Interesting Kickstarter - NEEO - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #1 of 114 Old 01-15-2015, 10:19 AM - Thread Starter
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Interesting Kickstarter - NEEO

Just came across this and backed it. https://www.kickstarter.com/projects...hinking-remote

I've been unhappy with Harmony remotes in the past. I've been kicking around the idea of an iRule for about a year now, but I still like the idea of having a remote instead of an iPod or iPhone. I might still wind up doing an iRule system, but this intrigued me enough to give it a shot.

It's like a Harmony remote with 100x better design (I'm kind of a freak about design).

We'll see. Curious what others think.
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post #2 of 114 Old 01-15-2015, 11:13 AM
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That does look nice. I'd like to buy one also.
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post #3 of 114 Old 01-16-2015, 10:21 AM
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Even less buttons then the Harmony's? = pass. Not even "remotely" interested.


I'll say this once. If I wanted to use a @#$@$# touch screen, I'd use my phone.
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post #4 of 114 Old 01-16-2015, 12:36 PM
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It looks interesting, but its ease of use and success all depends on the underlying software and UI. I absolutely love my Harmony 880, and can't see how I can use a remote that doesn't have a large number of discrete buttons I can assign commands to.

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post #5 of 114 Old 01-17-2015, 09:05 AM
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I like that you have a remote with a separate brain/IR blaster and the idea of scrolling touch screen. Most of my AV equipment is tucked away so I hope to be able to use the Neeo to control my TV (on/off/input) selection while still being able to control the tucked away equipment. We'll see. Currently I have to try and aim at my remote IR receiver and I am not always so lucky. It works but it can take several attempts. Since the brain receives commands via 6LowPAN (wireless format) (I think I heard that mentioned) from the remote it looks that I don't have to aim directly at the brain. Its an interesting project.
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post #6 of 114 Old 01-17-2015, 11:14 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pkeegan View Post
I like that you have a remote with a separate brain/IR blaster and the idea of scrolling touch screen. Most of my AV equipment is tucked away so I hope to be able to use the Neeo to control my TV (on/off/input) selection while still being able to control the tucked away equipment. We'll see. Currently I have to try and aim at my remote IR receiver and I am not always so lucky. It works but it can take several attempts. Since the brain receives commands via 6LowPAN (wireless format) (I think I heard that mentioned) from the remote it looks that I don't have to aim directly at the brain. Its an interesting project.
Any rf remote will do that. Whats interesting is it looks like it might mirror your screen as I can see them scrolling through movies?
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post #7 of 114 Old 01-19-2015, 10:37 AM
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Looks really cool!
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post #8 of 114 Old 01-19-2015, 02:10 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thrillcat View Post
Just came across this and backed it. https://www.kickstarter.com/projects...hinking-remote

I've been unhappy with Harmony remotes in the past. I've been kicking around the idea of an iRule for about a year now, but I still like the idea of having a remote instead of an iPod or iPhone. I might still wind up doing an iRule system, but this intrigued me enough to give it a shot.

It's like a Harmony remote with 100x better design (I'm kind of a freak about design).

We'll see. Curious what others think.
I am always searching for the "BEST" remote. NEEO looks well thought out & impressive.

I bought one and hope it's as good as it looks.

Looks like we will find out next May...

Thank you for posting this.....

Hope it doesn't wind up in my overflowing unused remote drawer
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post #9 of 114 Old 01-20-2015, 03:59 AM
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Looks nice but I don't see what that thing has over harmony ultimate home.... Harmony has touch screen, more hard buttons, same easy setup, same support for multiple device types like lights and home automation stuff....

The video just seemed odd to me as they talked like they were revamping the remote space when it looks like they are just doing what Logitech is already doing to an extent....
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post #10 of 114 Old 01-20-2015, 07:12 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by opie168 View Post
Looks nice but I don't see what that thing has over harmony ultimate home.... Harmony has touch screen, more hard buttons, same easy setup, same support for multiple device types like lights and home automation stuff....

