"The" Onkyo TX-SR875 Thread - Page 3 - AVS Forum
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post #61 of 6044 Old 07-18-2007, 10:29 AM
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nice, it's in stock at B&M's already? I was expecting shipments in the third week.

Oooh, the joys and burden of being the first one. Congrats.

- I wonder how bad the video delay is on this unit (connecting something like the PS3)
- Wonder if they've solved the pop/clicks problems (random pops through speakers while watching programs)

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post #62 of 6044 Old 07-18-2007, 10:44 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by warpdrive View Post

nice, it's in stock at B&M's already? I was expecting shipments in the third week.

Oooh, the joys and burden of being the first one. Congrats.

- I wonder how bad the video delay is on this unit (connecting something like the PS3)
- Wonder if they've solved the pop/clicks problems (random pops through speakers while watching programs)

What would cause a video delay?

And, in over 100 pages of the 805 thread which I have read, I don't recall "random pops through speakers while watching programs" being a problem ever.

The 875 is basically the same as the 805 with the Reon, they share the same manual.

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post #63 of 6044 Old 07-18-2007, 10:47 AM
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Really looking forward to hearing more about how well the Reon chip does on upconverting sdtv; svalley's initial report was NOT very encouraging, but I'll wait to hear more. The Reon chip is about the only really significant thing I see about the 875 over the 805 (am I missing something else?), unless of course it is free of some of the (relatively minor) 'issues' discussed re the 805.

I really don't need the Reon for dvd upconversion, since my Sam 1200 BRD has this and does it extremely well. But if the Reon makes a significant improvement of sdtv, that's a pretty big deal, for my wife still finds things she wants to watch on sd channels (and there's the History Channel too, for Tony S and me!)
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post #64 of 6044 Old 07-18-2007, 10:58 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dobieck1 View Post

What would cause a video delay?

And, in over 100 pages of the 805 thread which I have read, I don't recall "random pops through speakers while watching programs" being a problem ever.

The 875 is basically the same as the 805 with the Reon, they share the same manual.

Video delay shouldn't be a problem. It wasn't when I had the 805. Maybe he means the 3-4 seconds that the receiver takes to correctly detect the different audio signals. Others have said that it can be remedied by going into the menu setting and pre-determing what audio setting each audio signal should receive.

My biggest or only concern with these Onkyo's is any noticeable audio sync delay. The default 30 to 40ms delay that Onkyo placed on the audio inputs made my problems worse. Even at 0ms there was an audible delay in people lip movements and it could be tested when routing audio from one source into the receiver and to my wireless headphones or tv speakers. There was a pronounced echo, created by the receiver and that made movie/tv watching near impossible.
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post #65 of 6044 Old 07-18-2007, 11:04 AM
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Svalley, can you please post a picture of the receiver from the front with it powered on?
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post #66 of 6044 Old 07-18-2007, 12:09 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dobieck1 View Post

What would cause a video delay?

And, in over 100 pages of the 805 thread which I have read, I don't recall "random pops through speakers while watching programs" being a problem ever.

The 875 is basically the same as the 805 with the Reon, they share the same manual.

Look again. I too am very interested if you are noticing clicking or pops when powering up or using the PS3. Don't know if this will matter anyways seeing as it seems to be hit or miss on the 805. Mine will be here Friday and I am starting to get a little nervous.

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post #67 of 6044 Old 07-18-2007, 12:13 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bass addict View Post

Look again. I too am very interested if you are noticing clicking or pops when powering up or using the PS3. Don't know if this will matter anyways seeing as it seems to be hit or miss on the 805. Mine will be here Friday and I am starting to get a little nervous.

This guy says its a PS3 issue, from this very thread. I don't have one so I have no proof one way or the other

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...&#post11059625

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post #68 of 6044 Old 07-18-2007, 12:15 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dobieck1 View Post

What would cause a video delay?

And, in over 100 pages of the 805 thread which I have read, I don't recall "random pops through speakers while watching programs" being a problem ever.

The 875 is basically the same as the 805 with the Reon, they share the same manual.

Video delay is the time the video processor introduces into real time video doing its scaling/deinterlacing duties. If you are playing twitch video games, the extra 50-100 ms the video may be delayed may make some games unplayable (say Guitar Hero PS2). That's why some TV's may have a "game mode", in order to minimize the delay when a video game machine is being used.

