SSP & Pre/Pros that support HDMI Audio MPCM - Page 13 - AVS Forum
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post #361 of 1049 Old 06-27-2008, 07:53 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Eric Carroll View Post

I strive to make this thread as high value as possible, so I do as much crosschecking as I can and obviously prefer manufacturer, dealer and definitive preview sources (like RebelMan and Classe) in that order.

But sometimes a rumour is interesting. With some rumour cross-checking, I will link to a rumour. By cross-checking I mean reading the thread to see the context of the claim, doing some google searching, looking at the specificity of the claims or just speculation, looking at the poster's previous posts to see if they have any track record of insider info, etc. I don't just post single articles without any review or context. This one was sufficiently interesting enough to pass on in my estimation.

I do understand the risk of propagating rumours.

So, your mileage may vary, no warranty expressed or implied, this thread may contain forward looking statements made pursuant to the safe harbor provisions of the Private Securities Litigation Reform Act of 1995, as amended, this is not investment advice, you should consult a professional, this thread is for entertainment purposes only, .

I think important any news on the topic gets reported here, eric as long as you reference your source as you did on the point in question, people can go do their own digging to come to their own conclusions.

what people then take and do with the info is not erics responsibility and not something he or anyone else can do anything about

need to keep in mind you can even have info from official sources, even posting on this forum, info from reviewers, dealers and distributors from around the world confirming the info only for it to turn out bogus or a "mis-understanding". can think of one particualr example not that long ago fitting that bill

basically till some thing is out and in the flesh the rest is jsut words. hopefully everyone can appreciate that even if it is for these words that many do come here

"Technology is a drug. We can't get enough of it."


Welcome to my lounge room :)
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post #362 of 1049 Old 06-28-2008, 05:52 AM
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To help with Eric's plight, I've decided to make a matrix. I don't have time to complete it and perhaps I can request that the knowledge of this board can help me complete it. Here is what I have so far, attached as a PDF:

Can others help to make this matrix more complete? We need someone to be delegated to each of the products:

Meridian
Lexicon
ML 40
ML 502
Halcro SSP200
Denon AVP
Krell S1000
Krell Evo 707
McIntosh MX-136
Integra 9.8 DTC

Any others missing?

 

HDMI_Processors.pdf 193.740234375k . file

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post #363 of 1049 Old 06-28-2008, 06:12 AM
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PS. I'll maintain the Doc and keep it current. Just need people to add specs to the products based on the following categories:

Cost
DSP
DAC (LCR, S, A1, A2)
DAC(Surrounds)
ADC
Volume Control
SE OP Buffer
Balanced OP Buffer
Zones
HDMI
Analog Inputs
Video Inputs
Video Outputs
Audio Outputs
Codecs
Room Correction

It there anything I am missing? I thought about adding an option for video display/ touch screen but wasn't sure if it was important. is it? What about support for integration features? Classe's CANBUS system for an all Delta setup, or Crestron control, Denon link for their stuff and CAST for krell?

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post #364 of 1049 Old 06-28-2008, 07:57 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sikoniko View Post

PS. I'll maintain the Doc and keep it current. Just need people to add specs to the products based on the following categories:

Cost
DSP
DAC (LCR, S, A1, A2)
DAC(Surrounds)
ADC
Volume Control
SE OP Buffer
Balanced OP Buffer
Zones
HDMI
Analog Inputs
Video Inputs
Video Outputs
Audio Outputs
Codecs
Room Correction

It there anything I am missing? I thought about adding an option for video display/ touch screen but wasn't sure if it was important. is it? What about support for integration features? Classe's CANBUS system for an all Delta setup, or Crestron control, Denon link for their stuff and CAST for krell?

Suggest there are a few additional categories if you look at this thread.

Tim
Selling Anthem PVA7.
STABILITY + Superior audio (SC09-TX) + Incredible picture (VPL-VW200) + good integration.
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post #365 of 1049 Old 06-28-2008, 08:00 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sikoniko View Post

I'm not sure I find value in EQ though. I suppose it suits people who are trying to integrate into multi-role rooms?

