I think it is time. Please, post the type of TV you got: 32", 40", 46, or 52" and settings you use. It would also be helpful if agree what kind of channels/HD sources/movies types to turn Cinemotion on or off.
Quote:
Originally Posted by chazk /forum/post/11848417
Hey all, so I have my 46 xbr4 and playing with settings. Love the display, some flashlighting in the corners but I'm going to wait til settings more dialed in to make any return decisions. And I wanted to add my own questions about ideal settings. I've tried gordong which I found a bit blue, bpmurr which also seemed bit blue and musicrunt that seemed abit green/brown. My goal is as natural as I can create and this seems totally doable with the variety of settings we have to work with. I find myself turning the picture/color down somewhat to take away abit of the pop that many others may like. Has anyone else tried for what may seem lower key and maybe more natural settings that I may have missed. I'm also wondering if anyone has had this beauty professionaly callibrated (musicrunt may have?) and what experience may have been.
All and all, I love this lcd and coming from a sony 24 crt the difference is astounding. Thanks for everyone's help here. Charles
Have you tried my settings yet? I like natural colors too. and I found the white to be right on target and the colors pretty close. I calibrated it myself with professional equipment (Colorfacts Pro & Avia Pro DVDs), although I'm not a pro, I've been doing calibrating on tv's for awhile now and been a real geek about TV's, PC's & technology for over 7 years.
Interesting Comment - READ HERE - explaining 120hz and Sony/Samsung displays' application of the "Motionflow" feature - not good with this first generation (according to the member's opinion).
Quote:
Originally Posted by RUSTY PELICAN /forum/post/11870240
Interesting Comment - READ HERE - explaining 120hz and Sony/Samsung displays' application of the "Motionflow" feature - not good with this first generation (according to the member's opinion).
I disagree with his latter statement ("The latest crop of 120Hz LCDs are not displaying 24fps as true 24fps in the sense that each frame is displayed for 1/24 of a second exactly. What they are doing is interpolating intermediate frames to simulate the look of 120fps. This cause the motion to have a videolike appearance.")
I have a 52XBR4. I can turn motionflow ('frame interpolation') off and feed it a 24fps signal from a blu-ray on my PS3. What would the TV display images at then? A multiple of 24 (to fit in the refresh rate), with no interpolation of the frames. Right?
Quote:
Originally Posted by God_TM /forum/post/11870684
I disagree with his latter statement ("The latest crop of 120Hz LCDs are not displaying 24fps as true 24fps in the sense that each frame is displayed for 1/24 of a second exactly. What they are doing is interpolating intermediate frames to simulate the look of 120fps. This cause the motion to have a videolike appearance.")
I have a 52XBR4. I can turn motionflow ('frame interpolation') off and feed it a 24fps signal from a blu-ray on my PS3. What would the TV display images at then? A multiple of 24 (to fit in the refresh rate), with no interpolation of the frames. Right?
I experienced the "sopa opera" effect for the first time this past Sunday night watching "Curb Your Enthusiasm" on HBO. I missed the 8 p.m. airing on my HBO HD channel and had to watch it later at midnight on HBO SD.
I'll have to say it was a strange effect at first, but I kinda liked it after a while. Kind of a sureal feeling watching it.
I'm going to watch it again on repeat this week. What are we saying you need to do to disable that effect? Turn off Motion Enhancer or Cinemotion? I have my TV set to CM=auto1 and ME=standard.
Quote:
Originally Posted by vumcrab /forum/post/11871002
I experienced the "sopa opera" effect for the first time this past Sunday night watching "Curb Your Enthusiasm" on HBO. I missed the 8 p.m. airing on my HBO HD channel and had to watch it later at midnight on HBO SD.
I'll have to say it was a strange effect at first, but I kinda liked it after a while. Kind of a sureal feeling watching it.
