The "Official" Yamaha RX-V1800/RX-V3800 Thread - Page 267 - AVS Forum
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post #7981 of 8664 Old 10-20-2010, 06:28 PM
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Until recently, I thought that my 1800 decoded HDCD discs, of which I have several. I thought it worked like DSD or DVD-A: I have my Oppo DV-980H connected to my 1800 via HDMI, Digital Output set to "Raw," HDMI Audio set to "Auto," and SACD output set to "DSD." I assumed the 1800 decoded at least the DSD signal. My SACDs and DVD-As sound great. I'm wondering now, though, whether I have been listening to the higher resolution (or whatever it's called) of my HDCDs. Does a receiver need to be able to decode HDCD in my set-up?
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post #7982 of 8664 Old 10-21-2010, 04:18 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by paligap View Post

Until recently, I thought that my 1800 decoded HDCD discs, of which I have several. I thought it worked like DSD or DVD-A: I have my Oppo DV-980H connected to my 1800 via HDMI, Digital Output set to "Raw," HDMI Audio set to "Auto," and SACD output set to "DSD." I assumed the 1800 decoded at least the DSD signal. My SACDs and DVD-As sound great. I'm wondering now, though, whether I have been listening to the higher resolution (or whatever it's called) of my HDCDs. Does a receiver need to be able to decode HDCD in my set-up?

Look at the Signal Info within your 1800's OSM settings, that will tell you what your 1800 is receiving.
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post #7983 of 8664 Old 10-21-2010, 04:14 PM
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What should the signal info read if the 1800 is geeting HDCD, as opposed to regular CD?
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post #7984 of 8664 Old 10-22-2010, 02:56 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by paligap View Post

What should the signal info read if the 1800 is geeting HDCD, as opposed to regular CD?

I'm not sure as I never looked at the signal info for HDCD. I would assume if the signal info is greater than 2 ch 44.1 (basic CD) then you are getting the higher resolution.

Example, my signal info displays the following for these various input sources:
CD PCM 2-ch 44.1
DVD-A PCM M-ch 96
DVD-A PCM 2-ch 192
SACD (not DSD) PCM M-ch 88.2

Also, if your 1800 is decoding DSD it should say so on the front panel of your 1800.
Many SACD players cannot bitstream DSD, I'm guessing your OPPO is this way (as is my OPPO).
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post #7985 of 8664 Old 10-22-2010, 03:59 PM
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Well, this is what I found out from the Oppo website:

Q: Does the OPPO DV-980H support HDCD?

A: Yes, the DV-980H fully supports HDCD. When a HDCD track or HDCD disc is played, the on screen display (OSD) will show "HDCD" briefly. When a standard CD track is played, the OSD will show "CD" briefly. HDCD decoding is done by the DV-980H if analog audio output is used. When digital audio output is in use, it is the responsibility of the AV receiver to decode the HDCD digital stream.

So, since I have my Oppo hooked up via HDMI, and the 1800 can't decode HDCD, I'm not getting the benefits of HDCD. I suppose I could hook it up via analog, but since I'm looking at a new receiver anyway, I might just get one that decodes HDCD.

By the way, my Oppo does bitstream DSD.
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post #7986 of 8664 Old 10-22-2010, 05:14 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by paligap View Post

Well, this is what I found out from the Oppo website:

Q: Does the OPPO DV-980H support HDCD?

A: Yes, the DV-980H fully supports HDCD. When a HDCD track or HDCD disc is played, the on screen display (OSD) will show "HDCD" briefly. When a standard CD track is played, the OSD will show "CD" briefly. HDCD decoding is done by the DV-980H if analog audio output is used. When digital audio output is in use, it is the responsibility of the AV receiver to decode the HDCD digital stream.

So, since I have my Oppo hooked up via HDMI, and the 1800 can't decode HDCD, I'm not getting the benefits of HDCD. I suppose I could hook it up via analog, but since I'm looking at a new receiver anyway, I might just get one that decodes HDCD.

By the way, my Oppo does bitstream DSD.

I'm pretty sure the Oppo will still decode HDCD and send it over a digital connection as long as you set the output to PCM and not bitstream. You could try this and see if the 1800 signal info shows anything different. Frankly I doubt it will sound noticably better if the receiver decodes it.
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post #7987 of 8664 Old 10-23-2010, 04:16 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kriktsemaj99 View Post

I'm pretty sure the Oppo will still decode HDCD and send it over a digital connection as long as you set the output to PCM and not bitstream. You could try this and see if the 1800 signal info shows anything different. Frankly I doubt it will sound noticably better if the receiver decodes it.

