Me and my fiance just got into a huge argument - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 50 Old 04-06-2012, 06:36 PM - Thread Starter
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Hey now...

My fiance and I just got into a pretty big argument.

She wants surround sound, I don't.

Her argument:
I watch movies with surround sound.
I listen to music with surround sound

I asked her if she goes to a concert and stands backwards.
She said "what does that have to do with anything"
it has every ****ing thing to do with everything!

I do now want surround sound I will be pissed. I swear. Stupid speakers everywhere.

Sorry I just had to vent

You're not cultured. You're stupid.
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post #2 of 50 Old 04-06-2012, 06:51 PM
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it's OK to vent and rant, but the part of the concert example you left out is the acoustics of the theater or arena - you actually do hear reflected sound from all around and "surround sound" tries to recreate that. If you listen to true multi-channel music, SACD or DVD-A, then the original source material is actually recorded with mics at key positions to creat the "concert effect".

There is absolutely nothing wrong with stereo sound, but you still have that choice with a modern a/v receiver which will turn off the other speakers and drive the front L and R speakers as a stereo pair if you choose that mode.
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post #3 of 50 Old 04-06-2012, 06:56 PM
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There's a lot of threads and discussion on AVS about "serving two channel and HT needs" or similar topics - many users ultimately come down to the debate you're having. The easy answer is that you set-up a system that can properly do 5.1 or 7.1 or what have you, and it will (by virtue of being set-up right) properly do stereo as well. Yes it costs more (you're paying for more speakers after all). And, I'm aware of no surround processors made in the last say, 12 years, that cannot be switched into two-channel downmix (even for surround sources).

The girlfriend/fiance/wife actually wanting MORE speakers is a new one though; maybe you can convince her that you need a fancy 7.1 separates system with active multi-amplification and bridged monoblocks for every channel!
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post #4 of 50 Old 04-06-2012, 07:00 PM
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Wait, let me get this straight. Your fiancee wants you to spend more money on audio gear, and you don't want to?

WHAT THE F*** IS WRONG WITH YOU, MAN????

If you can't explain how it works, you can't say it doesn't.—The High-End Creed

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post #5 of 50 Old 04-06-2012, 07:05 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mcnarus View Post

Wait, let me get this straight. Your fiancee wants you to spend more money on audio gear, and you don't want to?

WHAT THE F*** IS WRONG WITH YOU, MAN????

No, now that she wants me to get more speakers I can't get my cool toys like an external dac and external streaming player because of the receiver will prolly have it. Also instead of spending more money on 2 channel I have to spend it on avr and extra speakers.

No, I'm standing firm. 2ch.

You're not cultured. You're stupid.
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post #6 of 50 Old 04-06-2012, 07:06 PM
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OK, I've calmed down. So let's start with the basic life lesson here:

She's right, you're wrong. Get used to it.

And she really is right in this case. (But that's optional anyway.) Movies are made for surround sound. Think about the sound system in a movie theater. To listen to movies any other way is a compromise.

As for music, as Walbert says, sound is always coming from all around you, even if the performers are all in front of you. Besides, any multichannel system can play just two channels, so you aren't losing anything.

If you can't explain how it works, you can't say it doesn't.—The High-End Creed

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post #7 of 50 Old 04-06-2012, 07:07 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by m_vanmeter View Post

it's OK to vent and rant, but the part of the concert example you left out is the acoustics of the theater or arena - you actually do hear reflected sound from all around and "surround sound" tries to recreate that. If you listen to true multi-channel music, SACD or DVD-A, then the original source material is actually recorded with mics at key positions to creat the "concert effect".

There is absolutely nothing wrong with stereo sound, but you still have that choice with a modern a/v receiver which will turn off the other speakers and drive the front L and R speakers as a stereo pair if you choose that mode.

Is acoustics though, not speakers in the rear that cause sound to be coming from that direction.

As far as the way it's recorded now your talking about mediums. I listen to vinyl and mp3. If I listened to SACD or DVD audio I might sing a different tune. I love vinyl. Vinyl is where I stand. So no need.

It's like the time I saw a symphony in NYC. There were no performers behind me. As far as microphones placed for SACD to create that sound I dont see why it can't be created with 2 speakers.

As far as sounding like a concert, I saw Hank 3 last, and before that I saw slayer. I am a firm believer in the going to a concert and standing backwards parallel to surround audio. Ill agree to disagree

You're not cultured. You're stupid.
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post #8 of 50 Old 04-06-2012, 07:09 PM
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No, now that she wants me to get more speakers I can't get my cool toys like an external dac and external streaming player because of the receiver will prolly have it. Also instead of spending more money on 2 channel I have to spend it on avr and extra speakers.

