Official Classe SSP-800 thread. - Page 8 - AVS Forum
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post #211 of 5881 Old 06-12-2008, 05:59 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DulcetTones View Post

Sounds like this has gone full circle.
Those of us interested in the ssp-800 (usually those already using Classe equipment) are more concerned about sound quality rather than worrying about Audyssey, however there is no reason why the SEQ cannot be purchased, which in theory should be better than the Audyssey provided on AV receivers.
At least with the SEQ and the pro kit you do not need to worry about calling out an engineer whenever you play around with layout and speakers, furthermore sounds like Chris in the Audyssey topic would be more than helpful as well.

While ssp-800 does not have HBR, films on blu-ray should be watchable using uncompressed PCM (via HDMI) that is equal (subjective I guess) in quality.

So I cannot see any problems, as long as the ssp-800 lives up to the sound quality that the company is known for
So the product may not convince those who are currently using top of the line Denons/etc, but then it could be argued they do not fit the Classe customer profile used for designing the ssp-800.

Edit:
One other nice feature of the SEQ is that it can be switched off easily, so can appeal to those who at times want correction or not, maybe switching from surround for films/sacd/etc to 2-channel listening.

Cheers
DT

sorry DT reading your post there are quite a few points needing correction and clarification in regards audyssey

sure if classe decide to not include audyssey onboard, people could always add on the SEQ unit. however as pointed out by myself and eric carrol earlier. unlike the built in system it is an additional box. and "at quite considerable additional expense plus additional cabling, associated insertion loss(3-10db!) and adding in the process another quite unnecessary ADC/DAC conversion".

The SEQ will always remain in curcuit. and quite contrary to what you have posted with the SEQ and the pro kit you do "need to worry about calling out an engineer whenever you play around with layout and speakers" this is quite unlike the built in system which you can run your self and dont need to worry about calling out an engineer whenever you play around with layout and speakers.

and yes orcourse either way you go Chris in the Audyssey topic would be more than helpful as well I am sure.

And with the built in audyssey system you can indeed switch audyssey off if it is not your want. you can also turn off dynamic eq if it is not your want you dont have to buy SEQ to get that handy feature

'classe customer profile' 'denon customer profile'

so what is the sim audio moon customer profile that happens to be given the option by the company to have the option and the choice of whether they want to use the audyssey system on board their new av pre

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post #212 of 5881 Old 06-12-2008, 06:12 AM
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Is this thread now a topic of audessey or the classe ssp-800?

I think people are upset that Classe made the choice for the customer, instead of letting people decide for themselves. I have a suggestion.. Don't buy the product. BUT, don't tell people they are wrong for wanting to buy it either. It is what it is and no matter how much we go round and round, the product won't ship with audessey, so lets move the topic along, please.

Consumers have options in which products they buy. There are plenty of options with Audessey. I suggest you exercise one of them.

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post #213 of 5881 Old 06-12-2008, 06:17 AM
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alebonau,
hate to disagree but I have seen the SEQ and I did not find it too awe inspiring technical to put me off using it on my own with the pro kit, try using the Meridian 861 equalizer to put it into perspective.
It comes down to how much time you are willing to invest in learning and using the technology.

Now my word may not be enough, so here is a link of an actual reviewer who did the same.
http://www.audioholics.com/reviews/a...ware-and-setup

To say the quality will reduce because of using an external SEQ is circumstantial and I have not seen one review or actual comment from someone using the product to suggest it corrupts the sound more so than the Audyssey in an all-in-one unit.

Edit:
And as a technical engineer/consultant I do have to say any product before it is created is designed around a customer profile, you do not spend time/energy/money on developing a product and then wonder who you are selling to
Understanding your customer base comes 1st, this may help to explain why Classe customers are not strongly concerned by the lack of room correction

Also please note I did not say that the SEQ is removed from the circuit, I mention the room correction can be switched off very easily.
Anyway I agree lets move on, I can see there are some who want to argue about the specifics of everything and anything.

Cheers
DT
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post #214 of 5881 Old 06-12-2008, 06:37 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sikoniko View Post

Is this thread now a topic of audessey or the classe ssp-800?

