AVS Forum banner

Official Lumagen RadianceMini 3D thread.

193K views 2K replies 220 participants last post by  rinvo 
#1 ·
Lets start an official Radiancemini3D thread. As customers take delivery please post your feedback and questions here.

From everyone: Thank you Lumagen!


We are running a special which can be found here:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=1304552



Lumagen Press Release:


Embargo release until January 6, 2011


RadianceMini 3D joins the award winning Lumagen® Radiance™ video processor family.

January 6, 2011 — Lumagen®, Inc., a specialist in the design and manufacture of video products for the home and corporate markets, is announcing the RadianceMini 3D. The RadianceMini 3D joins other members of the Radiance family, which includes the CEA® 2010 Platinum Video Product of the Year, the RadianceXE.

The RadianceMini 3D sports two HDMI® inputs, and one HDMI output, and can be controlled by either the included IR remote, or by RS-232. Control and setup are the same as other units in the Radiance family. In addition, it provides the same exceptional video quality that the Radiance line has become known for. The unit’s case measures in at a diminutive 8.5” by 5” by 1.05” (216mm by 127mm by 27mm) and has mounting tabs so it can be fastened to a shelf, or to the wall behind a flat-panel display.

HDMI 1.4 3D is supported, including scaling and aspect ratio control for 3D Bluray movies for use with an anamorphic lens, such as those produced by Panamorph®. For dual-projector 3D, two units can be used with each receiving 3D and outputting video for either the left-eye or right-eye.

Jim Peterson, Lumagen’s president, stated, “Our customers have been asking us for a new Radiance product optimized for small systems. The RadianceMini 3D fulfills this request, as well as the need for premier video processing when another product, such as an AVR, or HDMI matrix-switch, is being used for source selection.”

As with the other members of the Radiance line, proprietary No-ring™ scaling, linear-Gamma RGB-color-palette CMS, 21-point parametric grayscale calibration, video deinterlacing, MPEG artifact reduction, temporal noise reduction, and other features, combine to provide the best video quality available.

The RadianceMini 3D is currently available, and is priced at $1995 MSRP.

For more information contact Lumagen at:

503-574-2211 Voice • 503-296-2384 Fax • www.lumagen.comsales@lumagen.com

# # #

Lumagen is a registered trademark of Lumagen, Incorporated. VisionDVI, VisionHDP, VisionHDQ, VisionPro HDP, Radiance, RadianceXD, RadianceXE, and RadianceXS, RadianceMini, are trademarks of Lumagen Incorporated. Other trademarks are the property of their respective owners.
 
See less See more
#77 ·
Having had a play with one of these today I can now understand the menus a bit better. It's very familiar having owned a HDQ previously, but it seemed logical enough to move aroud the menus. I now understand the 'style' part a bit better as this is something I'll use as it contains the masking settings: For non lens use I want 0 masking, but due to my long throw and Isco II lens I need about 2% masking to remove overspill. I currently use the HD350's own masking control, but with the Mini3D I'll be able to set this up in different 'styles' which in turn can be assigned to different mem A-D.


As I always prefered the upscaling of my old HDQ to the Edge I'm currently using, I'm kind of buying this a little on faith as the upscaling is supposed to be better (but having got home I've realised I didn't ask to see any DVDs upscaled
)). However, DVDs are a very small part of my viewing these days anyway such that the Edge is 'good enough' the M3D will only be better.


It's a tiny unit, so I'll be able to hide it away under my equipment cabinet which helps clear some of the clutter. It's just such a flexible device that even if the final calibrated picture doesn't look any better than my current Edge+VEQ setup I'll still be happy, especially once I can autocalibrate using Chromapure.



Anyway, I should have mine in a couple of weeks having placed my order just before this post.
 
#78 ·
Can I use the Mini to store several inputs to calibrate display "A" and then use other memories to store the same device inputs to store calibrations for display "B" even though there is only one HDMI output? I see ability for multiple memories for each HDMI input, but no mention of such ability on the output.
 
#79 ·
Yes, that is what the Output Config 0-7, CMS 0-7 and Style 0-7 settings can be used for.