I'm going to watch it again on repeat this week. What are we saying you need to do to disable that effect? Turn off Motion Enhancer or Cinemotion? I have my TV set to CM=auto1 and ME=standard.
cinemotion on auto1 gives you that effect, very slightly, adding motion enhancer to standard and then high gives the soap opera effect. If you dont want it, I would just set your cinemotion to auto2
Quote:
Originally Posted by bishi /forum/post/11871416
cinemotion on auto1 gives you that effect, very slightly, adding motion enhancer to standard and then high gives the soap opera effect. If you dont want it, I would just set your cinemotion to auto2
I wonder if I'll ever fully understand the effects of those two settings (CM/ME).
What does that say about the show that I was watching? That it was filmed at 24fps but broadcast at 60fps?? And since CM was at auto1, the xbr applied a reverse 3:2 pulldown, as the Sony user manual states to get it back to the original 24fps??
Also, God_TM posted a week or so ago that Sony had explained to him that setting CM=auto2 automatically disables ME.
Hey everyone I was reading through here and it looks like we are getting away from actual calibration settings to LCD vs Plasma and other stuff. Can we stay on topic and leave non calibration talk for the owners thread?
What's the word recently on Xbox 360 settings? I just hooked one up to my 52XBR4 via component and need some feedback. I tried the Game/Text mode and wasn't thrilled with it on Forza 2. I'm going back to the beginning of this thread to start from scratch. Any feedback is appreciated.
Quote:
Originally Posted by vumcrab /forum/post/11871540
Thanks, Bishi.
I wonder if I'll ever fully understand the effects of those two settings (CM/ME).
What does that say about the show that I was watching? That it was filmed at 24fps but broadcast at 60fps?? And since CM was at auto1, the xbr applied a reverse 3:2 pulldown, as the Sony user manual states to get it back to the original 24fps??
Also, God_TM posted a week or so ago that Sony had explained to him that setting CM=auto2 automatically disables ME.
i am still learning as well..for example, PAL in auto 1 is choppy, i mean you can see it within 2 seconds, the choppiness. auto2 its fine with PAL not the soap opera effect because auto2 disables motion enhancer (for film says the manual) but its still pretty smooth. NTSC lets you use auto1 and get the 3d effects with motion enhancer.
About the show you were watching, it is film based so its 24 fps but i know cable companies dont have 24p output. Im still trying to learn all I can about that. I am also not sure if cinemotion = 3:2 pulldown (but if it says that in the manual I would accept it as true), i just know that motion enhancer inserts extra frames which = 3dness. Another thing I am uncertain about is what the cable companies i.e. I have comcast, do to the broadcasts. If they make a show 60fps that was 24fps like you suggested. Need to do more research but I will see what I can find as I am interested as well.
Quote:
Originally Posted by bpmurr /forum/post/11872035
Hey everyone I was reading through here and it looks like we are getting away from actual calibration settings to LCD vs Plasma and other stuff. Can we stay on topic and leave non calibration talk for the owners thread?
You are 100% correct. Sorry for the improper posts, they have been moved to the owners thread and I hope appropriately "removed" from this thread. BTW bpmurr Thanks for the starting the owners thread and participating in this calibration thread, your calibration settings were a good starting point for me (I like natural image/color too). I have found the threads and settings very useful.
Quote:
Originally Posted by YngwieDonut /forum/post/11872388
What's the word recently on Xbox 360 settings? I just hooked one up to my 52XBR4 via component and need some feedback. I tried the Game/Text mode and wasn't thrilled with it on Forza 2. I'm going back to the beginning of this thread to start from scratch. Any feedback is appreciated.
Game mode is used to reduce the delay in processing from the source to the screen. You still need to adjust the display according to your preferences and what's available in game mode. Game mode turns off any features that will create delay. I use an original 360 via VGA on the PC input with game mode and it looks great. My settings might not help you though since you're using component.
Quote:
Originally Posted by slumpey326 /forum/post/11878973
vumcrab' settings:
In picture mode CUSTOM, I use gordong11's settings posted HERE on the cal thread. This is what I use 99.99% of the time. When I occasionally set DRC=Mode1 for HD stuff, I also set MPEG_NR=High.
