Simplified REW Setup and Use (USB Mic & HDMI Connection) Including Measurement Techniques and How To Interpret Graphs - Page 577 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #17281 of 17649 Old 12-17-2015, 12:09 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PlasmaPZ80U View Post
Ok, thanks... so if I set match range to the measurement range, I should be good, right?

(In my case, that would be 15Hz to 200Hz.)
if you're doing a limited bandwidth measurement then yes. I assume you have a LPF on in the REW EQ window too?
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post #17282 of 17649 Old 12-17-2015, 01:17 PM
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Originally Posted by PlasmaPZ80U View Post
Regarding the EQ tool in REW, does the 'match range' need to be set to the exact area I want to apply eq in or should it just be set to the measurement range, like 15Hz to 200Hz for a typical sub only measurement?
You set it to whatever range you want REW to work on.

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Originally Posted by PlasmaPZ80U View Post
Also does the 'set target level' option use the 'match range' when determining the target level or is the 'set target level' not affected by the 'match range' in any way?
No and yes although it would probably be a desirable feature. Ask John.

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post #17283 of 17649 Old 12-17-2015, 01:27 PM
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Simple and hopefully not dumb Question...

I am decent at using REW to measure, but I get LOST on trying to use it (if even possible) to correct

But in all my reading...CAN REW be used to fix a room issue (i.e. a DIP) prior to running Audyssey - is that the intent ?

Yes I think I am aware boosting a dip is not ideal, but I have plenty of headroom (I think that is what it is called) I think for some minor tweaking.

Am I close to understanding this correctly ?
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post #17284 of 17649 Old 12-17-2015, 01:35 PM
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REW can be used to identify issues and it can also suggest solutions, that are compatible with various common EQ devices, to those issues. It cannot fix the issue itself.
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post #17285 of 17649 Old 12-17-2015, 02:19 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by toofast68 View Post
Simple and hopefully not dumb Question...

I am decent at using REW to measure, but I get LOST on trying to use it (if even possible) to correct

But in all my reading...CAN REW be used to fix a room issue (i.e. a DIP) prior to running Audyssey - is that the intent ?

Yes I think I am aware boosting a dip is not ideal, but I have plenty of headroom (I think that is what it is called) I think for some minor tweaking.

Am I close to understanding this correctly ?
You can use REW to find out if that dip is correctable with PEQ. Look at the excess phase group delay: http://www.roomeqwizard.com/help/hel...imumphase.html
In most cases you'll find that PEQ can't help.

Markus

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post #17286 of 17649 Old 12-17-2015, 03:26 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by markus767 View Post
You can use REW to find out if that dip is correctable with PEQ. Look at the excess phase group delay: http://www.roomeqwizard.com/help/hel...imumphase.html
In most cases you'll find that PEQ can't help.
Ok....so I found a MASSIVE DIP at my main MLP 300 Hz with my Center channel using REW, but I need a third party tool like this to fix the dip. I really can't move my MLP and I've tried adjusting the position of my center slightly, but to no avail.

https://www.minidsp.com/products/min...ox/minidsp-2x4
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post #17287 of 17649 Old 12-17-2015, 03:33 PM
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^^^

Is the dip only present on the CC or does it also show up in the measurements for the FR/FL?
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post #17288 of 17649 Old 12-17-2015, 03:54 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 3ll3d00d View Post
if you're doing a limited bandwidth measurement then yes. I assume you have a LPF on in the REW EQ window too?

Does this answer the question?
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post #17289 of 17649 Old 12-17-2015, 03:55 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by markus767 View Post
You set it to whatever range you want REW to work on.



No and yes although it would probably be a desirable feature. Ask John.

ok, thanks

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post #17290 of 17649 Old 12-17-2015, 03:57 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Alan P View Post
I was indeed boosting when using the housecurve.txt (and I just used one that I downloaded from AVS ). Probably part of my headroom issues.




If you can accomplish the curve you want with one set of EQ filters, less is always better. My issue was that I loved how Audyssey EQ'ed my speakers and subs, but wanted just a bit more low end...hence the house curve on top of Audyssey.

So, just to clarify/confirm, you can load a simple house curve text file directly into the MiniDSP?


such as:


"20 10.0
80 0.0"


or did you mean something else?

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post #17291 of 17649 Old 12-17-2015, 04:03 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PlasmaPZ80U View Post
Does this answer the question?
Yes you haven't set it, in REW eq screen, as a subwoofer but you do have a LPF in place.
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post #17292 of 17649 Old 12-17-2015, 04:15 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 3ll3d00d View Post
Yes you haven't set it, in REW eq screen, as a subwoofer but you do have a LPF in place.
I'm using the sub's Line In inputs, which has a built-in LPF. However, at the moment, the 'crossover' knob is maxed out and the slope is 12dB per octave.

