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post #1 of 303 Old 02-03-2014, 09:47 PM - Thread Starter
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Figured I'd start a thread for those of us who are looking beyond typical canned solutions and have already begun exploring the rabbit hole of acoustic optimization.

There's a big wide world beyond any one solution or single brand's offerings, and even pigeon holing ourselves to solely one methodology, so here's a good place to discuss acoustic theories, optimization techniques, different offerings and available tech, measurement equipment and techniques etc. as diverse as (just a tiny sample of the possibilities)

- Trinnov vs Audyssey vs ARC vs Dirac, pros and cons etc.
- Todd & Welti or Geddes?
- when and where to consider diffusers?


Welcome down the rabbit hole!

At the brilliant suggestions of thread members, here are a list of informative links to provide reading material on the journey down the rabbit hole.


Audyssey FAQ Link

paper by Mathias Johansson (Dirac) on room correction, IIR vs. FIR filters: http://www.dirac.se/media/12044/on_room_correction.pdf
- Basic guide to digital filters: http://www.users.qwest.net/~volt42/cadenzarecording/Filters.pdf

Constant-Q Graphic Equalizers

Operator Adjustable Equalizers: An Overview

Exposing Equalizer Mythology

Second-Order Digital Filters Done Right

Perfect-QTM, the Next Step in Graphic EQ Design

Bandwidth in Octaves Versus Q in Bandpass Filters

Constant-Q Graphic Equalizers*

Accelerated Slope Tone Control Equalizers

Equalization Methods with True Response using Discrete Filters

and some excellent non-EQ stuff as well: http://www.rane.com/library.html

Room Correction: A Primer (written before Dirac's mixed phase approach)
Audyssey XT32 vs Parametric EQ'
Equalization kills room modes: hard proof

A quote from Toole from our Acoustic Measurement Standards white paper:
"I try to be careful to say ’at low frequencies (subwoofer region below 80 Hz) small rooms behave as minimum phase systems (as it applies to equalizing resonances).’ When pushed I go on to say that this is mostly true for resonant peaks that stand above the average spectrum level, but as that level recedes below the average spectrum level, we clearly have a "signal to noise" (minimum phase-to-non-minimum phase) problem, because there are obviously non-minimum-phase activities in the region - interference dips being an example. This is relevant because the best evidence of an audible resonance is a highly visible peak, which, if attenuated to the average spectrum level (i.e. flat) results in a severe attenuation of ringing - which is the desired situation.”

My real favorite stuff is multi-sub arrays and low frequency optimization. The amazing 'out of the box' flatness from a properly setup array is something amazing to hear. Play a swept sine through it and it's a consistent zzzzzzzzoooooooooooooooopppp from low to high with nary a wiggle or bump. Sounds POWERFUL!!
Multiple subwoofer case study: Acoustic Frontiers Demo Room
I have more case studies but haven't written them up yet.

Optimizing acoustic treatment to speaker off axis response:
Speaker directivity / off axis response: an introduction
Speaker off axis: psychoacoustic and subjective importance
Speaker off axis: an examination of the directivity characteristics of forward firing cone/dome

http://www.trinnov.com/technologies/loudspeaker-room-optimization/acoustic-correction/

Here's a couple on the website that gets into elements of the math:
http://www.trinnov.com/wp-content/uploads/downloads/AES5717_A_New_Comprehensive_Approach_of_Surround_Sound_Recording.pdf
http://www.trinnov.com/wp-content/uploads/downloads/AES6116_High_Spatial_Resolution_Multichannel_Recording.pdf

And this is I believe about their approach to remapping:
http://www.trinnov.com/wp-content/uploads/downloads/AES6375_Reproducing_Multichannel_Sound_on_any_Speaker_Layout.pdf

And here's a presentation where they talk in a bit more detail about what they're doing in less journalese terms (see from roughly page 13 on):
http://www.tonmeister.de/vdt/webdownloads/Seminare/2011/Veit_Wegmann_VDT_Abhoerraeume_elektronisch_korrigieren_Nuernberg_2011.pdf

Finally, here's an earlier version (v3.1) of the Trinnov Optimizer manual:
http://www.defitechnique.com/upload/galerie/67/Optimizer_UserGuide_v3.1_v3.pdf

Room EQ Wizard manual: section on minimum-phase behavior

NonAESAudyssey_1.zip 3635k .zip file
NonAESAudyssey_2.zip 1875k .zip file


Max
Attached Files
File Type: zip NonAESAudyssey_1.zip (3.55 MB, 47 views)
File Type: zip NonAESAudyssey_2.zip (1.83 MB, 20 views)
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post #2 of 303 Old 02-03-2014, 10:34 PM
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I would broaden these themes to include additional devices that may augment one or more of these, such as the MiniDSP varieties that can import EQ filters from REW, the Behringer FBD and its close cousins, as well as the Antimode.