So, in other words, she wants you to spend your money on things that really matter sonically, and you want to waste it all on stuff that doesn't. Got it.

If you can't explain how it works, you can't say it doesn't.—The High-End Creed

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post #9 of 50 Old 04-06-2012, 07:10 PM
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Is acoustics though, not speakers in the rear that cause sound to be coming from that direction.

Right, but the rear speakers in a home system are there to reproduce the acoustics of the original hall, which your living room walls cannot do.

If you can't explain how it works, you can't say it doesn't.—The High-End Creed

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post #10 of 50 Old 04-06-2012, 07:21 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by outlawskinnyd View Post

No, now that she wants me to get more speakers I can't get my cool toys like an external dac and external streaming player because of the receiver will prolly have it. Also instead of spending more money on 2 channel I have to spend it on avr and extra speakers.

No, I'm standing firm. 2ch.

The external DAC is jewelry, to be quite blunt. The streaming hardware is something you can get out of a Blu-ray player (do DVD players have this yet?) or a receiver, so that's a logical conflation too.

An AVR can still run your system in stereo, and it's not like each speaker for the surround set has to be as expensive as the mains (yes, in an ideal world it'd all be the same perfect speaker, but most people don't live on that planet, and surrounds are usually a compromise - there's lots of options for compact and good performing speakers that will make good surrounds).

Quote:
Originally Posted by mcnarus View Post

Right, but the rear speakers in a home system are there to reproduce the acoustics of the original hall, which your living room walls cannot do.

I really have to agree with everything mcnarus has said, and I like this point quite a lot.
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post #11 of 50 Old 04-06-2012, 07:26 PM
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What if you two make a compromise? She can have her surround set-up, provided she pay for it herself. Then you can have a room all to yourself for listening to your two channel set-up. That way you both get something you want and enjoy.

Lemme guess. You're not married either.

Actually, there is a compromise, and it doesn't involve two systems and two rooms. Insist on a good pair of fronts in the surround system. That way, you can listen to two-channel music (or 2.1) whenever you want. And it'll sound just as good as a system with a lot of high-end boxes. I promise.

If you can't explain how it works, you can't say it doesn't.—The High-End Creed

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post #12 of 50 Old 04-06-2012, 07:31 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by outlawskinnyd View Post

Hey now...

My fiance and I just got into a pretty big argument.

She wants surround sound, I don't.

Her argument:
I watch movies with surround sound.
I listen to music with surround sound

I asked her if she goes to a concert and stands backwards.
She said "what does that have to do with anything"
it has every ****ing thing to do with everything!

I do now want surround sound I will be pissed. I swear. Stupid speakers everywhere.

Sorry I just had to vent

In your mind, can you show all of us an example of what you think a Surround sound system is? Look at it this way. If you do not do it, she will end up finding someone with a Home Theater, or who will spoil her. Really, just make an agreement with her and compromise. That is how relationships work.

My guess is that she knows more about Home theaters than you do, and you are upset about that fact.
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post #13 of 50 Old 04-06-2012, 07:37 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by mcnarus View Post

So, in other words, she wants you to spend your money on things that really matter sonically, and you want to waste it all on stuff that doesn't. Got it.

Umh...so saving up to get a set of 5.1 speakers that cost up to $1500 instead of a set of dali's, b&w or dynaudio for a room that is only 11ft 7pm by 15ft.

My sources going to the receiver or amplifier is a turntable, a streaming network player and a blurry player which I already stated I don't care about surround sound.

So instead of having to pay more for an avr and a phono preamp I now can't upgrade my cartridge or platter because it has to go towards the avr and phono preamp which MATTERS MORE sonically for me than Anything else.

I'm not saying avr's suck. I'm not saying your an idiot for liking surround sound music. I am saying that I dont like surround sound music and I am saying that it's fine what my living room can and can't do. But I'm not getting stupid surround sound and that's it. I personally don't like it. That's all.

