The "Official" Denon AVR-2808CI Owners Thread - Page 7 - AVS Forum
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post #181 of 3826 Old 10-16-2007, 07:06 PM
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Originally Posted by wabkab View Post

I think you're on to something. I'll try to change the automatic resolution output from my STB to a set resolution (I guess 720p- since I have a plasma?) and see if that helps. Does anyone think this will adversely affect 1080i or analog signal? I didn't see an option in the denon menu for just HDMI "pass through". I have it set for "a through h"

Thanks

I set the STB to just output @720p and this has made the delay much shorter and less frequent. Channel changes have a 1-2 second delay before picture is up. Not perfect, but much better.

Tony B
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post #182 of 3826 Old 10-17-2007, 12:15 AM
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Glad it helps. I think that channel changes reset the resolution everytime. This comes from the STB. Do you still see a delay when you watch ads?
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post #183 of 3826 Old 10-17-2007, 06:44 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by efjay View Post

I tried Audyssey again tonight at 6 different positions. The results were a bit better than before but after calibration I had no output from my sub in Stereo mode; surround was ok. I got it back by going into Manual setup and toggling the 2CH/Direct option. Also had to adjust the crossover settings a bit but I think this attempt has been successful overall.

Why does this matter? Isn't it supposed to work better with just one position? And why a position in front of the listening positions? Doesn't that defeat the point?
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post #184 of 3826 Old 10-17-2007, 08:31 AM
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OK, just got my 2808CI yesterday. I have it set up and it sounds great. Still trying to scope out all the options/configurations, etc..

I have one "problem".

First, an explanation of my hookup: My subwoofer (Definitive technology) has a built in crossover so that things can be wired with the main left and right speaker wires going to the SW. The SW handles the lows and the rest is passed on to the mains. This makes what would normally be "small" main L+R speakers become "large". There is also a coax LFE connection to the SW.

Now the problem: The auto-setup somehow interprets one of the mains (the one furthest from the SW) as being out of phase. If I move the SW to be dead center (and therefore somewhat close to both mains) then they are not detected as being out of phase. Of course the setup then is calculated with the wrong location (and distance) of the SW. I did not run into this with a Yamaha AVR I had previously.

So, any comments/suggestions?

One other question: With HDMI-in from both DVD (actually Blu-Ray) and DirecTV DVR, and with single HDMI-out to the TV is there any way to get the OSD to show "on top" of the source video? Seems I remember this as a limitation of the 2808CI.

Thanks!
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post #185 of 3826 Old 10-17-2007, 08:35 AM
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The phase detection seems a bit iffy to me, it reported varying results without any change in mic placement or speaker setup whatsoever. I wouldn't split hairs over it; just double check your wiring and move on.
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post #186 of 3826 Old 10-17-2007, 08:59 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by paulsen View Post

OK, just got my 2808CI yesterday. I have it set up and it sounds great. Still trying to scope out all the options/configurations, etc..

I have one "problem".

First, an explanation of my hookup: My subwoofer (Definitive technology) has a built in crossover so that things can be wired with the main left and right speaker wires going to the SW. The SW handles the lows and the rest is passed on to the mains. This makes what would normally be "small" main L+R speakers become "large". There is also a coax LFE connection to the SW.

Now the problem: The auto-setup somehow interprets one of the mains (the one furthest from the SW) as being out of phase. If I move the SW to be dead center (and therefore somewhat close to both mains) then they are not detected as being out of phase. Of course the setup then is calculated with the wrong location (and distance) of the SW. I did not run into this with a Yamaha AVR I had previously.

So, any comments/suggestions?

One other question: With HDMI-in from both DVD (actually Blu-Ray) and DirecTV DVR, and with single HDMI-out to the TV is there any way to get the OSD to show "on top" of the source video? Seems I remember this as a limitation of the 2808CI.

Thanks!

