n00b looking for some Klipsch Speakers/Receiver advice - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 8 Old 12-05-2012, 01:47 PM - Thread Starter
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First time poster looking for a little advice. My setup is located in our basement which is about 25-30 feet wide and about 12-15 feet deep with 8 foot ceilings. The stairway leads straight upstairs without any doorway so it's pretty acustically open. Here's my current equipment:

Video: Panasonic AE2000U projector on an 86 inch screen
Receiver: Yamaha RX-V565 90 watt x 7
Front R/L: Klipsch Synergy F1 Floorstanding Speakers (about 10 feet from primary listening zone)
Center: Klipsch Icon VC-25 (about 10 feet)
Surround R/L: Klipsch Reference RS-42II (positioned on sides about 12 feet away)
Sub: Klipsch Reference RW-12d (positioned in front along wall between center and front right - unfortunately no good front corner to sit it in)

We previously lived in a smaller apartment and I've found the sound in our new setup to be somewhat underwhelming. The system is used mostly for watching movies but is used for music from time to time as well. The current system has been patched together over several years and I have a feeling some items should be looked at with scrutiny (the front speakers and center channel for example). The surround speakers and subwoofer are fairly new so I would prefer to leave them alone.

I have been watching craigslist to try to find some reasonably priced Klipsch RF-82s or maybe even some RF-7s. Or would they completely overwhelm the room? Should the front speakers or center be addressed first? Or is the receiver potentially a hiderance at the moment? I used the Yamaha auto EQ and wasn't very impressed with it so I have the equalizer turned off at the moment. I haven't played around with any crossover frequencies and never have - I do understand the concept of it though.

I'm not willing to spend more than $1,000 on a new receiver (preferably $750 or less) right now. I'm currently looking at some used pairs of RF-7s for $1000-$1250 or RF-82s for $550-$650.

Any advice would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks!
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post #2 of 8 Old 12-05-2012, 04:04 PM
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The first thing I would do is spend $1100 on a Cambridge Audio 551R receiver; that will sound one heck of a lot better than your current one IMO. It sounds better than most Japanese receivers costing $2000-3000. It is a real bargain at $1100. If you are serious about sound quality, a Cambridge receiver is a must.

Home Theater magazine has consistently praised Cambridge Audio receivers as being the best-sounding receivers on the market; read the reviews and see.

The RF-82 speakers are a good idea; I would consider going with them. The Synergy F1 speakers are cheap junk and sound like it! The RF-82 speakers will sound 200% better, IF you get a decent receiver to drive them.

Your current receiver is NOT NOT NOT capable of putting out 90 watts to 7 channels all at once; that is total bull! It MIGHT be able to put out 30 or 40 watts per channel with all 7 channels driven; not much more. It is rated to put out 90 watts to 2 channels, and puts out a LOT less when driving 5 or 7.

Muliplying 7 times 90 is only a math exercise; it has nothing to do with what your receiver will actually do under load.

Its power supply is only rated for 450 watts TOTAL, so the idea that it can put out more total audio power than that is a joke! By comparison, the 551R has a 700 WATT power supply. It is rated to put out an honest 60 watts RMS per channel with all 7 channels driven, which is about twice as much power as you actually have now.
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post #3 of 8 Old 12-05-2012, 04:23 PM - Thread Starter
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Thank you very much for the feedback. So you would recommend the Cambridge receiver over an Onkyo TX-NR717 or NR818? Would you think a receiver upgrade would make a more noticable impact on my current system or upgrading to Klipsch RF-82s as front speakers?

They sure make it sound like the Yamaha RX-V565 is capable of pushing 90 watts to 7 channels:
Technical Details
7-channel 630W powerful surround sound (90W x 7)
Direct Mode for high quality sound reproduction
CINEMA DSP (17 DSP programs) with Adaptive DSP Level
Audio Delay for adjusting Lip-Sync (0-240ms)
HDMI Up Conversion:(with upscaling up to 1080p)

How can you sift through gimmicks if that's what they are advertising?
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post #4 of 8 Old 12-05-2012, 04:40 PM
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I certainly would recommend it; absolutely!

It helps to read the reviews and power lab tests that Home Theater magazine does; they show you what is really what with the receivers. ( you can't GET 630 watts from a 450-watt power supply...duhhh...lol; and part of that 450W power supply power has to run other circuits; it isn't all for the audio!).

You can look them up online on their website. It doesn't cost much to subscribe, and you can learn a lot by reading the magazine.

In my opinion, and also Home Theater's opinion, there is no receiver at ANY price that comes close to the sound quality of the Cambridge receivers.