I only glanced at the popping thread, so I'm not clear on what the popping is because I haven't heard it myself, but I was getting concerned based on posts like this which seem to indicate popping during continuous program material

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...&#post10948245

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post #69 of 6044 Old 07-18-2007, 12:22 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by warpdrive View Post

Video delay is the time the video processor introduces into real time video doing its scaling/deinterlacing duties. If you are playing twitch video games, the extra 50-100 ms the video may be delayed may make some games unplayable (say Guitar Hero PS2). That's why some TV's may have a "game mode", in order to minimize the delay when a video game machine is being used.

I only glanced at the popping thread, so I'm not clear on what the popping is because I haven't heard it myself, but I was getting concerned based on posts like this which seem to indicate popping during continuous program material

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...&#post10948245

I have read that one. Well, I have never heard a pop out of any of my speakers (knock on wood) with this unit or my last one (604).

As far as the video, that is interesing. My TV has a game mode, but I never know what it was for.

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post #70 of 6044 Old 07-18-2007, 12:26 PM
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Is svalley the only person in the world to get the 875 so far?? Seems a little strange that only one person would have this unit in a 24 hour period based on the anticipated demand of hundreds indicated on the http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=831063 ??
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post #71 of 6044 Old 07-18-2007, 12:35 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sjv View Post

Is svalley the only person in the world to get the 875 so far?? Seems a little strange that only one person would have this unit in a 24 hour period based on the anticipated demand of hundreds indicated on the http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=831063 ??

It does seem a little strange that we have not heard from someone else that has gotten an 875 yet. However, it may be that a lot of people don't know about this forum, but have the gotten the 875. Still...

I called J&R today, and they told me they are expecting 30 black units and 15 silver units on Monday. If allocation issues are as bad as I have read by some posters, they may only get a third of that. Not sure if my preorder number is 10 or lower... I actually think I am around 12 or something, which would suck...
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post #72 of 6044 Old 07-18-2007, 12:37 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pjdick View Post

It does seem a little strange that we have not heard from someone else that has gotten an 875 yet. However, it may be that a lot of people don't know about this forum, but have the gotten the 875. Still...

I called J&R today, and they told me they are expecting 30 black units and 15 silver units on Monday. If allocation issues are as bad as I have read by some posters, they may only get a third of that. Not sure if my preorder number is 10 or lower... I actually think I am around 12 or something, which would suck...

Well to the OP's credit, he said he picked it up at a B&M that got 5, and 4 were pre-sold. I think most everyone else on here pre-ordered from places. I believe some people had tracking numbers yesterday for delivery tomorrow.

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post #73 of 6044 Old 07-18-2007, 12:58 PM
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Svalley;

Too much good luck can be painful! Enjoy your new toy. We would all love to hear about your experiences.
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post #74 of 6044 Old 07-18-2007, 01:11 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by svalley View Post

The SD I watched was 4X3 with 2 side bars. I believes it is set in my HR20
to output 4x3 not 875 (at least 875 didn't mess it up)

That all folks, I have to go to company's picnic (that why I didn't call in sick )
Will do some testing tonight.

Okay I guess I'm a bit confused. Are you saying the Onkyo added the black bars or that your HR20 (satellite receiver?) added the black bars?
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post #75 of 6044 Old 07-18-2007, 01:24 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by iodine23 View Post

Okay I guess I'm a bit confused. Are you saying the Onkyo added the black bars or that your HR20 (satellite receiver?) added the black bars?

I`m sorry but no PANAMORPH compatibility, that means I need to buy a REAL Video processor like DVDO or LUMAGEN or..., to stretch or zoom vertically 2:35 top to the entire 16:9 resolution
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post #76 of 6044 Old 07-18-2007, 01:27 PM
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How about the sound quality of the 875 Vs 805 is better or the same?? The differences between the two are only the reon and 10 more watts on all chanells?? Does it mean that if we dont need the Reon the 805 is about the same as 875, dac, etc ??? I am a little confused
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post #77 of 6044 Old 07-18-2007, 01:44 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by adrian27 View Post

I`m sorry but no PANAMORPH compatibility, that means I need to buy a REAL Video processor like DVDO or LUMAGEN or..., to stretch or zoom vertically 2:35 top to the entire 16:9 resolution


Well were you REALLY expecting this thing (at this price) to have the feature set of DVDO or Lumagen? Personally I was only hoping that it did a better job cleaning and passing video signals than OTHER AVR's. I can guarantee this Onkyo will handle audio better than any DVDO. But then again the DVDO is not an AVR. So I would be foolish to expect it to- wouldn't I?!
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post #78 of 6044 Old 07-18-2007, 01:57 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dildatonr View Post

Well were you REALLY expecting this thing (at this price) to have the feature set of DVDO or Lumagen? Personally I was only hoping that it did a better job cleaning and passing video signals than OTHER AVR's. I can guarantee this Onkyo will handle audio better than any DVDO. But then again the DVDO is not an AVR. So I would be foolish to expect it to- wouldn't I?!