I would think it would be best to not route speaker wires through the subwoofer, just use the SW out from the preamp section of the reciever connected to the LFE in of the sub(that is the norm in most setups). Redo your Audessy setup with that. It will assign appropriate levels/crossovers, speaker sizes, etc. I think the manual states in the autosetup section to set your sub to about half volume and set crossover to max(double check that-which I don't think matters if it is hooked up via the sub in/out).

I have HDMI ins from DVD and DirectTVHDdvr and the menu does show on top of the source video. It must be something in your display or HDMI setup menu.

Tony B
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post #187 of 3826 Old 10-17-2007, 09:32 AM
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Originally Posted by sarvinth View Post

Hello fahertyps, Thanks for your response. As you said I did some research and gone thru some of the speaker forums. The main constraint I am facing is the size of the speaker system, I wish to take this abroad and for that reason I was looking for a home theatre system which could fit in a check-in size box. Could you please suggest me a good set of speakers which are smaller in size and good performance. Price is not a constraint. thanks Again.

Other small systems to check are HSU Ventiloquist, Orb audio and I think maybe Outlaw audio and Aperion has small packages.

Tony B
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post #188 of 3826 Old 10-17-2007, 09:57 AM
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Originally Posted by wabkab View Post

I have HDMI ins from DVD and DirectTVHDdvr and the menu does show on top of the source video. It must be something in your display or HDMI setup menu.

I'm in the same boat with paulsen, my menu displays on a black background when I'm connected to the TV via HDMI. However, when I tested a s-video connection to my TV, the menu displayed over the picture. I assumed the black background was a limitation associated with using HDMI to the TV.

I'm curious, do you only have HDMI going to the TV or do you have analog and HDMI going to the TV? When I hit this, I thought it was a 2808 limitation (I thought I read it somewhere) so I didn't tinker with it much. If you have OSD displaying over the video when using a HDMI connection to the TV, I'll start tinkering with it to figure out what needs to be changed.
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post #189 of 3826 Old 10-17-2007, 10:29 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by insitedata View Post

I'm in the same boat with paulsen, my menu displays on a black background when I'm connected to the TV via HDMI. However, when I tested a s-video connection to my TV, the menu displayed over the picture. I assumed the black background was a limitation associated with using HDMI to the TV.

I'm curious, do you only have HDMI going to the TV or do you have analog and HDMI going to the TV? When I hit this, I thought it was a 2808 limitation (I thought I read it somewhere) so I didn't tinker with it much. If you have OSD displaying over the video when using a HDMI connection to the TV, I'll start tinkering with it to figure out what needs to be changed.

This is mentioned on page 8 of the manual, this is how it is supposed to work over HDMI.
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post #190 of 3826 Old 10-17-2007, 10:56 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by insitedata View Post

I'm in the same boat with paulsen, my menu displays on a black background when I'm connected to the TV via HDMI. However, when I tested a s-video connection to my TV, the menu displayed over the picture. I assumed the black background was a limitation associated with using HDMI to the TV.

I'm curious, do you only have HDMI going to the TV or do you have analog and HDMI going to the TV? When I hit this, I thought it was a 2808 limitation (I thought I read it somewhere) so I didn't tinker with it much. If you have OSD displaying over the video when using a HDMI connection to the TV, I'll start tinkering with it to figure out what needs to be changed.

I have component ins, but the TV input is set to the HDMI only. Based on the last post, I'll double check to make sure that I do have menu over video and get back to you. You know this Alzhiemers thing can be tough??? I'll let you know (if I remember).

Tony B
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post #191 of 3826 Old 10-17-2007, 10:59 AM
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Originally Posted by rafale View Post

Glad it helps. I think that channel changes reset the resolution everytime. This comes from the STB. Do you still see a delay when you watch ads?

Funny, but yes, though shorter than before??

Tony B
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post #192 of 3826 Old 10-17-2007, 03:22 PM
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Originally Posted by wabkab View Post

I have component ins, but the TV input is set to the HDMI only. Based on the last post, I'll double check to make sure that I do have menu over video and get back to you. You know this Alzhiemers thing can be tough??? I'll let you know (if I remember).

I checked and definetely have menu displayed over video on my plasma with the HDMI in.