Also, let's differentiate between the DSP version of Trinnov, which was in the Sherwood R-972 and is what I have, and the fully adjustable Trinnov in the pro Trinnov and ADA units.

But beyond that, great to have company! And whomever joins us should hopefully have the desire to experiment, want to measure what can be heard, and most of all...have an open mind! smile.gif
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post #3 of 303 Old 02-03-2014, 11:49 PM - Thread Starter
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Oh absolutely, that was just a small example of various potential topics. And now that you've mentioned it, one of the things that has roused my curiosity is the differences between solutions i.e. automated systems using FIR or IIR filters vs basic PEQ.

Some of us who followed the REW thread noticed that when Audyssey needs to boost a naturally occurring dip in the bass frequencies, it apparently results in an increase in the measured ringing in all the other bass frequencies as well and not just the dip frequencies.

Before Audyssey XT32, I'd sampled the original MultEQ debuted in the, at the time, top of the line Denon, but other than that, I'd always been a PEQ guy. I'm curious if PEQ boosts cause this same increased ringing anomaly?

Obviously, one of the best ways to reduce ringing is simply bass traps, but it seems to me if the signal chain is adding it, then potentially eliminating it from there makes the solution easier.


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post #4 of 303 Old 02-04-2014, 04:25 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by djbluemax1 View Post

Oh absolutely, that was just a small example of various potential topics. And now that you've mentioned it, one of the things that has roused my curiosity is the differences between solutions i.e. automated systems using FIR or IIR filters vs basic PEQ.

Some of us who followed the REW thread noticed that when Audyssey needs to boost a naturally occurring dip in the bass frequencies, it apparently results in an increase in the measured ringing in all the other bass frequencies as well and not just the dip frequencies.

Before Audyssey XT32, I'd sampled the original MultEQ debuted in the, at the time, top of the line Denon, but other than that, I'd always been a PEQ guy. I'm curious if PEQ boosts cause this same increased ringing anomaly?

Obviously, one of the best ways to reduce ringing is simply bass traps, but it seems to me if the signal chain is adding it, then potentially eliminating it from there makes the solution easier.


Max

 

IDK the technical ins-and-outs of this, but I can show you a pertinent waterfall which I made after using some judicious PEQ on top of Audyssey XT32/Pro. My room is highly treated, but awkward (small and almost square) and XT32/Pro has done the best job it can, but I always wonder if I can improve on it. I added a secondhand ($50) Behringer Feedback Destroyer and set about using it with REW's EQ feature to create the filters. REW suggested just two filters would make an improvement. Here are the before and after graphs.

 

Before (Audyssey XT32/Pro):

 

 

After (BFD using two filters):

 

 

I considered this to be a worthwhile improvement. But, to your point, consider the waterfalls and spectrograms:

 

Before:

 

 

After:

 

 

There seems to be no evidence that using PEQ to boost the dip at around 80Hz has caused an increase in ringing at any other frequencies and certainly not at around 80Hz where the boost has been applied. Similarly, flattening the response has had a small commensurate improvement in reducing ringing.  Audibly, the bass seems to be better balanced and noticeably somewhat tighter.

 

Spectrograms of the above:

 

Before:

 

 

After:

 

 

I was impressed at REW's predictive ability when using its EQ tab.

 

This is REW's prediction of the change in FR:

 

 

And this is the actual measured response:

 

 

As you can see, they are all but identical. I have experimented with adding a third filter to the two used above and this is REW's prediction of the response. A further small improvement.

 

 

These results were obtained after just one session with REW and the BFD and I am by no means any kind of expert on this. But the results achieved so far seem, to me, to have shown that a little PEQ can definitely bring about an improvement in FR and with no apparent detriment elsewhere. This has shown me the potential value of PEQ and how it can potentially improve on Audyssey XT32's automated approach. My results so far have encouraged me to consider adding some PEQ across the entire frequency range, maybe in the form of a miniDSP 10x10 or something.

