URC MX-880 Unbelievable!!! - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 99 Old 09-12-2008, 03:37 PM - Thread Starter
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post #2 of 99 Old 09-12-2008, 04:41 PM
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Did you try the link at the bottom of this page?
http://www.universalremote.com/pro/
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post #3 of 99 Old 09-12-2008, 04:54 PM
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"I spent weeks researching top-end home theater remotes"

I think "researching" is a bit of a stretch. I am sure you will get the software unless it becomes apparent your dealer sold you stuff in an unauthorized manner.

This bloody Redcoat said I was a terrorist.

Somewhere along the way I become an Elitist who looks down on the
cheap bastards who call themselves my AV Hobbyist peers.
I am not prepared.
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post #4 of 99 Old 09-12-2008, 04:55 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HD_or_Bust View Post


I have been a computer systems administrator for over 20 years and have faced increasing tendency in software manufacturers to have rampant paranoia in regards to piracy. I can understand that, but this simply makes no sense! Who would buy a PC without software available? I simply cannot fathom the corporate decision process which would lead to such exclusivity. If I am forced to return these with no other option I will be extremely angry and frustrated. I have an impressive home theater setup and am proud that I have done it all myself. Who are they to deny me the best option in remotes which URC themselves created?!?

Simply unbelievable!

I made sure my dealer would give me the software for my MX-980 in advance.
I know these remotes are intended to be programmed by the dealers and URC doesn't want to have to deal with consummers directly if they can't program their remotes.

If you can't get the software from your dealer, I would return them and try and find a different dealer. I understand URCs policy on this but I wish they had a way for D.I.Y. people to buy these remotes with the condition they will not get any support from URC except for in the case of a defective remote.
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post #5 of 99 Old 09-12-2008, 07:02 PM - Thread Starter
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post #6 of 99 Old 09-12-2008, 08:31 PM
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If you go to Remote Central you will find a thread in the URC section on the software policy, I knew what to look for going in because of this thread and I asked for the software up front.

I am the kind of guy who likes to do everything myself, I don't trust anyone to do even minor repairs anymore, my feeling is too many people have a who gives a crap attitude when working on other peoples stuff, for me setting things up is half the fun.
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post #7 of 99 Old 09-13-2008, 01:54 AM
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Go return it.
This is not as dramatic as you are making it.

This bloody Redcoat said I was a terrorist.

Somewhere along the way I become an Elitist who looks down on the
cheap bastards who call themselves my AV Hobbyist peers.
I am not prepared.
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post #8 of 99 Old 09-13-2008, 04:48 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thomasv555 View Post

go return it.
This is not as dramatic as you are making it.

+1

"People are very open-minded about new things -- as long as they're exactly like the old ones"
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post #9 of 99 Old 09-13-2008, 08:06 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ThomasV555 View Post

Go return it.
This is not as dramatic as you are making it.

I think you guys caused him to delete his posts, I guess he was not feeling the love. I'm a custom installer, and personally I understand his anger/frustration. If the facts are indeed as presented, since he purchased it through an authorized dealer, it seems to me the very height of absurdity that he gets it home and discovers he cannot program it. Why did the dealer even sell it to him if they will not provide him the software???

I don't use URC much so I am not up to date on this issue but I was under the impression that after a lot of outrage over this issue after URC stopped allowing the software to be downloaded from their site, that URC partially reversed course and changed their policy to allow a customer to have the software or download it provided they could prove they purchased through an authorized dealer. Perhaps I am wrong. If the poster is still around and wants me to check, I will find out for him.
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post #10 of 99 Old 09-14-2008, 05:42 AM
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If the OP is still around, I have some info. you might be interested in.

HD_or_Bust...R U there?

"People are very open-minded about new things -- as long as they're exactly like the old ones"
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post #11 of 99 Old 09-16-2008, 08:45 AM
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To the OP, if you spent so much time researching remotes, then it should have been quite clear what the URC policy was regarding software for the 980.

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post #12 of 99 Old 09-16-2008, 09:17 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sailn View Post

To the OP, if you spent so much time researching remotes, then it should have been quite clear what the URC policy was regarding software for the 980.

First of all, if he can't get the software, then he (anyone) should not even be able to purchase the remote themselves through an authorized dealer. IMO it should not be up to him to research this to discover that. Let me give an example. Many companies require some type of certification training to purchase their products (I'm talking as a dealer). So if I want to but a digital PBX telephone system from Panasonic and resell it, I have to have a dealer certification # to purchase it. So it's impossible for me to discover after the fact that I will not be able to gain access to tech support without it. Similarly, authorized dealers should not be selling these in the first place if the purchaser cannot get the software. Unauthorized dealers are another issue, there's never much a manufacturer can do to stop them.

Regardless, it does not seem quite clear to me even as an integrator what their policy is. Here is the main page on the "pro" remotes:

http://www.universalremote.com/pro/

First they say this:
Quote:


All of the devices we advertise here in the Professional section of this website are designed to be programmed and installed by experienced custom installation professionals.

But then they say this:
Quote:


Consumers and End-Users Seeking Software
Please contact your place of purchase to obtain programming support, software and manuals. If your dealer is unable to help you, you may download the appropriate programming software here.Note: that you will be required to register your serial number and place of purchase.

