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post #121 of 1454 Old 01-01-2012, 04:46 AM
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Originally Posted by UKenGB View Post

The other problem is that the blaster devices are almost 3 times the price of the Global Cache units used by Roomie and iRule.

Sort of true. If one only needs an IR blaster and can use IP for everything else, than the RedEye Pro is more expensive than the iTach products. If one needs IR (with 3 or fewer steerable outputs), a serial port and a contact closure, things are closer in price. A Redeye Pro has 2 serial ports, 8 IR blaster ports (which double as sensor inputs), and 4 contact closures. If one needed 2 serial ports, 1 contract closure, 2 IR ports and 2 sensors, the Roomie solution would cost more. Unfortunately for Thinkflood, the more common case is 1 serial port, 1 (or even no) contact closure and 1 IR port which leaves them more expensive, especially if all devices running Roomie are on a single iTunes account.

So for smaller configurations, Roomie is certainly cheaper, for larger ones, it is likely to be similar in price (and might even be more expensive). The model where there is a charge for the app is great for a dedicated iPad/iPod Touch, but becomes an issue if one wants one's friends to be able to use their own devices ("sure you can use your iPhone, it will cost you $30").

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Also, RedEye has variables, so you can store state information. So the current state of the system is known, i.e. what is the power status of each device and what inputs are selected. IOW, just like the Harmony remotes. AFAICT, neither Roomie or iRule do any such thing and having messed with Prontos for years, it's a backward step losing that smartness of the Harmonies.

Server-based shared state is an absolute requirement for me.

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Speaking of which, DemoPad needs an actual application in order to set it up and that app is Windows only. So you need Windows to configure an app for your Apple iOS devices. Ha, rules that out for me even though I could run Windows if I wanted - which I don't.

I agree - having a Mac OS X or iOS application for configuration is also a requirement for me.
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post #122 of 1454 Old 01-01-2012, 04:59 AM
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Originally Posted by bucket23 View Post

Majortom,
I have three ipod touches, two iphones and two ipads, all with the one paid app from roomie.

All of your devices are on 1 iTunes account. In my household, I have at least 4 iTunes accounts, not counting visitors for whom it would be nice to allow them to use their own devices.

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Each ir bud on the global cache are individually controlled so I can have xbox 1 off ir 1 and xbox 2 off ir 2.

Should have been more clear, if one needs more than 3 IR ports or sensors.
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post #123 of 1454 Old 01-01-2012, 05:41 AM
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Originally Posted by Geordie View Post


I would like to know the answer to this too. Anybody?

I have 2 iOS devices connected, if someone tells me how to test for this I am more than happy to do so.

Re: TiVo question, I think both users can control, since roomie app is sending the same signal/command, just from a different device. TiVo doesn't know it's from two different apps/devices.

Really loving the apps after 1 day. I am controlling the master bedroom and living room with the app, all devices ir (only 1 ip device, and it doesn't support power on over ip, pioneer 1021). The real test will be tomorrow, to see if the wife can use it on her iPhone, while I am in Taipei for a week.

In really wish you could set up dvr recordings from the guide on the app, that would be huge.
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post #124 of 1454 Old 01-01-2012, 07:41 AM
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I am using Roomie and quite like it. But I haven't "deployed" it in our new house yet as I'm still waiting for some additional hardware. In our old house, I used iRule.

Using either of those products, you can definitely run into problems with ip control and multiple users, if the ip controllable device only allows one session for control (which is quite often the case). In that case, you need to set up a type of proxy server in front of the ip controllable device. A simple way of doing this is with a Digi PortServer box, with a hard wired connection between two of the ports (with one port acting as a client to an ip controllable device and the other acting as a server for iRule or Roomie clients). Search the iRule thread for more info on the PortServer and this type of setup - PortServers can be had for about $40 used on eBay and are fantastic devices for RS232 control and for setting up the type of proxy described above.
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post #125 of 1454 Old 01-01-2012, 07:55 AM
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The problem of state was always a big issue for the Prontos and I'm not sure if ANY of the current apparently high end products apart from RedEye have addressed this at all. Some developers simply seem to assume that all AV equipment has discreet codes for everything which is far from being anywhere near true and about as stupid as the manufacturers of the AV equipment not providing discrete codes for everything in the first place.

