Harman Kardon AVR 247 & 347 discussion thread. - Page 91 - AVS Forum
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post #2701 of 5256 Old 02-28-2008, 12:10 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lparsons21 View Post

Well, after all of the upgrade and other folderol, I'm back on my Yamaha/HK combo setup. Here's the issues after the upgrade:

1. Flakey video/audio on changing channels with my DirecTV HDDVR. Fixed by cycling the power on the 247. This was NOT the case prior to the upgrade.

2. Flakey changing of sound setups when changing channels. Sometimes it did it, sometimes not. Irritating as hell, but workable if #1 wasn't an issue.

3. No LFE properly done. Of course I knew that would be the case, but if #1 and #2 weren't there, I would put up with it for the however-many-months-till-the-next-firmware-upgrade from HK.

So the Yamaha is now my pre/pro for my HK. Great HK sound, no flakiness in either audio or video when changing channels, and the LFE is proper. Life is good...

Gonna keep my eye out..With the new Yamaha 663 coming out...I might be able to pick up a 661 for a good price and be able to do the same as you.
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post #2702 of 5256 Old 02-28-2008, 12:24 PM
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Originally Posted by RafaelSmith View Post

Gonna keep my eye out..With the new Yamaha 663 coming out...I might be able to pick up a 661 for a good price and be able to do the same as you.

Someone from here pm'd me about my 661 after I off-the-cuff mentioned selling it. I'm glad he didn't like my price!

Lloyd
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post #2703 of 5256 Old 02-28-2008, 12:28 PM
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Has anyone tried using an HDMI "equalizer" before or after the AVR to resolve sparkles? These units are supposed to do just that, and are reasonably affordable (<$50). They are made to improve signal over long HDMI runs.

Also, FWIW, my theory on the sparkles, since they are hit or miss across the same hardware rev is a manufacturing issue (duh), I am guessing a chip responsible for passthrough video has insufficient grease on the heat sink. This would result in overheating (remedied with added airflow) and fortunately, could be easily repaired.

Does anyone know their way around inside this unit, or better yet, have access to a repair guide or schematics?

If I knew which chip(s) the 1080p video flowed through I could try enhancing the heat sink with either A) More, better grease for better thermal transfer, B) A SMALL internal fan just above the heat sink, or C) A better heat sink.

------

(Edited for grammar)
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post #2704 of 5256 Old 02-28-2008, 12:31 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lparsons21 View Post

Someone from here pm'd me about my 661 after I off-the-cuff mentioned selling it. I'm glad he didn't like my price!

And to think...back when I was picking which AVR to get..I took home and auditioned...a 661, a Onkyo 605 and the H/K 247. Was so taken by the superior SQ the H/K had over the others....I really did not give much weight to all the other features. With my speakers the Yammy sounded the worst.

Ive seen the 661 for under $400.00 online so not really that bad if I were to chose to go that route. Overall would still be cheaper than what I would have to spend If were to scrap the 247 and get something like a good Marantz...which i have heard drive speakers like mine...and it sounded as good as the H/K....but $1500ish is not within reason at the moment. Just looking to do something to hold me over for a couple years.
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post #2705 of 5256 Old 02-28-2008, 12:34 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by echase View Post

Has anyone tried using an HDMI "equalizer" before or after the AVR to resolve sparkles? These units are supposed to do just that, and are reasonably affordable (<$50). They are made to improve signal over long HDMI runs.

I do not know enough about HDMI to be able to judge if something like that is snake oil or not...but I am somewhat skeptical.

Most of my HDMI cables are 3ft...the one going to the TV is 6feet.
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post #2706 of 5256 Old 02-28-2008, 12:51 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lparsons21 View Post

Someone from here pm'd me about my 661 after I off-the-cuff mentioned selling it. I'm glad he didn't like my price!