I think people are upset that Classe made the choice for the customer, instead of letting people decide for themselves. I have a suggestion.. Don't buy the product. BUT, don't tell people they are wrong for wanting to buy it either. It is what it is and no matter how much we go round and round, the product won't ship with audessey, so lets move the topic along, please.

Consumers have options in which products they buy. There are plenty of options with Audessey. I suggest you exercise one of them.

I think some are turning the ssp-800 functionality from a bump into a mountain the size of Everest
Cheers
DT
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post #215 of 5881 Old 06-12-2008, 07:37 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DulcetTones View Post

I think some are turning the ssp-800 functionality from a bump into a mountain the size of Everest
Cheers
DT

People are judging the SSP-800 by the lack of one feature, instead of waiting until it comes out, doing a demo and judging it based on its real-world capabilities.

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post #216 of 5881 Old 06-12-2008, 07:59 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sikoniko View Post

People are judging the SSP-800 by the lack of one feature, instead of waiting until it comes out, doing a demo and judging it based on its real-world capabilities.

Dont get me wrong, I agree with you and I am amazed 3 pages so far has been arguing about this, even to the point of arguing about the solution of using an external room correction system.

Like you say, who knows how it sounds on its own or even with an external solution such as SEQ, compared to other products.

I think some of what may have been missed in the argument is that the Classe is really more up against the Lexicon/Meridian 861/etc products, and to compete on room calibration would require an extensive product not just the add-in found in AV receivers.
This is why personally I am not worried as I can decide whether I want to pay the cost by looking at the SEQ; whether the SEQ matches up well with the Classe or even is required cannot even be argued for/against until the product is available and then compared to its relevant rivals.


Cheers
DT
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post #217 of 5881 Old 06-12-2008, 08:56 AM
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Originally Posted by RebelMan View Post

Classe' has REQ just not the one you are looking for and this thread was not interested in your Denon promotion.
A misstatement of facts and a pump for Denon warranted it.
That wasn't the case and I wouldn't have taken exception to your comments had you done your homework and not made a case for Denon.
You opinion is welcome but not your bias.

You are incredible. Please explain how the statement below, which is all I said about the Denon, implies a bias that I should be attacked for?

Verbatim;

"I agree with Prof that it's a puzzling feature set to come out with at this point in the HDMI 1.3 game. Same with the Cary 11a only having two HDMI inputs...
Right now IMO the Denon AVP is the only one that got it 100% right feature-wise, it'll be interesting to see if they hit that number with the audio quality too."


That is simply a statement that Denon has just about every bell and whistle available not that it's a better piece than the Classe. It's not a "pump" it's a fact - I can't think of any other pre-pro right now with the same feature set and if there was one I would have used it as the example instead.

By the way I was also referring to the lack of HBR processing which is now available on $500 receivers in that questioning. It's just strange they wouldn't have that. I don't know if you've heard DTS HD MA for music but it is incredible and to have access to the Classe's DACs instead of the players' would be highly desirable IMO.
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post #218 of 5881 Old 06-12-2008, 09:18 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rnrgagne View Post

That is simply a statement that Denon has just about every bell and whistle available not that it's a better piece than the Classe. It's not a "pump" it's a fact - I can't think of any other pre-pro right now with the same feature set and if there was one I would have used it as the example instead.

Yes, Denon has every bell and whistle... but what about those who don't want / need whistles? The Classe has very nice bells.

Quote:


By the way I was also referring to the lack of HBR processing which is now available on $500 receivers in that questioning. It's just strange they wouldn't have that. I don't know if you've heard DTS HD MA for music but it is incredible and to have access to the Classe's DACs instead of the players' would be highly desirable IMO.

Well, my PS3 will be able to do DTSMA to the SSP-800, so I don't see what the problem is. The problem will be for people who don't have onboard capability on their source, and IMO, if you can afford to buy the SSP-800, you can afford to update your source player.

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post #219 of 5881 Old 06-12-2008, 09:29 AM
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[quote=sikoniko;14068228]Yes, Denon has every bell and whistle... but what about those who don't want / need whistles? The Classe has very nice bells.
[quote]

There's tons of options for them, including the Classe.
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post #220 of 5881 Old 06-12-2008, 09:37 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sikoniko View Post

if you can afford to buy the SSP-800, you can afford to update your source player.