Last edited by PlasmaPZ80U; 12-17-2015 at 04:24 PM.
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post #17293 of 17649 Old 12-17-2015, 04:59 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PlasmaPZ80U View Post
So, just to clarify/confirm, you can load a simple house curve text file directly into the MiniDSP?


such as:


"20 10.0
80 0.0"


or did you mean something else?
No. You have to use the housecurve.txt file with REW. However, it would be quite easy to replicate with a low shelf filter in the MiniDSP (+10dB @ 20hz).
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post #17294 of 17649 Old 12-17-2015, 11:56 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by toofast68 View Post
Ok....so I found a MASSIVE DIP at my main MLP 300 Hz with my Center channel using REW, but I need a third party tool like this to fix the dip. I really can't move my MLP and I've tried adjusting the position of my center slightly, but to no avail.

https://www.minidsp.com/products/min...ox/minidsp-2x4
Again, look at the excess group delay. Did you also adjust center speaker height?

Markus

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post #17295 of 17649 Old 12-18-2015, 12:46 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PlasmaPZ80U View Post
I'm using the sub's Line In inputs, which has a built-in LPF. However, at the moment, the 'crossover' knob is maxed out and the slope is 12dB per octave.
It would be more correct then to set it as a subwoofer in the REW eq options. It probably doesn't make much practical difference though.
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post #17296 of 17649 Old 12-18-2015, 07:22 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Alan P View Post
No. You have to use the housecurve.txt file with REW. However, it would be quite easy to replicate with a low shelf filter in the MiniDSP (+10dB @ 20hz).

what do you mean exactly by housecurve.txt file? I'm not following

Quote:
Originally Posted by 3ll3d00d View Post
It would be more correct then to set it as a subwoofer in the REW eq options. It probably doesn't make much practical difference though.

Well, I'm using the house curve feature as the target curve in REW, so doesn't that bypass the other target settings?

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post #17297 of 17649 Old 12-18-2015, 09:09 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PlasmaPZ80U View Post
what do you mean exactly by housecurve.txt file? I'm not following
In this section of REW Preferences you can specify a .txt file for your house curve:




In that .txt file you would have parameters for the house curve, a simple one would be:

20 10
80 0


Or, here is an example of a "Hard Knee House Curve" that I downloaded from HTS at one time:

30 6.0
35 4.4
40 3.1
45 2.0
50 1.1
60 -0.1
70 -0.6
80 -0.5
90 0.0
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post #17298 of 17649 Old 12-18-2015, 11:54 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Alan P View Post
In this section of REW Preferences you can specify a .txt file for your house curve:




In that .txt file you would have parameters for the house curve, a simple one would be:

20 10
80 0


Or, here is an example of a "Hard Knee House Curve" that I downloaded from HTS at one time:

30 6.0
35 4.4
40 3.1
45 2.0
50 1.1
60 -0.1
70 -0.6
80 -0.5
90 0.0

Ok, so do you load this same housecurve.txt file directly into the PEQ portion of the MiniDSP plug-in OR do you use this to generate filters in REW and then use the send filters to EQ option to create a .txt file to import in the MiniDSP plug-in?

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post #17299 of 17649 Old 12-18-2015, 12:09 PM
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Hi All

Gonna try and get back to REW this weekend. I have UMIK from CSL.

Furthest I got before was figuring out how to get sound out of laptop. I can only seem to get multi-channel out from the SPDIF (not HDMI).

Can I still use ASIO to select the individual channels?

Regards

Mark

Home Theater and Home Automation Enthusiast
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post #17300 of 17649 Old 12-18-2015, 01:29 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PlasmaPZ80U View Post
Ok, so do you load this same housecurve.txt file directly into the PEQ portion of the MiniDSP plug-in OR do you use this to generate filters in REW and then use the send filters to EQ option to create a .txt file to import in the MiniDSP plug-in?
The House Curve.txt file only effects the Target in REWs EQ section...that is all it does. You then would create filters in REW based on the "House Curve" target then send them to the MiniDSP as usual.
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post #17301 of 17649 Old 12-18-2015, 01:46 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Alan P View Post
The House Curve.txt file only effects the Target in REWs EQ section...that is all it does. You then would create filters in REW based on the "House Curve" target then send them to the MiniDSP as usual.
Keep in mind that if you use a house curve file, the manual adjusters in the EQ are going to layer on top of that. That's why if I use a house curve file, I set the speaker type to None and then zero out the hf/lf rise etc stuff so that the EQ conforms the peq filters to my house curve only.
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post #17302 of 17649 Old 12-18-2015, 02:22 PM
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Originally Posted by markus767 View Post
Again, look at the excess group delay. Did you also adjust center speaker height?
Whew, so I read that a few times and WHAMMO I am so confused...but I will have to keep reading to figure out.

