Simplified REW Setup and Use (USB Mic & HDMI Connection) Including Measurement Techniques and How To Interpret Graphs - Page 639 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #19141 of 19161 Old Today, 06:16 AM
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Originally Posted by bgoering View Post
Did you try HD Audio Output 4 instead of Display?

Its all working now, it was just me being stupid!
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post #19142 of 19161 Old Today, 06:26 AM
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Originally Posted by artur9 View Post
My graph looked like that for a while - not quite as severe. It sounded terrible to me until I fixed it. The issue was too much overlap between the mains and the subwoofers.



How did you resolve the issue?

Thanks
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post #19143 of 19161 Old Today, 06:38 AM
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Originally Posted by indus1 View Post
How did you resolve the issue?

Thanks
I moved the XOver frequency higher. The subs I'm using go to 150Hz. I had the XO originally at 90 but that give a hump at the XO. Moving it higher let the natural rolloff of the sub work better with the mains, which are bookshelves. I think if I had DSP available other options are possible but my minidsp was unusable and got binned.
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post #19144 of 19161 Old Today, 07:12 AM
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Its all working now, it was just me being stupid!
Really? That's never happened around here before.

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post #19145 of 19161 Old Today, 07:16 AM
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Originally Posted by indus1 View Post
Hi

I should definitely be C and SW, and as I'm sure you know that the SW only channel had a +10db gain applied.
the overall level of a measurement sent to the LFE channel will be 10dB higher than a measurement sent to the C channel
a bass managed C channel measurement will not see a 10dB level difference between the sub passband and the C channel passband (unless your configuration is borked )

i.e. the LFE channel being 10dB higher does not explain the marked difference in shape between the SW alone and a bass managed C channel
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post #19146 of 19161 Old Today, 10:30 AM
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Originally Posted by 3ll3d00d View Post
the overall level of a measurement sent to the LFE channel will be 10dB higher than a measurement sent to the C channel
a bass managed C channel measurement will not see a 10dB level difference between the sub passband and the C channel passband (unless your configuration is borked )

i.e. the LFE channel being 10dB higher does not explain the marked difference in shape between the SW alone and a bass managed C channel

Ok thanks.

I've attached two pics. These are channel 3 and channel 4 with the positions you mentioned ie MLP, 0.5m either side and then about 0.5m in front. Please ignore the lowest measurement line in the second picture

Does this shed any further light?

Thanks again for your help and patience.
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post #19147 of 19161 Old Today, 11:13 AM
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Originally Posted by indus1 View Post
Ok thanks.

I've attached two pics. These are channel 3 and channel 4 with the positions you mentioned ie MLP, 0.5m either side and then about 0.5m in front. Please ignore the lowest measurement line in the second picture

Does this shed any further light?

Thanks again for your help and patience.
Just curious, how do you expect us to interpret your graphs if you don't enter a description of which curve is which? You include the legend in the screen print, but all that it shows is a date of the measurement. And the last waterfall you posted indicates that you completely ignored the advice I gave in post 19098 WRT how to set the waterfall lower limit. And I suggested you post the REW MDAT so we could look at the actual measurements, which you ignored as well.

We are trying to help out here, but you don't seem to be following the advice you get. And the bass response still doesn't look very good, IMO.
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post #19148 of 19161 Old Today, 11:29 AM
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As jerry says, informed commentary is V hard without details of which measurement is which. The only thing we can see is your measurement signal chain has a problem with bass managed SW levels, the sub looks pretty clearly 10dB low.

What is your measurement signal chain exactly? ie what do you connect to? How are those devices configured? What crossover are you using?
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post #19149 of 19161 Old Today, 11:57 AM
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And you also didn't include the CC only graph I requested.
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Originally Posted by AustinJerry View Post
Just curious, how do you expect us to interpret your graphs if you don't enter a description of which curve is which? You include the legend in the screen print, but all that it shows is a date of the measurement. And the last waterfall you posted indicates that you completely ignored the advice I gave in post 19098 WRT how to set the waterfall lower limit. And I suggested you post the REW MDAT so we could look at the actual measurements, which you ignored as well.

We are trying to help out here, but you don't seem to be following the advice you get. And the bass response still doesn't look very good, IMO.


Noted with thanks.

1) I'll get the graphs properly sorted.

2) I didn't ignore your advice on setting the WF lower limit. I thought I had done it but must have misunderstood what you said.

3) I don't know how to share the mdat data but will figure it out.

Thanks for your input
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post #19151 of 19161 Old Today, 12:06 PM
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Originally Posted by 3ll3d00d View Post
As jerry says, informed commentary is V hard without details of which measurement is which. The only thing we can see is your measurement signal chain has a problem with bass managed SW levels, the sub looks pretty clearly 10dB low.

What is your measurement signal chain exactly? ie what do you connect to? How are those devices configured? What crossover are you using?


Hi

I need to pop out but will respond once I'm back.

Thanks
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post #19152 of 19161 Old Today, 12:56 PM
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Originally Posted by indus1 View Post
Noted with thanks.


2) I didn't ignore your advice on setting the WF lower limit. I thought I had done it but must have misunderstood what you said.


Thanks for your input
1. Run the Spectrogram.
2. Observe the high and low limits for the measurement.
3. Take the high limit, subtract 40, and use that value as the lower limit of the vertical scale in the Waterfall.

