Wall Plate suggestions for 7.2 passive subs 12AWG wire - AVS Forum
Forum Jump: 
 
Thread Tools
post #1 of 11 Old 02-13-2012, 05:12 PM - Thread Starter
Member
 
Slash's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2001
Location: Tenino, WA, USA
Posts: 66
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 2 Post(s)
Liked: 10
I have a seven speaker setup with two passive subs... In total I will be running 2400 watts through this system.... 1700 to the speakers... 700 to the subs..

I have run 12AWG in wall speaker wire for all 7 speakers and 2 subs. So all wall plates need to accommodate 12 AWG (I haven't found any yet).

In addition... I have run two pairs of wires for the subs... One pair to the front corner of the room... One pair to the rear corner of the room, to give myself options with the subs when critique time comes.

In my simple mind, the following wall plates would work:

For behind the amps:
1) A seven speaker wall plate for the speakers
2) A four speaker wall plate for all of my passive SUB options

For Speaker Locations:
1) 7 single speaker wall plates for the seven speakers
2) 2 two speaker wall plates for the two corners (i.e. for the passive subs)

Here are my questions:
1) Can you refer me to a vendor that has high quality wall plates that accept 12 AWG?
2) Would you suggest other options for wall plate combinations to what I have guessed above?

Thanks in advance for any help.

Steve Russell
Slash is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #2 of 11 Old 02-13-2012, 05:41 PM
AVS Special Member
 
MrBobb's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Posts: 3,236
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 21 Post(s)
Liked: 16
Banana jacks that are originally intended for auto applications should accommodate the larger gauge.

Solution: FREE. Explanation: I will have to charge$ you.

MrBobb is offline  
post #3 of 11 Old 02-13-2012, 05:50 PM
AVS Addicted Member
 
ccotenj's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: the toxic waste dumps of new jersey
Posts: 21,915
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 89
i used the ones from monoprice with 12 gauge... worked out ok for me...

- chris

 

my build thread - updated 8-20-12 - new seating installed and projector isolation solution

 


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

ccotenj is offline  
post #4 of 11 Old 02-14-2012, 04:40 AM
AVS Addicted Member
 
arnyk's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Grosse Pointe Woods, MI
Posts: 14,381
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 747 Post(s)
Liked: 1162
Quote:
Originally Posted by Slash View Post

I have a seven speaker setup with two passive subs... In total I will be running 2400 watts through this system.... 1700 to the speakers... 700 to the subs..

I have run 12AWG in wall speaker wire for all 7 speakers and 2 subs. So all wall plates need to accommodate 12 AWG (I haven't found any yet).

In addition... I have run two pairs of wires for the subs... One pair to the front corner of the room... One pair to the rear corner of the room, to give myself options with the subs when critique time comes.

In my simple mind, the following wall plates would work:

For behind the amps:
1) A seven speaker wall plate for the speakers
2) A four speaker wall plate for all of my passive SUB options

For Speaker Locations:
1) 7 single speaker wall plates for the seven speakers
2) 2 two speaker wall plates for the two corners (i.e. for the passive subs)

Here are my questions:
1) Can you refer me to a vendor that has high quality wall plates that accept 12 AWG?
2) Would you suggest other options for wall plate combinations to what I have guessed above?

Thanks in advance for any help.

There is a durable, effective, safer, and even economical and ergonomic connector that is specifically designed for use with speaker cables and connections, and is generally and widely accepted in the pragmatic world of professional audio. It is called the Neutrik Speakon. It is available in both plastic and metal shell versions. It is available for both surface and cable mounting. There are even models that can handle one, two or four speaker electrically isolated connections in one connector. With common grounding, up to 7 speakers could be served by one connector. This connector is designed and frequently used with very high powered speaker systems and very low impedance's.

Speakon connectors in the panel mount configuration are essentially flush, whether male or female. There are no exposed conductors in any configuration whether panel or cable mount, male or female, so it is unlikely that there will be shorts or personal harm or discomfort from very high powered equipment. The connectors twist lock, so they won't pull out when you move a component a few inches.

Some power amps and speakers even come with Speakon connectors already in place. Crown and Behringer power amps as a rule come this way, for example. Most speakers with Speakons are designed for professional audio, but some of those could be profitably and effectively used in the home, such as the Electrovoice ZX-5.