Or you can do what I am going to do - wait for the upgrade. It's not like there is a huge amount of compelling DTS MA software out there.

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post #221 of 5881 Old 06-12-2008, 09:48 AM
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Originally Posted by sikoniko View Post

if you can afford to buy the SSP-800, you can afford to update your source player.

So you buy the SSP-800 because it's the best sounding processor on the market and then you go out and get external DACs to do the job?

I don't get it.

There likely is no reason to believe that conversion to LPCM/MPCM before sending it via HDMI will result in any loss of audio quality, but at the same time would it have been a tough thing for Classe to include HBR decoding on board for those that just want to use a transport?

It seems that every solution to Classe's excluded features is "go spend more money".

Not a problem for some I suppose, and likely their intended market as some have suggested earlier.

Having said all of that I wouldn't be surprised if they upgrade this unit over time as Anthem did with the D2. So this discussion could become a moot point. (Oh, shoot - now I'm an Anthem promoter.. )
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post #222 of 5881 Old 06-12-2008, 10:03 AM
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Originally Posted by rnrgagne View Post

So you buy the SSP-800 because it's the best sounding processor on the market and then you go out and get external DACs to do the job?

I don't get it.

Who said anything about a DAC? The PS3 can do DTSMA internally... That is relatively cheap. Make your dealer throw one in if you are paying full price...

Quote:


Having said all of that I wouldn't be surprised if they upgrade this unit over time as Anthem did with the D2. So this discussion could become a moot point. (Oh, shoot - now I'm an Anthem promoter.. )


Have you read the information on the SSP-800? Classe said they will include HBR decoding in a future hardware update that will be provided for free. The issue is that the supplier isn't able to meet the needs of Classe at this time, so instead of delaying the product another 6 months, classe will ship now with a lesser DSP and when the new one comes out, offer a field upgrade (again, free).

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post #223 of 5881 Old 06-12-2008, 10:45 AM
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Who said anything about a DAC? The PS3 can do DTSMA internally... That is relatively cheap. Make your dealer throw one in if you are paying full price...

I'm not getting your point then. If the PS3 can bitstream DTS HD MA then the Classe would have to decode it and right now can't. If what you're referring to is that the PS3 converts DTS MA to LPCM and sends it via HDMI then you are using the Classe's DACs.

I thought you were reffering to getting a player that can decode DTS MA and send it out via analog to the Classe. In which case you'd obviously be using the players' DAC's
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post #224 of 5881 Old 06-12-2008, 10:52 AM
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Originally Posted by rnrgagne View Post

If what you're referring to is that the PS3 converts DTS MA to LPCM and sends it via HDMI then you are using the Classe's DACs.

Thats it.

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post #225 of 5881 Old 06-12-2008, 10:54 AM
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The Classe can handle any Blu-ray 7.1 sound in the following:
1. A player translates the HBR and keeps it digital via HDMI.
2. The player reads the uncompressed PCM thats on the Blu-ray, and again sends digitally via HDMI.

In both cases the DAC of the Classe is used and will be up to 7.1 as long as the HDMI connection is used between the player and ssp-800.

Only thing I am not sure about is if the uncompressed PCM is 7.1 or 5.1 on the disks.

Edit:
NVM See all clarified and agreed before I posted:
Cheers
DT
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post #226 of 5881 Old 06-12-2008, 10:55 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sikoniko View Post

Have you read the information on the SSP-800? Classe said they will include HBR decoding in a future hardware update that will be provided for free. The issue is that the supplier isn't able to meet the needs of Classe at this time, so instead of delaying the product another 6 months, classe will ship now with a lesser DSP and when the new one comes out, offer a field upgrade (again, free).

Classe is not the only one with supplier issues right now so that's understandable. Kudo's to them for offering it for free.

With that on board and as long as it can pass 1080p/24/60 cleanly it should be an excellent unit especially for "purists".
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post #227 of 5881 Old 06-12-2008, 01:15 PM
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Please explain how the statement below, which is all I said about the Denon, implies a bias that I should be attacked for?