 

I am not sure if this is the kind of contribution you want in your thread Max (for which I congratulate you BTW - we have long needed somewhere to air these topics in an atmosphere of learning and mutual help). But, as someone very new to this subject and very keen to learn more, it is all I have to offer ATM by way of practical results from a simple hands-on experiment. 

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post #5 of 303 Old 02-04-2014, 04:35 AM
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One thing in connection with alternative forms of REQ - I have recently been looking at Anthem's ARC and would recommend that anyone interested in seeking out an alternative to Audyssey would do well to explore ARC. ARC runs on a laptop (Like the $700 Audyssey Pro) but it comes 'free' with Anthem AVRs. Because it runs on a laptop it is freed from the constraints imposed by the limited capabilities of the AVRs DSP chip which potentially makes it more powerful of course. But it also means that ARC is way, way more flexible than Audyssey in the sense that one can freely manipulate the curve after running ARC in order, for example, to add a house curve to the user's preference. Indeed, in this respect, the 'free' ARC is far more flexible than the $700 Audyssey Pro. There is also the option of saving as many configurations as your storage allows and reloading them at will etc.

 

I am almost certain that I would have bought the latest Anthem 510 in order to see how much more ARC might do for me than XT32+Pro is currently doing, but for one thing. I run Height speakers and Anthem have foolishly (IMO) succumbed to marketing pressure and dropped Height speaker capability in favor of ..... passive biamping of the front L&R!  Yes, you read that right. They have dropped a useful feature in favor of a useless feature. Ho hum.  The earlier Anthem 500 had capabilities for Height channels, but apparently the latest version of ARC, as found in the new 510, offers worthwhile improvements, so I don't want to take a step backwards. But nor do I want to lose my height channels either, so for the time being I am remaining with XT32+Pro and PEQ as a way to seek improvements.

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Originally Posted by kbarnes701 View Post

One thing in connection with alternative forms of REQ - I have recently been looking at Anthem's ARC and would recommend that anyone interested in seeking out an alternative to Audyssey would do well to explore ARC. ARC runs on a laptop (Like the $700 Audyssey Pro) but it comes 'free' with Anthem AVRs. Because it runs on a laptop it is freed from the constraints imposed by the limited capabilities of the AVRs DSP chip which potentially makes it more powerful of course. But it also means that ARC is way, way more flexible than Audyssey in the sense that one can freely manipulate the curve after running ARC in order, for example, to add a house curve to the user's preference. Indeed, in this respect, the 'free' ARC is far more flexible than the $700 Audyssey Pro. There is also the option of saving as many configurations as your storage allows and reloading them at will etc.

I am almost certain that I would have bought the latest Anthem 510 in order to see how much more ARC might do for me than XT32+Pro is currently doing, but for one thing. I run Height speakers and Anthem have foolishly (IMO) succumbed to marketing pressure and dropped Height speaker capability in favor of ..... passive biamping of the front L&R!  Yes, you read that right. They have dropped a useful feature in favor of a useless feature. Ho hum.  The earlier Anthem 500 had capabilities for Height channels, but apparently the latest version of ARC, as found in the new 510, offers worthwhile improvements, so I don't want to take a step backwards. But nor do I want to lose my height channels either, so for the time being I am remaining with XT32+Pro and PEQ as a way to seek improvements.

Yes yes! I am currently working on acquiring one of the Anthem AVR's. ARC intrigues me, and I don't see a whole lot of the guys around here that are "professional tweakers" using it, so I want to see what it is capable of. The other option is the the MiniDSP where you can create any type of curve you want, but a built-in unit seems to simplify things one step further. With that said, I was listening to the new mains last night and have no idea why I would want to mess with what I've got, it is just wonderful.

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Has anyone run into any documentation about how ARC has changed in functionality or its treatment of REQ with the 510/710/910 series?

Stuart

 

Denon 4311 with XT32 and Audyssey Pro

Oppo 93 and 103

Panasonic VT50

Sherwood R-972 with its version of the Trinnov Optimizer

MiniDSP 10x10 HD

PSB Imagine T2, Center, and Surrounds (as of 5/2014); HSU ULS-15 subs (2)

 

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post #8 of 303 Old 02-04-2014, 10:32 AM
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Max - a suggestion would be to use the first post as a "reference library" to collect a variety of links to relevant FAQ's, cool interviews with guys like Chris K, interesting technical articles, etc.. I doubt there will be the need for a dedicated FAQ for this thread since it is so broad in scope, but as time goes on I'm sure people will post links which tend to get buried and lost as the thread grows. So keeping a consolidated running list of interesting/relevant stuff would be a good resource in post #1.