Say Display 1 is 720p and Display 2 is 1080p.


You could set Output Config 0 to 720p, set CMS 0 to the calibration needed for the 720p display and Style 0 for whatever you needed for that display.


Likewise set Output Config 1 to 1080p, set CMS 1 to the calibation for that display and Style 1 for whatever you needed.


Set MemA (in all input resolutions) for Output 0, CMS 0 and Style 0. Set MemB (for all input resolutions) for Output 1, CMS 1 and Style 1.


Select MemA when using the 720p display and MemB for the 1080p display.


If desired you can get even trickier then that. For example Set 720p MemA to Output 0 but 1080p MemA to Output 1...etc...etc..etc.


Shawn
 
#80 ·
Thanks for the info. Looks like the Mini is a lot more flexible than I thought. I'm thinking of using it for both a projector at one end of the room and a plasma at the other.
 
#81 ·
I think the Mini3D is really flexible once you take all the virtual inputs into account. I'm going to be using my M3D with a projector (HD350 for now), a TV in the same room and another in an adjacent room. The output of the M3D will go through an existing 1 in 4 out HDMI splitter as the Edge currently does.


This will still likely leave me with a spare memory 'D' incase I want some variation in calibration for my projector (SMPTE-C perhaps). With the virtual inputs and per resolution memories I reckon I'm well covered for all the combinations I'll need from an Oppo 93, a PVR and a HTPC. I'll just use my AV9 audio processor to switch between two of the sources and the third can go direct into HDMI 2 on the M3D.


It may not have the physical inputs of the XS but with a bit of planing it can control even quite a complex setup. I'm still writing out what inputs/resolutions I'm going to send into it while I'm waiting for it to arrive, so I'll be ready to go. I recall only using one input on my old HDQ as I did the switching in a previous AV receiver I had and relied on the per resolution memories to sort the various sources, which were all different resolutions.


I can't wait to get mine now, but I know it'll be a couple of weeks yet.
 
#82 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dundas /forum/post/19918512


Part of the problem right now is that the current RadianceMini manual is just a very poorly revised XS manual so you do not know what really applies to the Mini and what doesn't.

A couple of examples:

Page 25 in the audio section actually starts out saying The Radiance XS supports ...

Page 34 has a section on the "trigger outputs on the rear panel" which don't exist on the Mini.

I'm sure there are many more mistakes.

Missed these.


The Mini is extremely similar to the XS in all but input selection and output (since there is only one).


I am planning another spin through the manuals very soon. I will try to clean these up, but in reality they are minor in my opinion. Thanks for pointing them out.
 
#83 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by Wilson-Flyer /forum/post/19914912


MAN... Did even more research. If this guy (the XS-3D and not the mini) will do what the 3d-VIP Theater (/Display) will do too, I am so in. Where do I sign up?!? I want one now. Yesterday even!


I may even take my VP50 and run over it with one of my tractors just for fun instead of trading it in with somebody! LMFAO!!!!


I sure hope one of the Lumagen guys jumps in here and sees my post. This thing could be the answer to all my dreams and I'm not kidding either.


Edit for emphasis: Using my existing 1080UB for 3D saves me about $600 on the Acer H5360 PLUS I get to keep 1080 for 3D. Using the XS-3D for switching (and all its other fcns to boot) saves me about $700 on the trade-up to a DVDO Duo that's only passive with 3D to begin with. Sounds like it ALREADY does everything the Optoma 3DXL does so that saves, what, $500 more? Unless my math is missing something, I can buy the XS-3D from a well-known site trading in my new in-box VP30 (ANOTHER DVDO story) for about $1900.


Now unless my math is extremely screwed up, I can simplify everything and get everything in one box for only $100 more than I was going to spend anyway. I MUST be missing something here. I know the 3D-VIP Theater device is a big gotcha here because unless the Lumagen does this fcn, I still have to buy the Acer (or wait for the 3D-VIP Theater device to come out and buy that.). Somebody get me down off this ledge before I jump! There's gotta be a catch somewhere. I'm missing something.


