Simplified REW Setup and Use (USB Mic & HDMI Connection) Including Measurement Techniques and How To Interpret Graphs - Page 739 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #22141 of 22163 Old Yesterday, 09:03 PM
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No, that's correct - I had to go through and play with it a bit to get things to align up properly. Labeling becomes even more critical when doing this kind of work, otherwise you wind up chasing your tail.

I'm going to take a break and watch a movie before trying to tackle the sub distance tweak.

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post #22142 of 22163 Old Today, 07:51 AM
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Can someone check my understanding of sub distance tweak procedure, please?

Take a total of 3 measurements:

Center + Sub (using HDMI 1 3)
Center with subs disconnected (using HDMI 1 3)
Subs with Center disconnected (using HDMI 1 3)

Yamaha should be set to 'Straight' to disable any PEQ

Thanks!

Mike

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post #22143 of 22163 Old Today, 08:00 AM
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Nope, that's for selecting the crossover point.
Sub distance is center (if movies are your main diet) or L/R (if music is primary) and sub(s) at different distances as set in your AVR (start with differences of at least a foot). After several runs, you'll see a trend that gets you the flattest response at the crossover point.
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post #22144 of 22163 Old Today, 08:04 AM
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Thanks Michael - that might answer my question about whether a 100Hz crossover would be better for the Center as well, though.

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post #22145 of 22163 Old Today, 08:44 AM
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When I am taking measurements my headroom is about 42dB. What do I adjust to get within the appropriate range?

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post #22146 of 22163 Old Today, 09:37 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by David Varner View Post
When I am taking measurements my headroom is about 42dB. What do I adjust to get within the appropriate range?

Yamaha CX-A5100, Emotiva XPA-7 gen3, JTR Orbit Shifter LFU, LCR DIYSG Fusion 15, Rear Sur. Tannoy 802's, Atmos Micca M-8C, TV LG 65UH8500
The REW measurement level is typically -12dBFS. To establish the desired headroom, place the mic in the MLP, open the REW SPL meter and the Signal Generator, select Pink Noise subwoofer cal @-12dBFS, play the tone and adjust AVR MV until the REW SPL reads 90dB.

My MV level is typically -11, but since you are using the UMM-6 and a different AVR, your level may be different.
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post #22147 of 22163 Old Today, 09:43 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mjmcmahon67 View Post
Can someone check my understanding of sub distance tweak procedure, please?

Take a total of 3 measurements:

Center + Sub (using HDMI 1 3)
Center with subs disconnected (using HDMI 1 3)
Subs with Center disconnected (using HDMI 1 3)

Yamaha should be set to 'Straight' to disable any PEQ

Thanks!

Mike
Mike, you arrived at this from reading the procedure I linked?

1. Measure subs+center.
2. Adjust the combined distance for the subs. Try adding 5'.
3. Re-measure.
4. Looks worse? Lower to 4' and re-measure.
5. Still looks worse? Lower to 3' and re-measure.
6. Repeat until the distance results in the smoothest response.

This is actually quite easy.

Last edited by AustinJerry; Today at 09:50 AM.
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post #22148 of 22163 Old Today, 10:17 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AustinJerry View Post
The REW measurement level is typically -12dBFS. To establish the desired headroom, place the mic in the MLP, open the REW SPL meter and the Signal Generator, select Pink Noise subwoofer cal @-12dBFS, play the tone and adjust AVR MV until the REW SPL reads 90dB.

My MV level is typically -11, but since you are using the UMM-6 and a different AVR, your level may be different.
I have done that and on my AVR -17mv is where i reach 90dB. I ran another measurement and in the spectorgram I am maxing at 107dB. I think the issue is with my windows properties mic volume. After doing the tests we did before for John and making changes to the mic volume. I'm not sure where to leave it now.

I see at 0% mic volume I have 31.4dB headroom and at 100% mic volume I have 2.4dB headroom.

Where should I leave the mic volume for taking measurements?
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post #22149 of 22163 Old Today, 10:39 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by David Varner View Post
I have done that and on my AVR -17mv is where i reach 90dB. I ran another measurement and in the spectorgram I am maxing at 107dB. I think the issue is with my windows properties mic volume. After doing the tests we did before for John and making changes to the mic volume. I'm not sure where to leave it now.

I see at 0% mic volume I have 31.4dB headroom and at 100% mic volume I have 2.4dB headroom.

Where should I leave the mic volume for taking measurements?
We established with John that the Windows setting has no effect on the dB output of REW measurements. So the "correct" setting is one that does not produce clipping during the measurement (too high), or results in a warning that the level is too low. Anywhere in between is perfectly acceptable, and makes no difference in the measurements. Typically, the measurement should have 10-20dB headroom. Time to pick a setting and move on.
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post #22150 of 22163 Old Today, 10:51 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AustinJerry View Post
We established with John that the Windows setting has no effect on the dB output of REW measurements. So the "correct" setting is one that does not produce clipping during the measurement (too high), or results in a warning that the level is too low. Anywhere in between is perfectly acceptable, and makes no difference in the measurements. Typically, the measurement should have 10-20dB headroom. Time to pick a setting and move on.
I realized that but now I'm talking about headroom not dB output in REW. Where to leave the mic volume was my original question that was never answered.