I am pleased to hear that Roomie now stores power on/off state information, I'm not sure that iRule can do this at all. I wouldn't mind having to code it myself using variables, but to not even provide that is unforgivable. However, it appears that even Roomie doesn't store state info for cyclic/toggle commands like Inputs are on many devices. I have several TVs and an amp that requires repeated pressing of one button to select the required input. In truth, the Harmony remotes handle it rather well, but how does Roomie and/or iRule handle that over IR? If they cannot, then that's incredibly disappointing as that means NO progress has been made since the first Prontos oh so many years ago.

How does anyone else handle cyclic commands (sometimes referred to as toggle commands with more than 2 options)?

Then there's the question of synchronicity between multiple remotes. RedEye have that completely nailed, but none of the others have that full capability. But what can they provide in this regard? That's what we need to know. To test this with 2 remotes, use one to start an activity that includes a device that only uses a toggle on/off. Then see what the second remote displays. Has it also 'entered' that activity (as would RedEye)? Probably not, so enter that same activity. Does the device with the toggle power command now turn off by mistake? Or does this second remote somehow KNOW that the device is already on and hence not issue the toggle power command again. This would be good to know.

Regarding pricing, this is a really thorny issue for me since the Global Cache iTach units are TWICE THE PRICE over here in the UK. Roomie sells the IP2IR for $89 which is about £57 (GBP) here. The price to purchase that same device over here ranges from £110 to £180. That's why we Brits are always moaning about prices:-(

So over here, that makes the iTach units closer to the price of the RedEye blasters. But you cannot avoid the fact that the latter is proprietary hardware, whereas with the former there are at least 3 entirely independent systems that utilise the same hardware.

So is the RedEye Pro the answer? Not really for me since there would need to be physical cables from that to each room you needed to control and part of the value of using IP to distribute the control is that it uses the existing network infrastructure, either wired or wireless. Also the Pro unit is so expensive that if you needed more than one then the overall cost is then far exceeding the other options.

I'll be honest, I'm having a tough time deciding between Roomie, iRule and RedEye as they each have their own unique strengths. The first 2 have an advantage though in that with the same hardware, I can switch between them until I find which works better for me. With RedEye, once I have their hardware, I'm stuck with their software and nice though their total synchronisation capability is, I think I can live without it, although I would understand it being vital for some users.

So, I think I need to figure out how to use cyclic IR commands with iRule and/or Roomie and find out where to get more reasonably priced iTach hardware here in the UK. Anyone any suggestions.

One final question. As any user of a Sky set top box knows, this unit can receive commands on its second RF port. It is apparently quite easy to convert from IR. So, I'm thinking it ought to be possible to take the output of an iTach and plug it into the Sky box's RF2 port for great control without needing any actual blaster. OK, still no feedback like with serial or IP control, but still better than blasting IR across the room.

Has anyone done this or got any information about doing it?

Any news on whether Sky will introduce IP control into their Sky boxes that have an ethernet port (all current ones)?
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post #126 of 1454 Old 01-01-2012, 12:46 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JustBusiness View Post

Re: TiVo question, I think both users can control, since roomie app is sending the same signal/command, just from a different device. TiVo doesn't know it's from two different apps/devices.

It "knows" because they have different ip addresses. TiVo boxes can only maintain one ip connection at a time.
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post #127 of 1454 Old 01-01-2012, 01:15 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by majortom View Post

It "knows" because they have different ip addresses. TiVo boxes can only maintain one ip connection at a time.

understood...im not using ip control at all.


I am having some trouble with the Volume Up sticking for my Pioneer VSX-21THX.
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post #128 of 1454 Old 01-01-2012, 02:40 PM
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Majortom,
I have four different itunes accounts.
Also, the itach has three ir ports, however you can by dual emitters to make 6 ir buds or you can use an ir blaster to control more devices. The global cache GC100-12 has 6 IR outputs, 6 contact closures and 2 x serial for about $230.
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post #129 of 1454 Old 01-01-2012, 05:53 PM
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Originally Posted by JustBusiness View Post

understood...im not using ip control at all.