I think I should have done like I usually do and have jumped into this 3D thing early and then I'd just be stuck with whatever I had already done. Now there just seems to be too many options to decide what is the right thing to do.

Feel free to give us a call or email support@luamgen.com with questions, but it does sounds like the RadianceXS-3D is a good match for your setup.
 
#84 ·
The guys from Spectralcal replied to an email of mine. Some good news for everyone who is buying a Mini. Apparently Spectracal will be offering a relatively inexpensive license add-on for direct control of the Radiance for people like me that have a DIY license.


Also, Spectralcal is working on saturation measurements so we can all see how well the Radiance tracks saturations.
 
#85 ·
Just to balance this up I understand that a similar automatic calibration will be possible using Chromapure.
As I already have the Professional version V2.0.3 I believe this upgrade will be FOC. I look forward to being able to press a button and let the system calibrate itself.
Even if it's not 100% spot on, then at least I'll be able to make some relatively quick tweaks using the M3D rather than the cumbersome controls of my HD350. Although it's overkill for a HD350, the M3D will be there for future upgrades, like when users are 'giving away' their X7s in their rush to buy the next new model.
Seeing that all isn't perfect in the JVC camp, waiting it out seems a good ploy anyway.


If only there was an add on that gives me an extra 30,000:1 on/off and 1000:1 ANSI.
 
#86 ·
You still have to drive the car a bit even though the transmission is an automatic. The auto calibration is not press a button, get a quickie, and come back and its calibrated. If it was, what would you guys who spend more time calibrating your displays, tweaking, yada yada do with your spare time? Watch content?


Mini3Ds are now in a back order state. Jim with the help of his friends has sold through his entire first production run. I have a mini here that we will be using to calibrate a RS40 for a customer when it arrives. I haven't opened it and I won't because it ids a functional subset unit of my Radiance XS. There is real;ly no need to check a mini out if you have checked out an RS.



Re upscaling. I do distinguish between upscaling and deinterlacing.


The ring free scaling of the Lumagens to me is worth the price of admission alone. Just to scale my sports in 720p to all my projectors' 1080p. Deinterlacing 1080i to 1080p is always interesting and very dependent of the deinterlacing chip the processor designer chooses to use. I really enjoy the deinterlacing setting the Lumagens provide allowing one to trade off increased combing artifacts for more detail. Thjis is not a detail setting in a display which degrades detail while giving the appearance of increased detail. Deinterlacing costs some detail. Its part and parcel to combing two interlaced frames into one progressive frame. Here the Lumagen says if you suffer a bit more combing from time to time, we can give your more of the real detail. I usually keep the deinterlacing slider set hard over to detail (its not a slider, you step to a number). There are all sorts of goodies to play with in these but it shouldn't scare you. Most use only a few features I suspect. But its the flexibility which impresses. If you have something needing a processing fix, the machine usually has a feature to enable the fix. And damn if it doesn't, a call to Jim and a feature is added to handle what you need, ergo the coming conversion of 720p sbs to 720p frame packed. Lumagen provides the best customer service out there. AVS is proud to be a Lumagen dealer. Very proud.
 
#87 ·
I hope they're not on backorder as I've been told to expect mine next week.



And yes, if it did do all the calibration, then I could just get on with watching as that's the whole point of my setup: It's not a testbed for AV devices to be analysed on.
If I had to tweak a few points WRT gamma for example, I could live with that, but I'd prefer to be able to press a button and go. Maybe that's expecting a bit too much, but it's a target to aim for IMHO. Having a nice set of calibration results is good, but the time I spend getting them could be better spent just enjoying the picture.
 
#90 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by mark haflich /forum/post/19955293


You still have to drive the car a bit even though the transmission is an automatic. The auto calibration is not press a button, get a quickie, and come back and its calibrated. If it was, what would you guys who spend more time calibrating your displays, tweaking, yada yada do with your spare time? Watch content?

I think I live a little bit in fear that auto-calibration wll do as good a job as I can in less time. First we had people losing jobs to machines. Now people losing hobbies to machines? I guess that we don't have to use it.
 