To me, that is "quite clear" that they are telling consumers they will be able to obtain the software. IF they in fact cannot, the website is horribly misleading.
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post #13 of 99 Old 09-16-2008, 09:35 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by QQQ View Post

First of all, if he can't get the software, then he (anyone) should not even be able to purchase the remote themselves through an authorized dealer. IMO it should not be up to him to research this to discover that.

Let me disagree, if I may. My company is an authorized URC dealer, yet we can often find the remotes cheaper online than we can purchase them through distribution. The reason being that some larger company's buy so much that they are more than happy to make five points, where the distributors usually make ten points.

I do agree that whomever sold the remote, should have clearly stated this is not for consumer purchase.

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post #14 of 99 Old 09-16-2008, 09:43 AM
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CL, I really don't see that your comment contradicts mine, it seems that we agree. Again, if URC has this policy, than part of the policy should be that an authorized dealer should not sell the remotes to anyone without warning that someone that they must be a dealer to access the software. Or if they are going to sell it (without programming it) they should have to provide the software to the end user. I am still unsure of the actually policy at this time as URC has I think done some waffling on the issue, and the website quote I posted seems to suggest they were letting customers download the software who had purchased through an authorized dealer.

I think I will see come clarification from URC on this just tio satisfy my curiosity.
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post #15 of 99 Old 09-16-2008, 10:07 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by QQQ View Post

CL, I really don't see that your comment contradicts mine, it seems that we agree. Again, if URC has this policy, than part of the policy should be that an authorized dealer should not sell the remotes to anyone without warning that someone that they must be a dealer to access the software. Or if they are going to sell it (without programming it) they should have to provide the software to the end user. I am still unsure of the actually policy at this time as URC has I think done some waffling on the issue, and the website quote I posted seems to suggest they were letting customers download the software who had purchased through an authorized dealer.

I think I will see come clarification from URC on this just tio satisfy my curiosity.

You're right. I probably shouldn't have wrote "disagree" but instead "further clarification".

The problem with URC is they do not enforce their own policies and the consumer gets hurt.

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post #16 of 99 Old 09-16-2008, 12:35 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sailn View Post

To the OP, if you spent so much time researching remotes, then it should have been quite clear what the URC policy was regarding software for the 980.


The problem is that URC dosn't seem to know what their policy is, read page 4 at the bottom of the MX-980 guide and it tells you, you can download the software from URC. It also recommends you have a professional program it, it does not say you must have a professional program it.
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post #17 of 99 Old 09-16-2008, 08:57 PM
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Where did you research it?

There are many threads on avs and remotecentral which state that you can not get the software from URC. If you went to the URC website, you would see the following:

"Consumers and End-Users Seeking Software
Please contact your place of purchase to obtain programming support, software and manuals. If your dealer is unable to help you, you may download the appropriate programming software here.Note: that you will be required to register your serial number and place of purchase.

If you follow the link provided, the MX980 is not on the list of software which you can donwload.

I am a URC dealer, and would not have sold the remote unprogrammed, nor would I give you the software, as URC claims that:

"Please note that all URC software is protected by copyright laws. Do not sell, give away or otherwise distribute URC software by any means without express permission. Universal Remote Control, Inc. does vigorously defend copyrights and trademarks."

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post #18 of 99 Old 09-16-2008, 10:19 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sailn View Post

Where did you research it?

There are many threads on avs and remotecentral which state that you can not get the software from URC. If you went to the URC website, you would see the following:

"Consumers and End-Users Seeking Software
Please contact your place of purchase to obtain programming support, software and manuals. If your dealer is unable to help you, you may download the appropriate programming software here.Note: that you will be required to register your serial number and place of purchase.

If you follow the link provided, the MX980 is not on the list of software which you can donwload.

I am a URC dealer, and would not have sold the remote unprogrammed, nor would I give you the software, as URC claims that:

"Please note that all URC software is protected by copyright laws. Do not sell, give away or otherwise distribute URC software by any means without express permission. Universal Remote Control, Inc. does vigorously defend copyrights and trademarks."


You have actually contradicted yourself all in one statement URC says see your dealer then you follow up with they dont want you to sell it blah blah blah... We are dealers as well... if you came to my store I would program the remote for them, give them the software if asked(as it is posted on the site that you can get it from your dealer) and if they screw it up I would send them the file again and tell them to keep at. Its called customer service, besides if you're any good they'll call you for any changes anyway. God forbid they find out you gave the software to someone... by the way anyone who wants the software can just call a distributor and they'll give you a password to the site and you can download anything you want

"I'm just a dog chasing cars. I wouldn't know what to do with one if I caught it"
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post #19 of 99 Old 09-17-2008, 08:13 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sailn View Post

I am a URC dealer, and would not have sold the remote unprogrammed, nor would I give you the software, as URC claims that:

"Please note that all URC software is protected by copyright laws. Do not sell, give away or otherwise distribute URC software by any means without express permission. Universal Remote Control, Inc. does vigorously defend copyrights and trademarks."