I am having some trouble with the Volume Up sticking for my Pioneer VSX-21THX.

Really having some trouble with volume up sticking on both Pioneer VSX-21 and VSX-1021, over ir control (two different rooms). The volume controls the appropriate receiver, but volum up sticks (especially often when sent from the cable remote screen, Motorola QIP 7216).
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post #130 of 1454 Old 01-02-2012, 12:28 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by UKenGB View Post

So, I think I need to figure out how to use cyclic IR commands with iRule and/or Roomie and find out where to get more reasonably priced iTach hardware here in the UK. Anyone any suggestions.

IP2IR in Belgium: 92 + VAT
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post #131 of 1454 Old 01-03-2012, 12:18 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bucket23 View Post

Majortom,
I have three ipod touches, two iphones and two ipads, all with the one paid app from roomie. Each ir bud on the global cache are individually controlled so I can have xbox 1 off ir 1 and xbox 2 off ir 2.

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Originally Posted by bucket23 View Post

Majortom,
I have four different itunes accounts.

How do you have 4 accounts and 7 devices with a single paid app without violating the license?


Quote:


Also, the itach has three ir ports, however you can by dual emitters to make 6 ir buds or you can use an ir blaster to control more devices.

Dual emitters preclude addressing the IR.


Quote:


The global cache GC100-12 has 6 IR outputs, 6 contact closures and 2 x serial for about $230.

The GC100 can only maintain 1 IP connection, which makes it problematic to use in a situation with multiple devices that need to use it.
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post #132 of 1454 Old 01-03-2012, 03:18 AM
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I just purchased Roomie to try. I have been using iRule.

Can anybody point me to the 'instruction manual' or tutorials? Apart from a couple of brief video overviews I can't find anything else?!
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post #133 of 1454 Old 01-03-2012, 08:59 AM
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Can Roomie (or iRule) control the PS3 or Apple TV via ethernet? Thanks
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post #134 of 1454 Old 01-03-2012, 11:23 AM
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AppleTV2 is closed to the general public -- IR command set only. AppleTV1 (hacked) can be controlled according to others -- search threads to see if this might be applicable to your situation.

Regards, Mark
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post #135 of 1454 Old 01-03-2012, 04:22 PM
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Majortom, you seem to have an issue with Roomie. I was just giving you some info.
If you don't like it, thats cool, but you don't have to post rebuttles on every bit of info I supply.

I have both Irule and Roomie. Both have their advantages and disadvantages.
Just choose the program thats right for you and be happy.
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post #136 of 1454 Old 01-03-2012, 06:05 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bucket23 View Post

Majortom, you seem to have an issue with Roomie. I was just giving you some info.

I have no issues with Roomie other than the technical ones I have posted. I asked for clarification on something you said because I am quite curious about it. From what I can see, the biggest disadvantage of Thinkflood's Redeye Pro is its price. If one has a single iOS device, controlling exclusively IP-based devices, Roomie is by far the best choice from what I have seen. The further one gets from that situation the less clear the choice becomes.

You first stated that you had 7 devices using a single paid copy of the app, and then stated that your devices were spread over 4 iTunes accounts. One thing that raises the price for Roomie users is the requirement to purchase copies of the application for every iTunes account. Your posts, taken together, indicate that you did not need to do that (one paid copy, four accounts), which leaves me curious how you do that. If there is some mechanism that allows this, it greatly reduces the cost of Roomie for situations like mine - something that would make it much more appealing.

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If you don't like it, thats cool, but you don't have to post rebuttles on every bit of info I supply.

I post responses to clarify technical issues to make sure that people reading these posts can decide with complete information. Again, if one has a single iOS device acting as a remote, the Global Cache GC-100 is a great, inexpensive option (I currently own 4 of them). The single connection is, however, a serious limitation and one about which readers here should know.

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I have both Irule and Roomie. Both have their advantages and disadvantages. Just choose the program thats right for you and be happy.

Actually, since none of these systems currently meet my needs well, my goal is to provide as much feedback to their creators as I can, in the hopes that one will solve the remainder of my concerns and make my choice easy.