#91 ·
LG; so long as they don't make a machine that watches the films for us, I'm happy.



At first learning about calibration was a challenge and a steep learning curve. Then when I got Chromapure it was like the mists cleared somewhat and then it was 'just' the pain of reitterating the greyscale/gamma points over and over until I was happy. I'd stay up until 4am sometimes just trying to nail the settings, then I'd do a 15 minute CMS adjustment (using my VideoEQ Pro) and that was it. I know I'm still learning new things after nearly 3 years, but while it's technically interesting I've got better things to do with my time (like actually watch films
).


I've found that my preferance (at least in my current room and with the HD350) is to have a 2.3 gamma that drops to 2.2 for the 10 IRE and below. If an autocalibration got me to a flat 2.2 and then all I had to do was change the gamma setting in the M3D +0.1 and tweak the 10 IRE point down 0.1 then I'd consider that fantastic. I'd still do a 'final' run to check everything was where I wanted, but to save the pain of hours of adjustment would be worth it for me. I know I could still have an inaccurate calibration if my sensor wasn't properly setup/off calibration/dark readings done, but at least that would still mean I had some input to ensure a good result.


Having said that the last time I had a Lumagen was before I got Chromapure, so maybe the two combined will make my manual calibrations less painful. I hope so as for now I'll have to setup the new M3D by hand anyway, at least Ricky is 'calibrating' my i1LT against his referance sensor so it'll do until I get some practice and can rent the i1Pro again.


Wish I had the M3D already...
 
#92 ·
I received the Mini yesterday, set it up, but did not calibrate.


I am very happy so far. I had forgotten how good the Radiance's scaling and sharpness controls are. I didn't buy it for those features but they are well worth the modest (for Lumagen) price of admission.


I was watching some Dirty Jobs on the Discovery Channel. It looked so sharp and likelike (on my RS20) that I would have thought that I was using frame interpolation. I had never before had that impression with this projector. I think I was using too much sharpness for my taste but I could easily see that someone would like the way it looked.


I plan to calibrate this weekend and am really looking forward to that.
 
#93 ·
The US is back ordered until early March. The Spectracal Lumagen interface is highly automated but there are still things for the calibrator to do. The Chromapure interface should be even more automated but no matter how automated it gets it will not be idiot proof so all end users and pro calibrators can relax or er not relaX.
 
#94 ·
I got mine this morning: Just like LG I haven't fully calibrated yet (I'm still using my VideoEQ Pro for CMS at the moment) but using it tonight for the vertical stretch on a BluRay and also on a DVD earlier this evening and the upscaling and general sharpness, etc is already winning me over.


Later this week I plan to run through the whole (manual) calibration process so I can remove the VEQ from the loop...so far I'm very happy with the purchase. Even off air HD at 1080i looks better than I've seen before via the Edge plus VEQ.
 
#95 ·
On physical input 1 if you have say 3 devices with same resolution are you out of luck? I thought I read inputs 1 and 2 have all these resolution choices but can you choose the same resolution more than once on each input? As I understand it the MEMA-D come after that choice.
 
#96 ·
I just got the XS and realize this is the Mini thread, but I assume they are basically the same as far as 3D and the question would apply to both. I have the Acer H5360 and hooked it up with the Lumagen XS to my PS3 for 3D. I can get an image that looks like it is a 3D image, although it is pretty jumpy. I had been assuming that I could use the Xpand X103 glasses I have, but I couldn't get them to work and from looking at the instructions and the Xpand site it looks like they aren't compatible with anything but IR systems. So, does anybody know what glasses I need for this configuration? Is it just DLP-Link glasses?


Thanks,

Darin
 
#97 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by darinp2 /forum/post/19999514


I just got the XS and realize this is the Mini thread, but I assume they are basically the same as far as 3D and the question would apply to both. I have the Acer H5360 and hooked it up with the Lumagen XS to my PS3 for 3D. I can get an image that looks like it is a 3D image, although it is pretty jumpy. I had been assuming that I could use the Xpand X103 glasses I have, but I couldn't get them to work and from looking at the instructions and the Xpand site it looks like they aren't compatible with anything but IR systems. So, does anybody know what glasses I need for this configuration? Is it just DLP-Link glasses?


