Simplified REW Setup and Use (USB Mic & HDMI Connection) Including Measurement Techniques and How To Interpret Graphs - Page 52 - AVS Forum
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post #1531 of 11295 Old 02-20-2013, 01:16 PM
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Originally Posted by Pres2play View Post

I'm sure it's not Herb's fault, but this hit or miss thing with the mic has got me unnerved. Will wait a little before trying again. Thanks.
 

Hit or miss?  I don't think it is hit or miss - the UMM-6 mic, when set up correctly, works fine.

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post #1532 of 11295 Old 02-20-2013, 01:18 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Selden Ball View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by kbarnes701 View Post

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Originally Posted by AustinJerry View Post

The entire REW Guide I created was using Windows 7, both 32-bit on my laptop, and 64-bit on my desktop.  Anyone who says the mic doesn't work with Win7 is blowing smoke.

Yee-har to that. 'Blowing smoke'. Nice one. Not heard that before - is it Texan?  I will adopt it here in Blighty.

"Blowing smoke" is the expurgated version of a phrase which is sometimes used when involved in blunt face-to-face conversations in the 'States. The rest of the phrase involves portions of the anatomy not normally mentioned in polite company.

 

Haha. Thanks. I'd figured out the provenance of the smoke :)  It's a neat trick for those that can manage it. Breaks the ice at parties huh? LOL.

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post #1533 of 11295 Old 02-20-2013, 01:21 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jkasanic View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by cadett View Post

Per Herb

"I can't get the UMM-6 to work with the newest version of REW under Win 7. However I'm not an REW expert so it may be something wrong with the configuration. I'm looking into it."

h

 

Yikes, that's not a good sign for getting "built-in" support of the UMM-6 mic in REW like there already is for the UMIK-1.

 

I wouldn't say that personally. The go-to guy for info on REW and a specific mic is John M, IMO, not Herb, who's already said he isn't familiar with REW. The UMM-6 works perfectly with REW and W7, as evidenced by all of us who are using it - any difficulties seem to arise from Windows configuration or possibly the ASIO driver I'd say. Heck, even my OmniMic mic worked just fine - just lacked the relevant cal file.

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post #1534 of 11295 Old 02-20-2013, 01:22 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AustinJerry View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by kbarnes701 View Post

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Originally Posted by AustinJerry View Post

The entire REW Guide I created was using Windows 7, both 32-bit on my laptop, and 64-bit on my desktop.  Anyone who says the mic doesn't work with Win7 is blowing smoke.

 

Yee-har to that. 'Blowing smoke'. Nice one. Not heard that before - is it Texan?  I will adopt it here in Blighty.

 

Yes, first "spark one up", then inhale, then blow the smoke.  Impairs one's judgement....  biggrin.gif

 
Always seems to enhance it IMO. I stress the word "seems" in that sentence ;)
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post #1535 of 11295 Old 02-20-2013, 01:31 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pres2play View Post

I'm sure it's not Herb's fault, but this hit or miss thing with the mic has got me unnerved. Will wait a little before trying again. Thanks.

 

 

Before you return the mic, please help us understand where the mic is failing.  When you plug the mic into a USB port, does the automatic driver install complete successfully?

 

 

When you open Windows Sound, is the UMM-6 listed, and is it set as the default?

 

 

Click on Properties, and on the Mic Properties screen, click Properties again:

 

 

Then click the Driver tab:

 

 

Is the driver listed the same one as shown below?

 

 

Is the level set to 100, with the mute button off?

 

 

 

 

If everything is the same as the screen shots above, then the mic should work in Windows Recorder.  Please let us know what you see on your system.

 

Edit:  When you configure REW, is the configuration screen similar to the one below?  (You can use the internal speakers in your laptop for a quick test--no need to hook up the AVR)

 

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post #1536 of 11295 Old 02-20-2013, 02:15 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kbarnes701 View Post

Hit or miss?  I don't think it is hit or miss - the UMM-6 mic, when set up correctly, works fine.

Plug-n-Pray?
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post #1537 of 11295 Old 02-20-2013, 02:21 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AustinJerry View Post

Before you return the mic, please help us understand where the mic is failing.  When you plug the mic into a USB port, does the automatic driver install complete successfully?




When you open Windows Sound, is the UMM-6 listed, and is it set as the default?




Click on Properties, and on the Mic Properties screen, click Properties again:




Then click the Driver tab:




Is the driver listed the same one as shown below?




Is the level set to 100, with the mute button off?






If everything is the same as the screen shots above, then the mic should work in Windows Recorder.  Please let us know what you see on your system.

