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Help me decide. Sim2, 160" scope,DLP/DLA smaller screen???

6K views 51 replies 13 participants last post by  Jason Turk 
#1 ·
Ok, posted a few threads on screen size and PJ's before and have received great advise. The problem is I am still as undecided as I was before and I have even been procrastinating on posting this thread.


Ok, my dilemma,


1.I am looking at either a 139" or 148" wide screen if I can. (I really want a 148")

2. There are not many PJ's that will light up a 139" wide screen let alone a 148", so I need a PJ to at least be able to take on a 1.2 gain screen.

3.Would I notice the difference in screen impact if I choose the smaller screen and sat closer? (I like a seating distance of about 2.4 times the height by what I have looked at so far)

4. This is my first time to buy a PJ so I have no pre-determined ideas. Good thing.

5. B/c this is my first PJ I was thinking I should start out with something cheaper, to see where my preferences will be.



So I have been looking at the BenQ with the 148" wide screen and the 550 DLA for the 139" wide screen. I have demoed neither of them and any PJ purchase will be blind. If I go with the 148" combo, I was wanting to go with the Sim2 3 chip and wait for the 3D model to see how it is received. (I say wait for 3D b/c this will be a family theater and my kids love the 3D animated stuff) The thing is , if I go with any type of Sim2 PJ I am thinking that it would be a waste to have it shine on a 139" wide screen when I can have a 148" wide screen? But as I said earlier I could sit closer and and maybe get a brighter image and have more impact. What to do, what to do.


If I am not making sense, it is b/c I am totally lost on what I should do. So just slap me a few times and I should be fine.
 
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#2 ·
I've been viewing scope films at 139" wide with the W6000 from about 12ft away. Love it. I am using a high power screen, although this was mainly for the daytime advantages. In the dark, I have way more than enough light for this size.


That said, if you have room for bigger, go bigger (within limits of course). Knowing what I know about the size I have now in relation to a smaller screen but same relative seating distance, raw size counts. A lot. Too big is not something many people regret. Not big enough, especially when you have room for it... this happens more.


The problem is, if this is your first setup and you never see that 148", you won't know any better. So 139" will blow your mind anyway... and make projector/screen material decisions more flexible.



Read through this recent thread too, may help: http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1259024
 
#3 ·
Based on your signature, I can see that you are a man of discerning taste.


Have you tried the routine where you go to a movie theater, find your favorite seat in the house, estimate the distance to screen and screen width via pacing them off, and then scaling that ratio to your room?


If you can, buy the projector first (ensuring enough lumens for both screen size scenarios), and then test out the alternative sizes before buying / building the screen.
 
#4 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by LilGator /forum/post/18995870


I've been viewing scope films at 139" wide with the W6000 from about 12ft away. Love it. I am using a high power screen, although this was mainly for the daytime advantages. In the dark, I have way more than enough light for this size.


That said, if you have room for bigger, go bigger (within limits of course). Knowing what I know about the size I have now in relation to a smaller screen but same relative seating distance, raw size counts. A lot. Too big is not something many people regret. Not big enough, especially when you have room for it... this happens more.


The problem is, if this is your first setup and you never see that 148", you won't know any better. So 139" will blow your mind anyway... and make projector/screen material decisions more flexible.



Read through this recent thread too, may help: http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1259024

Problem is I have seen a 150" scope setup with the seating distance at about 2.4 and I found that I wanted more, or felt I could have been closer.


But , like you said, size is always going to have more impact with everything else equal. But the reality is that not all PJ's are equal, hense my dilemma.


I am hearing great things about the Benq W6000 for its price, but I have also heard that the Vivitek H5080 was good. I guess , in the long run if I am going to go with a Sim2 PJ I would be better off with the bigger screen?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Brad Horstkotte /forum/post/18996043


Based on your signature, I can see that you are a man of discerning taste.


Have you tried the routine where you go to a movie theater, find your favorite seat in the house, estimate the distance to screen and screen width via pacing them off, and then scaling that ratio to your room?


If you can, buy the projector first (ensuring enough lumens for both screen size scenarios), and then test out the alternative sizes before buying / building the screen.

Yes, I have done the theater thing and I went and saw Avatar 4 times, sat in the very front row for one, at the back of the front row section the second time and the front row of the middle section the third and and the same place the forth time. I did prefer sitting at the back of the front row section , but the absolute front row seats where fine too (The only thing was the seats were too low, if they were higher that seat would be fine for me.)
 
#5 ·
Is this theater room just for you? If so, go big-big as you are thinking to satisfy your desire.