Roomie is quite close to what I want, as is Redeye Pro, but neither has solved all the issues that are critical to me.

I first posted on this issue in May (See Stateful iOS remote - Harmony 890 Pro Replacement), and while we are getting closer, we are not there yet.
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post #137 of 1454 Old 01-04-2012, 02:43 AM
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I am running the latest beta build of roomie. Anyone know how to add a command to a button from another remote to a current activity. Example, I have watch TV activity and pioneer receiver controls cound and Directv controls channels. DTV remote is selected for the activity but I want to be able to change the surround mode. When I try to add a button the commands listed to add are only thr Directv commands. Thanks for any help you guys can provide.
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post #138 of 1454 Old 01-04-2012, 03:05 AM
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In relation to the different itunes accounts and devices, your itunes account is not locked to any particular device. You add apps via the device by using many different itunes accounts. There is no eula breaking or anything like that. It is a common set up.
Your apple device is only locked to one user for syncing and is not locked to just one itunes account.

My kids have itunes accounts with no credit card details (don't want them running up bills). When they want to purchase a paid app they have to come to me and then I use my itunes account to purchase the app. The only other way would be for me to link a credit card or itunes voucher to their account which I would not do.

The gotcha with using multiple itunes accounts is that everytime an app needs updating the apple device will prompt for the different itunes accounts.

For my setup I have three itachs (one in each room) and just the one GC100 for the Theatre room. If you buy one itach IR and one itach RS232 it is cheaper than the one GC100 and you can have multiple people connecting to the itachs.

I would guess that most people who would invest in a GC100 would need it in a home theatre room for the serial control and then most likely you don't want multiple peolple messing around with the controls. Only one master, me.

The stateful info for me is only an issue for those devices that don't have individual commands, ie separate on and a separate off. The other issue that you always have with knowing state is that somewhere along the lines someone will turn a device on without using the remote and then the whole activities set up needs updating.
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post #139 of 1454 Old 01-04-2012, 06:06 AM
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Regarding the system 'state', RedEye has that covered better than any other, simply because EVERY (RedEye) remote is always aware of what EVERY other remote has done, even if you used a Mac/PC to cause the change of state. This is because of the client-server design of RedEye. All remotes will update almost simultaneously to whatever any other remote does. Of course, if the state is changed by any other method, i.e. a different type of remote and/or manually, then it is all out of sync, but only one RedEye remote needs to be made correct and they all are. Once RedEye has full RS232 and IP control with feedback, then it'll be hard to beat. But...

Not everything is RS232 and/or IP controllable. Far from it. Too far IMO. Also, RS232 control is based around the RedEye Pro which is a rack mount style box with multiple RS232 and IR ports. But IMO one central controller that contains the RS232 and IR connections is not the best way forward. It's been hard enough feeding all the wires around the house, first for TV, then satellite feeds and finally ethernet. But the latter provides the means to carry all the additional info we now need, so there should be no more additional wires. Now we start seeing these highly specced systems that use a central box which needs more wires throughout the house (for serial and IR control). This is nonsense.

What we really need is a central control server, much like RedEye uses, housed centrally, but which provides no physical connection to anything - except the network of course. This is the 'hub' that keeps all it's remotes in sync. Then, there are external IP to RS232 and IR adapters, like e.g. the iTach units and these then get distributed around the house to take the commands from the central server, but without the addition of any more wiring.

This server would be best implemented in Linux (as is RedEye), available in a self-contained box that you simply connect to the network, with an HTTP interface to allow all setup and configuration of the remotes to be done from a browser. Also sold (cheaper) as software only to be installed and run on any Linux based PC or Mac OSX since the code could be almost identical for those 2 platforms. And if you were feeling really masochistic, offer a Windows version too.

We shouldn't have to choose between easy setup and full control. Why can we not have easy setup, but then those 'default' solutions can be edited and modded to suit. Or left entirely as suggested if that is acceptable for the user. So, quick to get started, but without the limitations that usually means.

IOW, rather like a Roomie/iRule/RedEye hybrid. It should provide the quick setup abilities of Roomie, but with the additional configurability of iRule and with the scriptability, 'state' awareness and central server architecture of RedEye. It cannot completely solve the state problem for IR controlled devices, but it would be as good as it is possible to obtain.