Tony B
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post #193 of 3826 Old 10-17-2007, 06:06 PM
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Have the same delay problem when changing channels as well (5 - 6 sec). Are you using HDMI in and out to the receiver? Was thinking this might be an analog to digital conversion delay in my situation (analog in and HDMI to TV)?
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post #194 of 3826 Old 10-17-2007, 06:50 PM
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Originally Posted by Bob0115 View Post

Have the same delay problem when changing channels as well (5 - 6 sec). Are you using HDMI in and out to the receiver? Was thinking this might be an analog to digital conversion delay in my situation (analog in and HDMI to TV)?

Yes, but my STB is set to output analog signals and when it changes, I think the Denon hiccups doing its conversion. As I said, I set the STB to 720p stretch mode and it's much better now, but still a rare, short video drop on some commercial changes. Much less now changing channels.

Tony B
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post #195 of 3826 Old 10-18-2007, 07:05 PM
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Few things about the Denon-2808CI

Upscale to 1080p-Using component video connection (to avoid digital HDMI pass through), all 480i upscale to 1080p. The Sony XBR3 can't determine 4:3 ratio and default to FULL mode with all picture stretched.

Still feel that Ohms law prevails and the path of less resistance is best with HDMI straight to TV. Wish they made the same receive without the upscaling. Not worth the money as a modern TV is already pushing all images to 1080p.

Any thoughts...
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post #196 of 3826 Old 10-18-2007, 07:25 PM
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Nothing prevents you from turning the scaler off...
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post #197 of 3826 Old 10-21-2007, 06:24 AM
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I'm pretty new to my 2808 (about a week) and I have been noticing that during commercials the sound levels seem to jump much higher and/or lower as each one starts. This is primarily noticed on playback on a Directv H20 unit. I also notice the display on the receiver changes with each commercial (I don't recall the specifics now but it seems to be changing the sound processing).

Does anyone have any experience with this and any suggestions on how to address this? If you need more info, just ask.

Thanks.
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post #198 of 3826 Old 10-21-2007, 06:47 AM
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Hi. Am a newbie to the 2808 (love it so far) and have a couple of issues. Set-up for now is RCA (composite) from cable box to 2808 and then HDMI to Sharp Aquos. First issue (already have some help here from Tony with this) is the slow response with the picture coming on the screen when changing channels. Takes 5 to 7sec but looks like it is a conversion from analog to digital lag. Going to Direct soon so will be able to test this out.

Second isssue. Would like to be able to listen to the sound from the TV on occasion. I tried setting the audio HDMI set up to TV but it continues to send the signal to the main speakers and nothing to the TV. My HDMI is 1.1 on the TV and I know the receiver is 1.3. I believe these are compatible so anyone have any ideas? Am I missing something on the settings side? Appreciate the help.
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post #199 of 3826 Old 10-21-2007, 08:02 AM
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OK, so two people say they get OSD with a black backgroud and one says he can get OSD over HDMI although he also has component connections. Can anyone else confirm that you can get OSD overaly via HDMI? I had heard you could not with this receiver and that you had to step up to the 3808 to get this feature.

I have my receiver in a remote equipment room and will have only one HDMI cable going to my projector, so this feature is important to me. I do not want/need the networking capabilities of the 3808 and 2 HDMI inputs will work for me, so if the 2808 will do OSD over HDMI, I would rather save the $400 and get it over the 3808.

Thanks.
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post #200 of 3826 Old 10-21-2007, 08:02 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nycdan View Post

I'm pretty new to my 2808 (about a week) and I have been noticing that during commercials the sound levels seem to jump much higher and/or lower as each one starts. This is primarily noticed on playback on a Directv H20 unit. I also notice the display on the receiver changes with each commercial (I don't recall the specifics now but it seems to be changing the sound processing).

Does anyone have any experience with this and any suggestions on how to address this? If you need more info, just ask.

Thanks.