Thanks,

Darin

Hi Darin,


I think you need the nVidia glasses for the Acer, as the Acer is using the nVidia proprietary system (and not variations of 3DTV like the Xpand or the JVC). Don't quote me on this, hopefully someone who owns the Acer will chime in, but that's the direction I would explore.


Edit: here is what they say on the Amazon page for the product: "Stereoscopic visuals add depth and feeling to games, movies and photographs. The Acer H5360 projector is certified for leading 3D solutions: NVIDIA® 3D Vision and DLP 3D. NVIDIA® 3D Vision kits transform hundreds of PC games to full stereoscopic 3D. DLP 3D Ready kits with high (120 Hz) refresh rates render a flicker-free 3D experience."


So it looks like it supports DLP-3D too, on top of the nVidia vision kit.
 
#98 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kelvin1965S /forum/post/19995848


I got mine this morning: Just like LG I haven't fully calibrated yet (I'm still using my VideoEQ Pro for CMS at the moment) but using it tonight for the vertical stretch on a BluRay and also on a DVD earlier this evening and the upscaling and general sharpness, etc is already winning me over.


Later this week I plan to run through the whole (manual) calibration process so I can remove the VEQ from the loop...so far I'm very happy with the purchase. Even off air HD at 1080i looks better than I've seen before via the Edge plus VEQ.

I assume that you have not color calibrated yet? I did over the weekend. I am now seeing very obvious banding on DVDs and on some HD sources. It goes away when I turn the CMS off. There are some other issues as well. I have not gotten to the bottom of this yet and it may simply be user error. But, I had a Radiance in the past and did not experience any issues like this. I am kind of out of ideas and have e-mailed Lumagen's tech support.
 
#99 ·

Quote:
I am kind of out of ideas and have e-mailed Lumagen's tech support.

keep us updated on this ! I have a XE running on one display and thought about adding a Mini to another...
 
#100 ·
I've done a very quick colour calibration on my TV, but this suffers from banding anyway, so not the best display to test out the Mini3D (I may as well use it though as the signal passes through it via a HDMI splitter). I'm using the 013011 firmware (I think, the latest as of last Friday). It certainly improved the gamma on that TV as it is low for most of the IREs and too high at the bottom end: I was able to quickly dial in a flat 2.2 bar a lowering to 2.1 at the bottom end for improved shadow detail (was always poor on this older LCD set).


I will be very dissapointed if I spot banding on my projector though (HD350). I'm currently using a VideoEQ Pro which outputs at 10 bits after processing the 8 bit input and I do this specifically to avoid banding (which I've not seen on the VEQ). I wanted the Mini3D to replace both my Edge and VideoEQ Pro with the advantage of having one less box and much better support (than the VEQ anyway)...being able to place it next to my HDMI splitter also meant I could benefit from using it to correct two TVs as well as the projector.


Perhaps it is issues such as using the wrong HDMI levels or some other setting related cause. Please let us know what you find so that we can benefit from the correct settings (if it is settings related).


EDIT: I just checked and the Lumagen firmware page for the Mini3D says that there is a new update 'due on Monday' which is anytime now I guess. It says that with the current 013011 there is 'Video noise with this update on some units' so whether this is your issue but it's possible.
 
#101 ·
Hopefully this coming update solves my problem. I would not describe what I am seeing as noise. But, here's hoping.


If not, I'll try calibrating again. It took me a little while to get the hang of calibrating again with RGB controls. Plus, I went back and did some touchups. I think if I started from scratch after now being reacquainted with the controls, I might have better luck.


Using the RGB controls is actually pretty easy. I use Calman and can zoom in on each color on the CIE chart as I go. So, I can see which direction I need the color to move.


Things must really be screwed up because my wife, who never says a word about picture quality, told me today that my calibration must have gone wrong. She was watching the Grammys and she said that everyone's face looked wrong.


Ooops . . .
 
This is an older thread, you may not receive a response, and could be reviving an old thread. Please consider creating a new thread.
Top