Noob question for a new setup - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 12 Old 04-19-2013, 11:56 PM - Thread Starter
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Hi guys,
This will be my first audio setup, of witch I know nothing about.
I was thinking to get two floor standing speakers and an AV receiver for the beginning then build from there to a full 5.1 system.
The system will be used for movies, PS3 and music.

I was thinking to buy Yamaha rx-v475, and a pair of speakers for up to $800/pair, or that is too much for that receiver.

Any thoughts of getting a better receiver or cheaper speakers.

Thank you guys for any response.
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post #2 of 12 Old 04-20-2013, 01:39 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bstep View Post

Hi guys,
This will be my first audio setup, of witch I know nothing about.
I was thinking to get two floor standing speakers and an AV receiver for the beginning then build from there to a full 5.1 system.
The system will be used for movies, PS3 and music.

I was thinking to buy Yamaha rx-v475, and a pair of speakers for up to $800/pair, or that is too much for that receiver.

Any thoughts of getting a better receiver or cheaper speakers.

Thank you guys for any response.

Spend as much as you can afford on your speakers. $800 for a pair is a good start. Many around these parts start with just the front speakers (and oftentimes a sub as well) and add surrounds/rears/height as they go.

Do research on your reciever you choose and make sure that it has enough power to drive your speakers. If you get very efficient speakers (Efficiency of 94db or higher) you won't need a ton of power, but you have to make sure there's enough power to drive all 5 speakers if you do plan to go full on 5.1 or 7.1. For A/V receivers, most around here seem to like Denon (that's what I have) Onkyo (very comparable to the Denons) and Pioneer. Yamaha, Harmon Kardon and others are also popular, but the first three I mentioned seem to get the lion's share of recommendations from this site. The Yamaha reciever you mentioned seems decent enough. It's got all the bells and whistles including Airplay, Network connectivity (which is a handy little thing if you like internet radio or Pandora and stuff like that) but it seems to me that it's power rating may be a little low, unless you get very efficient speakers. It is listed as 80 watts per channel with 2 channels driven. That will probably be enough unless you try to listen at referrence volumes. The real question here is how much power can it provide to a full 5 speaker setup?
[EDIT]
I found the PDF Manual for the RX475 and it states that the Yamaha can provide up to 350 watts max. That's 80 watts per channel. Wow, the provided actual real numbers per channel driven. That should be okay, unless you get inefficient speakers AND listen loudly all the time.

Another very important consideration is your subwoofer. Most would probably recommend you start your setup with a pair of robust front speakers AND a good subwoofer. Ask around the subwoofer forums and they'll be able to provide some nice recommendations. Just figure out your budget first. Good budget subs include the BIC PL-200, BIC F20and the Klipsch R12 among others. If you aren't looking to spend a ton of money, those are the way to go. They have a very good bang-to-buck ratio (literally).

Check back in and let us know how your quest is going from time to time. People will have lots of recommendations for you. And welcome to the Rabbit Hole. It runs deeeeeep....
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post #3 of 12 Old 04-20-2013, 06:31 AM
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In the $400, I might shop around a bit and really try to figure out if you need the new 2013 models/features.

You can get a fantastic, refurbished, Denon for the same price:
http://www.accessories4less.com/make-a-store/item/DENAVR2113CI/DENON-AVR-2113CI-7.1ch-Networking-Receiver-w/AirPlay-3D-Ready/1.html

It's feature-rich with a bit more power for your long-range plans.

In the $600 range you can get the big-boy Marantz, and if you shop around you can find other Marantz deals (I'm very happy with my Marantz 1402).
http://www.accessories4less.com/make-a-store/item/MARSR5007/MARANTZ-SR5007-100w-x7-NetworkingTheater-Receiver-w/AirPlay-3D-4K/1.html

For $800, you can get a great pair of speakers - then spend another $300 on a good sub. Or you can spend $500 on some great bookshelf speakers and pair them with that $300 woofer. I did that with my Wharfedale 10.2's and the Klipsch 12D.