For the first time ever I started looking at what it costs to go with seperates...for HDMI 7.1 processing, etc...wow talk about pricey. Totally out of my league. Makes some of those $1500.00 AVR's not seem so bad =P

I drooled when I looked at what the Onkyo Pro PR-SC885P could do...I would be in my own little version of HT heaven if I could afford that and a amp to go with it =P

http://www.onkyopro.com/model.cfm?m=...eamplifier&p=i
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post #2707 of 5256 Old 02-28-2008, 12:51 PM
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Originally Posted by MilesToEmpty View Post

Hey guys, Im new here so bear with me here!

Here's my current setup:
Current setup:
Harman Kardon AVR-247 Receiver
Polk RTi front speakers
Polk CSM Center Channel
MTX SW2 subwoofer
2 large sony rear speakers

I jsut purchased the the 247 from Vanns.com for $380 and am having some issues with it. I couldnt find a better price so if there is one, please tell me!

Now my issues. I get static sometimes on the front speakers. Sometimes the center channel rings.

The sub woofer is pretty much non existing. It blasts loud on the auto configure, but then on radio and HDMI its practially silent.

Emailed HK and they said to update, but its running the current updating firmware.

Can someone provide me with their phone number also?

Im completely stuck...

I had some similar problems. After several days of searching I found out that the EzSetEQ (what you called the Auto Configure) doesn't always work so well. I would suggest doing a reset on the receiver (see the manual) and then listen to the audio and configure the settings manually. The only thing you won't be able to setup manually is the EQ, which is likely what's causing the odd levels anyway. Now as to whether or not this will address the static or ringing you're hearing, I don't know ... probably not ... but I definately think it will fix some of your issues.
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post #2708 of 5256 Old 02-28-2008, 12:56 PM
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Originally Posted by logmecode3 View Post

I had some similar problems. After several days of searching I found out that the EzSetEQ (what you called the Auto Configure) doesn't always work so well. .

EzSetEQ sucks. The only thing the EzSetEQ got correct for me was speaker distances. The rest (xover, gains, etc) were way off. I ended up using SPL meter to set things...but I could have gotten closer than EzSetEQ did with just my ears =P
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post #2709 of 5256 Old 02-28-2008, 01:09 PM
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I think there are several of us now that are ready to exchange our receivers (via RMA through HK) and we're just waiting on the word from HK that they have receivers with the hardware "sparkle fix" applied. I was told about 1-2 weeks. I already have my RMA in place and was told that my electronic UPS label will expire after about 10 days. If it goes longer than that I'd have to email the customer support person I've been speaking with to get a new electronic UPS label. Anyway, for those of us that are in this same situation, when someone finds out that they have these "AVR247-Z" receivers ready, could you please post that info so everyone knows? If I find out first, then I'll post it myself. Thanks. I sure hope they actually fix it and that there are no other problems with them.

By the way, the "Z" designation, I found out, means remanufactured. The guy I was talking to, however, said that in this case, with the 247s and the sparkle issue, they are pretty much new receivers with the sparkle fix applied.
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post #2710 of 5256 Old 02-28-2008, 01:17 PM
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Ok,
So I just got off the phone with H/K tech support. I told them about the problems I was having after the firmware update(audio/video dropping). They had me perform a system reset 3 times in a row. Have the receiver in standby mode and hold tone mode button until it powers up, repeat three times. They mentioned that they were just given this information today by the software guys. I tried it and so far so good. I also asked about the LFE bug and they are aware of it but haven't given a date as to when the fw update will be released. He said that they don't tell them until the day it's released so that way it's not promised on a certain date and if it doesn't come out on that day 1000's of people aren't calling up asking where it is. He said welcome to corporate America

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post #2711 of 5256 Old 02-28-2008, 01:36 PM
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Originally Posted by jtenn View Post

Ok,
So I just got off the phone with H/K tech support. I told them about the problems I was having after the firmware update(audio/video dropping). They had me perform a system reset 3 times in a row. Have the receiver in standby mode and hold tone mode button until it powers up, repeat three times. They mentioned that they were just given this information today by the software guys. I tried it and so far so good. I also asked about the LFE bug and they are aware of it but haven't given a date as to when the fw update will be released. He said that they don't tell them until the day it's released so that way it's not promised on a certain date and if it doesn't come out on that day 1000's of people aren't calling up asking where it is. He said welcome to corporate America

Did they mention at all what this did? I'm not a programmer, nor am I any kind of engineer, but I'm wondering what 3 resets in a row does versus just one. Does 3 clear some extra buffer or something? I wonder if it's like clearing the CMOS on a computer. I'd be curious to know. It doesn't somehow restore the originally installed firmware, does it?