Exactly my point.

paligap,
Try this and see if the signal info on the 1800 matches the purported resolution of the HDCD.
It may or may not work, but worth a shot.
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post #7988 of 8664 Old 10-23-2010, 05:45 PM
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Originally Posted by Charles944 View Post

I had sent the receiver in to a authorized Yamaha repair center and they stated that they cannot do anything with it because the software is corrupted or most likely deleted. They stated I would need a new "main board" that has the software installed to it in the PROM chip. To do this it would need to go Yamaha out in NJ and run ~$350. I have a tie to a Yamaha tech guy who can ship me new boards so I have him looking into it.

Which board has the software installed to it? Is it the DSP board or FL1 Function board?

Well. I got the 1800 back from the service center because they did not install any firmware because they said it would not turn on (duh, that is why I sent it in). Anyhow, I managed to get the receiver into CDA1800 Upgrade mode and had kriktsemaj99 helping me out big time by sending me a known good firmware file. After installing the software, it was up and running again but now with a DC protection failures. I put the receiver into Diagnostic mode and section 11 has a AD value of 55-58 (supposed to be 3-33).

Called Yamaha tech support and they say something with the amp portion is not right.
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post #7989 of 8664 Old 10-26-2010, 07:01 PM
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What setting are most using for 7.1 surround HD sports broadcasts? When i put my receiver on sports mode my surround rears do not have any signal.
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post #7990 of 8664 Old 10-26-2010, 07:54 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Charles944 View Post

Well. I got the 1800 back from the service center because they did not install any firmware because they said it would not turn on (duh, that is why I sent it in). Anyhow, I managed to get the receiver into CDA1800 Upgrade mode and had kriktsemaj99 helping me out big time by sending me a known good firmware file. After installing the software, it was up and running again but now with a DC protection failures. I put the receiver into Diagnostic mode and section 11 has a AD value of 55-58 (supposed to be 3-33).

Called Yamaha tech support and they say something with the amp portion is not right.

I placed an order for a new RX-V1900 through NewEgg while they had their excellent sale going on through the 25th. I was hopeful that the 1800 was not so plagued with problems but it is what it is. I wish to thank you all for your help trying to get the 1800 up and running.
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post #7991 of 8664 Old 10-26-2010, 07:55 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ragman78 View Post

What setting are most using for 7.1 surround HD sports broadcasts? When i put my receiver on sports mode my surround rears do not have any signal.

PLIIx

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post #7992 of 8664 Old 10-27-2010, 06:55 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Charles944 View Post

I placed an order for a new RX-V1900 through NewEgg while they had their excellent sale going on through the 25th. I was hopeful that the 1800 was not so plagued with problems but it is what it is. I wish to thank you all for your help trying to get the 1800 up and running.

Hey, you took a gamble based on sound (no pun) reasoning that it was fixable, I applaud your efforts.
More often than not when I have taken similar gambles the payoff has been tremendous and far outweighs the few misses.
The 1900 at that price is an unbeatable deal, enjoy!
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post #7993 of 8664 Old 11-11-2010, 04:36 PM
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Hi

I've run YPAO three times, one for flat, natural, and front speakers on the eq and save each setting to memory. If I load the settings from memory back into the active circuit, is there anyway of displaying the results of the EQ that you can see when one reviews the result of YPAO?
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post #7994 of 8664 Old 11-11-2010, 08:31 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 3db View Post

I've run YPAO three times, one for flat, natural, and front speakers on the eq and save each setting to memory. If I load the settings from memory back into the active circuit, is there anyway of displaying the results of the EQ that you can see when one reviews the result of YPAO?

It's been a while since I did this, but I think you can go back into AUTO SETUP and look at the results, but there's no graph. And I think it only gives you the frequency and gain for each filter, and not the Q factor (the width), so it's not very useful.

But if you connect a PC via RS-232 cable you can run PEQedit, which can graph the results. It can either read the values directly from the receiver, or from a file of saved settings that you made with Receiver Manager.
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post #7995 of 8664 Old 11-12-2010, 05:31 AM
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Thanks alot Krik. I've not heard of this PQ Edit tool before. Is this something from Yamaha? Will it work with Windows Vista? Is there a setting I need to put the receiver in or is it simply just plugging the serial port in from the 1800 into the PC? I apologize for all of these dumb questions but you can tell that I'm quite excited about this.
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post #7996 of 8664 Old 11-12-2010, 06:53 AM
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post #7997 of 8664 Old 11-12-2010, 07:04 AM
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Yes, PEQedit should work with Vista (it uses an old version of .NET, but that shouldn't be a problem). It's not a Yamaha application, it's something I wrote to get access to the PEQ on my 1800 (Yamaha didn't provide access through the normal menus, but the RS-232 commands exist).

You need the same connection that you would use with Receiver Manager, i.e. it has to be a null modem (crossover) cable. Once you have the right cable just connect the DB9 on the back of the 1800 to a PC serial port.