Edit:  When you configure REW, is the configuration screen similar to the one below?  (You can use the internal speakers in your laptop for a quick test--no need to hook up the AVR)



All the windows in my system matched those above, except in Soundcard window I had ASIO4ALL as my driver. I did not get the Driver Date or Driver Version before sending it back, thought. I was hoping to have it replaced, but it seemed to me if Herb was having trouble with it...
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post #1538 of 11295 Old 02-20-2013, 02:29 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pres2play View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by kbarnes701 View Post

Hit or miss?  I don't think it is hit or miss - the UMM-6 mic, when set up correctly, works fine.

Plug-n-Pray?

My experience with Windows has always been that. But I haven't had any significant issues with REW, the UMM-6 or W7, to be fair.

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post #1539 of 11295 Old 02-20-2013, 03:21 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kbarnes701 View Post

My experience with Windows has always been that. But I haven't had any significant issues with REW, the UMM-6 or W7, to be fair.

TBH, I just didn't wanna return a second mic to Spectrum Labs after Herb's statement that he didn't think a replacement mic would fare any better. I'll probably pickup a new mic some other place.
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post #1540 of 11295 Old 02-20-2013, 04:31 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kbarnes701 View Post

My experience with Windows has always been that. But I haven't had any significant issues with REW, the UMM-6 or W7, to be fair.

For those of you questioning the reliability of the UMM-6 - here's some info on the other available USB REW configured mic - the UMIK-1. I purchased the UMIK-1 based on the reports that it was compatible with REW upon installation. While this is true, and no additional SPL calibration is required; other problems have surfaced. The published specs for the UMIK-1 indicated measurement capability from 15hz to 20kHZ. However Home Theater Shack members reported problems with their individually calibrated files, and Mini DSP responded by generating new Calibration files (however they didn't notify the consumers that purchased their UMIK-1 from DSP - the information was only available on the HTS UMIK-1 forum page) and the revised calibration files now have a 20HZ to 20kHZ range.

I have e-mailed DSP requesting a refund and will wait to see how they respond. Their standard Terms & Conditions state that no returns/refunds are available. It seems to me that if they change the specs of their microphones AFTER the sale - they should provide a refund option. We shall see.

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And to think that we started this thread as the "Simplified REW Setup..." thread.  Turns out it isn't quite as simple as we had hoped.

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post #1542 of 11295 Old 02-20-2013, 05:06 PM
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Originally Posted by ggsantafe View Post

For those of you questioning the reliability of the UMM-6 - here's some info on the other available USB REW configured mic - the UMIK-1. I purchased the UMIK-1 based on the reports that it was compatible with REW upon installation. While this is true, and no additional SPL calibration is required; other problems have surfaced. The published specs for the UMIK-1 indicated measurement capability from 15hz to 20kHZ. However Home Theater Shack members reported problems with their individually calibrated files, and Mini DSP responded by generating new Calibration files (however they didn't notify the consumers that purchased their UMIK-1 from DSP - the information was only available on the HTS UMIK-1 forum page) and the revised calibration files now have a 20HZ to 20kHZ range.

I have e-mailed DSP requesting a refund and will wait to see how they respond. Their standard Terms & Conditions state that no returns/refunds are available. It seems to me that if they change the specs of their microphones AFTER the sale - they should provide a refund option. We shall see.

I have a UMIK-1 mic. I did not know there was a new calibration file. I will have to go over HTS to check it out. Maybe when I am in Hong Kong in a week or so I can stop by and see them smile.gif Where is the UMM-6 from?

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Originally Posted by cdnbum88 View Post

I have a UMIK-1 mic. I did not know there was a new calibration file. I will have to go over HTS to check it out. Maybe when I am in Hong Kong in a week or so I can stop by and see them smile.gifWhere is the UMM-6 from?

 

Cross Spectrum Labs. 

 

No 1 Regent Road used to have the best view across the harbour from any restaurant in HK. They also have a bar but the view is inland from the bar - it is still spectacular though. In the restaurant every table is a window table.

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post #1544 of 11295 Old 02-20-2013, 07:33 PM
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Cross Spectrum Labs. 

No 1 Regent Road used to have the best view across the harbour from any restaurant in HK. They also have a bar but the view is inland from the bar - it is still spectacular though. In the restaurant every table is a window table.

May have to look that up in my 3 night stay in Hong Kong.

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Quote:
Originally Posted by AustinJerry View Post

And to think that we started this thread as the "Simplified REW Setup..." thread.  Turns out it isn't quite as simple as we had hoped.

Maybe 'Acoustic engineer skills track, using REW with USB Mic (HDMI connection strongly recommended)' is more like it. And this is just Class 101 (Setup) tongue.gif. And you're the TA when the Professor's not here.