The video just seemed odd to me as they talked like they were revamping the remote space when it looks like they are just doing what Logitech is already doing to an extent....
I'm just going to list a few associated thoughts:

• I've always thought the Harmony felt cheap and a little bit half-finished.
• I've owned a Harmony and it ended up never being used, it made some things more difficult.
• I really wanted my Harmony to be a great solution, but it never was.
• The TiVo Remote feels better than any other remote in my hand.
• I can use my TiVo Slide for 70-75% of my daily activity, but need others around for occasional functions.
• While functionally limited to the AppleTV, the remote is a fantastic design and superbly crafted.
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post #11 of 114 Old 01-20-2015, 08:25 AM
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I saw the kickstarter campaign also.

Like interesting, but how many of those campaigns actually come to fruition?
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post #12 of 114 Old 01-20-2015, 08:32 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fst96se View Post
I saw the kickstarter campaign also.

Like interesting, but how many of those campaigns actually come to fruition?
This one has already passed 10x it's goal, so it's getting funded. Currently at $509K of a $50K goal.

I love my iPhone, but it will never replace my turntable.

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post #13 of 114 Old 01-20-2015, 06:26 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thrillcat View Post
I'm just going to list a few associated thoughts:

• I've always thought the Harmony felt cheap and a little bit half-finished.
• I've owned a Harmony and it ended up never being used, it made some things more difficult.
• I really wanted my Harmony to be a great solution, but it never was.
• The TiVo Remote feels better than any other remote in my hand.
• I can use my TiVo Slide for 70-75% of my daily activity, but need others around for occasional functions.
• While functionally limited to the AppleTV, the remote is a fantastic design and superbly crafted.
I bet u have the same issue with this one then... Only difference ill see is feel between the 2... Setup wise it doesn't get any easier than harmony for integrating multiple different components and interfaces.
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post #14 of 114 Old 01-21-2015, 10:17 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thrillcat View Post
I'm just going to list a few associated thoughts:

• I've always thought the Harmony felt cheap and a little bit half-finished.
• I've owned a Harmony and it ended up never being used, it made some things more difficult.
• I really wanted my Harmony to be a great solution, but it never was.
• The TiVo Remote feels better than any other remote in my hand.
• I can use my TiVo Slide for 70-75% of my daily activity, but need others around for occasional functions.
• While functionally limited to the AppleTV, the remote is a fantastic design and superbly crafted.
  • Nobody has felt this remote
  • That seems odd. I've used Harmony, URC, and iRule and they all made things easier and I used all of them.
  • Who knows if this remote would be any better. I sure wouldn't put up my money without at least a return option or some unbiased reviews.
  • This remote is also nothing like a TiVo remote.
  • A TiVo remote is a poor universal remote. A decent universal remote solves the need to use other remotes.
  • Design is subjective, but how do you know its craftsmanship?
I guess I'm not the Kickstarter audience. I would not want to pony up my money on promises from a marketing video. I do think the Z-wave integration is interesting, but again I'd rather wait for some real world testing before saying it is a useable solution.

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post #15 of 114 Old 01-21-2015, 10:39 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bryansj View Post
  • Nobody has felt this remote
  • That seems odd. I've used Harmony, URC, and iRule and they all made things easier and I used all of them.
  • Who knows if this remote would be any better. I sure wouldn't put up my money without at least a return option or some unbiased reviews.
  • This remote is also nothing like a TiVo remote.
  • A TiVo remote is a poor universal remote. A decent universal remote solves the need to use other remotes.
  • Design is subjective, but how do you know its craftsmanship?
I guess I'm not the Kickstarter audience. I would not want to pony up my money on promises from a marketing video. I do think the Z-wave integration is interesting, but again I'd rather wait for some real world testing before saying it is a useable solution.
• True nobody has felt this remote, but based on the materials and familiarity with them I'm confident in the feel.
• Not my experience, but good for you!
• Nobody knows, you're absolutely right. I was just putting it out there for those who might want to be aware.
• I didn't say it was like a TiVo remote.
• My TiVo remote is actually fantastic for most of what I do - watching TV. One button press turns on my projector and my pre/pro and amp. I can also turn everything off with it. And of course adjust volume etc. It's when I want to watch AppleTV or PS3 that I have to have extra remotes around, even though those are usually movie-watching and involve one or two clicks at the start then nothing, they still have to be there.
• Design is definitely subjective. I'm guessing on craftsmanship. But if they're using a single piece of etched aluminum and Gorilla Glass, I'm guessing they're not going to be cheap on assembly. I'm confident it will be much better built than every Harmony I've ever picked up.