You would have to spend twice as much to even get close, and even that is no guarantee.

One Anthem receiver that costs $3000 was tested by Home Theater, and it put out about 40 watts per channel with all 7 driven, which was WORSE than the $300 Denon 1713.

Denon is more honest than most on their specs, but they all play fast and loose with the truth EXCEPT Cambridge.

Your current receiver is not very good, and those front speakers are dog doodoo. You need to improve both if you want good sound. If you can't do both now, I would get the good speakers and save until you can get the receiver.

BTW-The VC-25 is probably fine; I would keep that. As a matter of fact, the only speakers I would replace are the fronts; all the others are really pretty good. It is just those front speakers that suck.
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post #5 of 8 Old 12-05-2012, 05:41 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by khazmodain View Post

Thank you very much for the feedback. So you would recommend the Cambridge receiver over an Onkyo TX-NR717 or NR818? Would you think a receiver upgrade would make a more noticable impact on my current system or upgrading to Klipsch RF-82s as front speakers?
They sure make it sound like the Yamaha RX-V565 is capable of pushing 90 watts to 7 channels:
Technical Details
7-channel 630W powerful surround sound (90W x 7)
Direct Mode for high quality sound reproduction
CINEMA DSP (17 DSP programs) with Adaptive DSP Level
Audio Delay for adjusting Lip-Sync (0-240ms)
HDMI Up Conversion:(with upscaling up to 1080p)
How can you sift through gimmicks if that's what they are advertising?

You got to watch Commsysman, pretty much no matter what you say you own he's going to say its no good and that you need what he recommends. Blind tests has shown numerous times that most if not all user can't tell a diiference from one receiver to the next. More watts doesn't equal better sound. He seems to disregard all the other receivers like Denon, Onkyo, Interga, that do meet the stated numbers and in some cases exceeded the stated power output.

Research his posts and you'll see he just copy pastes that CA receiver is the only good receiver out there. Has very little experience with stuff but still believes his own BS about it.

How to shop for a receiver?
1. Price range
2. Look into features that you like (not commsysman)
3. Check online for feedback from other owners.

I can say by experience that the Onkyo 818 is a fantastic receiver. I've power some Arx speakers to crazy almost painful output levels and never noticed a bad sound. Its been rock solid and has all the options I could want.

Commsysman on the other had seems to dislike any MODERN receiver features. He would have you spend alot of money on these brands that strip every option out but still charge quite a bit of money. While the CA receiver is a good receiver its not light years beyond any other receiver thats just total BS.
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post #6 of 8 Old 12-11-2012, 01:07 PM - Thread Starter
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Okay.. I decided to replace my front mains and center channel with some Klipsch Reference speakers so I now have the following:
Front R/L: Klipsch Reference RF-82II
Center: Klipsch Reference RC-62II
Surround R/L: Klipsch Reference RS-42II
Sub: Klipsch Reference RW-12d

The sensitivity on the fronts and center are 98 dB so I keep hearing that you don't need much to power these things. However, I've also seen that you can do some serious damage from underpowering a speaker. The fronts and center each have a 150w RMS and 600w peak. Am I going to risk damage from underpowering these with my current receiver (Yamaha RX-V565)?

I would like to upgrade the receiver at some point - I was just hoping I wouldn't have to do it immediately. If my current receiver is okay I'll plan on holding off but I do really like some of the modern features of the newer receivers (internet radio, firmware updates, more advanced room EQ, more HDMI ports, etc). If I do need to upgrade to avoid damaging the new speakers what should I be looking at to push these fronts? I've seen quite a bit of back and forth on what sounds better between Yamaha and Onkyo when paired with Klipsch and don't seem to have a definitive conclusion.

As always, any advice is appreciated.

Thanks!
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post #7 of 8 Old 12-11-2012, 01:42 PM
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No issues what so ever using your Yamaha receiver to power the Klipsch speakers. Your receiver will only put out a few watts to reach crazy output levels with the Klipsch speakers. I've used a Onkyo 605 receiver (90x7) and powered less sensitive speakers to some pretty loud levels running full range and never ran into any issues or felt the speakers would be damaged.
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post #8 of 8 Old 12-12-2012, 11:28 AM - Thread Starter
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Thanks! That's definitely good to hear. I'll try to hold off on throwing money at a receiver for a little while now. Do I have to worry about overpowering my RS-42 surrounds (75w RMS/300w peak) if I went with an Onkyo TX-NR809 or 818 which claim 135w per channel? Or is the power going to drop to a reasonable level with 5 channels driven?

Thanks again!
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