Or do you have others to consider?

While total immersion may be the ticket for you, will others feel the same or possibly be overwhelmed? Just a thought.

Quote:
Originally Posted by JapanDave /forum/post/18996398


Problem is I have seen a 150" scope setup with the seating distance at about 2.4 and I found that I wanted more, or felt I could have been closer.


But , like you said, size is always going to have more impact with everything else equal. But the reality is that not all PJ's are equal, hense my dilemma.


I am hearing great things about the Benq W6000 for its price, but I have also heard that the Vivitek H5080 was good. I guess , in the long run if I am going to go with a Sim2 PJ I would be better off with the bigger screen?


Yes, I have done the theater thing and I went and saw Avatar 4 times, sat in the very front row for one, at the back of the front row section the second time and the front row of the middle section the third and and the same place the forth time. I did prefer sitting at the back of the front row section , but the absolute front row seats where fine too (The only thing was the seats were too low, if they were higher that seat would be fine for me.)
 
#6 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by mtbdudex /forum/post/18996441


Is this theater room just for you? If so, go big-big as you are thinking to satisfy your desire.

Or do you have others to consider?

While total immersion may be the ticket for you, will others feel the same or possibly be overwhelmed? Just a thought.

It is mainly just for me, but my kids will be watching a lot of 16:9 content(A lot of the kids movies here are 16:9) Besides that, they always want to sit up front of the movie theater, so there is no problem there.


On a different note, does anyone know where you can pickup a Sim2 C3X under MSRP? The only prices I can find are MSRP, does AVS stock them?
 
#7 ·
We do not stock Sim2, but we can get them (though there are restrictions on them).


Truthfully not much is going to light that size screen well, sans 3 chip DLP. If you do buy a projector with more typical light output, I'd HIGHLY recommend trying it on a wall or such to start so that you can play with sizes. This is especially good if you are new to front projection...
 
#8 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by JapanDave /forum/post/18996528


It is mainly just for me, but my kids will be watching a lot of 16:9 content(A lot of the kids movies here are 16:9) Besides that, they always want to sit up front of the movie theater, so there is no problem there.


On a different note, does anyone know where you can pickup a Sim2 C3X under MSRP? The only prices I can find are MSRP, does AVS stock them?

no price discussion allowed, but i can say u should be able to buy it very significantly less than the MSRP. To the extent, it almost sounds like an affordable projector, for what it offers.
 
#9 ·
JapanDave:

I have a JVC RS35 and started out at 120" diagonal 16/9. I quickly realized I wanted to go full screen for 2.35/1 movies so I stayed at 120" 16/9 (58" high) and went to 150" diagonal for scope movies (138" wide). I sit 12 feet away and am close to the shortest throw distance. I was concerned at first that it would not be bright enough but I have had my previous TV's calibrated and already knew that I didn't like a bright image.


Long story short it was an excellent decision for me. I DIY'ed both my screens so there wasn't a huge investment to worry about. They are both Seymore AT screens with a gain of 1.0 to 1.2 depending on where you read about it.


I have about 400 hours on my PJ so hopefully it won't get too dull as the lamp ages. I already am prepared to buy a new one a little more often if I have to. I also will do the lamp/prism cleaning when I notice any dimming.


If you like an extremely bright image or have much ambient lite it may not work for you, but if I had the room I would go to 149" just to see if I liked it.


Also I am following your thread on Seaton Sound forum as I have a Subm (assuming that there aren't 2 JapanDave's out there
). Hope you get that all straightened out soon. My ultimate goal is to have Cat 12c's or 8c's myself.


Hope this helps

Moto
 
#10 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by hd_newbie /forum/post/18998455


To the extent, it almost sounds like an affordable projector, for what it offers.

Hmm... sounding better everytime I think about it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by MX48 /forum/post/18998990


JapanDave:

I have a JVC RS35 and started out at 120" diagonal 16/9. I quickly realized I wanted to go full screen for 2.35/1 movies so I stayed at 120" 16/9 (58" high) and went to 150" diagonal for scope movies (138" wide). I sit 12 feet away and am close to the shortest throw distance. I was concerned at first that it would not be bright enough but I have had my previous TV's calibrated and already knew that I didn't like a bright image.


Long story short it was an excellent decision for me. I DIY'ed both my screens so there wasn't a huge investment to worry about. They are both Seymore AT screens with a gain of 1.0 to 1.2 depending on where you read about it.


