Neo:X 7.1 - Wides a bit too directional - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 12 Old 01-13-2013, 09:11 PM - Thread Starter
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Hello,


I've been running 7.1 with my NR818 for a few months now and I feel like the wides are being too directional, I can easily make out where the sound is coming from versus having it seemless like with the surrounds.

I currently have them wall mounted at 60 degrees with the tweeters about a foot about ear level. The stereo mains are electrostatics and the wides are not, but in the same series of speaker. Also I'm wondering if wides are right for this room, the front part is only 12' wide and one wide (left) is closer than the right, the right is in the ideal position but only about 4-5 feet from the ESLs.

Another option is also using heights or rear surrounds. The heights would be 8' up and the rear surrounds would be 10 feet into the back of the room maximum.

Appreciate any advice on making them blend in better.
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post #2 of 12 Old 01-14-2013, 07:07 AM
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It sounds to me as if you are trying to cram 10 pounds into a 5-pound bag.

I suggest you go to a 5.1 system and optimize it.

The result may be far more satisfying.
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post #3 of 12 Old 01-14-2013, 08:32 AM
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A couple of things you can do to make the Wides less distracting: lower their volume level and/or point them to the person at the opposite end of the couch (e.g., point the Left Wide to the person on the right side of the couch).

If you decide to change them to Heights, I would keep the same ±60° location but mount them as high up as possible. I prefer this to mounting them high above the Front L/R speakers because it gives a sense of sound above you rather than just a taller soundstage.

My first choice would be to use those speakers as Rears, placed behind you and spread at least 60° apart. However, in order get proper rear-vs-side separation in the surround field, you'll need to place the Side speakers directly to your sides (±90°). With 10 feet of space behind you for the Rear speakers, you're an ideal candidate for the traditional 7.1-speaker layout. There's also a lot of movies mixed for that speaker configuration.

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post #4 of 12 Old 01-15-2013, 02:20 PM - Thread Starter
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Got an update here

I angled the wides a bit differently and it made a nice difference, a lot less directional now which is great.

But one other thing is that while playing between DTS:Neo X modes and DSX + Dynamic EQ I found that with Dynamic EQ a ton of my mid-bass came back while with DTS: Neo X it was missing when I was using only Re-EQ.

To get the same effect with DTS:Neo X on should I run it with just Dynamic EQ and Re-EQ off? Also what is the difference when it is running DTS:Neo X + THX Cinema?

Thanks..
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post #5 of 12 Old 01-15-2013, 02:24 PM
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Neo x adds the 6th and 7th channel on 5.1 material.

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post #6 of 12 Old 01-15-2013, 03:12 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kamikaze13 View Post

Neo x adds the 6th and 7th channel on 5.1 material.
And adds the 8th and 9th channel, and 10th and 11th channel.

Basically, Neo:X scales 2-channel or 5.1-channel material to (upto) 11 speakers.

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post #7 of 12 Old 01-15-2013, 03:18 PM - Thread Starter
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?...

DSX was playing the wides also. I was doing 7.1.

I'm asking why I had more mid-bass with DSX versus using Neo:X
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post #8 of 12 Old 01-15-2013, 04:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BB1111 View Post

?...
Sorry, just making a general comment about Neo:X, not specific to your set-up.
Quote:
Originally Posted by BB1111 View Post

I'm asking why I had more mid-bass with DSX versus using Neo:X
You were using loudness compensation (Dynamic EQ) with DSX. Was Dynamic EQ on when listening to Neo:X?

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post #9 of 12 Old 01-15-2013, 04:23 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sdurani View Post

Sorry, just making a general comment about Neo:X, not specific to your set-up.
You were using loudness compensation (Dynamic EQ) with DSX. Was Dynamic EQ on when listening to Neo:X?


Appreciate your replys sdurani


For the last two months I was using DTS:X Cinema + THX Cinema setting with RE-Eq enabled and no Dynamic EQ.

Today after trying DSX with Dyn. EQ I realized how much of my mid-bass was missing (I normally listen at -10 or -5)... I've tried DTS:X with Dynamic EQ only and also with Dyn. EQ and Re-EQ but the highs were overly bright both times and was too fatiguing. When I use just Re-EQ with THX Cinema the highs were good but the midbass was missing.


Just confused on why this is happening. Does DSX apply it's own curve? I was using Audyssey "Movie" in all instances.
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post #10 of 12 Old 01-15-2013, 04:46 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BB1111 View Post

Does DSX apply it's own curve?
Yes, because our human hearing varies across frequencies AND changes depending on level. As you lower the volume, we hear the low frequencies drop off faster than the rest of the range.

So receivers have loudness compensation (Audyssey Dynamic EQ, THX Loudness Plus, Dolby Volume) in order to compensate for our hearing by boosting the low frequencies more and more as you lower the volume. This selective boosting gives the impression that the bass is staying as loud as the rest of the frequencies.

The bass difference you were hearing wasn't due so much to DSX wides vs Neo:X wides but more due to having Dynamic EQ on vs having it off. If you leave Dynamic EQ on for all modes, their bass should sound similar.

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post #11 of 12 Old 01-15-2013, 05:54 PM
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I believe loudness plus diverts the all the bass from your mains to your sub, hence more mid bass?

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post #12 of 12 Old 01-15-2013, 09:27 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kamikaze13 View Post

I believe loudness plus diverts the all the bass from your mains to your sub, hence more mid bass?

After some testing I've found Dyanmic EQ to give a better overall sound, it was similar with Neo:X but I liked DSX a little bit more
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