How to Build Your Own Home Theater - Part 1 of 4 - Page 3 - AVS Forum
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post #61 of 102 Old 08-29-2011, 09:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by erkq View Post

Huh... but it's not just about the subs... golden ratios, standing waves being the same from two directions and all that.... these ideas are outdated now?

Yup. See Ch 13 of Toole's book. Here's a teaser:
Quote:


It is difficult to understand how this concept of an optimum room got so
much traction in the field of listening room acoustics, and why it has endured.
Figure 13.6 illustrates the principles. In (a) it is shown that, even with the greatest
of determination, a listener is not likely to put ears in the ideal location,
and practical loudspeakers do not radiate all of their sound into a corner. This
means that with a loudspeaker and a listener in typical practical locations, all
of the calculated modes will not be equally audible, and any of the measures of
modal distribution will fail. In (b) there is another fatal flaw. We insist on listening
to at least two loudspeakers, if not five or more. All of the calculations
underlying the ideal dimensions come to naught.

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post #62 of 102 Old 08-30-2011, 05:40 AM
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Uhmmm, Ii think it goes without saying that we want to replicate the good theatre experience, not the crappy $1 theatre.

Your comment regarding 35mm projector is just silly

1. Most theatres now use digital projection
2. It's not about bringing the theatre Equipment home but bringing the theatre experience home

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post #63 of 102 Old 08-30-2011, 07:45 AM
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This article was not meant to be a "only one way approach" to home theater, but meant to give ideas and maybe prevent mistakes by a beginner when building a home theater. Everyone is different. That's why there are so many variations of projectors, sound systems and movie formats. I also believe that the article was discussing the use of small rooms.
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post #64 of 102 Old 08-30-2011, 08:23 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jabba359 View Post

For all those people who have "been in the game longer" than the rest of us and object to us calling our "lesser" systems and "non-dedicated" rooms home theaters, maybe you should take a look at your system and see if you actually meet the criteria. Does your "home theater" have:

1) 35mm film projector?
2) sticky floors with popcorn spilled everywhere?
3) the annoying kids who talk and text throughout the movie?
4) someone to take tickets at the door when you enter?
5) a projectionist to run your films from a dedicated booth?
6) flat, scope, and academy lenses with mattes for other ratios (not some stupid anamorphic adapter that slides in front of a lens, deteriorating picture quality)?

..........


Hehehe........I was thinking the same thing. For me my "theater experience" at home is better than at a "real theater" for some of the reasons you mentioned above. The only advantage the "real theater" has over mine is screen size.

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post #65 of 102 Old 08-30-2011, 10:50 AM
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Originally Posted by Saturn94 View Post

The only advantage the "real theater" has over mine is screen size.

And if you sit at 1sw, your screen is plenty big. I sit 10' back from a 10' wide screen for 2.35 material. It's a little overwhelming for 16:9 material, though, so I move back to the second row for that.
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post #66 of 102 Old 08-30-2011, 10:51 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by megalen View Post

This article was not meant to be a "only one way approach" to home theater, but meant to give ideas and maybe prevent mistakes by a beginner when building a home theater.

Mistakes... you mean like light-colored walls? THOSE types of mistakes?
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post #67 of 102 Old 08-31-2011, 06:05 AM
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Originally Posted by mikeyinokc View Post

A Ferrari is an automobile. A Volkswagon is an automobile. They are both automobiles, but what a difference in style and performance.

Bottom line, the guy with the HTIB setup and the LCD TV does have a home theater. Just a big difference in style and performance with the guy that spent $50,000 on equipment and room decor.


Thats right. And the equivalent of the commercial theater would be a bus. I wouldn't want a bus just like I don't want my "home theater" to be like a commercial theater. And although a Ferrari is a nice car, it is mostly for showing off, and I wouldn't pay that amount of money just for show off purposes.

When buying a car you choose one that fits your needs and budget and you do the same when creating a "home theater". It is not useful to tell people that they need certain things in order to qualify for a mere title - "Home Theater". What is useful is to help people get the best experience for their needs within their budget.