I don't think there is anything you can do about it other than get the television industry, DirectTV, and everyone else involved to all provide content in the same format. Your system is simply dealing with the source material being fed to it. It *might* be that a fancier AVR with a faster processor would be quicker at switching formats but the 2808 is not a low-end piece of equipment so I wouldn't expect much improvement from other equipment (just guessing here).

One thing you might look at is the setup screens on the H20, If it is like mine it has options for the allowable (?) formats (480i, 720p, 1080i, etc.). Be sure those are set properly to match the abilities of your TV's display.

Another option on the H20 is someting called (I think) "native mode" which may or may not help. I don't think it will but you can experiment with it.

Neither of the above will fix everything and may not even fix anything. Just some things to try out.

rcp
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post #201 of 3826 Old 10-21-2007, 08:55 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gator123 View Post

OK, so two people say they get OSD with a black backgroud and one says he can get OSD over HDMI although he also has component connections. Can anyone else confirm that you can get OSD overaly via HDMI? I had heard you could not with this receiver and that you had to step up to the 3808 to get this feature.

From the 2808CI manual page 8:

Quote:


* When viewing HDMI or component video signals via the AVR-2808CI, the on-screen display appears when the MENU button or the main remote control unit's PARA button is operated.
* When only HDMI or component video signals are input to the AVR-2808CI, the characters of the on-screen display are not displayed over the picture.

I think this means that you are right -- you cannot get OSD overlay unless the video signal to the AVR is via either S-Video or plain old Video (RCA). Maybe if your source can be wired via *both* HDMI and S-video you can get the OSD overlay by (temporarily) switching the AVR (and the source) to S-video. This will likely defeat your reason for wanting this ability in the first place or at the least may be too inconvenient to be acceptable.

I also have the 2808 with only HDMI inputs. The one place where I would have liked OSD over picture is when using the audio-delay feature. Fortunately Denon has anticipated this and allows you to watch the picture with *no* OSD while adjusting audio-delay. It can be done while showing the undisturbed video with the adjustment being shown only on on the unit's front panel display. That is good enough for me.

rcp
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post #202 of 3826 Old 10-21-2007, 01:36 PM
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I have a DirecTV satellite digital video recorder hooked to HDMI2.

Before I start experimenting with a variety of configurations, a few questions...
  1. Should I use Input Setup's assign function to assign HDMI2 to DVR, SAT, or leave it its default of HDP? Does it make a difference? I think I should use SAT or DVR so I can tell the remote to use the proper preset code to, at a minimum, change channels.

  2. Assuming I set it to DVR or SAT, has anyone worked out the best preset code to use for a DirecTV HR20?

  3. Do I need to press one of the [MODE SELECTOR] "buttons" on the remote in order to operate the DirecTV or do things like channel change "punch through" (I think that's the standard terminology) so that the channels change even when the remote is in [AMP] mode?

Thanks!

rcp
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post #203 of 3826 Old 10-21-2007, 03:09 PM
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Paulsen - Thanks for the confirmation, that is what I thought. One more question though, other than the audio-delay setting, is there any other time where you think you think OSD over the picture would be really necessary?

Do I understand it correctly that what happens is basically you are watching a movie, you hit the menu button on the remote and the audio remains but the picture is replaced with the the text of the input/source, Surround Mode and Volume over a black background until you hit the menu button again and the picture re-appears? If that is how it works, can you basically hit the menu button two times really fast and miss only a few seconds of the video you are watching? I would probably just use it right after I started a movie to confirm that I am getting DTS or DD or whatever new HD format I might be using and to confirm the volume is not through the roof. If this is the case I am thinking I might not really "need" OSD overlay via HDMI.
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post #204 of 3826 Old 10-21-2007, 03:59 PM
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Hello,

I purchased the Denon AVR-2808CI several weeks ago but have not unboxed it yet. I have been waiting until I purchased a plasma TV. Well, I just purchased a plasma TV last Tuesday, but it will not be delivered until 10/29. The TV is the Panasonic TH-50PZ700U 1080P plasma. The TV will go in the family room. It has 2 HDMI connections on it..