I don't think it is unrealistic to expect to get a good featureset from the video processors in this price range. I think it is a natural progression for the video processor to eventually be swallowed up by the AVR's and all the features implemented. I just think that the implementation will need to be simpler than on a dedicated VP. Perhaps that is still a ways off. I guess the VP's aren't going away this year, but I'd expect someone to get it right eventually and give us the performance we all want at better prices. I wouldn't expect it to have the full featureset of the DVDO, but something 80-90% of us would be happy with. Not something to satisfy the 5% of users that demand every bell and whistle.

The jury is still out since we only have a report from one owner about its capabilities and he hasn't been able to do extensive testing just yet. However, things aren't looking good for the home team so far (eg. no option to perform reverse telecine on 3:2 cadence, no mosquito noise or block noise options, etc.). Perhaps it is there, just needing to be dug out.

Anyway, the Denon is starting to regain some of the ground lost during the anticipation. I'm still waiting for reviews from both units.

I don't really see that price is any indication of what you are or should be getting. When VP's are integrated into AVR's the economy of scale will dictate lower pricing. When you have an industry dedicated to a very few people, prices will be higher. When it is accepted by the mass market, prices plummet. That is what happened to the computer, the VCR, etc.
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post #79 of 6044 Old 07-18-2007, 02:00 PM
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I can guarantee this Onkyo will handle audio better than any DVDO[i][quote]

yeah, that's true and the reason that good receiver are making for, to handle and process audio with excellence, but I really don`t know how much cost can ad a stretching pixel feature If the 2:35 ratio became a standard in the near future of home entertainment
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post #80 of 6044 Old 07-18-2007, 02:05 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by svalley View Post

When I first turn on 875 1080p, my directv looked washed out, so I calibrated
my TV with AVIA. Most of the settings (Picture, color, tint) are not impacted, but
I had to turn Brightness from 23 to 13. After that I watch Directv HD and
picture looks good. Then, I played Casino Royale on PS3, and the picture
looks too dark, I cranked the Brightness back to 23, it looks just look how
it used to be when I had the PS3 HDMI straight to the TV.

Did you have these same differences before the 875 with brightness between the PS3 and Directv?
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post #81 of 6044 Old 07-18-2007, 02:10 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bfdtv View Post

You've indicated you have a HR20.

I assume you've set the HR20 to output all formats natively, so your HR20 outputs SD channels as 480i, 720p channels as 720p, and 1080i channels as 1080p?

Once you've done that, is there an added delay in switching between a SD (480i) and a HD channel? And if so, is it a fraction of a second or more than a second?

Ah! My question precisely!
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post #82 of 6044 Old 07-18-2007, 02:11 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ken Ross View Post

Did you have these same differences before the 875 with brightness between the PS3 and Directv?

Since there was apparently also a handshake issue between the DirecTV box and the AVR, it might be a problem with the DirecTV and the HDMI 1.3a connection. Just speculation.
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post #83 of 6044 Old 07-18-2007, 02:12 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by svalley View Post

Yes, my HR20 is set to to output all formats natively. I didn't notices any
"addition" delay in surfing compared to previous. Like I said before, there is
handshaking problem between 875 and HR20, and simple power up PS3
fixed the problem, that might concern you (what happen if I don't have a PS3).

I think bfdtv was asking when you switch from say ABC HD to CBS HD or NBC HD, do you notice that it takes more time for that channel change than when you switch from NBC TO CBS? In the first scenario you are switching from a 720p channel to a 1080i channel. In the 2nd you're switching from a 1080i to a 1080i.
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post #84 of 6044 Old 07-18-2007, 02:36 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ryarber View Post

(eg. no option to perform reverse telecine on 3:2 cadence

Film and video detection with appropriate deinterlace would be "automatic" on the Onkyo. There wouldn't be an option for it.