For me going to a projector with a screen had a vast positive impact on the way I experience movies. My projector is some years old now and I would really like to upgrade to one with higher contrast. On the other hand my relatively cheap KEF satellite speakers and sub are perfectly fine for me. I never felt the need for something better and listening to speakers of much higher price didn't make me feel that I want to spend that amount of money to get what for me was only marginally better.
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post #68 of 102 Old 08-31-2011, 09:33 AM
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Originally Posted by Zoom123 View Post
I never felt the need for something better and listening to speakers of much higher price didn't make me feel that I want to spend that amount of money to get what for me was only marginally better.
An IB sub with 8 AE IB-15 woofers is not just "marginally better" than your KEF sub. I do get the point you are trying to make... but I mean... really...

BTW, I love KEF speakers... one of my all time faves... up there with Dynaudio (what I have).
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post #69 of 102 Old 08-31-2011, 10:14 AM
 
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Originally Posted by thxman View Post
If you drove out of your way to see a home for sale that advertised a large home theater and when you arrived, it was the living room with a big screen, would you be disappointed?
This is the key to what a Home Theater is. When you hear the term, what do you envision in your mind? I would say most people envision a dedicated space with a riser for each successive row of seating, a projector, surround sound, etc.
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post #70 of 102 Old 08-31-2011, 10:32 AM
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Originally Posted by cybrsage View Post
This is the key to what a Home Theater is. When you hear the term, what do you envision in your mind? I would say most people envision a dedicated space with a riser for each successive row of seating, a projector, surround sound, etc.
It makes me think of a room with a banging sound system with a projector or very large screen tv. Nothing else.
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post #71 of 102 Old 08-31-2011, 10:35 AM
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Originally Posted by JukeBox360 View Post
It makes me think of a room with a banging sound system with a projector or very large screen tv. Nothing else.
So... it could be a bedroom then?
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post #72 of 102 Old 08-31-2011, 10:38 AM
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Originally Posted by erkq View Post
So... it could be a bedroom then?
Sure. Bedroom/living room. Living room would make more sense but it defiantly doesn't have to be a "dedicated" room at all.
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post #73 of 102 Old 08-31-2011, 11:04 AM
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Woot! I found my dvi>15 pin connecter from my old Power Mac. I'm going to get a dvi>hdmi and see if it works with my brother's In Focus projector. If it does we have the making of a real low budget home theater.

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post #74 of 102 Old 08-31-2011, 05:46 PM
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You guys can call your "true home theaters" what ever you want. Though, I believe that the description "true home theater" is a little misleading in the first place and is causing much confusion. The majority of the people here that claim that their setup is a "true home theater" are logically attempting to replicate a theater itself, and not just for the experience.

In my room I use a 22" HD Monitor with a TV Tuner, a PC streaming 5.1 PCM audio to my Yamaha RX-V663 with Polk Audio 2xM40, 2xM30s, CS1, & a JBL PS-1200W. When all of this hardware processes a movie in 1080p with DTS-HD Master Audio or Dolby TrueHD it sounds better and is a better experience than any movie "theater" that I've been in. That being said, it would be silly for me to consider my setup a "home theater".

I am not trying to replicate a theater or create a "true home theater" in any way. What I did try to do was create a higher quality sound experience for which I have succeeded to my taste. For me, that is a "true accomplishment". I would rather watch movies on my setup than to attend any "true theater" any day! That is all that matters to me and I am happy.
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post #75 of 102 Old 08-31-2011, 08:34 PM
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^^^
most sensible, logical and factual post on this thread. Kudos!!

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post #76 of 102 Old 09-01-2011, 03:00 PM
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So if I have a 20" CRT with an old dolby receiver in a dedicated room, does that make it a home theater? Or if I have a 70" projector with 5.1 surround sound but somebody else has a 120" projector with 7.1 surround sound both in dedicated rooms, does that not make mine a home theater since the other person has a bigger setup? How can any Home Theater compare with a properly setup commercial theater with stadium seating, 40' wide screen, 20'+ ceilings, multiple speakers arrayed around a large space?

A home theater is just a place in your house where you have a nice TV and some sort of surround system that you enjoy watching movies in. Yes, some are better and more expensive than others but they are all home theaters, just at different levels.
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post #77 of 102 Old 09-01-2011, 03:09 PM
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The post above shows the misunderstanding of screen size. It's not the screen size that matters. It's the screen size vs viewing distance ratio that matters.

Yes you can't have 370" screen, but then again you don't watch is from 60ft away. But if you have 10ft screen viewed from 10ft away than visually you'll have the same theater experience as in the commercial theatres.

A person with 50" TV viewed from 7ft away will have a more theatrical experience than someone with a 65" TV viewed from 14ft away.