Yes, my center speaker is as high as it can go, and aimed directly (with laser) at MLP ear level.
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post #17303 of 17649 Old 12-18-2015, 02:34 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by toofast68 View Post
Whew, so I read that a few times and WHAMMO I am so confused...but I will have to keep reading to figure out.
Keep on reading. Understanding phase isn't easy.

Quote:
Originally Posted by toofast68 View Post
Yes, my center speaker is as high as it can go, and aimed directly (with laser) at MLP ear level.
So do different height positions affect the dip? You need to do multiple measurements of different positions. REW can show you what each position looks like but it won't tell you what is causing the dip.

Markus

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post #17304 of 17649 Old 12-18-2015, 02:38 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by markus767 View Post
Keep on reading. Understanding phase isn't easy.

So do different height positions affect the dip? You need to do multiple measurements of different positions. REW can show you what each position looks like but it won't tell you what is causing the dip.
I will keep reading....

I honestly thought the HIGHEST position would be best, so I did not bother lowering say closer to the ground, but now it sounds like I need to :-)

Thanks much!
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post #17305 of 17649 Old 12-18-2015, 02:48 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Alan P View Post
The House Curve.txt file only effects the Target in REWs EQ section...that is all it does. You then would create filters in REW based on the "House Curve" target then send them to the MiniDSP as usual.
Quote:
Originally Posted by corradizo View Post
Keep in mind that if you use a house curve file, the manual adjusters in the EQ are going to layer on top of that. That's why if I use a house curve file, I set the speaker type to None and then zero out the hf/lf rise etc stuff so that the EQ conforms the peq filters to my house curve only.
Ok, looks like I'm already doing this as described in both quoted posts. The only difference is that I have set things for no overall boost as I'm not already starting with a flat sub response due to Audyssey.
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post #17306 of 17649 Old 12-20-2015, 12:06 PM
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If I want to try various kinds of house curves, is there a good place to view many good examples?

Right now, my house curve is basically just a straight line between 2 points like +XdB boost at 20Hz to 0dB boost at 80Hz (or 100Hz or whatever).

What other kinds of curves are worth trying and is something that only boosts 50Hz and under worth trying?

Basically, looking for many examples/suggestions/ideas.
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post #17307 of 17649 Old 12-20-2015, 04:35 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PlasmaPZ80U View Post
If I want to try various kinds of house curves, is there a good place to view many good examples?
Don't see how this has anything to do with Simplified REW Setup and Use
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post #17308 of 17649 Old 12-20-2015, 07:33 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by artur9 View Post
Don't see how this has anything to do with Simplified REW Setup and Use
I think it's the "and Use" part.
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post #17309 of 17649 Old 12-21-2015, 03:46 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by artur9 View Post
Don't see how this has anything to do with Simplified REW Setup and Use
Quote:
Originally Posted by corradizo View Post
I think it's the "and Use" part.
Considering it's a part of REW and my question relates to how house curves are created via REW preferences and EQ tool, I'd say it's on topic.

Anyhow, I've been playing around with the EQ tool in REW a lot and one idea I got was to set speaker type to subwoofer and use the LPF as a house curve of sorts. For example, a cutoff of 60Hz and a slope of 12dB per octave brings the level down 6dB by 80Hz. And since while I like the sound of a ruler flat frequency response, one issue with it at my listening levels (moderate) is that when I run the sw trim hot the mid bass causes listening fatigue long before the low bass is satisfyingly strong. Perhaps, using a LPF like this is a simple and smooth way of achieving that.

Now another thing worth noting is after upgrading to version 5.14 of REW a day or 2 ago, I'm finding I get the same filters regardless of whether the flatness target is 1, 2, or 3dB and that even though I have selected drop filters if gain is too small, I'm still getting filters that are less than half of the flatness target. Odd.
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post #17310 of 17649 Old 12-22-2015, 01:28 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PlasmaPZ80U View Post
even though I have selected drop filters if gain is too small, I'm still getting filters that are less than half of the flatness target. Odd.
Bit of a bug there, a threshold of 1 dB was used in some circumstances regardless of the flatness limit. I've fixed it for the next release.
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