And how many rooms are so acoustically perfect that they cannot benefit from help?

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post #366 of 1049 Old 06-28-2008, 08:02 AM
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I know of one, HELENE.
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post #367 of 1049 Old 06-28-2008, 08:36 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CINERAMAX View Post

I know of one, HELENE.

Thanks for the glib answer but I suspect that you think it unique enough to support my position.

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post #368 of 1049 Old 06-28-2008, 08:44 AM
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post #369 of 1049 Old 06-28-2008, 08:57 AM
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DSD and scaling stand out to me in the chart. Are those of importance to people for this purpose?

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post #370 of 1049 Old 06-28-2008, 09:07 AM
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Is this going to be an EQ thread? What are you boosting and why? Even if something can be "AutoEq'd" wouldn't it be important to understand what is being done and why it is being done?

I would not consider EQing a room until I have completed treatment of the room. I think it is safe to assume, especially in a WAF situation, that most people with AutoEq are using it in rooms where there is little to no treatment and the EQ is being used as a work-around to a properly setup room.

Are you claiming that this room is 100% properly treated, and you are using Audyssey as a last measure?



Or, could it be that you've treated to what is "liveable" and then using the EQ to get you over the hump?

I don't see audyssey or Trinnov as a means to an end, or the holy grail that everyone makes it out to be. I see it as another tool on the toolbelt. Sometimes you use it, sometimes you don't.

Sometimes the best advice is to keep it simple.
LL

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post #371 of 1049 Old 06-28-2008, 09:17 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sikoniko View Post

Is this going to be an EQ thread? What are you boosting and why? Even if something can be "AutoEq'd" wouldn't it be important to understand what is being done and why it is being done?

I would not consider EQing a room until I have completed treatment of the room. I think it is safe to assume, especially in a WAF situation, that most people with AutoEq are using it in rooms where there is little to no treatment and the EQ is being used as a work-around to a properly setup room.

Are you claiming that this room is 100% properly treated, and you are using Audyssey as a last measure?

Or, could it be that you've treated to what is "liveable" and then using the EQ to get you over the hump?

I don't see audyssey or Trinnov as a means to an end, or the holy grail that everyone makes it out to be. I see it as another tool on the toolbelt. Sometimes you use it, sometimes you don't.

Sometimes the best advice is to keep it simple.

I see it as one of the means to an end and not the holy grail.

Is this room 100% properly treated? Of course, not but, as I asked, how many rooms are? If you scan the many pictures posted for various reasons on AVS, the obvious conclusion is that very, very few are and many (perhaps the majority) are not treated at all. In all these cases (and my own), EQ is a useful tool.

So, let me ask another question, why is the inclusion of EQ not a useful feature for many people? You do not have to use it if it is not needed or if you have a philosophical bias against it.

Kal Rubinson

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Senior Contributing Editor, Stereophile
http://www.stereophile.com/category/music-round

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post #372 of 1049 Old 06-28-2008, 09:40 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kal Rubinson View Post

I see it as one of the means to an end and not the holy grail.

Is this room 100% properly treated? Of course, not but, as I asked, how many rooms are? If you scan the many pictures posted for various reasons on AVS, the obvious conclusion is that very, very few are and many (perhaps the majority) are not treated at all. In all these cases (and my own), EQ is a useful tool.

So, let me ask another question, why is the inclusion of EQ not a useful feature for many people? You do not have to use it if it is not needed or if you have a philosophical bias against it.

Kal, waste of time, that last statement encapsulates his position, which of course would change should Classe ever include REQ.
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post #373 of 1049 Old 06-28-2008, 10:05 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rnrgagne View Post

Kal, waste of time, that last statement encapsulates his position, which of course would change should Classe ever include REQ.

Why does my opinion have to be based on Classe? How do you know what experience I have?

I argue the notion that flat is the best, or a "curve" is just as much as anyone can argue that ford is better than chevy.