Your statements were perceived as intending to undermine the goodwill of this thread or to showcase your nescience of the Classe' piece. I condensed the bulk of your first message to highlight key areas.

Quote:
Originally Posted by rnrgagne View Post

"My take on room EQ's,... is there's no logical reason for Classe not to include some version..."

"I think Classe is just "cheaping out" and using a lame excuse not to have it."

"There's a better argument for not having a VP in the box,... But I'm skeptical on that too."

"Right now IMO the Denon AVP is the only one that got it 100% right feature-wise,..."

It is clear from your description that you hadn't conducted a thorough research into Classe's newest SSP, despite that plenty of information had been communicated in this thread with links to external sources for more.

If you had approached this topic with serious inquisition you would have learned or at least realized what the processor was capable of and who it was intended for. When you couple this lack of awareness with the fact that you just procured the Denon AVP-A1HD, it put into question your true motives. If you didn't understand something you could have just asked.

A remark such as, "I am disappointed that the processor doesn't include automated REQ like Audyssey. While I understand their logic to provide manual PEQ in lieu, I don't agree with their decision to limit choices.", would have been much more palatable, intelligent and free from bias.

Quote:
Originally Posted by rnrgagne View Post

By the way I was also referring to the lack of HBR processing which is now available on $500 receivers in that questioning. It's just strange they wouldn't have that. I don't know if you've heard DTS HD MA for music but it is incredible and to have access to the Classe's DACs instead of the players' would be highly desirable IMO.

You didn't mention this in your initial post. Then again, had you done your homework, which anyone with genuine intentions would have, or at least asked for clarification before hand, you would have been informed.

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post #228 of 5881 Old 06-12-2008, 06:02 PM
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Rebelman, you are completley out to lunch, dead wrong in fact, with your accusations about my motives and insultingly so.
You continue to put your own spin on my motives because it suits your alterior motive of selling for Classe.
And obviously I'm not the only one you've completely disrespected. Your responses to a few other posters here were also rude, condesending and self serving.

We need not continue this any more, because you're not worth the effort.
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post #229 of 5881 Old 06-12-2008, 06:33 PM
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Rebelman, you are completley out to lunch, dead wrong in fact, with your accusations about my motives and insultingly so.
You continue to put your own spin on my motives because it suits your alterior motive of selling for Classe.
And obviously I'm not the only one you've completely disrespected. Your responses to a few other posters here were also rude, condesending and self serving.

We need not continue this any more, because you're not worth the effort.

It took you this long to figure this out? Finally. Amen. Give it up. You will never be able to argue logic here. Even on the pain of reflexivity, this guy does not get it. You will do well to leave him to his own devices. Oh man, there, I did it. For the first ime ever on this forum I have stooped to the level of the poster. Arrrgggh. Sorry everyone.

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post #230 of 5881 Old 06-12-2008, 07:47 PM
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Rebelman, you are completley out to lunch, dead wrong in fact, with your accusations about my motives and insultingly so.
You continue to put your own spin on my motives because it suits your alterior motive of selling for Classe.
And obviously I'm not the only one you've completely disrespected. Your responses to a few other posters here were also rude, condesending and self serving.

We need not continue this any more, because you're not worth the effort.

You asked.

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post #231 of 5881 Old 06-12-2008, 07:54 PM
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Finally. Amen. Give it up.

It's no coincidence that the people most bothered are the people with the least interest. Accept what you prescribe.

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post #232 of 5881 Old 06-12-2008, 09:39 PM
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It's no coincidence that the people most bothered are the people with the least interest. Accept what you prescribe.

It's no coincidence that you are the most bothered. Hmmmm.

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post #233 of 5881 Old 06-12-2008, 11:30 PM
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It took you this long to figure this out? Finally. Amen. Give it up. You will never be able to argue logic here. Even on the pain of reflexivity, this guy does not get it. You will do well to leave him to his own devices. Oh man, there, I did it. For the first ime ever on this forum I have stooped to the level of the poster. Arrrgggh. Sorry everyone.