Some ideas:

- The Audyssey FAQ, MCACC FAQ, and any other similar FAQ/101 type links for REQ solutions
- This paper by Mathias Johansson (Dirac) on room correction, IIR vs. FIR filters: http://www.dirac.se/media/12044/on_room_correction.pdf
- Basic guide to digital filters: http://www.users.qwest.net/~volt42/cadenzarecording/Filters.pdf
- Useful tools like the Room Mode Calculator, etc.
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post #9 of 303 Old 02-04-2014, 10:37 AM
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Has anyone run into any documentation about how ARC has changed in functionality or its treatment of REQ with the 510/710/910 series?

 

I asked the question on the Anthem thread and received a reply. I will try to find it and post it here later.

 

Edit - yes here it is. Bob Pariseau who seems to be very knowledgable replied:

 

"^ Yes, the new units have more processing power for ARC -- closer to what's in the AVM and Statement pre-pros. This gives more flexibility in setting Crossover points, and means that ARC can correct rooms that need more help.

Also, the communication during ARC setup is via the network -- so no serial cable.
--Bob"

 

http://www.avsforum.com/t/1497598/anthem-mrx-receivers-310-510-710-owners-thread-tweaking-guide/780#post_24263806

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Quote:
Originally Posted by kbarnes701 View Post

One thing in connection with alternative forms of REQ - I have recently been looking at Anthem's ARC and would recommend that anyone interested in seeking out an alternative to Audyssey would do well to explore ARC. ARC runs on a laptop (Like the $700 Audyssey Pro) but it comes 'free' with Anthem AVRs. Because it runs on a laptop it is freed from the constraints imposed by the limited capabilities of the AVRs DSP chip which potentially makes it more powerful of course. But it also means that ARC is way, way more flexible than Audyssey in the sense that one can freely manipulate the curve after running ARC in order, for example, to add a house curve to the user's preference. Indeed, in this respect, the 'free' ARC is far more flexible than the $700 Audyssey Pro. There is also the option of saving as many configurations as your storage allows and reloading them at will etc.

I am almost certain that I would have bought the latest Anthem 510 in order to see how much more ARC might do for me than XT32+Pro is currently doing, but for one thing. I run Height speakers and Anthem have foolishly (IMO) succumbed to marketing pressure and dropped Height speaker capability in favor of ..... passive biamping of the front L&R!  Yes, you read that right. They have dropped a useful feature in favor of a useless feature. Ho hum.  The earlier Anthem 500 had capabilities for Height channels, but apparently the latest version of ARC, as found in the new 510, offers worthwhile improvements, so I don't want to take a step backwards. But nor do I want to lose my height channels either, so for the time being I am remaining with XT32+Pro and PEQ as a way to seek improvements.

Yes yes! I am currently working on acquiring one of the Anthem AVR's. ARC intrigues me, and I don't see a whole lot of the guys around here that are "professional tweakers" using it, so I want to see what it is capable of. The other option is the the MiniDSP where you can create any type of curve you want, but a built-in unit seems to simplify things one step further. With that said, I was listening to the new mains last night and have no idea why I would want to mess with what I've got, it is just wonderful.

 

The more you read about ARC the more I bet you will be intrigued by it. 

 

Info on ARC-1M as it's called in the user manual here:

 

http://www.anthemav.com/downloads/ENG-ANTHEM%20MRX%20Manual-SECURED-102313.pdf

 

Page 32 onwards.

 

Good review of the previous version of ARC here...

 

http://www.hometheaterhifi.com/audio-calibration/audio-calibration-reviews/anthem-room-correction-arc-system-part-1.html

 

Read and weep at what Audyssey users have been missing from XT32 - and Pro!  This is where Audyssey should be going with XT32 (now undeveloped for 4 years) IMO.

 

I could pick up a used 500 I bet quite reasonably now that people will be upgrading to this one. Or even a disco new model maybe. The only thing that is stopping me is the thought that I wouldn't have the latest, greatest version, and I think that would upset my OCDness.