What experience have I to make these claims? I've been in studio's. I've worked with engineers and sound guys and I am a musician.

I use EQ in my car. I boost 80hz, 400khz and 12.5khz. But I know what I'm doing and why I am doing it. I also adjust it on my own for my own tastes. I like the crispness of a ringing cymbol, the depth of the sound of a guitar and I enjoy hearing the different tones of a bass guitar.

You know what? I get that out of my system, in my room without EQ. My room has a few problems. I plan on adding some diffusors shortly, carpet and a second row of seating. All of these changes will dynamically change the outcome of my room. Only after I made those changes would I be worried about EQ. It may take a year to get to that point though, as of right now my wife and I are working on our backyard.

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post #374 of 1049 Old 06-28-2008, 10:15 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kal Rubinson View Post

I see it as one of the means to an end and not the holy grail.

Is this room 100% properly treated? Of course, not but, as I asked, how many rooms are? If you scan the many pictures posted for various reasons on AVS, the obvious conclusion is that very, very few are and many (perhaps the majority) are not treated at all. In all these cases (and my own), EQ is a useful tool.

I wish I could scan a picture of your B&W room... you are hiding that picture like the ark of the covenant! (OK, I'm on an Indy theme, but I won't discuss Indiana Jones and the close encounters of the crystal ETs).

Quote:


So, let me ask another question, why is the inclusion of EQ not a useful feature for many people? You do not have to use it if it is not needed or if you have a philosophical bias against it.

In response to your question, it really depends on implementation. I'm not technically against the notion of an EQ. I'm against the juju that says you have to have it or else a product is obsolete, not competitive, or a waiste of money. Which you have never stated.

Again, it is a tool in the belt. Would you use a jackhammer to drill holes in the wall to hang a picture?

To be honest with you Kal, I find you to be the most credible proponent of making the arguement to add it. But you don't say, you have to have it or else its crap like everyone else does.

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post #375 of 1049 Old 06-28-2008, 11:09 AM
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Guys, you are getting away from the point of the thread (just like me complaining about rumors). Can you take it outside?

Tim
Selling Anthem PVA7.
STABILITY + Superior audio (SC09-TX) + Incredible picture (VPL-VW200) + good integration.
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post #376 of 1049 Old 06-28-2008, 02:34 PM - Thread Starter
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I have updated post #1 with this month's activities, and promoted Marantz to "shipping". And then there were four!

Note that Classe moved its ship date for the SSP-800 to July: http://www.classeaudio.com/html/ssp800notice.htm
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post #377 of 1049 Old 07-03-2008, 09:05 AM
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Hi,

Just heard that CRESTRON was getting a pre with audyssey EQ, HDMI and HD audio... plus multiroom and Crestron things, of course.
Should quite a big boy !

There will be amplifiers to go with it...
No price or deadline to give you, sorry (but i believe it will be expensive) !
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post #378 of 1049 Old 07-03-2008, 11:58 AM - Thread Starter
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There is a discussion of the new ATI Theta successor to the CB3 in The New Theta Digital ATI "Full Speed Ahead" for CEDIA 2008 & BEYOND!!!! thread.

Some highlights:
  • two processors underway, Valis and Casablanca III successor.
  • Valis will be HMDI 1.1 or 1.2 and not HBR capable.
  • Casanblanca III successor will use their existing CB3 chassis, and Xtreme and Superior II DACs
  • Momentum Data Systems OEM DSP (same as Classe)
  • first showing at CEDIA 08
Availability dates and MSRP not yet available.

(Thanks to rydenfan for pointing this out to me).
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post #379 of 1049 Old 07-03-2008, 12:21 PM - Thread Starter
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In the "no confirmation but I've heard it enough times from different sources to be deemed interesting" department:

Parasound will debut an HDMI capable pre/pro to replace the C2 at CEDIA 08. No other details currently available.

I have not heard anything even semi-official on this front.