Just wait until we get to the dissertation wink.gif

Stuart

 

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post #1546 of 11295 Old 02-20-2013, 08:02 PM
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post #1547 of 11295 Old 02-20-2013, 08:20 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cdnbum88 View Post

I have a UMIK-1 mic. I did not know there was a new calibration file. I will have to go over HTS to check it out. Maybe when I am in Hong Kong in a week or so I can stop by and see them smile.gif Where is the UMM-6 from?

Here is a link to the offical Mini DSP rsponse concerning the UMIK-1 calibration file issue: http://www.minidsp.com/forum/18-umik-questions/7851-calibration-file-question-about-freq-range?limit=6&start=24#7907 and at HTS you can easily search for the UMIK-1 microphone discussion thread for more information.

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post #1548 of 11295 Old 02-21-2013, 12:58 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cdnbum88 View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by kbarnes701 View Post

Cross Spectrum Labs. 

No 1 Regent Road used to have the best view across the harbour from any restaurant in HK. They also have a bar but the view is inland from the bar - it is still spectacular though. In the restaurant every table is a window table.

May have to look that up in my 3 night stay in Hong Kong.

 

I’d better get the address right this time then - 1 Peking Road. :)  Go for dinner - the views come alive in HK at night.

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I ordered a new UMM-6 from Parts Express and it should get here in two or three days. I'm not going to let a bad mic stop me from learning REW. (I can always send the mic to CSL for calibration later, if Herb will accept it). I'll post back when it arrives.
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post #1550 of 11295 Old 02-21-2013, 05:57 AM
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Originally Posted by cadett View Post

Per Herb

"I can't get the UMM-6 to work with the newest version of REW under Win 7. However I'm not an REW expert so it may be something wrong with the configuration. I'm looking into it."

h

As an FYI, I did get the mic working with REW under Win 7/64, it just took some fiddling with the configuration on the sound control panel. It had me confused because it worked perfectly fine out-of-the-box with ARTA and HolmImpulse, and I had no problems using the UMM-6 with REW under Win XP/32 (which I was using until last week).

I'll check out the mic when it gets returned to me, if it works, I'll check the cal and then resell it as a discounted mic.

edit: clairfication
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post #1551 of 11295 Old 02-21-2013, 06:23 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Anechoic View Post

As an FYI, I did get the mic working under Win 7/64, it just took some fiddling with the configuration on the sound control panel. It had me confused because it worked perfectly fine with ARTA and HolmImpulse, and I had no problems using the UMM-6 with REW under Win XP/32 (which I was using until last week).

Thanks for reporting that yourself!
I had posted a bit back that you had gotten it tot work. The post right after the one you quoted.

P.S. I think the glue is going to hold up enough for me to use the mic. Thanks for the tip!
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post #1552 of 11295 Old 02-21-2013, 06:30 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ggsantafe View Post

For those of you questioning the reliability of the UMM-6 - here's some info on the other available USB REW configured mic - the UMIK-1. I purchased the UMIK-1 based on the reports that it was compatible with REW upon installation. While this is true, and no additional SPL calibration is required; other problems have surfaced. The published specs for the UMIK-1 indicated measurement capability from 15hz to 20kHZ. However Home Theater Shack members reported problems with their individually calibrated files, and Mini DSP responded by generating new Calibration files (however they didn't notify the consumers that purchased their UMIK-1 from DSP - the information was only available on the HTS UMIK-1 forum page) and the revised calibration files now have a 20HZ to 20kHZ range.

I have e-mailed DSP requesting a refund and will wait to see how they respond. Their standard Terms & Conditions state that no returns/refunds are available. It seems to me that if they change the specs of their microphones AFTER the sale - they should provide a refund option. We shall see.

I did receive a prompt response from mini DSP and they have agreed to refund my purchase price ($75) but I'll still be out the original $20 shipping charge. Looks I'll return the UMIK-1 and start over with a CSL UMM-6 since that appears to be a better overall unit with calibrations for 0/45/90 as well as frequency response to 5HZ.

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post #1553 of 11295 Old 02-21-2013, 07:57 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cadett View Post

Thanks for reporting that yourself!
I had posted a bit back that you had gotten it tot work. The post right after the one you quoted.

Oops, I missed that smile.gif

Regarding REW in general - REW appears to be the program most-used by folks that purchase microphones from me, so I get a lot of questions about using REW, and using it with my mics in particular. The problem as discussed in this thread is that I'm not an REW expert. For what it does, and how it does it, REW appears to be a great program (and you certainly can't beat the price!) but it doesn't fit into what I do as a consultant so I've never really gotten around to really learning it, other than to run it, load a cal file, and do a couple of sweeps to make sure it works.