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post #11 of 303 Old 02-04-2014, 10:39 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by batpig View Post

Max - a suggestion would be to use the first post as a "reference library" to collect a variety of links to relevant FAQ's, cool interviews with guys like Chris K, interesting technical articles, etc.. I doubt there will be the need for a dedicated FAQ for this thread since it is so broad in scope, but as time goes on I'm sure people will post links which tend to get buried and lost as the thread grows. So keeping a consolidated running list of interesting/relevant stuff would be a good resource in post #1.

Some ideas:

- The Audyssey FAQ, MCACC FAQ, and any other similar FAQ/101 type links for REQ solutions
- This paper by Mathias Johansson (Dirac) on room correction, IIR vs. FIR filters: http://www.dirac.se/media/12044/on_room_correction.pdf
- Basic guide to digital filters: http://www.users.qwest.net/~volt42/cadenzarecording/Filters.pdf
- Useful tools like the Room Mode Calculator, etc.

 

+1. Great idea. 

 

It would be neat if this thread could attract the respective 'experts' on the various room EQ systems, providing they could post in a non-biased way. Would enable subscribers to ask meaningful questions about the differences between the different REQ systems.

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post #12 of 303 Old 02-04-2014, 10:58 AM
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I'll compile the Trinnov links. BTW Trinnov (of the DSP and Pro flavors) uses IIR filters and FIR filters. The R-972 on a per channel basis uses 7 IIR filters below 300 Hz, and 1024 FIR filters above that. The sub channel is IIR only. By contrast, the Pro version allows customized selection of the number of IIR and FIR filters, use of either approach or only one, and adjustment of the frequency range that each type of filter applies to. And lots of other stuff with phase and how target curves by channel can be set. Ken (Rur) can give you some idea of what that means smile.gif.

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By contrast, the Pro version allows customized selection of the number of IIR and FIR filters, use of either approach or only one, and adjustment of the frequency range that each type of filter applies to.
Stuart, Trinnov will only select the range for IIR filters, anywhere between a low of 10Hz and high of 1kHz. FIRs are full-range, or disabled.

TacT does permit FIR filter range adjustment, though I always preferred full-range. YMMV.
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Duly noted. Next time I'll pull up the Optimizer manual online again instead of relying on memory when I'm typing on the iPad smile.gif. BTW Curt Hoyt had mentioned the FIRs being full-range as well in the R-972 in an email, but the comments on the Sherwood threads were kind of unclear if that was true.

So, for the mains, do the IIR filters below the user-defined limits (300 Hz in the R-972) operate simultaneously with the FIRs in that range when both IIR and FIR are active? IOW if I had IIR from 20 to 300 Hz on your Pro MC-8, is there BOTH IIR and FIR correction occurring in that area? I'd originally thought so but I didn't want to say so without confirming.

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Denon 4311 with XT32 and Audyssey Pro

Oppo 93 and 103

Panasonic VT50

Sherwood R-972 with its version of the Trinnov Optimizer

MiniDSP 10x10 HD

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post #17 of 303 Old 02-04-2014, 11:28 AM
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BTW Curt Hoyt had mentioned the FIRs being full-range as well ...

 

Blimey... the thread's only a day old and name-dropping has started already! LOL. JK, Stuart...

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So, for the mains, do the IIR filters below the user-defined limits (300 Hz in the R-972) operate simultaneously with the FIRs in that range when both IIR and FIR are active? IOW if I had IIR from 20 to 400 Hz, is there BOTH IIR and FIR correction occurring in that area? I'd originally thought so but I didn't want to say so without confirming.
Yup, FIRs are applied first, then IIRs.
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post #19 of 303 Old 02-04-2014, 11:36 AM
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The question of whether one should apply EQ to certain types of frequency response errors, or whether one should just leave them alone comes up a lot. This relates to the idea of minimum-phase behavior in frequency-domain measurements. There's a section of the Room EQ Wizard manual that has a very interesting discussion of this issue and an interesting proposed measurement post-processing technique that attempts to answer that question. I've linked it below.

Room EQ Wizard manual: section on minimum-phase behavior
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post #20 of 303 Old 02-04-2014, 11:36 AM
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@Rur: No wonder the mains sound so good smile.gif

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post #21 of 303 Old 02-04-2014, 11:58 AM
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post #22 of 303 Old 02-04-2014, 12:03 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by beastaudio View Post

The other option is the the MiniDSP where you can create any type of curve you want...
According to the Dirac thread in the $20k section of the forum, miniDSP should be announcing a couple of Dirac based devices in the next few weeks. I'm guessing they'll be 2-channel units, but that could make for a reasonably priced trial into higher end room correction for those with a stereo set-up.