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post #380 of 1049 Old 07-03-2008, 11:23 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Eric Carroll View Post

In the "no confirmation but I've heard it enough times from different sources to be deemed interesting" department:

Parasound will debut an HDMI capable pre/pro to replace the C2 at CEDIA 08. No other details currently available.

I have not heard anything even semi-official on this front.


I heard end of the year for Parasound but this could easily slip to spring.
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post #381 of 1049 Old 07-04-2008, 12:06 PM
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Originally Posted by Krobar View Post

I heard end of the year for Parasound but this could easily slip to spring.

Parasound Halo is notorious for missing dates. I would expect next Spring best case if not later.

"Dream as if you'll live forever. Live as if you'll die today."
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post #382 of 1049 Old 07-06-2008, 12:45 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Eric Carroll View Post

In the "no confirmation but I've heard it enough times from different sources to be deemed interesting" department:

Parasound will debut an HDMI capable pre/pro to replace the C2 at CEDIA 08. No other details currently available.

I have not heard anything even semi-official on this front.


I have heard this as well. ...from one of their dealers.

->>>≈<<<-
Speakerquest
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post #383 of 1049 Old 07-17-2008, 06:55 PM - Thread Starter
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Onkyo has announced the DHC 9.9 pre/pro for release in early September at least in Japan. MSRP is 231,000 yen, which is around US$2200.

Not a lot of detail available as yet other than standard features like HDMI 4I/2O. ISF certification logo is embedded in a Japanese overview PDF so it will be interesting to see what that really means. Another interesting tidbit is the apparently inclusion of Audyssey MultiEQ XT, Dynamic EQ and Dynamic Volume.

Akihabara News blog posting
AVSForum Integra DTC-9.9 in September thread
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post #384 of 1049 Old 07-17-2008, 07:25 PM - Thread Starter
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I have heard from a dealer directly that Cary has notified dealers of a ship date of mid-September for the Cinema 11a.
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post #385 of 1049 Old 07-18-2008, 09:28 AM - Thread Starter
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Cary Audio has posted a status update on the Cary 11 thread basically confirming my above post. Target ship for CEDIA.

Cary summarizes the delay as a CODEC approval issue from Dolby/DTS on the Cirrus Logic DSP:
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Originally Posted by Jason Barbour View Post

After months and months of waiting for Dolby and DTS to finally get their stuff together with Cirrus on this new chip, as of this week, BOTH audio codecs have been approved. Dolby was finalized and approved months ago, but we have been waiting on DTS. Cirrus Logic submitted over 27 sample chips to DTS over the course of the last few months, all of which were rejected by DTS. Well, DTS has finally approved the DTS-HD and DTS-HD MA audio codecs so now we can all finally move forward!

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post #386 of 1049 Old 07-20-2008, 12:17 PM - Thread Starter
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A posting on HTGuide suggested Lexicon might be working on a successor to the MC-12HD. Its as rumour-y as you can get, but let's see if they announce anything at CEDIA.
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post #387 of 1049 Old 07-22-2008, 12:17 PM
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Is the Cirrus Logic DSP the chip to beat? When this chip finally ships, is it going to be open up a flood-gate of high-end processors? Is the TI going to stand a chance, or the Cirrus chip over hyped?
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post #388 of 1049 Old 07-22-2008, 12:22 PM - Thread Starter
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Let's just say that the a number of (non-AVR) vendors picked the Cirrus chip and got caught in the resulting delays. When I looked at it, it has some advantages that made it obviously attractive.

But better?

Discussions of "whose chip is better" would be interesting, but are better done in a separate thread.
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post #389 of 1049 Old 07-23-2008, 06:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Eric Carroll View Post

Let's just say that the a number of (non-AVR) When I looked at it (Cirrus), it has some advantages that made it obviously attractive. .

Curious -- such as what?
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post #390 of 1049 Old 07-23-2008, 06:53 PM - Thread Starter
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Dual core on chip making for high speed inter-DSP communication to keep the audio chain delay down, for one. Higher clock speed than usual as well. There is a thread discussing this somewhere...
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