While you have the right to refuse to sell the remote unprogrammed and also the right to not give the customer the software, I as an end user also would not buy from you. You could have sold the remote and made a profit for doing nothing more than making a sale, instead you get nothing.

Luckily for me there are dealers out there that are willing to sell the remote to D.I.Y. types and give them the software, those are the types of dealers that will get my repeat business.
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post #20 of 99 Old 09-17-2008, 10:06 AM
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I am only refering to the 980 software. I have discussed this with URC many times. I think it is a stupid policy, but it is THEIR software, and THEIR license, so I deal with it. In truth, I don't care for the 980 and have avoided selling them or programing them as much as possible. The price of a 980/260 is close to that of a 810/msc-400; which is much more powerful.

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post #21 of 99 Old 09-17-2008, 05:34 PM
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I like my MX-980 but after looking into the MSC-400 I wish I would have bought it instead of a MRF-350.

I think the MX-810 is ugly but it makes sense to run all the logic in the MSC-400 and use a cheaper remote to trigger everything.
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post #22 of 99 Old 09-17-2008, 06:30 PM
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I'll chime in here for no good reason.

I can live with URC's software policy as I used to have a dealer that would sell me a remote and give me the software.

However, URC institued this new 200 mile rule so my old dealer that I had purchased 4 remotes from, was no longer able to sell to me. So my last one shipped to my "brother" within the 200 miles, but hence he moved so I can't get a new 880 as I have no one within the 200 miles to ship it to.

Now here is the kicker, if I go to URC's web page and go under the "Professional" line of remotes to the dealer locator and put in my state, it provides no listings but a link to "Authorized Online Dealers", none of which can sell me a remote or those such as ABT and B&H who will sell it, but not provide software.

In the end, I will get what I want which is an 880 with software.

Does anyone know if the Complete Control Suite will update itself with the 880 software?

Please do not send me PM's asking for software! You will not get it.
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post #23 of 99 Old 09-18-2008, 05:32 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sailn View Post

The price of a 980/260 is close to that of a 810/msc-400; which is much more powerful.

I don't want to take over this thread by going to a completely different topic, but how many 810's have you programmed? After we did our 2nd one we switched back to the older 850. One issue, I'd like to know how you program for, is when someone chooses an Activity we could not open the Device page. What we ended up doing was creating an Activity Page identical to the Device page, but no matter how many times we copied the IR codes from Device to Activity we couldn't get the punchthrough's to work - until we physically learned them for that specific activity.

Obviously the msc-400 takes care of any of those issues related to the RF but that's usually too expensive an option for our under $10k theaters.

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post #24 of 99 Old 09-18-2008, 09:17 AM
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That is the problem with the 810, you can not assign page jumps to a macro. It is a PITA, and I have had to do what you have done; move all the necessary device buttons into the active activity page.

The 880 should solve these problems as it is similar to the 900 which can do exactly what you want.

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post #25 of 99 Old 09-18-2008, 09:44 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WayneDB123 View Post

I like my MX-980 but after looking into the MSC-400 I wish I would have bought it instead of a MRF-350.

I think the MX-810 is ugly but it makes sense to run all the logic in the MSC-400 and use a cheaper remote to trigger everything.

Ok, I happen to like the 810. For me it is easier to use all the soft buttons with one hand; maybe I have short fingers.

The msc-400 is the only reason we still use URC; we use it on every job. I have built custom serial interfaces for it. The only thing it is really missing is a clock.

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post #26 of 99 Old 10-18-2008, 08:52 PM
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WayneDB123,

I was looking at the mx-880 and mrf-350 combination. Why do you wish you had gone with the msc-400? What does it do in your set up that the mrf-350 doesn't?
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post #27 of 99 Old 10-18-2008, 10:41 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by golfshore View Post

WayneDB123,

I was looking at the mx-880 and mrf-350 combination. Why do you wish you had gone with the msc-400? What does it do in your set up that the mrf-350 doesn't?

RS-232 for one thing, I also like the idea of being able to use power sensors on IR controlled equipment to be sure of power status.
http://www.universalremote.com/resou...20brochure.pdf
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post #28 of 99 Old 10-19-2008, 06:48 PM
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Don't buy anything from URC.

They screwed their end-users before, when they pulled their software without warning, after having it available on their site as a download to entice end-users to purchase the hardware. Plus, URC's database is pathetic, compared to Harmony's (I have both.)

I personally would never recommend URC, nor would I ever buy one of their products.
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post #29 of 99 Old 10-19-2008, 11:31 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ryan1 View Post

Don't buy anything from URC.

They screwed their end-users before, when they pulled their software without warning, after having it available on their site as a download to entice end-users to purchase the hardware. Plus, URC's database is pathetic, compared to Harmony's (I have both.)

I personally would never recommend URC, nor would I ever buy one of their products.

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post #30 of 99 Old 10-20-2008, 12:44 AM
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Seriously... lol.
A thousand words saved.
Haha.. I feel so immature.

This bloody Redcoat said I was a terrorist.

Somewhere along the way I become an Elitist who looks down on the
cheap bastards who call themselves my AV Hobbyist peers.
I am not prepared.
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