But now you have answered it. Thanks


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post #22151 of 22163 Old Today, 12:12 PM
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I was also looking at getting an SPL meter to go along with the REW setup. What dB weighting filter on the meter should I use? (A, C or Z)
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post #22152 of 22163 Old Today, 12:42 PM
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I was also looking at getting an SPL meter to go along with the REW setup. What dB weighting filter on the meter should I use? (A, C or Z)
C, Slow. But you would be better served by getting a USB mic, IMO.
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post #22153 of 22163 Old Today, 12:49 PM
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And a good (ie, accurate) meter will cost as much as a calibrated mic.
Nice to have, but get the mic first.
Michael
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post #22154 of 22163 Old Today, 01:02 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AustinJerry View Post
Mike, you arrived at this from reading the procedure I linked?

1. Measure subs+center.
2. Adjust the combined distance for the subs. Try adding 5'.
3. Re-measure.
4. Looks worse? Lower to 4' and re-measure.
5. Still looks worse? Lower to 3' and re-measure.
6. Repeat until the distance results in the smoothest response.

This is actually quite easy.
Yup - did it and wound up selecting a 100Hz crossover for the Center as well as it provided the flattest response. You're correct that it's easy, but when one only does it once every few years, it's easy to get it crosswise in your head.

Now I'm letting MSO do its magic

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post #22155 of 22163 Old Today, 01:23 PM
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Originally Posted by mjmcmahon67 View Post
Yup - did it and wound up selecting a 100Hz crossover for the Center as well as it provided the flattest response. You're correct that it's easy, but when one only does it once every few years, it's easy to get it crosswise in your head.

Now I'm letting MSO do its magic
If you are going to explore MSO, please make sure you document before and after results and post them here, please.
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Now that the miniDSP UMIK-1 seems to be back in stock, what would be a good mic stand for REW measurements?
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post #22157 of 22163 Old Today, 01:51 PM
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Originally Posted by AustinJerry View Post
If you are going to explore MSO, please make sure you document before and after results and post them here, please.
That sounds somewhat ominous....I did just get some very odd results and had asked in that thread about them:
Final gain and delay/distance settings:
Decrease AVR sub out trim gain by 1.5 dB
Sub Channel 1 gain: -0.16 dB
Sub Channel 2 gain: -2.53 dB
Increase AVR sub out distance by 7.6 feet
Delay settings:
Sub Channel 1 delay: 0.01 msec
Sub Channel 2 delay: 21.80 msec

This was AFTER doing the distance tweak....something smells in Denmark

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post #22158 of 22163 Old Today, 02:06 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve Hanna View Post
Now that the miniDSP UMIK-1 seems to be back in stock, what would be a good mic stand for REW measurements?
Just about anything inexpensive that keeps the mic where you want it without touching anything else.
https://www.sweetwater.com/store/det...FciKswodGzIGEQ
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post #22159 of 22163 Old Today, 02:26 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve Hanna View Post
Now that the miniDSP UMIK-1 seems to be back in stock, what would be a good mic stand for REW measurements?
https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/produ..._Boom_Mic.html

$20 free shipping
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I think I paid 20 bucks for boom mic stand on amazon......I think it was a samson brand.

They key is getting one with a mic holder included that fits the umik.......

The only thing I would have liked better was one with a longer swing arm to extend out over the seating better.

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I have started taking measurements in REW and I am not sure which mode on the Yamaha CX-A5100 to use to give me full control of 7.1 channels and where no kind of signal processing is applied. Straight mode shows only L R and sub on the front display so no 7.1. Any of the movie settings have some kind of signal processing applied.

In Jerry's REW Guide he suggest using "MULTI CH IN 7.1" which I assume is for a Denon or Marrantz. What would be the equivalent setting for a Yamaha CX-A5100? I assume the newer Yamaha AVR's would be pretty much the same.

PS- I am using ASIO and HDMI
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Quote:
Originally Posted by David Varner View Post
I have started taking measurements in REW and I am not sure which mode on the Yamaha CX-A5100 to use to give me full control of 7.1 channels and where no kind of signal processing is applied. Straight mode shows only L R and sub on the front display so no 7.1. Any of the movie settings have some kind of signal processing applied.

In Jerry's REW Guide he suggest using "MULTI CH IN 7.1" which I assume is for a Denon or Marrantz. What would be the equivalent setting for a Yamaha CX-A5100? I assume the newer Yamaha AVR's would be pretty much the same.

PS- I am using ASIO and HDMI

My current AVR is also the Yamaha A5100 and I use straight mode. Don't worry about only the left and right channels showing on the display. The other channels will all play fine when chosen in REW. If you want a set of baseline measurements one thing you want to make sure is that you have the EQ choice set to manual and choose PEQ DATA CLEAR. This will zero out all EQ and clear out the YPAO RSC settings too. Might want to run all speakers as full and keep that mdat file for reference to compare against any future EQ'd results.
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post #22163 of 22163 Old Today, 03:31 PM
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My current AVR is also the Yamaha A5100 and I use straight mode. Don't worry about only the left and right channels showing on the display. The other channels will all play fine when chosen in REW. If you want a set of baseline measurements one thing you want to make sure is that you have the EQ choice set to manual and choose PEQ DATA CLEAR. This will zero out all EQ and clear out the YPAO RSC settings too. Might want to run all speakers as full and keep that mdat file for reference to compare against any future EQ'd results.
Perfect thanks for the info. That's what I was figuring but the 5100 only displaying LR and SUB threw me off.

Good tip on clearing out the PEQ and saving the .mdat

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