OK, that's what I want. Who's gonna see the light and produce it?
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post #140 of 1454 Old 01-04-2012, 01:06 PM
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I am trying to get roomie on another IOS device (ipod touch) but when I search for yhe app in the itunes store it looks like it is going to charge me another 9.99. I have signed in to the store with the same acct I purchased with but it comes up "$9.99" then when I press "buy Now" it tries to verify my acct. I hit cancel at that point. Can anyone tell me if this is normal and itunes does NOT charge twice ?
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post #141 of 1454 Old 01-05-2012, 01:06 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tmanbt View Post

I am trying to get roomie on another IOS device (ipod touch) but when I search for yhe app in the itunes store it looks like it is going to charge me another 9.99. I have signed in to the store with the same acct I purchased with but it comes up "$9.99" then when I press "buy Now" it tries to verify my acct. I hit cancel at that point. Can anyone tell me if this is normal and itunes does NOT charge twice ?

iTunes certainly does NOT charge the same account twice for the same app. If it seems to be doing that, there is a problem somewhere.

For some reason it thinks the app has not yet been purchased for that account. Have a look at the purchased list for that account and see if it's there. Also, 'Get Info' on the app in iTunes. That will show you which account was used to purchase the app so you can see if you're trying to use the wrong account.

These problems usually occur when the wrong account is being used.
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post #142 of 1454 Old 01-05-2012, 03:29 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tmanbt View Post

I am trying to get roomie on another IOS device (ipod touch) but when I search for yhe app in the itunes store it looks like it is going to charge me another 9.99. I have signed in to the store with the same acct I purchased with but it comes up "$9.99" then when I press "buy Now" it tries to verify my acct. I hit cancel at that point. Can anyone tell me if this is normal and itunes does NOT charge twice ?

No you shouldn't get charged twice on the same itunes account.
I just set up 2 ipod touches and 1 iphone. Purchased the app once, the home theater pack once and the IR control pack once and used dropbox to transfer all the settings from the first set up ipod touch.
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post #143 of 1454 Old 01-05-2012, 03:31 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tmanbt View Post

I am trying to get roomie on another IOS device (ipod touch) but when I search for yhe app in the itunes store it looks like it is going to charge me another 9.99. I have signed in to the store with the same acct I purchased with but it comes up "$9.99" then when I press "buy Now" it tries to verify my acct. I hit cancel at that point. Can anyone tell me if this is normal and itunes does NOT charge twice ?

Go to your account in the app store. Then click on previous purchases. There should be an icon for you to download Roomie again assuming you are using the same account. Then in Roomie, if you have any in-app purchases, there is a button to restore them.
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post #144 of 1454 Old 01-05-2012, 09:36 AM
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I purchased Roomie Remote the other day, along with the Home Theater and IR options. I already had an IP2IR installed.

I got more done in a couple of hours than I did with several days of screwing-around with iRule. (But that's easy, because all I ever accomplished with iRule was to turn a light on and off...) Within a couple of hours, I had a complete and very usable "TV" activity. Really, all I need to do now is add a "Bluray" activity.

It looks very promising, but here are the current serious issues:

- If the app is closed for any reason (which could simply be because you switched to another app which needed memory) and in some other circumstances (which I've yet to determine) you need to re-enter the activity. That is, it doesn't seem to remember the current activity. This can have annoying side-effects. You should be able to enter an activity without performing any commands.

- Although the current version is stated to preserve state, it doesn't seem to preserve state of power toggles. (&^%$! Scientific-Atlanta cable box!). I'm not concerned about multiple remotes - I only need one. It certainly should be able to remember state of a power toggle given that constraint.

- Many edit changes don't seem to take effect until you fully close (from the task bar) and re-open the app.