In the long run, I guess it doesn't really matter how, as long as it works, which I hope it does. I am not experiencing these problems right now, but if I end up with a receiver with these problems after my RMA, then it would be nice to know of a fix ahead of time. Let us know if the problems start-up again (or, more importantly, if they do not and it really is fixed).
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post #2712 of 5256 Old 02-28-2008, 01:37 PM
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Removed because I think everyone who will used it has.

I have a website, but apparently I can't put it here. WTF?
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post #2713 of 5256 Old 02-28-2008, 01:45 PM
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Here are the files I used to upgrade. It's possible that the download you guys had were somehow curropted. These files are the ones I used and didn't have a problem with the 3 devices I have upgraded.

I make no warrenty on this. I make no promises about how these files will effect your device, but if it's already messed up, I doubt it could do much worse.

DO NOT USE THESE FILES IF YOU DO NOT UNDERSTAND THAT YOU ARE TAKING A RISK (small one, but a risk nonetheless).

Travis,

Are these specific to the 347 (the file name states 347)? When you updated with those files, did you end up with the odd characters at the end of the text on the display?
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post #2714 of 5256 Old 02-28-2008, 01:49 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Travis M View Post

Here are the files I used to upgrade. It's possible that the download you guys had were somehow curropted. These files are the ones I used and didn't have a problem with the 3 devices I have upgraded.

I make no warrenty on this. I make no promises about how these files will effect your device, but if it's already messed up, I doubt it could do much worse.

DO NOT USE THESE FILES IF YOU DO NOT UNDERSTAND THAT YOU ARE TAKING A RISK (small one, but a risk nonetheless).

I forget do you have the 247 or 347?

What I have:

AVRX47_0724_01.s24 (size 578,682)
cust_1000_ntsc.hex (size 1,552,929)

Yours:

AVR347_0724_01.s24 (size 578,682)
cust_1000_ntsc.hex (size 1,554,338)

So one file has different name but same size.

The other has same name but diff size.
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post #2715 of 5256 Old 02-28-2008, 01:51 PM
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I have the 347, but I"ve used this same file on the 247.

As an aside, again being cryptic, I just got an email that will make my weekend a bit more fun.

I wonder what movies are LFE heavy?

I have a website, but apparently I can't put it here. WTF?
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post #2716 of 5256 Old 02-28-2008, 01:58 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RafaelSmith View Post

I forget do you have the 247 or 347?

What I have:

AVRX47_0724_01.s24 (size 578,682)
cust_1000_ntsc.hex (size 1,552,929)

Yours:

AVR347_0724_01.s24 (size 578,682)
cust_1000_ntsc.hex (size 1,554,338)

So one file has different name but same size.

The other has same name but diff size.

Yeah, maybe your's was curropt? I was told that what I had been using had not been altered from what was going to be sent out. Dunno what to tell ya. If you have ANY doubts, don't do it. I don't want ppl coming back on here yelling "IT HOSED MY AVR!". I can assure you, if it does and you call HK and tell them you tried a firmware you downloaded from anywhere other than thier site, you won't be getting a replacement.

But, I have updated 3 avrs with this firmware and it's been fine with no weird charactors at the end of the version number.

I have a website, but apparently I can't put it here. WTF?
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post #2717 of 5256 Old 02-28-2008, 02:02 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Travis M View Post

Yeah, maybe your's was curropt? I was told that what I had been using had not been altered from what was going to be sent out. Dunno what to tell ya.