You're obviously not the Kickstarter audience. That's cool. I'm usually not, but this jumped out at me as more like an iRule system with a very well-designed physical remote instead of just an app. The price is right. The development team is very responsive on the Kickstarter site. I jumped in more because of that - I was able to post my components and they responded within an hour or so that they had all but my pre-pro in their database, and by the next day they had my pre-pro in there too.

I love my iPhone, but it will never replace my turntable.

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post #16 of 114 Old 01-21-2015, 06:14 PM
 
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Harmony, If it's not broke don't fix it!

I'm worried my trusty Harmony 1100 is getting old, and now Harmony has discontinued them.

The new flagship remote for Harmony is the "Ulitima".
The reviews on the Ultima are really terrible. Reading some of the user comments on Amazon are
just plain scary.

The Neeo team looks lean, hard working, innovative, and hungry.

I'm taking a chance that they are going to make a fantastic 21st Century remote.

Can't wait to get mine!
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post #17 of 114 Old 01-21-2015, 08:10 PM
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Originally Posted by Laredo View Post
I'm worried my trusty Harmony 1100 is getting old, and now Harmony has discontinued them.

The new flagship remote for Harmony is the "Ulitima".
The reviews on the Ultima are really terrible. Reading some of the user comments on Amazon are
just plain scary.

The Neeo team looks lean, hard working, innovative, and hungry.

I'm taking a chance that they are going to make a fantastic 21st Century remote.

Can't wait to get mine!
The complaints about the new Harmonys are the lack of buttons. This remote has even less. I broke down and reluctantly picked up the Harmony Ultimate Home to replace a failing 890 with the Best Buy trade in deal, and am glad I did. I will certainly keep an eye on this, but not really sure what its bringing new to the table. The commercial makes it sounds like they invented what Harmony has done for years. This looks like a Harmony remote made to look like an apple product...
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post #18 of 114 Old 01-21-2015, 08:33 PM
 
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Originally Posted by shamus View Post
The complaints about the new Harmonys are the lack of buttons. This remote has even less. I broke down and reluctantly picked up the Harmony Ultimate Home to replace a failing 890 with the Best Buy trade in deal, and am glad I did. I will certainly keep an eye on this, but not really sure what its bringing new to the table. The commercial makes it sounds like they invented what Harmony has done for years. This looks like a Harmony remote made to look like an apple product...
Many of the complaints about the Harmony Ultimate have to do with the transport keys above the touch screen.
Multiple users are saying this is an awkward finger stretch and the buttons should be below the touch screen.
I noticed on the Neeo it was designed that way?

Many posts about the Ultima end asking if Harmony really had anyone use one before they went into production or,
also asking who was in charge of "green lighting" it?

The Neeo is using a much higher color resolution touch screen than the Harmony Ultima.

I don't miss hard buttons at all on my current Harmony 1100.
One Rule and Android remote apps are tremendously popular.

I had a Phillips Pronto for awhile very few hard buttons, nice remote very expensive.

I have a good feeling about the Neeo, hope they get it right.
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post #19 of 114 Old 01-22-2015, 12:21 PM
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I've had a Harmony One and still use a Harmony 900, to me the bottom half of those remotes (from the channel/volume up/down) is the best layout I've ever used. If NEEO had a lower half similar to the older Harmony's with the high res capacitive touchscreen they've come up with on top, I'd be perfect. I suppose I'd even be fine cutting out the numbers, I don't use them much, but I do use them.

The ergonomics of this remote seem a bit off to me, the Harmony is rounded and fits in the palm of your hands well, the contour, this looks like a thin rectangle, I'd like to hold one before spending the money. For the price range, the lack of a backlight also hurts the product. I've backed 3 projects on kickstarter, 2 I have received my product and 1 is still currently in production, so I'm not adverse to investing if it's something I believe in.