In general it is a bit of woodworking and wiring project to convert a speaker designed for home audio over to dual-use including Speakon connectors, but it is very easy to make jumper cables with a bananna plug on one end and a Speakon on the other. You can even buy cables made up this way in various lengths from sources that cater to the professional audio trade.

FWIW I have wired my main listening room with Speakons, and use jumper cables to connect home audio style speakers and receivers to it. I have also converted some home audio style speakers to include a pair of Speakon connectors in the professional audio daisy-chainable configuration. I've also fitted some of them with sockets for professional pole mounts. Makes them far easier to hook up and temporarily install for demonstrations and tests.
arnyk is offline  
post #5 of 11 Old 02-14-2012, 05:06 AM
AVS Addicted Member
 
ccotenj's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: the toxic waste dumps of new jersey
Posts: 21,915
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 89
^^^

arny, what's a good source for raw 8 conductor cable? i've kicked around the idea of doing exactly what you suggest in my main room, it would clean things up a bit...

- chris

 

my build thread - updated 8-20-12 - new seating installed and projector isolation solution

 


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

ccotenj is offline  
post #6 of 11 Old 02-14-2012, 06:25 AM
AVS Addicted Member
 
arnyk's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Grosse Pointe Woods, MI
Posts: 14,381
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 747 Post(s)
Liked: 1162
Quote:
Originally Posted by ccotenj View Post

^^^

arny, what's a good source for raw 8 conductor cable? i've kicked around the idea of doing exactly what you suggest in my main room, it would clean things up a bit...

I fabricated my own 12 gauge multiconductor cable out of rolls of 12 gauge stranded wire (coarser strands, such as used for house wiring) using a vise and a battery operated drill for twisting. I marked the ends while building up the raw cable set, as I only had 4 colors of wire to work with.
arnyk is offline  
post #7 of 11 Old 02-14-2012, 08:29 AM
AVS Special Member
 
DS-21's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Posts: 3,430
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 110 Post(s)
Liked: 187
Quote:
Originally Posted by arnyk View Post

There is a durable, effective, safer, and even economical and ergonomic connector that is specifically designed for use with speaker cables and connections, and is generally and widely accepted in the pragmatic world of professional audio. It is called the Neutrik Speakon.

+1 to all of the above. As well as to unquoted parts relating to the general superiority of Speakons over more Rube Goldberg single-pole uninsulated connectors, such as bananas or spades on binding posts.

But to answer the question, you can get connections for your speakers (three mains, four surrounds, two subs) using three of these: 2-Speakon wall plate. Perhaps there is a triple-gang one loaded with six Speakons as well, though I've never seen one.

Or you can roll your own, using blank plates in whatever color/material you want raw Speakon connectors. All that requires is drilling three holes per Speakon jack: one for the body and one for each mounting screw.

I'd dedicate one 4-pole connector for the left and right mains, one for center, one for each set of surrounds, and one for subs. But that's just me. As long as you label them properly it's not a functional issue but a convenience one.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ccotenj View Post

arny, what's a good source for raw 8 conductor cable? i've kicked around the idea of doing exactly what you suggest in my main room, it would clean things up a bit...

My method is cruder than Arny's, and possibly no more or less time consuming though it requires no tools. I do is lay out all of the wires, tape them at fairly close intervals (maybe a band of electrical tape every foot or so) and cover with Techflex.

The only advantage of my method is that twisting does shorten the wires a bit, whereas running them shotgunned does not. If one plans for that, it's no big deal. If one does not, then the runs will be too short to reach!

--
"In many cases there aren’t two sides unless one side is 'reality' and the other is 'nonsense.'" - Phil Plait

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
 

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
 
DS-21 is offline  
post #8 of 11 Old 02-15-2012, 04:54 AM
AVS Addicted Member
 
ccotenj's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: the toxic waste dumps of new jersey
Posts: 21,915
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Liked: 89
Quote:
Originally Posted by arnyk View Post

I fabricated my own 12 gauge multiconductor cable out of rolls of 12 gauge stranded wire (coarser strands, such as used for house wiring) using a vise and a battery operated drill for twisting. I marked the ends while building up the raw cable set, as I only had 4 colors of wire to work with.