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post #23 of 303 Old 02-04-2014, 12:14 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sdurani View Post

....but that could make for a reasonably priced trial into higher end room correction for those with a passive stereo set-up.
Fixed!wink.gif

All kidding aside, as with the Emotiva unit, much will depend on the Dirac feature set, esp. user tweak-able curve - or not.
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post #24 of 303 Old 02-04-2014, 12:25 PM
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This looks like a pretty cool place to hang out.

 

But remember, the first rule of this thread is you don't talk about this thread. ;)


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post #25 of 303 Old 02-04-2014, 12:25 PM
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Keep in mind that's a 2-in/4-out pre-amp, that can be used for 2.2-speaker layouts and 3.1-speaker layouts (the latter using Trinnov re-mapping to play back 2 channels over 3 speakers).

Trinnov is also going to be releasing "the most advanced Home Cinema AV-Preamplifier on the market", called the Altitude 32.

Altitude.jpg

ISE 2014 starts today in Amsterdam, and Trinnov has a booth there, so I hope more information is released. I'm guessing from the name that it has 32 channels of Trinnov room correction.

http://www.trinnov.com/tri_news/trinnov-at-ise-2014/

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post #26 of 303 Old 02-04-2014, 12:26 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RUR View Post

Fixed!wink.gif

All kidding aside, as with the Emotiva unit, much will depend on the Dirac feature set, esp. user tweak-able curve - or not.

Yup, we really don't know. It could be support for a plug-in accessing the Dirac Live RCS software for stereo, or for all we know a dumbed down OEM plug-in version configured for the MiniDSP board, where you'd have to run REW with downloadable EQ to adjust the target curve on top of Dirac or an either/or choice of fixed form Dirac or downloadable filters. A device like the NanoAVR would be a natural for multichannel correction because everything's in the digital domain already via HDMI. But I'd be surprised if Dirac would introduce a fully featured version of their product for the MIniDSP market that might conceivably cannibalize what they have licensed with Datasat.

OTOH their new Unity product puts them at the bleeding edge even aside from Dirac Live for the high-end market, so I could be wrong.

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post #27 of 303 Old 02-04-2014, 12:28 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sdurani View Post

Keep in mind that's a 2-in/4-out pre-amp, that can be used for 2.2-speaker layouts and 3.1-speaker layouts (the latter using Trinnov re-mapping to play back 2 channels over 3 speakers).

Trinnov is also going to be releasing "the most advanced Home Cinema AV-Preamplifier on the market", called the Altitude 32.

Altitude.jpg

ISE 2014 starts today in Amsterdam, and Trinnov has a booth there, so I hope more information is released. I'm guessing from the name that it has 32 channels of Trinnov room correction.

http://www.trinnov.com/tri_news/trinnov-at-ise-2014/

So I read, and if you're right, the price point's going to be in at least in the range of their current Magnitude 32, possibly higher. Something that makes the MCs look economical LOL....one of which is a future object of lust when I have the dedicated room to justify it.

Stop it, you're depressing me smile.gif

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Sherwood R-972 with its version of the Trinnov Optimizer

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post #28 of 303 Old 02-04-2014, 12:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sdurani View Post

According to the Dirac thread in the $20k section of the forum, miniDSP should be announcing a couple of Dirac based devices in the next few weeks. I'm guessing they'll be 2-channel units, but that could make for a reasonably priced trial into higher end room correction for those with a stereo set-up.

now that's something there biggrin.gif how exciting. With no constraints, I am terrified of all the ideas that could come of this biggrin.gif

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post #29 of 303 Old 02-04-2014, 12:34 PM
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I've already got one....hello, R-972 and MiniDSP-based Dirac working in tandem eek.gif

(although there's probably very good technical reasons why I'd never want to try this)

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Denon 4311 with XT32 and Audyssey Pro

Oppo 93 and 103

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Sherwood R-972 with its version of the Trinnov Optimizer

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post #30 of 303 Old 02-04-2014, 12:35 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sdrucker View Post

I've already got one....hello, R-972 and MiniDSP-based Dirac working in tandem eek.gif

(although there's probably very good technical reasons why I'd never want to try this)

I have it on good authority that your room will implode.
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