It's nice to see more options for smart remotes, but this seems like you are loosing some features while gaining a very nice touchscreen. I think a touchscreen should be more for "functions/combos", to supplement the basic functions not to replace basic features. I've tried XBMC/WDTVLive/Roku remotes on my iPhone and def prefer the physical Harmony remote to the all touchscreen concept. In the dark or under the covers I can feel my Harmony and use it correctly, the NEEO seems like it would be a bit more difficult to use blind. I have not used the new Harmony's, their touchscreens might be improved, but my One and 900 are fickle. I don't mind the design of the new Harmony's but as others have said, the DVR controls above the touchscreen seem ridiculous. Maybe in practice it's not bad, but I don't like that implementation.

I'll drop a lot of cash for a smart remote hub that can full do IR & RF, along with bluetooth and the rest. I know companies can use proprietary RF frequencies, but if a company figures out how to make something that can truly control everything, that will get a pledge from me on kickstarter. I have a FireTV with a Flirc so I can use my Harmony, and I have a Boxee Box that I use their remote to control because I didn't buy a second Flirc. I want a unit/hub that has an internal RF to IR and RF to RF converter and when you add a device like "FireTV" it'll already have a database of frequencies required and can implement control. Or will tell you to "use" your current remote and it can scan for the RF frequency or something and mimic it. Might be impossible, not sure. The Harmony came close to replacing all my remotes, but didn't, and still doesn't, do it 100%. I don't think NEEO will either but they are heading in the right direction.
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post #20 of 114 Old 01-29-2015, 05:34 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thrillcat View Post
This one has already passed 10x it's goal, so it's getting funded. Currently at $509K of a $50K goal.
Look up Soap Home Automation. They've surpassed their goal big time once on kickstarter, another time one Indigogo and have a 3rd Indigogo campaign going. They've yet to bring any actual products to market. They even had a CES booth this year but with no actual products to demo. But the owners like posing next to their new BMWs. Point is, a campaign can be fully funded and still not deliver either via scam artists or failed business plans.

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post #21 of 114 Old 01-30-2015, 04:17 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by havok2022 View Post
Look up Soap Home Automation. They've surpassed their goal big time once on kickstarter, another time one Indigogo and have a 3rd Indigogo campaign going. They've yet to bring any actual products to market. They even had a CES booth this year but with no actual products to demo. But the owners like posing next to their new BMWs. Point is, a campaign can be fully funded and still not deliver either via scam artists or failed business plans.
Since they surpassed the funding goal of the NEEO then there shouldn't be a problem with just waiting for them to bring it to market and waiting until the initial investors churn out some feedback. I'll surely keep my money in my pocket for now.

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post #22 of 114 Old 01-30-2015, 11:37 AM
 
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Since they don't charge your credit card until it ships that doesn't worry me in the least.
If I don't like it I can always send it back call my credit card company and they will remove
the charge without a problem.

I really see very little risk here?
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post #23 of 114 Old 02-05-2015, 01:48 AM
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While I'm all for more competition in the remote space I expect this will go the way of almost every other hardware KS.

First, their production timeline seems ridiculously optimistic. One production snafu, or unexpected manufacturing issue and the entire thing will be set back. Possibly resulting in modifications, retooling and/or change of supplier. There is nearly always a production issue for gadgets on KS because the creators are not used to the process or go with lowest priced bidder. Most of them can't even deal with handling a tshirt in a timely manner for so many backers.

Then comes the software. The most simple devices on KS like Pressy have resulted in software glitches, errors, incompatibilities and general bugginess. Sure NEEO has a little iPhone demo running but what about the learning system and macros? Device customization? The thing I hate most about Harmony was their convoluted-dumb software that forced you through multiple pages to make one adjustment. How are these guys going to handle thousands of devices and millions of codes and permutations in a database?

I'll wait to see if this hits market. Based on usual timelines for hardware I expect at least a year before this is finally announced as finished and until then lots of comments from backers asking where their devices are and when they are going to fix the bugs.


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post #24 of 114 Old 02-07-2015, 11:45 AM
 
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Looks like we won't have to wait long to find out?

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post #25 of 114 Old 02-07-2015, 05:48 PM
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Cool

check this out.. you can get it from Google Play, but if your interested in becoming a beta tester shoot me an email at info@panoptic-app.com. i'm the dev, so if you don't see a driver for a device that you want to control just let me know. if i can get my hands on the protocol and a device, i can turn out a driver in a few days.

you don't need any additional hardware like controllers or hubs.

http://panoptic-app.com/
https://play.google.com/store/apps/d...m.scs.panoptic

BTW - i supported NEEO too... it looks awesome!