In picture mode STANDARD, I use R.MnTnA's settings posted HERE on the cal thread.
In picture mode CINEMA, I use the Home Theater Mag settings.
"Every now and then, I flip between these 3 modes just to experiment with different programming. I'm using Comcast cable via HDMI connections to a Motorola 3416 STB."
thanks for doing this. I'm reposting my reply because the URL links are missing above
In picture mode CUSTOM, I use gordong11's settings posted HERE on the cal thread. This is what I use 99.99% of the time. When I occasionally set DRC=Mode1 for HD stuff, I also set MPEG_NR=High.
In picture mode STANDARD, I use R.MnTnA's settings posted HERE on the cal thread.
In picture mode CINEMA, I use the Home Theater Mag settings.
"Every now and then, I flip between these 3 modes just to experiment with different programming. I'm using Comcast cable via HDMI connections to a Motorola 3416 STB."
These have been my settings for a while and I'm really happy with them. I've tried other's settings but they just don't work for me, perhaps it's my source but for me these are the best settings. Comments are welcome.
SA8300 STB via HDMI
Picture Mode: Standard
Backlight: 8
Picture: 80
Brightness: 50
Color: 55
Hue: 0
Color temp: Neutral
Sharpness: 60
Noise reduction: Low
MPEG noise reduction: Off/Low
DRC mode: Mode 1
DRC palette: Factory settings (this will automatically change for SD or HD)
Advanced Settings
Black corrector: Low
Advanced C.E: Low
Gamma: Low
Clear white: Off
Color space: Wide
Live color: Med
Detail enhancer: Low
Edge enhancer: Low
White Balance
R-Gain: 0
G-Gain: -3
B-Gain: 0
R-Bias: 0
G-Bias: -3
B-Bias: 0
Motion Enhancer: Standard (Sometimes on High or Off)
I bought a 46XBR4 in August and have been frequenting these forums (lurking) and reading up on various people's settings and experiences with this TV.
I like this TV a lot, but there's one thing that is bugging me. For starters here are my display settings. They were gordong's but a little tweaked.
Custom:
Backlight: Min
Picture: 90
Brightness: 45
Color: 60
Hue: 0
Temp: COOL
Sharpness: 64
Noise Reduc: Off
Mpeg: Off
DRC: Off
Black Corrector: Off
Advanced C.E.: Off
Gamma: Off
C White: Off
C Space: Standard
Live Color: Low
White Balance:
R Gain: -3
G Gain: -4
B Gain: -2
R Bias: +3
G Bias: -2
B Bias: +4
Detail Enhancer: Off
Edge Enhancer: Off
Cinemotion: Auto2
Motion Enhancer: Off (I've fooled with these settings though, and can't seem to correct the issue)
Anyway, I use these settings to watch Blu-ray on my PS3 and have been noticing that when the camera pans left and right, or when someone moves through the screen left or right (it doesn't happen when the camera follows the person), there is a severe loss of detail and it makes the screen hard to look at (hurts my eyes).
The BD I've been testing this with is Reign Over Me, and in scenes in the courthouse and offices, the walls look like they move back and forth as the camera pans, and you can't focus on the actors as they move around. This isn't only in those scenes, but it's very easy to pick out in these particular ones.
So, my question is: Is this the judder effect or motion blur or both? I'm not real tech savvy when it comes to TVs so when people describe judder I'm not exactly sure if that's what I'm seeing. I'm wondering if anyone else has experienced this effect and any input they might have in resolving it.
Using Cinemotion 1 and Motionflow Standard/High seems to reduce/eliminate this, but as some other people in this thread have pointed out this can cause various artifacts on the picture.
Thanks for any help, sorry in advance for any confusion, and if I need to explain myself better I will certainly try.
Thanks.
EDIT: And to clarify it's not a smearing effect like when noise reduction is turned on, it isn't nearly as smooth of a blur as that effect.
Quote:
Originally Posted by bcring /forum/post/11879747
Hello, everyone. First post.