At some point I'd like to be more familiar with REW, but that's going to have to wait as I already have my hands full learning the ins and outs any number of other software packages I use for my work. For now I've been referring folks to this thread and to the REW forum on HTS. If there are any questions about REW I try my best to address them, but I'm not the best resource.

Now if anyone has a question about ARTA, fire away!
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Anechoic View Post

As an FYI, I did get the mic working with REW under Win 7/64, it just took some fiddling with the configuration on the sound control panel. It had me confused because it worked perfectly fine out-of-the-box with ARTA and HolmImpulse, and I had no problems using the UMM-6 with REW under Win XP/32 (which I was using until last week).

I'll check out the mic when it gets returned to me, if it works, I'll check the cal and then resell it as a discounted mic.

edit: clairfication

Anechoic,how exactly did you get the mic to work? From earlier posts, I assumed the problem had to do with the way and order the mic is connected, i.e., plug in mic before powerup. If you remedied the problem with the sound control panel instead, can I ask you which driver did you use? Java or ASIO? I used ASIO and maybe the issue is there.
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post #1555 of 11295 Old 02-21-2013, 11:43 AM
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P.S. I think the glue is going to hold up enough for me to use the mic. Thanks for the tip!

 

You could always fix it the professional way: gaffer tape ;)

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post #1556 of 11295 Old 02-21-2013, 11:46 AM
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Originally Posted by Pres2play View Post

Anechoic,how exactly did you get the mic to work? From earlier posts, I assumed the problem had to do with the way and order the mic is connected, i.e., plug in mic before powerup. If you remedied the problem with the sound control panel instead, can I ask you which driver did you use? Java or ASIO? I used ASIO and maybe the issue is there.

 

FWIW, I had various problems getting Windows/REW to recognise the mic until I adopted a standard sequence for setting it up. This is:

 

  1. Plug in mic and HDMI cables to laptop and AVR
  2. Power on laptop
  3. Power on AVR
  4. Start REW

 

I always use that sequence now and it has worked every time - both my UMM-6 and Onkyo 5509 are recognised when REW runs.

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You could always fix it the professional way: gaffer tape wink.gif

Well after the glue dried. I attempted to use the mic & didn't work. I think i might have pulled one of the three wires lose when trying to fix it.
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post #1558 of 11295 Old 02-21-2013, 12:31 PM
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OK guys - question... I was about to do the 'string thing', despite Mrs Keith looking on incredulously as I measure and prepare to cut a length of string ;)

 

Here is the ETC of my centre speaker (Audyssey is on):

 

 

 

It shows a couple of nasty spikes. The first is at 1.44ms and the second is at 4.76ms. Using the formula on p63 of Jerry's guide gives me the following:

 

1.44 x 13.39722 is 19.29 inches, or 1.60 feet.

 

4.76 x 13.39722 is 63.77 inches, or 5.3142 feet.

 

Multiplying those by 1.13 gives me a total reflection distance of 1.82 feet and 6.00 feet respectively.

 

The problem is, in my room, it is impossible to have a reflective surface at those distances, given that the MLP (and thus the mic) is approx 9.5 feet from the centre speaker.

 

What am I missing before I break out my new ball of string delivered so efficiently by Amazon Prime yesterday?

 

 

EDIT: The example in the Guide doesn't make much sense either, because it shows a calculated distance of 8.6 feet and, again, that is way too short a distance from the speaker to the reflective point and then on to the mic. Something seems to be amiss...

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post #1559 of 11295 Old 02-21-2013, 12:57 PM
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Keith,

 

I went back and looked at my notes, and that section in the ETC guide is wrong.  The proper way to determine the distance of a peak is to place the cursor vertically on zero, hold the Control Key down, click the right mouse button, and drag the cursor to the peak you want to measure.  Here is an example:

 

 

I will edit that section in the guide--don't know where that mistake came from!

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post #1560 of 11295 Old 02-21-2013, 01:06 PM
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Originally Posted by AustinJerry View Post

Keith,

 

I went back and looked at my notes, and that section in the ETC guide is wrong.  The proper way to determine the distance of a peak is to place the cursor vertically on zero, hold the Control Key down, click the right mouse button, and drag the cursor to the peak you want to measure.  Here is an example:

 

 

I will edit that section in the guide--don't know where that mistake came from!

 

That is exceptionally cool, but...

 

I just tried that Jerry but the problem is still the same - the distance to the peak is impossibly short, as it is in your graph above (6.1 feet).  I must be missing something - it's impossible to have a distance from the MLP to the speaker to any wall, ceiling or floor point of just 6 feet.

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