In your recent waterfall, the highest measurement point looks to be in the 80-85dB range, which suggests that a Waterfall lower limit of 40-45dB would be appropriate. Or better yet, take the measurements at a higher level. You really are not far enough above the noise floor.
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post #19153 of 19161 Old Today, 02:28 PM
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Originally Posted by indus1 View Post
3) I don't know how to share the mdat data but will figure it out.
As Jerry mentioned before, you can set up a Dropbox account in about 2 minutes. It's one of the easiest (and free) ways to share files here.
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post #19154 of 19161 Old Today, 04:17 PM
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Questions about REW instructions.

1. Page 17 - I do not have an "Enhancements" tab for my HDMI properties. Is that okay?

2. Page 18 - When I press the TEST button, nothing plays through my speakers. The AVR display shows PCM. Should any test sound be heard?

3. Page 18 - I am able to select "24 bit 48000 Hz Studio Quality". Is that okay for me to select?

4. Page 9 - How do you cable for testing just the subwoofer?

5. Page 23 - (kind of a stupid question, but sometimes dummies read these instructions) - When should the microphone be plugged in?

I am using Windows 10 Home, and HMDI.


ps - any questions I have about the REW instructions, are meant to 1) help me, and to 2) improve those instructions. I so appreciate such work. I have written plenty of instructions before, and it is a labor of love, and constant improvement. After a lot of use and a lot of improvements, it is so satisfying to answer a question with "Did you look in the instructions?".
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post #19155 of 19161 Old Today, 04:55 PM
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After a lot of use and a lot of improvements, it is so satisfying to answer a question with "Did you look in the instructions?".
You're much more polite than I am. I go with "RTFM," which you may want to add to your acronym thread.
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post #19156 of 19161 Old Today, 05:10 PM
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I used to watch users using the systems I was involved in. I would check that the instructions mirrored what the users were doing by instinct. If they had any questions, I would ask them to look in the instructions while telling me what they were thinking. That would tell me how they were searching, and what they thought they read (which might be different from the written words). It was a labor of love to make the instructions as good as the users. Not easy.

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post #19157 of 19161 Old Today, 05:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by XBR11 View Post
Questions about REW instructions.

1. Page 17 - I do not have an "Enhancements" tab for my HDMI properties. Is that okay?

2. Page 18 - When I press the TEST button, nothing plays through my speakers. The AVR display shows PCM. Should any test sound be heard?[/COLOR]

3. Page 18 - I am able to select "24 bit 48000 Hz Studio Quality". Is that okay for me to select?

4. Page 9 - How do you cable for testing just the subwoofer?

5. Page 23 - (kind of a stupid question, but sometimes dummies read these instructions) - When should the microphone be plugged in?

I am using Windows 10 Home, and HMDI.


ps - any questions I have about the REW instructions, are meant to 1) help me, and to 2) improve those instructions. I so appreciate such work. I have written plenty of instructions before, and it is a labor of love, and constant improvement. After a lot of use and a lot of improvements, it is so satisfying to answer a question with "Did you look in the instructions?".
Thank you for your questions and feedback. I'll try and answer each.

1. The "enhancements" tab seems to have been dropped for PC's that support 7.1. I believe if you were to switch to the Java drivers, you might see that tab. No worries, just ignore that step. BTW, I am currently in the process of going through the guide and updating a number of areas that have changed with all the updates that REW has had over the last year. Stay tuned...

2. Don't worry if the Test button doesn't produce a sound.

3. 24 bit 48000 is fine.

4. To test the sub channel by itself, output the REW test signal to HDMI4 (the LFE channel). Note: the HDMI4 output will be 10dB higher than the other HDMI outputs, so don't be alarmed when the curve is higher.

5. You should plug the mic in before you launch REW. It is not necessary to plug in the mic before you boot up the PC.
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post #19158 of 19161 Old Today, 05:35 PM
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Thank you so much for your answers. Especially #2 - it had me worried.
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post #19159 of 19161 Old Today, 05:36 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by XBR11 View Post
I used to watch users using the systems I was involved in. I would check that the instructions mirrored what the users were doing by instinct. If they had any questions, I would ask them to look in the instructions while telling me what they were thinking. That would tell me how they were searching, and what they thought they read (which might be different from the written words). It was a labor of love to make the instructions as good as the users. Not easy.
I have always aspired to authoring the perfect user guide. Given the wide range of reader knowledge levels, it has been an elusive target. And with something like the REW Guide, I am always dealing with a moving target--changes in the OS, updates to drivers, enhancements to REW, etc.
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post #19160 of 19161 Old Today, 06:10 PM
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I've thought I had a nearly perfect set of instructions once or twice with a static system and I was proved wrong. Users change, usage changes, "experts" no longer feel that they need to read instructions. Etc, etc. I feel your pain of trying to write instructions for a constantly changing system.

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Originally Posted by AustinJerry View Post
4. To test the sub channel by itself, output the REW test signal to HDMI4 (the LFE channel). Note: the HDMI4 output will be 10dB higher than the other HDMI outputs, so don't be alarmed when the curve is higher.
I am going to use HDMI, but in the past I used non-HDMI, and the non-HDMI table on page 9 does not list how to test just the subwoofer.

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