Members will have to test for that capability with the HD HQV test disk. If you have a HD-DVD player and a DVD burner, burn the HD-DVD compatible test disk (zipped) on this site. I would like to see a member test and confirm whether the 875/905:
  1. outputs the correct YCbCr 4:2:2 or 4:4:4 colorspace
  2. has no pixel cropping on 4:3 or 16:9 sources
  3. has no peak white or BTB clipping
  4. passes full luma resolution, i.e. no roll off in vertical or horizontal Nyquist
  5. passes full chroma resolution, i.e. no roll off in vertical or horizontal Nyquist
  6. does not suffer from chroma bug, aka CUE
  7. correctly deinterlaces 480i film sources
  8. correctly deinterlaces 480i video sources
  9. correctly deinterlaces 1080i film sources
  10. correctly deinterlaces 1080i video sources
I would also like to see a member confirm whether any of the following options are present in the hidden menu:
  1. adjustable color space - YCbCr for those with HDMI, RGB for those with DVI
  2. adjustable noise reduction levels for SD
  3. adjustable block/mosquito reduction levels for SD
  4. adjustable detail enhancement levels for SD
  5. adjustable color settings
  6. option to switch between zoom, stretch, use black bars, or grey bars for 4:3 SD material
  7. adjustable overscan (default 0, but configurable)
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post #85 of 6044 Old 07-18-2007, 03:32 PM
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What worries me is, looking through the manual, there seems to be no options/settings what-so-ever for video processing.
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post #86 of 6044 Old 07-18-2007, 03:43 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jay_Davis View Post

What worries me is, looking through the manual, there seems to be no options/settings what-so-ever for video processing.

I know what you mean. Based on svalley's "limited time" assessment it does not seem like any menu features for video processing were added after the 805/875 manual was printed. For the life of me I can just not understand why Onkyo would implement (not to mention tout) this Silicon Optix Reon chip but not allow the user any access to its capabilities. Based on what people who own the XA2 have said, the Reon does a fantastic job with SD DVD upconversion but the XA2 allows you to adjust the Reon settings.

Hopefully the secret menu (AUX and Power buttons at the same time on the actual unit) will allow us to access the Reon's features. Like everyone else I am waiting for an in-depth analysis of the implementation of the Reon in the Onkyo 875/905 before I buy one. I really have high hopes for these two units. I had fully bought into the "hype".
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post #87 of 6044 Old 07-18-2007, 05:00 PM - Thread Starter
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OK, I set the XBOX360 output to 1080p, and the 875 did "NOT" pass it to my TV.
When I set XBOX360 1080p, I have a blank screen, oucch, not good.

I look thru the OSD again, and there is nothing to tweak the Reon. The only video
stuff I didn't mentioned before is I can en/disable xvYCC.
I tried to enter "hidden menu" by pressing Power and AUX at the same time, but
nothing happened, it either power on or power down my 875. There are 2 AUX (AUX1
and AUX2) buttons, I tired both.

I am still having problem with HDMI handshaking, both the HDA1 and Directv HR20.
I tried to power cycle all 3 units (875, HDA1, and HR20), but 875 always display no
signal. The only fix I know is turn on my PS3, might be a HDMI1.3a problem with 875?

To my "eyes" the SD DVD does look better with 875, but SD TV is hit and miss. See attached
DVD pictures, and next one for SD TV pics. DVD is played from HDA1 set to 480p out,
and SD TV is 480i
LL
LL
LL
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post #88 of 6044 Old 07-18-2007, 05:03 PM - Thread Starter
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SD Directv Pics, remember the pictures is taken from a 65" DLP
LL
LL
LL
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post #89 of 6044 Old 07-18-2007, 05:09 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by svalley View Post

SD Directv Pics, remember the pictures is taken from a 65" DLP

At least I don't see any 'jaggies' on the oblique lines. Is this really true as you view sdtv at a reasonably close distance?
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post #90 of 6044 Old 07-18-2007, 05:16 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by svalley View Post

OK, I set the XBOX360 output to 1080p, and the 875 did "NOT" pass it to my TV.
When I set XBOX360 1080p, I have a blank screen, oucch, not good.

I look thru the OSD again, and there is nothing to tweak the Reon. The only video
stuff I didn't mentioned before is I can en/disable xvYCC.
I tried to enter "hidden menu" by pressing Power and AUX at the same time, but
nothing happened, it either power on or power down my 875. There are 2 AUX (AUX1
and AUX2) buttons, I tired both.

I am still having problem with HDMI handshaking, both the HDA1 and Directv HR20.
I tried to power cycle all 3 units (875, HDA1, and HR20), but 875 always display no
signal. The only fix I know is turn on my PS3, might be a HDMI1.3a problem with 875?

To my "eyes" the SD DVD does look better with 875, but SD TV is hit and miss. See attached
DVD pictures, and next one for SD TV pics. DVD is played from HDA1 set to 480p out,
and SD TV is 480i

This preliminary information is not looking good. I am running an HDA1 also as well as a PS3. Handshaking w/ the A1 is a deal breaker. I will be picking up mine on Friday, unfortunately I am on my way out of town so I won't get a chance to test it until Sunday.

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