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post #78 of 102 Old 09-01-2011, 03:12 PM
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Would love to go back to the mid '80s where people with a 27" TV with a surround set up (including myself) calling their set up as "home theatre". Did I enjoyed my set up back then? Yes! Did I call it a home theatre? No! Why? Because it's just NOT a home theatre!

ahhh the simple times.

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post #79 of 102 Old 09-02-2011, 03:22 AM
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Seems like semantics are causing problems...

"Home Theater" means different things to different people obviously.

Not many can afford a home (with dedicated square footage) to have the "true" Home Theater, complete with the uber expensive equipment.

I think that most people would call any area that incorporates a big screen TV and (at least) a 5.1 surround system their home theater. Sorry if this offends some but their reality is not mine or yours.

It's the experience people want to replicate in the home... not the equipment, not the screen size, and not the dimensions.

Can this experience be possible without a huge screen and projector?
Does a 5.1 system convey the experience, or is 7.1/2 or 11.3 necessary?
Opinions will vary... but that's life!

For me I want to be emersed in the movie in my downstairs family room, just like at the theater. I have a 54" LED TV with a 7.2 AVR that will do height/wide/rear. I have that emersion into the movies I watch.

Do I have a home theater? Many may say no, others will say absolutely! All I know is with the limits of the space I have, I have done the best I could to get that experience, and I am very pleased with the results!

If you are happy with your results you have acheived in replicating that experience, then I would say that qualifies as your "home theater".
Too bad if others would disagree or are insulted at such a thought.

And just to be perfectly clear, I do not call it a "home theater"... it's the TV room... with a kick ass picture and sound system! (Kinda hard to imagine "Spongebob Squarepants" or the evening news as home theater material!)
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post #80 of 102 Old 09-05-2011, 10:41 PM
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It's interesting that people who, more than likely, are better off than others, with their dedicated "true" home theaters; would actually be insulted if people with less means(see: the majority) called their rooms a home theater. As if us lesser people aren't deserving of the title, which is only reserved for the proper class.

I'd suggest you actually read what your writing and see how ridiculous you all are being. Allow others to have their fun too. Are BMW M3s, Ferraris, Porches, etc the only cars allowed to be called sport cars?

Personally, I've always called my dedicated room either a game room or an entertainment room. But I think my simple room with a couch, TV and 5.1 will be called a Home Theater from this day forth.

Snobs.
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post #81 of 102 Old 09-05-2011, 11:13 PM
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Originally Posted by kryloc View Post

Snobs.

Nobody resorted to name calling until you came along. Thanks so much for your valuable contribution to the discussion. BTW, I have a full home theater with 10' screen and tiered seating. But you almost certainly make more money than I. It's not about being a snob or being in the "proper class". It's about priorities. There are many things I do without... like a wife and kids.
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post #82 of 102 Old 09-06-2011, 04:48 AM
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Money has nothing to do in terms of building home theatre and entertainment system. I know of many people whose ONE speaker cost more than my entire home theatre yet they opt to take the entertainment room route.

Funny enough, most of these type of people I know never call their system as Home Theatre because they realize what is a true definition of Home Theatre is.

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post #83 of 102 Old 09-06-2011, 12:00 PM
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Originally Posted by erkq View Post


Nobody resorted to name calling until you came along. Thanks so much for your valuable contribution to the discussion. BTW, I have a full home theater with 10' screen and tiered seating. But you almost certainly make more money than I. It's not about being a snob or being in the "proper class". It's about priorities. There are many things I do without... like a wife and kids.

So true. So true.
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post #84 of 102 Old 09-06-2011, 02:04 PM
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Quite an interesting thread to follow. I see that Part 2 is up. I'll have to go read that.
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Originally Posted by thxman View Post

If you drove out of your way to see a home for sale that advertised a large home theater and when you arrived, it was the living room with a big screen, would you be disappointed?

I think that's an excellent yardstick to determine what a "Home Theater" is.

In my family room I have a 52" LCD and 5.1 audio. I don't consider it a Home Theater. Downstairs I have a projector (92" @ 1.78, 117" @ 2.40) and 5.1 in a dedicated room. Everyone that has seen the downstairs room (that didn't come to watch a movie, for example the HVAC repairman, or parents coming to pick up their kids in the next room), have said "Nice Theater". No one said that about our Family Room.