I have about 400 hours on my PJ so hopefully it won't get too dull as the lamp ages. I already am prepared to buy a new one a little more often if I have to. I also will do the lamp/prism cleaning when I notice any dimming.


If you like an extremely bright image or have much ambient lite it may not work for you, but if I had the room I would go to 149" just to see if I liked it.


Also I am following your thread on Seaton Sound forum as I have a Subm (assuming that there aren't 2 JapanDave's out there
). Hope you get that all straightened out soon. My ultimate goal is to have Cat 12c's or 8c's myself.


Hope this helps

Moto

Thanks for the detailed reply. It is completely light controlled and if I was to go 150" diagonal, I will probably go with the JVC for the time being, but I was thinking I would be pushing it to go with a 160" diagonal, however, I am not one who likes an overly bright image from what I can tell.


Thanks for the support on the sound system, there is no way I want to give those speakers up if I can help, just too good at what they do. I just hope I can get the electrical side of things sorted.
 
#11 ·
...image brightness requirements is relative to room light conditions in a major way. If you have a complete light controlled dedicated theater room with a dark room decor, it requires considerably less image brightness to achieve a satisfying experience. Screen gain is also a secondary factor. Any advice concerning this projector with that screen size depends entirely upon the room environment context. Contrast rules -- if you have ambient light conditions, it will degrade the blacks such that no level of brightness can make the image satisfactory -- regardless of projector and screen size.
 
#12 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jedi /forum/post/19000187


...image brightness requirements is relative to room light conditions in a major way. If you have a complete light controlled dedicated theater room with a dark room decor, it requires considerably less image brightness to achieve a satisfying experience. Screen gain is also a secondary factor. Any advice concerning this projector with that screen size depends entirely upon the room environment context. Contrast rules -- if you have ambient light conditions, it will degrade the blacks such that no level of brightness can make the image satisfactory -- regardless of projector and screen size.

My room is performance first (contractors start the build in a month), so decore is all completely black and so are the walls and celling, except for the carpet which will be a very dark color. No windows , which means no ambient light from out side. The PJ will be housed in a hush box to stop and light spill and sound. AV equipment will be in reccessed section will a door to stop any light escaping. Also the screen will be 1.2 gain. So pretty much it is as light controlled as you can get, I am someone who chooses performance over looks, to the dismay of the wife, but it is my room and she has no say!
 
#13 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by JapanDave /forum/post/19000296


My room is performance first (contractors start the build in a month), so decore is all completely black and so are the walls and celling, except for the carpet which will be a very dark color.

Having had a black room, I have just one word for why I would never do another - DUST! Yes you do get the best CR, however (and maybe because I used flat black) it was a pain to maintain. If you wiped a patch of wall, it marked and the only way to restore the finish was to paint it again.
 
#14 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by CAVX /forum/post/19001086


Having had a black room, I have just one word for why I would never do another - DUST! Yes you do get the best CR, however (and maybe because I used flat black) it was a pain to maintain. If you wiped a patch of wall, it marked and the only way to restore the finish was to paint it again.

Hey Mark,


Every surface is going to be fabric except the pillars.
 
#16 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jason Turk /forum/post/19001593


Sounds like you are doing it right...full dedicated room. Kudos.

Hopefuly, the designs for the room were done by Dennis Erskine.
 
#17 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by JapanDave /forum/post/19001823


Hopefuly, the designs for the room were done by Dennis Erskine.

...If Dennis is involved I'll assume you're going with an acoustically transparent screen with front speakers behind?
 
#18 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jedi /forum/post/19003540


...If Dennis is involved I'll assume you're going with an acoustically transparent screen with front speakers behind?

Yes, you would be correct. The screen has a gain of 1.2 BTW
 
#20 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by LilGator /forum/post/19005180


Is this spec or actually measured?

It will be the SMX CineWeave HD. I may have over estimated, it is 1.16 gain, I just rounded up b/c I am too lazy to type the extra digit.
 
#22 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by LilGator /forum/post/19005276


If it's actually 1.16 gain, you're probably looking at 800-1000 calibrated lumens at a minimum for that 148" wide.

That is what I was thinking. And with aging bulbs I would want something that could pump out at least 1200-1300 at minimum. This does not leave many single chip DLP that could handle that.
 
#24 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jason Turk /forum/post/19006902


Well then I have no concerns. FYI I will call you tonight.

Thanks, looking forward to speaking to you.
 
#26 ·
So , anyone else with any ideas?


Still waiting on Jason to give me a call on the Sim2, but if anyone else has any suggestions I am all ears?
 
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