No, I figured that out on his first reply to my post. But unlike you, I don't have similar restraint had to call him out. Obviously an exercise in futility.
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post #234 of 5881 Old 06-13-2008, 05:10 AM
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Or it is the fact all 3 of you cannot let this go, hence why it has escalated to this point.
I think the Buzz Lightyear saying can be used with the current tit-for-tat......
To infinity and beyond!!!!


Cheers
DT
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post #235 of 5881 Old 06-13-2008, 08:55 AM
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Originally Posted by DulcetTones View Post

Or it is the fact all 3 of you cannot let this go, hence why it has escalated to this point.
I think the Buzz Lightyear saying can be used with the current tit-for-tat......
To infinity and beyond!!!!


Cheers
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Actually, I think it's five of us..

I'm done though. There's no skin left on my forehead from bashing it against the wall.
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It's no coincidence that you are the most bothered. Hmmmm.

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post #237 of 5881 Old 06-19-2008, 07:04 AM
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If you haven't heard from HTGuide, I was privy to see and hear the public premier of the Classe SSP-800 at Definitive Audio in Bellevue, Wa. It is a fantastic sounding processor and certainly highly anticipated. Dave Nauber from Classe was on-hand to do the presentation and I got some candid time to speak with him.

My initial impression: I've never heard the Proceed, so I can't comment in that regards, but I will say that if you like Classe, you will love this processor. Don't expect it to sound like something else.

To all of the people shopping, don't compare this unit to the Denon. Classe doesn't. If you want Audessey, buy the Denon. They don't plan on adding it. It is as simple as that.

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post #238 of 5881 Old 06-23-2008, 11:11 AM
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I have posted a review of the even on htguide. Please check it out!

ask not what you can do for your country, but what your country can do for you.
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post #239 of 5881 Old 06-27-2008, 04:23 PM
wse
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Whoa a lot of sword fighting goes on here,

I also wonder if RebelMan is not a sales guy for Classe which is why he is justifying why we should go out and buy an obsolete processor out the gate.

Maybe when Classe 800 has the new DSP chip then and only then it might be a contender with the Denon. Classe saying that automatic EQ is not worth it makes me smile So why is it that Meridian and Lexicon incorporate it.

Stop making defensive statement and rationalize why Classe didn't incorporate all these features!! They basically are looking to squeeze as much money as possible and run a business. There is no way they can compete with a group like Harman and Meridian or even less with Denon. THey have 1/10 of the cash in R&D.

RB has been very kind in providing a lot of info before anyone on the classe

I will let my ears be the judge in my own HT.

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post #240 of 5881 Old 06-27-2008, 06:02 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wse View Post

Whoa a lot of sword fighting goes on here,

I also wonder if RebelMan is not a sales guy for Classe which is why he is justifying why we should go out and buy an obsolete processor out the gate.

and you felt it appropriate to join in.

Quote:


Maybe when Classe 800 has the new DSP chip then and only then it might be a contender with the Denon. Classe saying that automatic EQ is not worth it makes me smile So why is it that Meridian and Lexicon incorporate it.

Didn't your mother tell you to quit worrying about what others are doing and stand on your own two feet?

Quote:


Stop making defensive statement and rationalize why Classe didn't incorporate all these features!! They basically are looking to squeeze as much money as possible and run a business. There is no way they can compete with a group like Harman and Meridian or even less with Denon. THey have 1/10 of the cash in R&D.

That is quite bold of you to make the statement. Do you have any facts to substantiate that?

Quote:


RB has been very kind in providing a lot of info before anyone on the classe

you're a hipocrit.


Quote:


I will let my ears be the judge in my own HT.

no you won't. you've already got a pre-conceived notion of what you want before you even open your ears. your waisting peoples time by posting here.

You are entitled to your opinion. If you believe the classe is obsolete, don't buy it. Your statements really show how ignorant and naive you are. What is your reason for posting this? Are you on some sort of bashing tirade? You feel you have to put down others to boost yourself up?

Why do people feel it is appropriate to be disrespectful to others? Have you no class? - wait, you have proven you don't.

ask not what you can do for your country, but what your country can do for you.
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