You're not cultured. You're stupid.
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post #14 of 50 Old 04-06-2012, 07:40 PM
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Any woman that wants you to spend more money on a larger system is a keeper. She's right in this case. Surround sound for movies and blu ray concerts or SACDs is great. You can still have 2.1 for your music and 3.1, 5.1 or 7.1 for movies and blu ray concerts. If you don't want her send her over to me. I'm newly divorced and have a huge 7.4 system and a couple other smaller systems that I bet she will be happy with. Just kidding of course. The external DAC and the other things you mentioned are really not going to make a difference. Sorry for the bad news.
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post #15 of 50 Old 04-06-2012, 07:47 PM
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Here's the thing: You and your fiancee have to resolve this between yourselves. Even if we took your side (and, apparently, we do not), it would not make a difference in this situation where both of you have strong opinions.

You can go 5.1 and, in the future, add the bells and whistles you want.
You can go stereo but converting/adding mch/HT in the future will be more complex.
In the meanwhile, how happy will the two of you be, together?

Kal Rubinson

"Music in the Round"
Senior Contributing Editor, Stereophile
http://www.stereophile.com/category/music-round

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post #16 of 50 Old 04-06-2012, 07:50 PM
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Originally Posted by Secret Squirrel View Post

Any woman that wants you to spend more money on a larger system is a keeper. She's right in this case. Surround sound for movies and blu ray concerts or SACDs is great. You can still have 2.1 for your music and 3.1, 5.1 or 7.1 for movies and blu ray concerts. If you don't want her send her over to me. I'm newly divorced and have a huge 7.4 system and a couple other smaller systems that I bet she will be happy with. Just kidding of course. The external DAC and the other things you mentioned are really not going to make a difference. Sorry for the bad news.



11x15 is a pretty large room, and you could easily set-up 5.1 or 7.1 in there without much hassle. A competent AVR will replace/handle what all of the outboard jewelry will do, for less money (so now you've saved money and gotten the same performance), and let you compromise with the fiance (which is worth more than money). Isn't it Charlie Sheen that says "winning" all the time?

Of course, jesting aside, I agree with Kal.
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post #17 of 50 Old 04-06-2012, 07:51 PM - Thread Starter
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I know the dacis a toy.

As for rear channels creating what my room can't there's always a trade off. I'd much rather have great speakers up front. That's just me. It's what I like. I have a budget and I have to stick to it. That's it. I have to cut some places.

As for the the wasting money if you think I'm dropping 1000 on a 2 channel integrated amp your wrong. I have my heart set on the Yamaha as500. $365.

The streaming media is not from Netflix or pandora. This system is gonna be for me when I move to Canada. That's where she is. I a, going back to ny Tuesday. They dont have pandora up here. They dont have the same streaming services our blu ray players have. So it's not all cut and dry. Denon has a whole radio network that works in Canada. What Yamaha does have is Yaired which in another post I said only if Yaired does t work out I'd get a streaming media player.

I'm sticking with what I want. I've tried surround sound, i dont like it.

You're not cultured. You're stupid.
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post #18 of 50 Old 04-06-2012, 07:51 PM
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With you outlaw.....a good 2 ch system beats a crappy multi anything.
If your on a limited budget, your better to spend it on quality not quantity.
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post #19 of 50 Old 04-06-2012, 07:55 PM - Thread Starter
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Lol we are over it now. We are cuddling watching sleepy hollow.

I made a deal with her. I'm gonna order an avr right now, but we are gonna keep it 2 channel. If she can't handle watching movies I'll add more speakers, but I don't wanna hear it when I spend money on my guns and watches (other 2 hobbies of mine)

Problem solved. Hahaha

You're not cultured. You're stupid.
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post #20 of 50 Old 04-06-2012, 07:58 PM
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At $365 it's somewhat tough - there's a few AVRs in that price range that will be very competent for stereo playback and handle surround sound (which is truly ideal for movies), but you'd probably need to spend a bit more to get a good AVR (say, $400-$500 total). Look at what kinds of streaming and other features are available. It looks like Sirius is available in Canada, and there are a number of receivers that can do that; I would believe XM to also be available based on that (since they merged). No idea on other services (gotta love American copyright laws).

I'm not saying the A-S500 is bad, but neither is surround. And again, as we're telling you, it can be turned off and the system run in stereo (which will be audibly no different than what you'll get from the A-S500) - that's a compromise.
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post #21 of 50 Old 04-06-2012, 08:00 PM
 
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Originally Posted by outlawskinnyd View Post

Problem solved. Hahaha

That is what you think. Wait until you leave.
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post #22 of 50 Old 04-06-2012, 08:03 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by gregzoll View Post


That is what you think. Wait until you leave.

Don't work like that.

