How you guys achieve a 4th order high pass filter? - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 12 Old 07-24-2013, 06:28 PM - Thread Starter
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What I mean is 99% of receivers use a 4th order low pass for the sub but a 2nd order high pass for the other channels so unless you have sealed speakers with an f3 close to your crossover point most of us have too much bass in our system. Aside from running separates I haven't found any receivers that allow you to run variable crossover slopes so just curious is there any other way of achieving a 4th order high pass? Are most people just not worried about this?
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post #2 of 12 Old 07-24-2013, 06:53 PM
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Great post! But I have no answer for ya.

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post #3 of 12 Old 07-25-2013, 01:30 AM
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I have been using JRiver 18's DSP room correction feature to get 24dB/octave high pass for my speakers and output as 2.1 over HDMI and disable the AVR's bass management and play the channels straight through.

Plus I also found I needed to use port plugs on the speakers if I was using the AVR's 12dB/octave high pass.
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post #4 of 12 Old 07-25-2013, 04:04 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by aarons915 View Post

What I mean is 99% of receivers use a 4th order low pass for the sub but a 2nd order high pass for the other channels so unless you have sealed speakers with an f3 close to your crossover point most of us have too much bass in our system.

Many of us have an effective system integration methodology in our AVRs such as Audyssey, MCACC, YPAO, or other stand alone system equalizer (MiniDSP, Behringer, DSP in the power amp, etc.).
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Aside from running separates I haven't found any receivers that allow you to run variable crossover slopes so just curious is there any other way of achieving a 4th order high pass? Are most people just not worried about this?

At this point it seems difficult to buy an AVR that lacks Audyssey, MCACC, YPAO or one of the lesser-used alternatives.
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post #5 of 12 Old 07-25-2013, 04:17 AM
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Originally Posted by arnyk View Post

At this point it seems difficult to buy an AVR that lacks Audyssey, MCACC, YPAO or one of the lesser-used alternatives.

My Yamaha AVR only offers 12dB/octave high pass. I wanted to try a steeper slope on the speakers.
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post #6 of 12 Old 07-25-2013, 05:05 AM - Thread Starter
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In regards to Odyssey, or any other room correction, does it specifically allow you to set your crossover slopes to 4th order or just EQ the response? I don't really like the idea of just EQ'ing it out, I'd rather have a solid starting point and then work from there.
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post #7 of 12 Old 07-25-2013, 07:25 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by kiwi2 View Post

I have been using JRiver 18's DSP room correction feature to get 24dB/octave high pass for my speakers and output as 2.1 over HDMI and disable the AVR's bass management and play the channels straight through.

Plus I also found I needed to use port plugs on the speakers if I was using the AVR's 12dB/octave high pass.

So wait a sec, maybe this is an easy solution as I'm mostly worried about music. So you can set your Jriver device to output in 2.1 so that your mains are high passed at 80hz 4th order and it still sends a signal to the sub? So basically my AVR would be set to direct and it would still get the high passed signal to the mains and a signal to the sub? That would be all I need I think if that works.
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post #8 of 12 Old 07-25-2013, 08:13 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by aarons915 View Post

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Originally Posted by kiwi2 View Post

I have been using JRiver 18's DSP room correction feature to get 24dB/octave high pass for my speakers and output as 2.1 over HDMI and disable the AVR's bass management and play the channels straight through.

Plus I also found I needed to use port plugs on the speakers if I was using the AVR's 12dB/octave high pass.

So wait a sec, maybe this is an easy solution as I'm mostly worried about music. So you can set your Jriver device to output in 2.1 so that your mains are high passed at 80hz 4th order and it still sends a signal to the sub? So basically my AVR would be set to direct and it would still get the high passed signal to the mains and a signal to the sub? That would be all I need I think if that works.

Usually setting an AVR to direct disables bass management. Check your user's manual. If so, you can probably get what you want by avoiding direct mode which generally has no other audible side-effects.
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post #9 of 12 Old 07-25-2013, 08:15 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by aarons915 View Post

In regards to Odyssey, or any other room correction, does it specifically allow you to set your crossover slopes to 4th order or just EQ the response? I don't really like the idea of just EQ'ing it out, I'd rather have a solid starting point and then work from there.

Audessey will automatically set crossover points, but it may be possible to override it. The same may apply to the slopes.

Just for grins try reading the user's manual. ;-) If you lost it, it is probably easily downloadable from the manufacturer's site.
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post #10 of 12 Old 07-25-2013, 08:25 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by arnyk View Post

Usually setting an AVR to direct disables bass management. Check your user's manual. If so, you can probably get what you want by avoiding direct mode which generally has no other audible side-effects.

Except then I'm back to where I started which is 2nd order high pass slopes that I'm trying to avoid lol...

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Audessey will automatically set crossover points, but it may be possible to override it. The same may apply to the slopes.

Just for grins try reading the user's manual. ;-) If you lost it, it is probably easily downloadable from the manufacturer's site.

I don't have Audyssey on my receiver but the way I understand it is it sets the crossover points based on the in room response but you're still limited to what's built into the receiver so it won't do what I need.
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post #11 of 12 Old 07-25-2013, 09:55 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by aarons915 View Post

So wait a sec, maybe this is an easy solution as I'm mostly worried about music. So you can set your Jriver device to output in 2.1 so that your mains are high passed at 80hz 4th order and it still sends a signal to the sub? So basically my AVR would be set to direct and it would still get the high passed signal to the mains and a signal to the sub? That would be all I need I think if that works.

Yep, that. I just set all speakers to large to disable the AVR's bass management. I play in 'straight' mode.
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post #12 of 12 Old 07-25-2013, 10:14 AM
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Originally Posted by arnyk View Post

Many of us have an effective system integration methodology in our AVRs such as Audyssey, MCACC, YPAO.......................
At this point it seems difficult to buy an AVR that lacks Audyssey, MCACC, YPAO..................

Very few, if any, AVRs offer or have the ability to vary their crossover filters' slopes. And most AVRs' digital crossovers apply a 12dB/octave high-pass and 24dB/octave low-pass.

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