I bought a 46XBR4 in August and have been frequenting these forums (lurking) and reading up on various people's settings and experiences with this TV.
I like this TV a lot, but there's one thing that is bugging me. For starters here are my display settings. They were gordong's but a little tweaked.
Custom:
Backlight: Min
Picture: 90
Brightness: 45
Color: 60
Hue: 0
Temp: COOL
Sharpness: 64
Noise Reduc: Off
Mpeg: Off
DRC: Off
Black Corrector: Off
Advanced C.E.: Off
Gamma: Off
C White: Off
C Space: Standard
Live Color: Low
White Balance:
R Gain: -3
G Gain: -4
B Gain: -2
R Bias: +3
G Bias: -2
B Bias: +4
Detail Enhancer: Off
Edge Enhancer: Off
Cinemotion: Auto2
Motion Enhancer: Off (I've fooled with these settings though, and can't seem to correct the issue)
Anyway, I use these settings to watch Blu-ray on my PS3 and have been noticing that when the camera pans left and right, or when someone moves through the screen left or right (it doesn't happen when the camera follows the person), there is a severe loss of detail and it makes the screen hard to look at (hurts my eyes).
The BD I've been testing this with is Reign Over Me, and in scenes in the courthouse and offices, the walls look like they move back and forth as the camera pans, and you can't focus on the actors as they move around. This isn't only in those scenes, but it's very easy to pick out in these particular ones.
So, my question is: Is this the judder effect or motion blur or both? I'm not real tech savvy when it comes to TVs so when people describe judder I'm not exactly sure if that's what I'm seeing. I'm wondering if anyone else has experienced this effect and any input they might have in resolving it.
Using Cinemotion 1 and Motionflow Standard/High seems to reduce/eliminate this, but as some other people in this thread have pointed out this can cause various artifacts on the picture.
Thanks for any help, sorry in advance for any confusion, and if I need to explain myself better I will certainly try.
Thanks.
EDIT: And to clarify it's not a smearing effect like when noise reduction is turned on, it isn't nearly as smooth of a blur as that effect.
When you set Cinemotion(CM) to Auto2, it automatically turns Motion Enhancer (ME) Off. Set it to CM=Auto1 and ME=Standard. Now, what kind of artifacts do you get when you use CM=auto1 and ME=Std.? How is the PS3 connected (HDMI, Component, etc.)? What is the output resolution set to on the PS3?
Quote:
Originally Posted by vumcrab /forum/post/11880853
When you set Cinemotion(CM) to Auto2, it automatically turns Motion Enhancer (ME) Off. Set it to CM=Auto1 and ME=Standard. Now, what kind of artifacts do you get when you use CM=auto1 and ME=Std.? How is the PS3 connected (HDMI, Component, etc.)? What is the output resolution set to on the PS3?
I will test this when I get off work tomorrow (hitting the sack now), but just from memory:
I did various testing with the cinemotions and motionflows. I have tried:
(Cinemotion/Motionflow)
Off/off - the effect happens
auto1/off - the effect happens
auto1/standard - it is lessened, but minor artifacting when people move around it seems to be like little squares form around the movement.
auto1/high - Smooth, but with the weird "Soap Opera" type movement, and some artifacts
Auto2/any variation - the effect happens
Like I said I will try it again tomorrow. I would definitely say Auto1/Standard would be a good way to go, but objects/people moving across the screen seem to make it (for lack of a better term) pixellate.
Quote:
Originally Posted by bcring /forum/post/11881800
I will test this when I get off work tomorrow (hitting the sack now), but just from memory:
I did various testing with the cinemotions and motionflows. I have tried:
(Cinemotion/Motionflow)
Off/off - the effect happens
auto1/off - the effect happens
auto1/standard - it is lessened, but minor artifacting when people move around it seems to be like little squares form around the movement.
auto1/high - Smooth, but with the weird "Soap Opera" type movement, and some artifacts
Auto2/any variation - the effect happens
Like I said I will try it again tomorrow. I would definitely say Auto1/Standard would be a good way to go, but objects/people moving across the screen seem to make it (for lack of a better term) pixellate.