I think it's a matter of presentation, not of price or size.
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post #85 of 102 Old 09-06-2011, 02:29 PM
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+1

Within any conversation that ends up with me showing the pic of my HT, 100%, without exception, people will say "oh, you have a REAL home theatre"... And these are NOT A/V enthusiasts. So even the non enthusiasts differentiate between the "so-called home theatre" vs the "true home theatre.

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post #86 of 102 Old 09-07-2011, 10:14 AM
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I would have to say that the theater experience trumps equipment/materials in this debate. And since everyone's home theater experience is entirely subjective, that's a likely reason why a man who has surpassed the specs of an IMAX theatre in his own home won't ever convince a kid living in his parents' basement that his 40-incher, HTIB, and parents' old living room sectional couch isn't a "home theater". When his buddies (or girlfriend) come over and watch a movie, and the lights are out, it's a theater-like experience for them. I doubt any in attendance leave the basement thinking, "gee, that movie would've been great if only he had tiered seating, a subterranean basement, and a front projection screen". Of course, it wouldn't hurt to have a setup like David Susilo or some of the other posters above, and one day I look forward to progressing to that level. However, for now, I thoroughly enjoy movies on my puny 47-incher, 6.1, single couch system, complete with self-repleneshing Juicy Juice stains thanks to my four year old. Hey, that last "feature" counts towards having a true theater, doesn't it? Kudos to all who have contributed to this discussion in a positive way that encourages sharing of ideas and opinions without condescension and insults. PS - Love the use of red, white, and blue, Mr. Susilo.
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post #87 of 102 Old 09-07-2011, 04:37 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by erkq View Post

Nobody resorted to name calling until you came along. Thanks so much for your valuable contribution to the discussion. BTW, I have a full home theater with 10' screen and tiered seating. But you almost certainly make more money than I. It's not about being a snob or being in the "proper class". It's about priorities. There are many things I do without... like a wife and kids.

You welcome. It has nothing to do with priorities. The point is that Home Theater is a vague term that defines a theater(or movie watching) experience for the user at Home. When others actually get offended when someone calls their room a Home Theater when it doesn't live up to "their opinion" of what a Home theater should be, that is the issue.


But hey, if it makes you and others feel better to say that you have a real home theater and others don't. More power to ya. I'll be enjoying my Home Theater now.
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post #88 of 102 Old 09-07-2011, 04:49 PM
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if it makes you and others feel better to say that you have a real home theater and others don't. More power to ya.

You are putting words in my mouth. I never said this.
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post #89 of 102 Old 09-07-2011, 05:02 PM
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Being brought up in the '70s and '80s, the time when the term "home theatre" starting to become popular, "Home Theatre" can only mean "a theatre... but at home". It's the English language, pure and simple.

The dilution of the term "Home Theatre" start to happen around 1997 during the introduction of the DVD format where companies (Kenwood, to be exact) start with an entry level Home Theatre in a Box (nobody ever used this term before Kenwood) package.

This results in more and more companies diluting the terms "Home Theatre" even further, down to the $59 so-called "HTiB" that includes a DVD player, 5 single-driver plastic-enclosure speakers and a fist-size "subwoofer" that doesn't even go lower than 80 Hz.

So the general meaning of Home Theatre becomes a "free-for-all" term.

Some people with old-school approach call their 100" Sim2 with 2-channel Wilson Audio system in their dedicated corner (not room) as their entertainment system, while some people with new-school approach call their 19" HDTV with the $59 WalMart HTiB set up as their "home theatre". NOTHING wrong with either approach in terms of "you enjoy whatever you want to enjoy". Often times when I'm not in the mood, I prefer my 50" plasma, BD player and sound coming from its own puny crud-tastic speakers over my dedicated room. However, what one enjoys does not change the fact that "Home Theatre" should always be a "theatre... but at home"

Another example, I drive a 2011 VW GTI 2-door with Stage 1 upgrade. Do I love my car? yes! Does it make my car a "sports car"? heck no! Can I call my car a "sports car" of course, it's my right to call it whatever I want... but still it is NOT THE CORRECT TERM because that car is NOT a "sports car"

but hey, English is my second language, so I try to adhere to the actual meaning of the words/terms, not the generalization of said words/terms.

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post #90 of 102 Old 09-28-2011, 06:07 AM
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Well, I have real home theater...
It's 7.1 Dolby Digital surround sound...
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