I just did a lot of shopping around, and even returned a few things. I'm starting with a 2.1 system with the idea of upgrading to 5.1 eventually - unless Dolby Virtual Speaker surround-mode really impresses me then I'll stop at a 3.1 system.

For me, I liked looking for used/refurbished stuff; they still come with warranty's - even e-bay and sellers like that offer 3rd party warranty's. I don't need the latest-and-greatest, but I do want some convenience features and some room for expansion. I felt that I could get more power, and the features I really will use - by looking at models 1 or 2 years old.

Good luck!
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post #4 of 12 Old 04-20-2013, 07:14 AM
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IMO the Harman-Kardon receivers have much better power supplies and amplifiers than almost all of the competition. They can supply the peak current that speakers need without distortion. Most of the competition can't.

If I was recommending to a friend I would say that the Harman-Kardon 1650 is FAR better-sounding than anything Yamaha makes at any price.

If you just want a 2-channel system, the HK 3490 is even better, for about the same price.

My first choice in speakers for $800 would be the Wharfedale Diamond 10.4 speakers.

That will give you some very good sound.
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post #5 of 12 Old 04-25-2013, 11:59 AM - Thread Starter
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Thank you guys for fast replies.
I hope I didn't make too big of a mistake buying the yamaha rx-v 475, but I got it for a great price from a "friend of a friend" ($290).
Guess it will do the job for now. I can sell it later.

Still don't know what kind of speakers to get. "CubicleCrusher" and "commsysman" you guys recomend Wharfdale which have an impedance of 6ohm and rx-v has 8ohm impedance. I don't know how much of a strain will that be on a receiver (if any for a 2.1 system), but all the articles I've read about all of this mention to match the impedance.

Should I do all this research about all this how will it sound, or just go and buy good speakers? I'm not sure if the difference in sound quality will be that noticeable.

Anyone knows a good HiFi shop in Chicago area so I can hear the speakers?

Thank you guys for the help.
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post #6 of 12 Old 04-25-2013, 12:22 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bstep View Post

Thank you guys for fast replies.
I hope I didn't make too big of a mistake buying the yamaha rx-v 475, but I got it for a great price from a "friend of a friend" ($290).
Guess it will do the job for now. I can sell it later.

Still don't know what kind of speakers to get. "CubicleCrusher" and "commsysman" you guys recomend Wharfdale which have an impedance of 6ohm and rx-v has 8ohm impedance. I don't know how much of a strain will that be on a receiver (if any for a 2.1 system), but all the articles I've read about all of this mention to match the impedance.

Should I do all this research about all this how will it sound, or just go and buy good speakers? I'm not sure if the difference in sound quality will be that noticeable.

Anyone knows a good HiFi shop in Chicago area so I can hear the speakers?

Thank you guys for the help.

Since speaker sound quality is so strongly influenced by the room they are in, the value of auditioning speakers at dealers showrooms is questionable.
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post #7 of 12 Old 04-25-2013, 01:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by arnyk View Post

Quote:
Originally Posted by bstep View Post

Thank you guys for fast replies.
I hope I didn't make too big of a mistake buying the yamaha rx-v 475, but I got it for a great price from a "friend of a friend" ($290).
Guess it will do the job for now. I can sell it later.

Still don't know what kind of speakers to get. "CubicleCrusher" and "commsysman" you guys recomend Wharfdale which have an impedance of 6ohm and rx-v has 8ohm impedance. I don't know how much of a strain will that be on a receiver (if any for a 2.1 system), but all the articles I've read about all of this mention to match the impedance.

Should I do all this research about all this how will it sound, or just go and buy good speakers? I'm not sure if the difference in sound quality will be that noticeable.

Anyone knows a good HiFi shop in Chicago area so I can hear the speakers?

Thank you guys for the help.