Best to save your settings in memories before messing around, but you already did that. There's more info in the other thread I linked to, plus a basic Readme.txt file when you download PEQedit. You can download it and make sure it runs OK on your PC even if you don't have the RS-232 cable yet.
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post #7998 of 8664 Old 11-12-2010, 07:55 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kriktsemaj99 View Post

Yes, PEQedit should work with Vista (it uses an old version of .NET, but that shouldn't be a problem). It's not a Yamaha application, it's something I wrote to get access to the PEQ on my 1800 (Yamaha didn't provide access through the normal menus, but the RS-232 commands exist).

You need the same connection that you would use with Receiver Manager, i.e. it has to be a null modem (crossover) cable. Once you have the right cable just connect the DB9 on the back of the 1800 to a PC serial port.

Best to save your settings in memories before messing around, but you already did that. There's more info in the other thread I linked to, plus a basic Readme.txt file when you download PEQedit. You can download it and make sure it runs OK on your PC even if you don't have the RS-232 cable yet.

Many thanks Krik. I can't wait to kick the proverbial tires.
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post #7999 of 8664 Old 11-12-2010, 06:47 PM
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If I connect my Oppo (see above) to my 1800 via analog cables, does it bypass any YPAO settings?
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post #8000 of 8664 Old 11-12-2010, 08:13 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by paligap View Post

If I connect my Oppo (see above) to my 1800 via analog cables, does it bypass any YPAO settings?

If you connect to one of the regular stereo analog inputs (red + white RCA connectors, then the 1800 will digitize the incoming analog signal and can apply all the usual processing, including YPAO filters and bass management. The only way to stop it digitizing the signal is to use Pure Direct mode, but then you lose all processing options.

If you connect the multi-channel analog outputs of the Oppo to the multi-channel analog inputs on the 1800, then the signal remains analog and processing will always be bypassed.
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post #8001 of 8664 Old 11-13-2010, 08:09 PM
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Thanks for the info. I had wanted to be able to send the signals that would usually go to my dipole surrounds to my direct radiating rears while listening to multi-channel music, while also being able to use my rears in a 7.1 configuration while watching TV and Blu-rays. I bought a Denon 4310, mistakenly thinking I would be able to do so.

I connected my Oppo via the multi-channel analog inputs on my 1800, switching the surround and surround back connections. Mission accomplished. Of course, now I'll have to use my Oppo only as a CD/HDCD/SACD/DVD-Audio player. I'll also return the 4310 that I never took out of the box and save a lot of money. I guess I'll hang on to my 1800 for a while, until the new 7.2, 3D receivers work out the kinks and come down in price.
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post #8002 of 8664 Old 11-15-2010, 02:27 AM
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Hi,
I am having a very weird issue with my RX-V3800 and could use your expertise.

My RX-V3800 is connected to a LG BD590 Blu-ray player via HDMI. I can play DVDs fine but when I play an audio CD, MP3s or even steam Youtube I get no sound..even there is no audio when I stream Netflix once I get into this error path. (Netflix streams fine with audio if I do it the first thing after turning everything on).

If I go back to play the DVD there is sound. When I connect the BD590 to my TV directly via HDMI, there is sound, so I guess the Yamaha V3800 is unable to decode when a CD is playing and any audio signal after that is not getting recognized.

In the Yamaha Menu under "Signal Info" I see all blanks for Audio.. I plugged in the HDMI cable to another HDMI input on the Yamaha but the result was same.

Any help is hugely appreciated ? This is driving me crazy.. I have read the manual, played around with all menu settings..
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post #8003 of 8664 Old 11-15-2010, 03:49 AM
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I assume DVD's and CD's are being played from the same source?
The only thing I can think of is possible settings in the DVD/CD player for CD playback. Same types of settings may be the issue with streaming content as well.
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post #8004 of 8664 Old 11-15-2010, 10:51 AM
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Yes, the source for the CD, DVD and streaming (Netflix, Youtube) is the LG BD590 player..

One other thing: I get sound when I do "Pure Direct".

I tried a workaround and hooked a digital coax cable from the BD590 to the Yamaha(changed the audio input to coax) and there is sound ! (no change in settings in the LG), but I still would like to figure out why there is no sound over HDMI when playing CD from the same source..

This is really perplexing.. I guess I will have to call Yamaha support to see if they could debug this issue.
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post #8005 of 8664 Old 11-16-2010, 08:36 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by paligap View Post

Thanks for the info. I had wanted to be able to send the signals that would usually go to my dipole surrounds to my direct radiating rears while listening to multi-channel music, while also being able to use my rears in a 7.1 configuration while watching TV and Blu-rays. I bought a Denon 4310, mistakenly thinking I would be able to do so.