Not sure if the size of the screen would make it more noticeable but on my 32xbr4 if i turn off cinemotion and motionflow or just cinemotion and leave motionflow on i dont see judder with anything. Only time i ever see any distortion or anything like that is with auto1 and motionflow is Std or high...but still I like the 3d effect and can settle for 5% judder and 95% 3dish.
Quote:
Originally Posted by EADGBE /forum/post/11879313
Game mode is used to reduce the delay in processing from the source to the screen. You still need to adjust the display according to your preferences and what's available in game mode. Game mode turns off any features that will create delay. I use an original 360 via VGA on the PC input with game mode and it looks great. My settings might not help you though since you're using component.
vumcrab: I tried turning DRC on to mode1 with the MPEG set to High last night. Love it! It eliminated any artifacts created by the DRC mode. I'm staying with this for all viewing as the PQ is better in my opinion with DRC on. Thanks for the tip.
Quote:
Originally Posted by bcring /forum/post/11881800
I will test this when I get off work tomorrow (hitting the sack now), but just from memory:
I did various testing with the cinemotions and motionflows. I have tried:
(Cinemotion/Motionflow)
Off/off - the effect happens
auto1/off - the effect happens
auto1/standard - it is lessened, but minor artifacting when people move around it seems to be like little squares form around the movement.
auto1/high - Smooth, but with the weird "Soap Opera" type movement, and some artifacts
Auto2/any variation - the effect happens
Like I said I will try it again tomorrow. I would definitely say Auto1/Standard would be a good way to go, but objects/people moving across the screen seem to make it (for lack of a better term) pixellate.
Just to confirm, the auto1/standard effect I tested out a few discs this afternoon. The judder (have we confirmed that's what this is?) is noticeably lessened, but as reported earlier some of the edges of the image at what seems like random times blur for a moment. Also, though not as apparent as auto1/high, the movement at times appears quickened and not natural looking.
Is it going to be pretty much one way or the other (the "judder" or the weird smoothness)?
I'm just curious what other people with this set have experienced as far as watching a BD disc or something similar?
And to answer a previous question I overlooked, I'm running the PS3 to the TV via HDMI, output is 1080/24p on BD.
- Another good thing you'll like about the VGA cable is that the 360 will upconvert your standard DVD's as well. Plus it keeps an extra HDMI port free. Eventually I'll probably get a 360 with an HDMI out, but in the meantime this is working just fine. FYI - it's not a big deal for me but just so you know you can only watch the PC input in "normal" which works out to be the same as "full pixel." So you won't have access to any of the stretch modes. Not that it's a problem since full pixel is the best setting anyway but just so you know.
I made the switch to an HDMI cable last night with my Scientific Atlanta 8300 to my 52XBR4 and the quality of SD channels has vastly improved over the component cables. Also, It's very noticeable on HDMOV, one of my worst HD channels, which I now consider viewable. MOJO now looks fantastic. It's almost on par with HD Discovery. ESPN HD is nearly perfect, as it was with component in.
The verdict:
The good still looks good and the bad looks better.
Spend the $7 instead of the C-note for the Monster. Trust me, I have them both. I picked up an open box deal at BB and ordered a cheap cable through an Amazon seller. I can't tell squat between the two.
I use Gordong11's settings for everything except Showtime HD which looks a bit too blue. I have Home Theater Magazine's setting on my Theater Key to fix it.
In Hawaii, Oceanic Time Warner does not carry CBS due to our local affiliate, KGMB (boo-hiss), wanting some $$$ before they give out an HD feed. So, I ended up watching Dallas get pummeled in SD today. It's miserable to go from the 1st game in HD to the 2nd game in SD, but I actually tolerated it.
Oceanic Time Warner Cable in Hawaii (No Dish or OTA option for me)
Explorer 8300 HD via HDMI
And gordong11's settings.
Gordong11, You and your co-worker tekkie pal ROCK!
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