I am willing to give it a shot. I think really only need to use your cust_1000_ntsc.hex files since that is the one that is diff in size.
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post #2718 of 5256 Old 02-28-2008, 02:03 PM
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Well I got off the phone with HK.

They had me do one reset and told me I had a bad unit and to return it and have a nice day o.O
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post #2719 of 5256 Old 02-28-2008, 02:10 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RafaelSmith View Post

I am willing to give it a shot. I think really only need to use your cust_1000_ntsc.hex files since that is the one that is diff in size.

Please report your findings.

I have a website, but apparently I can't put it here. WTF?
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post #2720 of 5256 Old 02-28-2008, 02:19 PM
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I am amazed that the firmware loader (apparently) does not checksum the firmware image before loading it. MAJOR oversight IMNSHO.

Travis, let us know if that email rocks your world :-)~

"Master and Commander" has some major LFE with the cannon fire in the opening scene... this thread has some other recommendations. I hope your sub is up to it ;-)
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post #2721 of 5256 Old 02-28-2008, 02:23 PM
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Originally Posted by echase View Post

I am amazed that the firmware loader (apparently) does not checksum the firmware image before loading it. MAJOR oversight IMNSHO.

Travis, let us know if that email rocks your world :-)~

"Master and Commander" has some major LFE with the cannon fire in the opening scene... this thread has some other recommendations. I hope your sub is up to it ;-)

Is M&C a Bluray or HD DVD? IF not, then I need other recommendations.

I have a website, but apparently I can't put it here. WTF?
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post #2722 of 5256 Old 02-28-2008, 02:34 PM
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Originally Posted by Travis M View Post

Is M&C a Bluray or HD DVD? IF not, then I need other recommendations.

Transformers/Live Free or Die Hard mightn't be bad choices.
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post #2723 of 5256 Old 02-28-2008, 02:36 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Travis M View Post

Is M&C a Bluray or HD DVD? IF not, then I need other recommendations.

To do the LFE test, you don't necessarily need Bluray or HD DVD. Even with normal DVD, if you have a PS3 or any other player that can bitstream DD/DTS as well as send 5.1 PCM out through HDMI, you can put it in either modes and compare the LFE levels. This is how I did my testing. The PS3 is an ideal candidate for this since changing from Linear PCM to Bitstream and vice versa is so easy.
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post #2724 of 5256 Old 02-28-2008, 02:41 PM
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Originally Posted by bommai View Post

To do the LFE test, you don't necessarily need Bluray or HD DVD. Even with normal DVD, if you have a PS3 or any other player that can bitstream DD/DTS as well as send 5.1 PCM out through HDMI, you can put it in either modes and compare the LFE levels. This is how I did my testing. The PS3 is an ideal candidate for this since changing from Linear PCM to Bitstream and vice versa is so easy.

I forgot about this. Thanks man.

I have a website, but apparently I can't put it here. WTF?
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post #2725 of 5256 Old 02-28-2008, 02:42 PM
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I think I over did it on speakers (or under did it on the receiver), and my speaker volume is pretty low when I run in full 7.1. We're talking about going into the +10-15 range on volume to really feel it.

Forgive my ignorance with this question... But how exactly to the speaker preouts on the 247 work?

I was considering buying a 2 channel amp to take some of the load off the receiver... Would it make sense to move off one set of my surrounds, or for my fronts? (assuming its pointless for the center).

Am I then relying on the amp for sound quality, and losing the "H/K sound" ? I'm finding used 100w 2x amps on ebay for under $100, and it seemed like a cheap fix, but I don't want to sacrifice sound quality for it...