- Something is wacky with the "ENTER" command for the Scientific-Atlanta boxes. The ENTER command used as part of a channel change from the program guide as well as the ENTER button on the virtual remote apparently send the wrong code, which seems to be the FORMAT command. So, initially, I had to always hit EXIT after changing channels. I changed to the 0XX format, which doesn't send ENTER, but that only works for me because the 2-digit channels in my area are all SD and I don't use them. The 0XX format doesn't actually work on Scientific Atlanta boxes. But ENTER is optional. i.e. to change to channel 10, it's just 1 0. To change to channel 1002 it's 1 0 0 2.
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post #145 of 1454 Old 01-05-2012, 03:52 PM
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anyone know if they have any sort of official support forum? i used their email support and asked some questions about other support options and forums and whatnot and never heard back, this was a few weeks ago. i have emailed them about other things in the past and they are pretty quick.
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post #146 of 1454 Old 01-06-2012, 01:37 PM
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They are usually pretty quick to respond to email. Did you try posting question to Facebook page for Roomie?
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post #147 of 1454 Old 01-06-2012, 10:04 PM
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I downloaded the Roomie app and literally within 5 minutes had 2-way IP-based control of my Denon AVR 4810CI. I'm pretty impressed with that! I haven't done much additional fiddling with it, but I do have a few questions:
  • I did not see a button on the Denon Roomie remote that allowed me to select some of the enhanced surround modes, such as Pro-Logic Iix Cinema, or Dolby Digital EX. The "Standard" option within the "Mode" button seems like where it should be, yet pressing this button repeatedly does not toggle to any additional modes. Any Denon owners know where, in the Roomie remote, I can find this option?

  • The navigation commands (cursor left/right/up/down, & enter) did not seem to work at all. I brought up the Setup Menu and tried to scroll around, but was unable to do so.

  • I currently use a Universal Remote Control MX-810, along with two Universal Remote MRF-350 IR distribution blocks. I have a number of IR emitters going out of the IR outputs on the two MRF-350s to their source devices. I'd prefer to leave all of this as-is and use it in conjunction with one of the IR-based Global Cache products. Is it possible to connect an IR emitter cord from a Global Cache device IR output to one of the MRF-350 inputs, and distribute the IR signals to the devices? If so, do I need the GC-CGX IR Converter Cable to do so, or can I use a standard IR emitter wire for this purpose? I'm concerned about "frying" either the Global Cache device or the MRF-350 if an incorrect cable is used.

  • If I need the GC-CGX cable, can it be used with any Global Cache product that has an IR output? Will it work with the iTach and GC product lines?

  • If I don't need the GC-CGX, are there any limitations on which Global Cache devices will work in conjunction with the MRF-350s?

Thanks in advance for the help. This app holds a ton of promise and I'm looking forward to further exploration. I still can't get over how easy setup was.

Regards,

Scott

Thanks,

Scott
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post #148 of 1454 Old 01-07-2012, 07:04 AM
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anyone able to launch the apple remote app within rookie? i am able to get it to load the webpage separately but the "load within rookie" url doesn't work.

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post #149 of 1454 Old 01-07-2012, 08:36 AM
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Quote:
Although the current version is stated to preserve state, it doesn't seem to preserve state of power toggles. (&^%$! Scientific-Atlanta cable box!)

In case you're interested, I have an SA 8300HD, and a work-around for System ON / OFF is to use 0's - you can config the box to turn on when a channel is entered if it is off, so, you can send a [ZERO][ENTER] and it will turn on if it's off, and do nothing if on. To guarantee it gets turned off, send a [ZERO][ENTER][POWER TOGGLE].

Quote:
The ENTER command used as part of a channel change from the program guide as well as the ENTER button on the virtual remote apparently send the wrong code, which seems to be the FORMAT command.

Yeah, they need to fix this - I send the developers a note but nothing yet - I'll try again. It's CURSOR ENTER they need mapped as ENTER. The good thing about this is that I didn't know about the FORMAT command, and now I can get rid of black bars on top and/or bottom - and it seems to stick for each channel individually!

David
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post #150 of 1454 Old 01-07-2012, 10:23 AM
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Originally Posted by Anthony A. View Post

anyone able to launch the apple remote app within rookie? i am able to get it to load the webpage separately but the "load within rookie" url doesn't work.

I use "Open URL in Safari" with "remote://" as the URL and it works fine (apart from doing it too early, while roomie is still supposed to set up the devices).
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