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post #26 of 114 Old 02-09-2015, 10:47 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Laredo View Post
Since they don't charge your credit card until it ships that doesn't worry me in the least.
If I don't like it I can always send it back call my credit card company and they will remove
the charge without a problem.

I really see very little risk here?
With Kickstarter your CC is charged if the project is funded. If you look on the page it says:

"This project will be funded on Thu, Feb 12 2015 9:32 AM EST."

Your credit card will be charged around that time, not when it ships. One of the many issues with Kickstarter is that people never receive the product ... which wouldn't make a difference if you weren't charged till something shipped.

With kickstarter they are typically using your pledge money to help with manufacturing, so in some cases you can be paying over a year if not longer before you are scheduled to receive a product. I've backed several projects but were all less than $30 each so if I got ripped off it wouldn't be too bad.
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post #27 of 114 Old 02-09-2015, 01:47 PM
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Originally Posted by opie168 View Post
I bet u have the same issue with this one then... Only difference ill see is feel between the 2... Setup wise it doesn't get any easier than harmony for integrating multiple different components and interfaces.
Are there different softwares for Logitech remotes? I have Harmony One, and setup wise it can't get any worse :P The software for programming the remote is by far the worst designed UI and user experience this side of year 2000. It inexplicably also requires internet connection, and I believe is nowadays a web app only.

It is for the painful software I don't have some of my newer devices fully configured. That alone is almost worth $250 to change remotes. Almost.

I have to say I like the minimalist design of the Neeo, and the few tactile buttons. Harmony One has way too many buttons which I never use - not really an issue in itself, but if the Neeo UI is well-designed, this could be a killer device.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Laredo View Post
Since they don't charge your credit card until it ships that doesn't worry me in the least.
If I don't like it I can always send it back call my credit card company and they will remove
the charge without a problem.

I really see very little risk here?
Confirming what essentialjpm said: you are charged the second the campaign ends. You will get charged even if the product is never delivered, and you have practically zero chance of recovering your pledge. Since it is likely to take months for the remote to arrive, your chances of disputing the charge might be limited or non-existent, depending on your CC provider policies on grace periods.

Out of 34 project I've backed one was a no-show and the creators just disappeared and stopped communicating, and KS wouldn't do anything. Fortunately it was only around $30, but frustrating nevertheless. Another one was delayed for over a year, and I'd say most have been delayed by a few weeks to months.

All in all, it's to be expected, and KS is not for everyone. In my experience the ones with physical products are more likely to be delayed due to inexperienced production crew or quality control issues. Yet it is a great source for early birds who know the risks, and are willing to put money up on projects which otherwise might not see the light of day.

No idea about the background of the Neeo team, so this is not a judgment on them or the campaign. Neeo looks legit to my layman eyes. They seem to have working prototypes, and the brain unit in one of the videos appears to have all the parts that they claim in the product page.

Very excited about it, but I will not buy a remote at this time as my Harmony One works. Only backing at the entry level to get access to the user voting to prioritize products to be supported by future upgrades, and well, just to support it. But when I upgrade to a 4K projector when their prices come down to earth, Neeo might be just the thing so I don't have to open up the abortion of a software the Logitech programming app is.

Last edited by jouko342; 02-09-2015 at 02:10 PM.
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post #28 of 114 Old 02-12-2015, 10:33 AM
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The Neeo campaign on Kickstarter has ended and credit cards are being charged. Hope it works as advertised.
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post #29 of 114 Old 02-13-2015, 08:13 AM
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Harmony Smart Control at twice the price.

Unless it does Nest, multi vendor smart lighting, environmental control, security and home automation in addition to AV, it's no better than existing projects.

I have backed so many projects on Kickstarter and indiegogo to get crap or extreme delays after funding. I've only received one project out of seven that I actually like as much as the promise in the pitch.
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post #30 of 114 Old 02-13-2015, 09:19 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BoulderGeek View Post

Unless it does Nest, multi vendor smart lighting, environmental control, security and home automation in addition to AV, it's no better than existing projects.
That answer is yes, yes, yes, and yes.
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I love my iPhone, but it will never replace my turntable.

The Cinema 1858 Remodel Thread
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