The family room is already pre-wired for surround sound and the TV will fit above the fireplace in an alcove. The receiver will be on a rack approximately 15 foot away. This is the location where all of the speaker wires comes to a box inside the wall. It will be impossible for me to run an HDMI cable from the TV to the receiver thru the wall. However, the person that pre-wired that room, did run 3 RG6 quad-shielded coax from the alcove to the box inside the wall where the receiver will be located.

OK.. I have three components that I need to connect to the Denon receiver.
1. Comcast HD Cable Box
2. Sony PS3 Blu-Ray DVD Player
3. Panasonic TH-50PZ700U plasma TV

Please give me advice on the best approach in connecting these components to the DENON receiver. I am especially interested in how to connect the TV to the receiver knowing that I am unable to use a HDMI cable. I could use the three coax to create a component cable. If I am using a component connection for the TV, will the Denon upconvert/upscale the signal to 1080p. I don't fully understand the concept of upconverting and upscaling.

Please HELP!!!!!
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post #205 of 3826 Old 10-21-2007, 05:46 PM
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Is it safe to assume that the 2808 cann apply post processing (PLIIx) to 5.1 LPCM sources such as a PS3 to get 7.1 surround?

Also, can anyone comment on the color space settings I heard the Denons have (being able to set RGB)
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post #206 of 3826 Old 10-21-2007, 06:44 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob0115 View Post

Second isssue. Would like to be able to listen to the sound from the TV on occasion. I tried setting the audio HDMI set up to TV but it continues to send the signal to the main speakers and nothing to the TV. My HDMI is 1.1 on the TV and I know the receiver is 1.3. I believe these are compatible so anyone have any ideas? Am I missing something on the settings side? Appreciate the help.

I had the same situation. The 2808 definitely does not send an audio signal over HDMI when using an RCA input signal. The manual confirms this somewhere. Maybe it will send audio over HDMI if scaling is disabled and the input is also HDMI. However, I'm not setup like that so I haven't tried it.

I had the same situation before my speakers arrived. I ran analog stereo cables to the TV using my second room pre-out. It wasn't seamless when switching between components (since you had to change it for two rooms), but it works when needed. Just remember that, initially, the volume on the second room is turned completely down. As a newbie, I initially thought I had a problem since I didn't hear anything through the pre-out. However, I only needed to turn up the volume on the second room!

Another option, if you have enough HDMI inputs on your TV, is to run HDMI directly to the TV (both audio and video would come through) and also run your RCA from the box through the receiver to a second HDMI TV input. Then you would have a clean way to watch TV without the receiver and one path through the receiver.
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post #207 of 3826 Old 10-21-2007, 07:35 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by paulsen View Post

From the 2808CI manual page 8:



I think this means that you are right -- you cannot get OSD overlay unless the video signal to the AVR is via either S-Video or plain old Video (RCA). Maybe if your source can be wired via *both* HDMI and S-video you can get the OSD overlay by (temporarily) switching the AVR (and the source) to S-video. This will likely defeat your reason for wanting this ability in the first place or at the least may be too inconvenient to be acceptable.

I also have the 2808 with only HDMI inputs. The one place where I would have liked OSD over picture is when using the audio-delay feature. Fortunately Denon has anticipated this and allows you to watch the picture with *no* OSD while adjusting audio-delay. It can be done while showing the undisturbed video with the adjustment being shown only on on the unit's front panel display. That is good enough for me.

rcp

Okay, since my 2808 is displaying menu over video when outputing HDMI and the AVR's input is via HDMI, I don't know what to say. I did also run an Svideo out of my Directv HD DVR to alleviate possible downconversion issues for my analog zone 2. I still can't figure out why that would be a player here, since I know that can't be passing the HD that I can have the menu overlay. If that is why it works, then it is doing this automatically since I haven't done anything specific in the setup(that I know of). Again, although I have a component set out to the TV, it is not set on that input.