Since speaker sound quality is so strongly influenced by the room they are in, the value of auditioning speakers at dealers showrooms is questionable.

Not questionable, just not very effective for a listener who can recognize some of the subtle differences. For someone who is new to auditioning speakers, though, auditioning can be very effective at weeding out the overpriced, underperforming models (like Bose). The difference between a small speaker (one with 3" "woofers" ) and a good one (with 6" or larger woofers) is quite obvious, too. If you've never compared them, though, you might not realize what you're missing.

Selden
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post #8 of 12 Old 04-26-2013, 10:35 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bstep View Post

... you guys recomend Wharfdale which have an impedance of 6ohm and rx-v has 8ohm impedance. I don't know how much of a strain will that be on a receiver (if any for a 2.1 system), but all the articles I've read about all of this mention to match the impedance.

Okay, so, I looked into this ohm-matching thing too but what I found was that the difference between a 6ohm speaker and an 8ohm reciever was nominal (no pun intended). My Marantz is rated at 8, but the Wharfes pull 6 - and I didn't let that stop me. wink.gif

The ohm rating is a result of the design, and as long as you are not trying to push 4ohm speakers with an 8ohm amp/receiver then you should be okay (and if you have a good quality amp/reciever you could still be alright). The risk, as I understand it, is in overheating your amp.

Tube amps are more sensitive to this than solid-state amps, from what I've gleaned. But I came to the conclusion that the difference between 6ohm speakers and a good 8ohm amp is nothing to worry about. The ohm-rating is a bit of a game as ohms fluctuate anyway.

I guess, in the end, I put a bit of trust in brands that I felt are of good-quality and didn't worry about the numbers all lining up.

Are you finding any 8ohm speakers that you like? I think Infinity makes some and that's a well respected brand (as far as I'm concerned).

P.S. - The Monitor BX2 bookshelf speakers are 8ohms - that would be tempting to me as they were a close runner-up to my Wharfes anyway.
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post #9 of 12 Old 05-01-2013, 11:52 AM
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I'm getting ready to pull the trigger thanks to you guys but wanted to get some advise. I have a focal 800v cc, and 2 706v for fronts and two 106 customs for surrounds. I've narrowed down to the pioneer 1522-k or denon 3313 what do u guys think?
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post #10 of 12 Old 05-01-2013, 02:28 PM
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Rafa,

Denon's AVR 3313 has Audyssey XT, which equalizes all speakers over their full frequency ranges. Pioneer's MCACC does not equalize the lowest frequencies or the subwoofer. (But separate subwoofer equalization devices are available from other companies.) If you can delay your purchase for a month or so, you might want to consider Denon's recently announced X4000 receiver. It replaces the 3313 at a comparable price and should be available soon. It includes the highest grade of Audyssey, XT 32. Of course, pricing for the now discontinued 3313 is decreasing, too.

Don't forget that to get the best pricing you have to call an authorized dealer on the phone (or visit in person). Denon's authorized dealers are only allowed to publicize MSRP, and Denon is extremely reluctant to honor the warranty if a receiver is purchased from an unauthorized dealer.

Selden
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post #11 of 12 Old 05-01-2013, 03:12 PM
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Thank you for your advise the reason I was leaning to the 3313 was 699 price tag I'm just wonder what the price for the 4000 is going to be
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post #12 of 12 Old 05-01-2013, 06:20 PM
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Unless you need the additional power, the Denon AVR-2113 recommended above is quite a nice receiver for $400. I would consider the 3313 over the 2113 only if you want HDMI matrix switching. You can use this thread to read up on the difference in the Denon xx13 models.

Retail price of the X4000 is $500 more than the 3313. I'm not sure where Seldon shops but if you can get an X4000 at the same price as the 3313 buy two and send me one smile.gif You aren't going to find the X4000 for less than $1300 for awhile.

Electronics Expo is great for negotiating a good deal, and I've never had a problem with buying from accessories4less for refurbished products. The difference is full warranty vs. 1 year.

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