Specs on my fronts (JBL L880)

Maximum Recommended Amplifier Power: 200W
Power Handling (Continuous/Peak): 100W/400W
Nominal Impedance: 8 Ohms
Sensitivity (2.83V/1m): 91dB
Frequency Response (±3dB): 30Hz ? 40kHz
Crossover Frequencies: 700Hz, 5kHz, 20kHz


Specs on my surrounds (JBL L810)

Maximum Recommended Amplifier Power : 150W
Power Handling (Continuous/Peak) : 75W/300W
Nominal Impedance : 8 Ohms
Sensitivity (2.83V/1m) : 88dB
Frequency Response (±3dB) : 60Hz – 40kHz
Crossover Frequencies : 3.5kHz, 20kHz
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post #2726 of 5256 Old 02-28-2008, 02:50 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by clouser2k7 View Post

I think I over did it on speakers (or under did it on the receiver), and my speaker volume is pretty low when I run in full 7.1. We're talking about going into the +10-15 range on volume to really feel it.

Forgive my ignorance with this question... But how exactly to the speaker preouts on the 247 work?

I was considering buying a 2 channel amp to take some of the load off the receiver... Would it make sense to move off one set of my surrounds, or for my fronts? (assuming its pointless for the center).

Am I then relying on the amp for sound quality, and losing the "H/K sound" ? I'm finding used 100w 2x amps on ebay for under $100, and it seemed like a cheap fix, but I don't want to sacrifice sound quality for it...

Specs on my fronts (JBL L880)

Maximum Recommended Amplifier Power: 200W
Power Handling (Continuous/Peak): 100W/400W
Nominal Impedance: 8 Ohms
Sensitivity (2.83V/1m): 91dB
Frequency Response (±3dB): 30Hz ? 40kHz
Crossover Frequencies: 700Hz, 5kHz, 20kHz


Specs on my surrounds (JBL L810)

Maximum Recommended Amplifier Power : 150W
Power Handling (Continuous/Peak) : 75W/300W
Nominal Impedance : 8 Ohms
Sensitivity (2.83V/1m) : 88dB
Frequency Response (±3dB) : 60Hz - 40kHz
Crossover Frequencies : 3.5kHz, 20kHz

Using the EzSetEQ can also produce this effect. If you set up your speakers using the EzSetEQ on the 247/347, you may want to try doing a reset on the receiver and setting everything manually. This happened to me as well -- volume was very low on all speakers, and especially low and muffled from the center.
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post #2727 of 5256 Old 02-28-2008, 03:11 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by logmecode3 View Post

Using the EzSetEQ can also produce this effect. If you set up your speakers using the EzSetEQ on the 247/347, you may want to try doing a reset on the receiver and setting everything manually. This happened to me as well -- volume was very low on all speakers, and especially low and muffled from the center.

Thats good to know, but I havent ran the EZSet yet... I have all the settings default out of the receiver, except for setting the fronts to large when trying to understand why they were so weak. I hadn't run it yet because my sub hasn't arrived and I didn't want to have to set it twice.
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post #2728 of 5256 Old 02-28-2008, 04:09 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by logmecode3 View Post

Using the EzSetEQ can also produce this effect. If you set up your speakers using the EzSetEQ on the 247/347, you may want to try doing a reset on the receiver and setting everything manually. This happened to me as well -- volume was very low on all speakers, and especially low and muffled from the center.

Thanks for this info. I have been thinking that my overall volume level was kind of low as well. I ran the EZ set a few times. I am gonna try this reset and manual setup suggestion this weekend. Thanks again.
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post #2729 of 5256 Old 02-28-2008, 04:13 PM
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Just when I'm looking to get a new 247 from HKebay I find all of this upgrade fiasco. Wonder if those sold by HKebay now include these updates?
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post #2730 of 5256 Old 02-28-2008, 05:29 PM
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Originally Posted by Travis M View Post

Here are the files I used to upgrade. It's possible that the download you guys had were somehow curropted. These files are the ones I used and didn't have a problem with the 3 devices I have upgraded.

I make no warrenty on this. I make no promises about how these files will effect your device, but if it's already messed up, I doubt it could do much worse.

DO NOT USE THESE FILES IF YOU DO NOT UNDERSTAND THAT YOU ARE TAKING A RISK (small one, but a risk nonetheless).

Has anbody tried these files to see if it worked and actually displayed FAR at the end of the software version?
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