Tony B
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post #208 of 3826 Old 10-21-2007, 08:33 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by insitedata View Post

I had the same situation. The 2808 definitely does not send an audio signal over HDMI when using an RCA input signal. The manual confirms this somewhere. Maybe it will send audio over HDMI if scaling is disabled and the input is also HDMI. However, I'm not setup like that so I haven't tried it.

I had the same situation before my speakers arrived. I ran analog stereo cables to the TV using my second room pre-out. It wasn't seamless when switching between components (since you had to change it for two rooms), but it works when needed. Just remember that, initially, the volume on the second room is turned completely down. As a newbie, I initially thought I had a problem since I didn't hear anything through the pre-out. However, I only needed to turn up the volume on the second room!

Another option, if you have enough HDMI inputs on your TV, is to run HDMI directly to the TV (both audio and video would come through) and also run your RCA from the box through the receiver to a second HDMI TV input. Then you would have a clean way to watch TV without the receiver and one path through the receiver.

Quote:
Originally Posted by wabkab View Post

Okay, since my 2808 is displaying menu over video when outputing HDMI and the AVR's input is via HDMI, I don't know what to say. I did also run an Svideo out of my Directv HD DVR to alleviate possible downconversion issues for my analog zone 2. I still can't figure out why that would be a player here, since I know that can't be passing the HD that I can have the menu overlay. If that is why it works, then it is doing this automatically since I haven't done anything specific in the setup(that I know of). Again, although I have a component set out to the TV, it is not set on that input.

Please excuse me if I've missed something along the way and seem to be missing the mark with my remarks.

My cabling method ensures audio and video, (as applicable) is available from Directv HD/SD, Toshiba HD-DVD and Denon CD/SACD to my Denon AVR 987, Infinity Systems Speakers, Velodyne Sub and just as importantly, our Sony KDF46E2000 HDTV.

I run HDMI from the Directv HR20-700 HD-DVR and Toshiba HD-DVD to the Denon AVR 987. Multi-Channel analog audio cables connect the Denon 2200 SACD to the Denon AVR 987.

A third HDMI connects my Denon AVR 987 to the Sony KDF46E2000. This configuration ensures audio and video is available to all components.

1953

MY EQUIPMENT
Sony HDTV KDL-46HX750
Denon AVR 1912
DirecTV HD DVR HR24 & AM21N OTA Receiver
Panasonic HD DVD DMP-BD65 & Toshiba HD DVR A20
Infinity Alpha Series Speakers - 50's (2), 20's (2), 10's (2), 37c (1) & Velodyne Subwoofer
Panamax M4300-PM Power Center
Monoprice Cables & Harmony One Remote
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post #209 of 3826 Old 10-22-2007, 04:51 AM
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Originally Posted by 49Merc View Post

Please excuse me if I've missed something along the way and seem to be missing the mark with my remarks.

My cabling method ensures audio and video, (as applicable) is available from Directv HD/SD, Toshiba HD-DVD and Denon CD/SACD to my Denon AVR 987, Infinity Systems Speakers, Velodyne Sub and just as importantly, our Sony KDF46E2000 HDTV.

I run HDMI from the Directv HR20-700 HD-DVR and Toshiba HD-DVD to the Denon AVR 987. Multi-Channel analog audio cables connect the Denon 2200 SACD to the Denon AVR 987.

A third HDMI connects my Denon AVR 987 to the Sony KDF46E2000. This configuration ensures audio and video is available to all components.

1953

Sounds fine, we're just trying to figure out why my 2808 is displaying OSD at the same time with HDMI passed audio/video. If no one else is getting it, it must be my Svideo to the AVR and the AVR is putting that thru HDMI. Either way, it works.

Tony B
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post #210 of 3826 Old 10-22-2007, 05:11 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wabkab View Post

Sounds fine, we're just trying to figure out why my 2808 is displaying OSD at the same time with HDMI passed audio/video. If no one else is getting it, it must be my Svideo to the AVR and the AVR is putting that thru HDMI. Either way, it works.

I get the OSD on s-video and composite sources, output overlayed over HDMI. No biggie, this is normal.
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