on the remote has now got some interesting burnt-in spots on their tv).
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post #834 of 20256 Old 08-24-2007, 08:19 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pclausen View Post

I'm happy to report that my GUI now works on all inputs, even the ones with no video associated with them. Everything began working after I used the web interface to clean up all my settings (much easier to navigate than the on screen GUI IMHO.) Go figure.

I also deleted all the inputs I don't use. This way the input selector knob on the front of the AVR only scrolls through the inputs actually in use. Nice! Of course my 3 most frequently used inputs are also associated with the quick select buttons on the front. I plan to roll all this into my Harmony 880 so it won't really matter, but it is still a neat feature.

Thanks. This was a very informative post. My gear (Sony 60A3000, Denon 3808CI and DefTech speakers) should arrive midweek. If the GUI/remote are tedious, I may try the web interface as well. I've heard it is written by and for engineers, but I am one...so maybe that will work out for me. LOL
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post #835 of 20256 Old 08-24-2007, 08:24 PM
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Any un-boxing photos???
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post #836 of 20256 Old 08-24-2007, 09:24 PM
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For those of you that use AVIA or DVE to calibrate your speakers with your 3808ci when you are listening to test tones on the DVD how do you adjust your channel level without the reciever sending its own test tone? I am using a meter and wanting to use the tones on AVIA but when I need to adjust the channel level, the Denon test tone kicks on and mutes the DVD

My (Old) Theater Build Thread

Samsung UN75-F6400 | Denon 2313CI | Def Tech BP8060 | Def Tech CS8060 | Def Tech SR8080 

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post #837 of 20256 Old 08-24-2007, 09:38 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pclausen View Post

I'm happy to report that my GUI now works on all inputs, even the ones with no video associated with them. Everything began working after I used the web interface to clean up all my settings (much easier to navigate than the on screen GUI IMHO.) Go figure.

I also deleted all the inputs I don't use. This way the input selector knob on the front of the AVR only scrolls through the inputs actually in use. Nice! Of course my 3 most frequently used inputs are also associated with the quick select buttons on the front. I plan to roll all this into my Harmony 880 so it won't really matter, but it is still a neat feature.

Web interface, please tell me what this is all about?
I do have the unit playing my music through my lan. Can I control and set it up eaiser on the computer?
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post #838 of 20256 Old 08-24-2007, 10:28 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SinisterJ View Post

For those of you that use AVIA or DVE to calibrate your speakers with your 3808ci when you are listening to test tones on the DVD how do you adjust your channel level without the reciever sending its own test tone? I am using a meter and wanting to use the tones on AVIA but when I need to adjust the channel level, the Denon test tone kicks on and mutes the DVD

Hit Enter/Ch Select on the remote (the round button in the center of the 4 navigational arrows).
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Room EQ: Audyssey - am I the only one who thinks the Audyssey EQ mode takes away from the dynamics/range? I prefer setting the Room EQ to off even though it may not be "correct".

Maybe we should start a new thread where the only thing we discuss is our experience with Audyssey. So far I ran it twice (and in the process as a side effect aka bug I lost my i/p scaler settings) but I'm not impressed with the results. The crossovers were set all over the place though I have identical speakers all around, the levels don't match what I would otherwise calibrate with Avia or DVE (I guess because there's more processing happening on the path from the DVD player to the speakers which affects the levels) and I'm not a big fan of the EQ curve it determined. The only thing that was accurate was the speaker distance but that I can easily measure myself with a tape measure.

I ended up turning off Room EQ, calibrating the levels with an SPL using Avia, setting my own crossovers and just keeping the distances.

In my opinion the Audyssey process is flawed, it should not be using tones generated by the receiver, but instead it should come with a DVD that has the tones on it so that you are truly calibrating the entire sound path from the source to the destination.
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post #840 of 20256 Old 08-25-2007, 05:27 AM
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I've seen many people not happy with the settings Audyssey provided...and this was not just with Denons. My thinking on this is that ultimately it's you that's going to listen to the receiver, not "Mr. Audyssey", so adjust it so that it sounds good to you.
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