See I dnt get. 5 minutes t myself because she constantly has me on Skype.

You're not cultured. You're stupid.
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post #23 of 50 Old 04-06-2012, 08:03 PM
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I can guarantee if you ever let her hear movies or music with a properly calibrated subwoofer or subwoofers it will be all over. I see a lot more speakers and subwoofers in your future. I don't want to insult your audio intelligence but I think she knows what she's doing. 2.0 for movies is alright but when compared to even 2.1 it's inferior. 5.1 or 7.1 movies and now you're talking.
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post #24 of 50 Old 04-06-2012, 08:13 PM
 
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Originally Posted by outlawskinnyd View Post

Don't work like that.

See I dnt get. 5 minutes t myself because she constantly has me on Skype.

I can guarantee that just because right now she has you skypeing her now, or vice versa, does not mean that things will change, or she is just playing you, until you leave to go home.
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post #25 of 50 Old 04-06-2012, 08:14 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Secret Squirrel View Post

I can guarantee if you ever let her hear movies or music with a properly calibrated subwoofer or subwoofers it will be all over. I see a lot more speakers and subwoofers in your future. I don't want to insult your audio intelligence but I think she knows what she's doing. 2.0 for movies is alright but when compared to even 2.1 it's inferior. 5.1 or 7.1 movies and now you're talking.

2.1 I'm fine with. I don't mind getting a sub just for movies. But I don't want to start adding more speakers that can do just as much damage as good.

You're not cultured. You're stupid.
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post #26 of 50 Old 04-06-2012, 08:15 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by gregzoll View Post

I can guarantee that just because right now she has you skypeing her now, or vice versa, does not mean that things will change, or she is just playing you, until you leave to go home.

I'm with her right now.

I'm not insecure. Nice try though. Let's keep the chat on audio

The main reason she got mad was bc I took 2 speakers and put them in the basement without her permission. She just told me.

You're not cultured. You're stupid.
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post #27 of 50 Old 04-06-2012, 08:18 PM
 
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Originally Posted by Secret Squirrel View Post

I don't want to insult your audio intelligence but I think she knows what she's doing. 2.0 for movies is alright but when compared to even 2.1 it's inferior. 5.1 or 7.1 movies and now you're talking.

Oh, I know just like you know, that she knows what she is talking about. Not too many girls out there want to go whole hog with wanting a good home theater. My wifes eye's were rolling in the back of her head, when I took her out to one of the local Mom & Pop shops that has been in our town for over thirty years, to go check out some new speakers. Only reason was due to the ones that she had, that were over 25 years old, that I married also, finally gave up and decided that it was beyond their lifespan.

She of course stated at that time very clearly that she was not going any more than $300 on the first set. Then she heard the pricing on the sub, the center, the surrounds, and the AVRS. But she is still going to let me do it, just that I have to do it over time, but she gets her couch this next week, and I got her to agree to a Home theater style couch, with power recliners.

Now, of course, the OP is probably going "What is wrong with these guys, that they get their women to let them do what they want, and actually get along with them."

Sorry, but at this point I firmly believe that the OP is just pulling everyones legs, due to if it was for real, and his girl knows anything about home theater, she could easily find this thread by doing a websearch, or coming to the website.
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post #28 of 50 Old 04-06-2012, 08:19 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by outlawskinnyd View Post

2.1 I'm fine with. I don't mind getting a sub just for movies. But I don't want to start adding more speakers that can do just as much damage as good.

I'm kind of curious now, what leads you to believe surround sound will "damage" things, and in what way?
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post #29 of 50 Old 04-06-2012, 08:20 PM
 
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Originally Posted by outlawskinnyd View Post

I'm with her right now.

I'm not insecure. Nice try though.

Then why are you posting that you are acting like a toddler having a Temper Tantrum, due to your girl wanting to go with a home theater, and you don't. Sorry, but you lost all confidence with anyone, when you posted your so called rant, which I do not believe it. If I did, I have some Ocean Front property in Colorado for sale.
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post #30 of 50 Old 04-06-2012, 08:22 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by outlawskinnyd View Post

2.1 I'm fine with. I don't mind getting a sub just for movies. But I don't want to start adding more speakers that can do just as much damage as good.

What damage? What, your hearing? What, your cat starts climbing the drapes, or the dog starts howling? Sorry, but either you are just pulling everyones leg at this point, because this is more far fetched than the people who state that wifi gives them headaches, or you are more whipped than the 80lb guy with the 300lb girlfriend/wife.
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