I connected my Oppo via the multi-channel analog inputs on my 1800, switching the surround and surround back connections. Mission accomplished. Of course, now I'll have to use my Oppo only as a CD/HDCD/SACD/DVD-Audio player. I'll also return the 4310 that I never took out of the box and save a lot of money. I guess I'll hang on to my 1800 for a while, until the new 7.2, 3D receivers work out the kinks and come down in price.

Well, I found the first drawback to my solution. When I play HDCDs, the Oppo now decodes them, but I can't apply any of the 1800's processing, such as PLIIx Music. So now all my CDs and HDCDs played on the Oppo will be strictly stereo. I know a lot of purists prefer that, but I like the surround effect for music.

I also noticed that the Signal Info function on the 1800 reveals only that the signal is analog. I played several DVD-A discs, some encoded in DTS 5.1, some in DD 5.1, and some in Quad. Most of them sounded very good, but others seemed a little flat. To be honest, I can't remember whether they sounded the same when I had the Oppo connected via HDMI. I also played several SACDs that sounded good. I'm starting to wonder, though, if I somehow took a step back in Multi-channel music SQ by connecting the Oppo via the multi-channel analog inputs. Am I missing something here?
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post #8006 of 8664 Old 11-17-2010, 11:05 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by paligap View Post

...I played several DVD-A discs, some encoded in DTS 5.1, some in DD 5.1, and some in Quad. Most of them sounded very good, but others seemed a little flat. To be honest, I can't remember whether they sounded the same when I had the Oppo connected via HDMI. I also played several SACDs that sounded good. I'm starting to wonder, though, if I somehow took a step back in Multi-channel music SQ by connecting the Oppo via the multi-channel analog inputs. Am I missing something here?

With the multi-channel analog connections, not only do you lose all processing and EQ but you need to recalibrate your system manually (with an SPL meter) to make sure the bass is correct. The subwoofer channel from the Oppo will be 10 or 15dB low and needs boosting. There's not much chance the Yamaha is doing this automatically and by the correct amount (as not all players behave the same).

And if you turn up your sub to make it sound right with analog, what happens when you switch back to a digital source? Getting the system set up so it's correct for both analog and digital is non-trivial. I think you'll save yourself a lot of pain by going back to HDMI.
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post #8007 of 8664 Old 11-17-2010, 03:17 PM
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Dang. Maybe I should have kept the 4310. Oh well, I'll experiment some more to find out if I can get what I want.
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post #8008 of 8664 Old 11-18-2010, 05:40 PM
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I tried some settings in the Oppo that seem similar to the kinds of processing my 1800 does. I played some HDCDs, and they sounded pretty darn good. After I selected some EQ parameters, the bass sounded pretty full. The Oppo does have many settings for speakers, including config, size, distance, and trim. I even found a setting to simulate multi-channel, so I can get sound from the center and rears while playing stereo CDs. I'm not sure it sounds better than just playing them in my old CD player and using the 1800's processing, but I'm going to experiment some more.
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post #8009 of 8664 Old 11-28-2010, 10:26 AM
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I have a Yamaha RX V 3800 and have connected two speakers in the living room ( Zone 2 ) and two on the deck ( Zone 3 ). The amps are set to INT -SP1 for the Zone2 speakers and INT SP2 for the Zone 3.

Recently I noticed that in each zone I can hear any music from only one speaker in each zone.

In Zone 2 it was the speaker in the left corner of living room . I swapped the zone 2 connections and now I can hear music from the right-corner speaker.

Same thing for Zone 3 speakers - if i swap connections I can hear music from the other speaker .

Obviously all 4 speakers and the cabling to all of them is working fine. I do not think that one connector in each zone is busted on the receiver .( At least I hope so ).

Is there a setting I need to check / change ? How can I get music out of both speakers in each zone ?

thanks in advance
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post #8010 of 8664 Old 11-29-2010, 10:52 PM
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I'm hoping someone here can supply with a solution to running my soon to be delivered Panny 3D with my RX-V1800 Which I purchased as a replacement for RX-V2600 to obtain 1080P. Now it appears an RX-A2000 will be in my future (hopefully that one will not be obsolete in the next couple years but I doubt it). Anywho I was wondering if anyone could give me an easy way to run my Direct TV / XBOX360 / PS3 to utilize the 3D functionality of the display but utilizing the RX-V for audio? What would the drawbacks be? I appreciate any help or advice you can give me.

Panny 58VT25
Elite SC-55
Oppo BDP-93
AppleTV 3rd Gen
PS3 Slim
Xbox 360
Xfinity HD-DVR
Panamax M5100-EX
9.2 setup
Polk RM50T mains
Polk RM 302 center
Polk RM 301 surrounds
Polk RM 201 surround back
Polk RM 101 front height
Rel T3
Velodyne DLS4000R
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