Quote:
Originally Posted by DS-21 View Post

My method is cruder than Arny's, and possibly no more or less time consuming though it requires no tools. I do is lay out all of the wires, tape them at fairly close intervals (maybe a band of electrical tape every foot or so) and cover with Techflex.

The only advantage of my method is that twisting does shorten the wires a bit, whereas running them shotgunned does not. If one plans for that, it's no big deal. If one does not, then the runs will be too short to reach!

thanks guys... i think i can probably handle that...

actually, i pretty much have your method in place ds, i just didn't techflex them... i use that wiremold stuff, and bundilng them together made it easier to run... so all i really gotta do is get the various connectors i need... which should have been obvious to me...

lol at the last sentence... as brought up in another thread recently, i've found that the A#1 contributor to sound quality is cables/wires that will reach where you need to go...

- chris

 

my build thread - updated 8-20-12 - new seating installed and projector isolation solution

 


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

ccotenj is offline  
post #9 of 11 Old 02-15-2012, 05:20 AM
AVS Addicted Member
 
arnyk's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Grosse Pointe Woods, MI
Posts: 14,381
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 747 Post(s)
Liked: 1162
Quote:
Originally Posted by DS-21 View Post

The only advantage of my method is that twisting does shorten the wires a bit, whereas running them shotgunned does not. If one plans for that, it's no big deal. If one does not, then the runs will be too short to reach!

I'm a bit more purist, and like to entertain my mind with the thought that my speaker cables are twisted pair, which reduces their series inductance. TYhic advantage comes at a cost in more resistance since twisting does indeed significantly shorten the lines.

One of the rules of installing cables is that you always make your wire bundles significantly longer than you think you'll need because splices are so time-consuming, ugly, and can hurt reliability. You also leave excess lengths of wire hidden away someplace so that you can re-terminate without pulling a new cable. Even the electrical code says leave at least 6 inches at each end.
arnyk is offline  
post #10 of 11 Old 02-15-2012, 05:53 AM
AVS Special Member
 
DS-21's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Posts: 3,430
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 110 Post(s)
Liked: 187
Quote:
Originally Posted by arnyk View Post

I'm a bit more purist, and like to entertain my mind with the thought that my speaker cables are twisted pair, which reduces their series inductance. TYhic advantage comes at a cost in more resistance since twisting does indeed significantly shorten the lines.

I'm curious, what about shotgunned twisted pairs? I bought all of my speaker wires as pre-twisted pairs (mil-spec stuff with teflon insulation, because it was the thinnest OD wire I could find for a given conductor thickness, and cheap). So for the run to the front (the AVR being hidden off to the side, mostly to keep diffraction around the speakers down but also to keep visual distractions away from the front of the room) I shotgun the three twisted pairs together as discussed above.

What, if any, would be the effect on inductance from that arrangement?

Quote:
Originally Posted by arnyk View Post

One of the rules of installing cables is that you always make your wire bundles significantly longer than you think you'll need because splices are so time-consuming, ugly, and can hurt reliability. You also leave excess lengths of wire hidden away someplace so that you can re-terminate without pulling a new cable. Even the electrical code says leave at least 6 inches at each end.

Agreed.

--
"In many cases there aren’t two sides unless one side is 'reality' and the other is 'nonsense.'" - Phil Plait

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
 

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 0 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
 
DS-21 is offline  
post #11 of 11 Old 02-15-2012, 06:17 AM
AVS Addicted Member
 
arnyk's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Grosse Pointe Woods, MI
Posts: 14,381
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 747 Post(s)
Liked: 1162
Quote:
Originally Posted by DS-21 View Post

I'm curious, what about shotgunned twisted pairs? I bought all of my speaker wires as pre-twisted pairs (mil-spec stuff with teflon insulation, because it was the thinnest OD wire I could find for a given conductor thickness, and cheap). So for the run to the front (the AVR being hidden off to the side, mostly to keep diffraction around the speakers down but also to keep visual distractions away from the front of the room) I shotgun the three twisted pairs together as discussed above.

What, if any, would be the effect on inductance from that arrangement?

If the pairs are twisted, then that is about as good as it gets.
arnyk is offline  
Reply Audio theory, Setup and Chat

User Tag List

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page


Forum Jump: 

Posting Rules  
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off